Wiki manual pages out of date

Started by cat, Fri 08/12/2017 14:12:19

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Crimson Wizard

#20
I pmed this to AGA, but will duplicate it here too.

So, today I tried to upload new manual content to the website, but some issues were found, so had to revert.

1. Pages on website use styles from external css file. While pages generated in repository have embedded css, and they are different (background, font, etc).
2. Pages on website have some additional script for toolbar display.
3. Website manual has additional html pages for contents, index etc. Manual in repository does not generate html pages for these. This means that even if I upload new topic pages, the contents tree will remain 3.2.1, and links won't match.

Would it be possible to find out who have created this online manual, and how?

selmiak

a link would be helpful?
to all pages, the old page on ags, the new page on ags, the new page on git please.

Crimson Wizard

#22
Quote from: selmiak on Sun 18/03/2018 08:06:44
to all pages, the old page on ags, the new page on ags, the new page on git please.

Existing manual: http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/manual/
Random page on existing manual: http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/manual/ags1.htm

Current manual source on git: https://github.com/adventuregamestudio/ags/tree/master/Manual
To build html pages: run run.cmd (may have to install Python 2.7).

Archive containing both versions for comparison: https://www.dropbox.com/s/v958t0938w76cyk/AGS--manualpages.zip?dl=0

selmiak

wohah, there is also an outdated manual on the ags server... all the time I was thinking you were talking about this manual-wiki: http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/wiki/Contents_(manual)
which is hosted on the same domain but even more outdated! This is a mess, time for some spring clean up :D

So my opinion on this is, one of the 2 manuals  on adventuregamesudio.co.uk has to go. Whichever one is easier to update from one source should stay, so probably the static manual you just linked to should stay, if at all. we need _one definite source_ for the manual. There the wiki I just linked would be great as everyone can edit and update with a forum account. But then all the changes would have to be transfered to git again. So my conclusion is, the definite source for the manual should be on github, where it is already and where the binaries of the engine are too. This also means, all these wikipages in the http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/wiki/ domainrange either just disappear or redirect to... either the manual on http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/manual/ or to the manual on github. oh the messy confusion... :-D
It is kind of bitter and if some interested person wants to write some good changes to the manual, this person first needs to make a github account. This could be a barrier for some, but if you really want to help make the AGS manual better this should not stop you. my opinion, not a fact. it sure is convenient to have the option to write changes to the wiki with a forum account, but who does that anyways, so imho github is the main source...


just out of curiosity, how would you change stuff in the manual on git? How do you edit this:
https://github.com/adventuregamestudio/ags/blob/master/Manual/htmlfiles/acintro.htm
and is there a way to display the html on github as it would show in the browser or within the AGS helpwindow?

Crimson Wizard

Quote from: selmiak on Sun 18/03/2018 09:22:05
wohah, there is also an outdated manual on the ags server... all the time I was thinking you were talking about this manual-wiki:

I clearly stated what I was talking about, posting the link several times, starting since very first posts in this thread.


Quote from: selmiak on Sun 18/03/2018 09:22:05
just out of curiosity, how would you change stuff in the manual on git?

By learning how to use github and text editor.


Quote from: selmiak on Sun 18/03/2018 09:22:05
https://github.com/adventuregamestudio/ags/blob/master/Manual/htmlfiles/acintro.htm

These are some unused files that should have been deleted. The actual manual source is in file called "ags.tex" which is a LaTeX document.

selmiak

sorry, my fault, I just assumed you were talking about this /wiki manual and didn't know that /manual was something different but somehow the same and just didn't click the link. sorry for wasting your time and making you post the links once more.


The ags.tex has (WARNING) very long loading times.
Is this the WHOLE MANUAL delivered with the AGS editor in ONE FILE??? That is nice and a great source. But then you'd have to know or learn LaTeX to edit the manual, which is another barrier, but it's like that it seems.

selmiak

#26

Crimson Wizard

#27
Quote from: selmiak on Sun 18/03/2018 10:44:50
Is this the WHOLE MANUAL delivered with the AGS editor in ONE FILE??? That is nice and a great source. But then you'd have to know or learn LaTeX to edit the manual, which is another barrier, but it's like that it seems.

I do not know if this was sarcasm, but having it in one file does not really make it a great source, because it makes it difficult to search and edit.
For that reason the solution that was proposed and discussed long time ago was to change format to something else, even if plain html.
Here is a link to related discussion: http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=51340.0
This is where we discussed possible formats, having manual source only in one place, automatic upload to site, and so on.

Since that thread exists I did not want to discuss it here again, because I practically have to repeat myself multiple times. I was posting here for only one reason: trying to update online manual to the latest 3.4.1 version.

Wiki is a separate question. I would not care about it much if lots of people would not rely on it thus sticking to outdated material.

Quote from: selmiak on Sun 18/03/2018 10:55:41
what about this for a start?
http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/wiki/Credits_(manual)
What about it?

selmiak


Crimson Wizard

#29
You probably should not be editing each page individually. As cat mentioned in her post above, there is a template for "manual entry" which supposed appears on every page in manual category:
http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/wiki/Template:Manual_entry

But, wiki is not interesting to me, I do not want to decide anything about it.

selmiak

Quote from: Crimson Wizard on Sun 18/03/2018 10:57:02
Quote from: selmiak on Sun 18/03/2018 10:44:50
Is this the WHOLE MANUAL delivered with the AGS editor in ONE FILE??? That is nice and a great source. But then you'd have to know or learn LaTeX to edit the manual, which is another barrier, but it's like that it seems.

I do not know if this was sarcasm, but having it in one file does not really make it a great source, because it makes it difficult to search and edit.
not really sarcasm, just too quick to post, it is a great source as it is all in one place, but somehow I clicked send before writing down what you wrote down. split it in parts to make it load faster and easier to edit and all the format changes from the other threads... but for that, the other thread is there, push it to restart the discussion or do something, I have no idea about LaTeX or .chm formats or whatelse is out there ;)

selmiak

Quote from: Crimson Wizard on Sun 18/03/2018 11:04:01
You probably should not be editing each page individually. As cat mentioned in her post above, there is a template for "manual entry" which supposed appears on every page in manual category:
http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/wiki/Template:Manual_entry

But, wiki is not interesting to me, I do not want to decide anything about it.
direct links would be more convenient, but there you go, the manual entry template now also links to the /manual

Crimson Wizard

#32
Can we please, REMOVE the manual from Wiki? People KEEP referring to these pages, because apparently the warning is not distinct enough. They don't find functions they need and assume they don't exist, then ask how to script things.

Gilbert

I think, at least the link in the WIKI's front page should be updated to the external one from the AGS site. Couldn't do this though as it requires admin right to edit the front page it seems.

Crimson Wizard

#34
Quote from: Crimson Wizard on Wed 27/06/2018 11:23:48
Can we please, REMOVE the manual from Wiki? People KEEP referring to these pages, because apparently the warning is not distinct enough. They don't find functions they need and assume they don't exist, then ask how to script things.



BUMP. :(
It happens again: https://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=56826.msg636600584#msg636600584


Quote from: Gilbert on Wed 27/06/2018 18:06:13
I think, at least the link in the WIKI's front page should be updated to the external one from the AGS site. Couldn't do this though as it requires admin right to edit the front page it seems.

I cannot edit the main page either...
Still I'd suggest to remove these manual pages completely. After all, if old manuals have any historical value they are packaged within corresponding AGS editors, and these may be downloaded from agsarchives torrent (https://www.agsarchives.com/agsarchives.torrent).

Gilbert

The problem was that the Engine Limit page was not marked "Manual Entry" so it did not have that large warning box on top of it.
I've now deleted all the pages marked as "Manual Entry" (with the first page giving a link to the updated online manual, as this page is still being linked by the Main page) plus the Engine Limit page.
There are certainly many other outdated pages but I'd rather leave them as-is and only act "on-demand" to avoid complications.

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