And then there were none (AGS Werewolf Game 3) (Phase: End Discussion)

Started by Sinitrena, Tue 14/08/2018 19:22:55

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Kastchey

Yeah. Though as I said, as long as no one votes "no one" or a third player other than me or cat, it wouldn't even matter who votes for whom. We would *always* end up with one extra vote for either me or her. I'm tempted to keep my vote purely for the RP but meh, an agreement is an agreement.

Cat it is then.

Sinitrena

The fear is palpable in every second and every thought. You do not dare look at anybody, you do not dare talking to them. You mistrust them, you even mistrust yourself. You killed someone just yesterday and then another body was found the following night.

Can you blame

Spoiler
cat
[close]
for running after the suspicion suddenly came down on her full force? First she jumped out of a window and later she just disappeared.

You do not really look for her. You do not dare being alone, because someone could attack you from behind. You do not leave the other prisoners on this islands out of your sight.

It is no surprise to anyone that you do not want to climb over cliffs and dangerous tracks to look for her and so you spend the day strained and nervous all in the same room. Only later, weeks later, her body is washed ashore but by then, well...

It is already evening when something like a consensus builds in your frightful conversations and you all decide to search her room.

Spoiler
Art supplies are strewn all over it and among the clutter there are a couple recent pictures. They start out depicting the island with storm and rough waves but happy enough. But they become progressively darker.
[close]
Again, you are not surprised.

What you do not find is

Spoiler
any proof of her guilt.
[close]
You can only hope that
Spoiler
cat
[close]
escaped from this wretched island and manages to send help. But what would the help be like? Four people are dead, one person disappeared. What will the authorities think?

You don't even notice that the storm dies down during the day.



(That's a picture by cat, taken from the Artjam thread.)

Votes:

Spoiler
VampireWombat: cat
tzachs: cat
cat: VampireWombat cat
josiah1221: cat
Kastchey: VampireWombat cat Kastchey cat

5 votes for cat

You sacrifice cat for the greater good. She was
Spoiler
a normal Guest.
[close]
[close]

Players:

Spoiler
VampireWombat: alive
dayowlron: bludgeoned to death with a spotlight in Night 2 (Role: Nurse)
Riaise: strangled with her own feather boa in Night 1 (Role: Guest)
tzachs: alive
Mandle: drank a glass of poisoned wine in Night 3 (Role: Guest)
cat: disappeared and then drowned on Day 4 (Role: Guest)
Stupot: run off the cliffs by everyone on Day 3 (Role: Murderer)
josiah1221: alive
Kastchey: alive
[close]

Role Setup:

Spoiler
2 Guests
1 Psychic
0 Nurses
1 Party Host
0 Murderers
[close]

Another day gone, another innocent victim. The Party Host gets another kill this night and the Psychic another scan. As always, I await your PMs.

Current Phase: Night 4

Sinitrena

The lights flickered the whole time you spend in this wretched house but they at least kept it slightly illuminated.

Now, they flicker more than ever, even though the storm has finally subsided to a little bit of wind still howling through the cracks. Maybe it is also your eyes and your mind flickering in and out of awareness due to you being so tired. You can't leave the lobby where the other guests are, you cannot close your eyes or you would make yourself an easy target.

But the light or the generator is strained beyond believe and so it flickers more and more and finally it expires completely around three in the morning.

Soon, the old grandfather clock in the corner strikes the hour.

One.

Two.

But the second stroke is louder. There is no doubt. You flinch from the gunshot, from the three gunshots so very close to you.

Three.

For a minute you wonder if you will soon feel blood running down your chest.

There is no pain, only the smell of powder in the stuffy room and then clicks of a weapon not firing.

You see a spinning revolver on the little table between you all when the light comes back. It spins and spins until it finally stops with the barrel pointing towards
Spoiler
josiah1221.
[close]

It is in this moment that you take your eyes from the weapon and look up to the man next to you. He stares back with empty eyes. Slowly, his head sinks down onto his chest. Then the rest of his body follows and he falls from the couch.

He ends up in a pool of his own blood, soaking the rug and your shoes.



This night
Spoiler
josiah1221 was killed. He was
Spoiler
a normal Guest.
[close]
[close]

Players:

Spoiler
VampireWombat: alive
dayowlron: bludgeoned to death with a spotlight in Night 2 (Role: Nurse)
Riaise: strangled with her own feather boa in Night 1 (Role: Guest)
tzachs: alive
Mandle: drank a glass of poisoned wine in Night 3 (Role: Guest)
cat: disappeared and then drowned on Day 4 (Role: Guest)
Stupot: run off the cliffs by everyone on Day 3 (Role: Murderer)
josiah1221: shot in a room full of people in Night 4 (Role: Guest)
Kastchey: alive
[close]

Role Setup:

Spoiler
1 Guest
1 Psychic
0 Nurses
1 Party Host
0 Murderers
[close]

Deceased players may no longer post here but are allowed to communicate through other means.

You have about 48 hours to find the killer. The Day Phase ends on 2. September between 4 PM and 7 PM BST.

But: Due to only three players being left, 2 real life days seem a bit long. I don't want to break the normal structure too much, just in case one of you isn't online, so here is a little addition to the rules: You can now lock your votes (add locked (bold) to your vote), which takes your ability away to change your vote (take this option at your own risk) but once all three still active players have locked their vote, the round can end earlier. If not all three lock their votes, the Day Phase runs its course and the above date is used. I can't guarantee to be online exactly when all votes are locked, so the round might not officially end earlier, but should a player get lynched he may reveal himself then. I'll wrap the round up as soon as I have the time.

This is just an option. You don't have to take it.

Current Phase: Day 5

VampireWombat

I'm not sure there's any reason to drag anything out...
As the psychic, I know that tzachs is innocent and Kastchey killed Josiah in cold blood.

Kastchey

Yup ^^ Go ahead and lynch my @&& then. It was a coin toss between you and Mandle on night 3 kill, too bad the coin did not favour us =)


VampireWombat

Yes, so many things could have gone differently.
Though I am quite surprised you killed poor Josiah instead of me...

Kastchey, locked

Kastchey

Killing you wouldn't have made any difference.

There was a very slight chance that Josiah was the psychic, that he scanned cat on night 3 and then he and Mandle decided to throw her under the bus because they knew they needed someone lynched on day 4 to win and there was a very convenient excuse for cat.

I thought it highly unlikely for Mandle to have made such a rookie mistake (i.e. sacrificing a scanned person) but since I no longer needed the real psychic killed, I could as well kill Josiah to double check that this had not happened.

Not sure if I explained it clearly enough, but perhaps we could continue discussing motives and all when the thread is open to everyone? So that the guys we had to silence have a chance to participate too.

tzachs


VampireWombat

Yes, motivations and all would be nice to discuss further at a later point. I'm still not sure why poor cat was drowned...

I am saddened by the fact that the rp aspect got mostly dropped. I was enjoying playing a skeptic who debunked things despite/because of having psychic powers. I kind of wanted to explore how something about the island made his powers more pronounced or something.

I also kind of want to see a group project game made from this experience...

Sinitrena

The gun spins slowly to a stop and you lock eyes with the other two people in the room. You did not know that time could feel so strange. Of course you knew that it can slow down to a turtle's pace or run like an antelope but to lose hours to a staring contest?

It is hours later when the feral smile has finally formed fully on

Spoiler
Kastchey's
[close]
lips that three hands grab a now still gun at the same time.

The storm is gone, the wind and rain have stopped. The first rays of sunshine in nearly a week break through the last remnants of clouds in the morning when a fisherman makes his way over still rough waves and up the path to an old house on the cliffs.

What he sees in the lobby there is not pleasant: Two people lie dead on the ground, two others stand over them, their eyes locked, never leaving each other or the gun between them, never trusting. The fisherman takes one look at the scene and then he runs.

His sudden movement wakes you from your shock. You follow, you run after him, leaving

Spoiler
Kastchey's body, the body of a murderer
[close]
behind. Your calls to stop only make the fisherman run faster.

He reaches his boat before you catch up with him, he rows away before you can stop him.

How do you explain all this to the police some hours later?




Votes:

Spoiler
VampireWombat: Kastchey
tzachs: Kastchey
Kastchey: Kastchey

You lynch Kastchey, who was, to nobody's surprise
Spoiler
the Party Host.
[close]
[close]

Players:

Spoiler
VampireWombat: alive
dayowlron: bludgeoned to death with a spotlight in Night 2 (Role: Nurse)
Riaise: strangled with her own feather boa in Night 1 (Role: Guest)
tzachs: alive
Mandle: drank a glass of poisoned wine in Night 3 (Role: Guest)
cat: disappeared and then drowned on Day 4 (Role: Guest)
Stupot: run off the cliffs by everyone on Day 3 (Role: Murderer)
josiah1221: shot in a room full of people in Night 4 (Role: Guest)
Kastchey: finally lynched on Day 5 (Role: Party Host)
[close]

Role Setup:

Spoiler
1 Guest
1 Psychic
0 Nurses
0 Party Hosts
0 Murderers
[close]

Congratulations, the first time on the AGS Werewolf Game, the good side has won.

The game is over and the thread is open to discussion to everyone, including killed players and non-players.

Sinitrena

During Day Phase 4 a rule problem came up. I explain the problem below, but I would like to tell you all that I asked Mandle for his opinion in the matter and revealed cat's role in the process before it was officially revealed, trusting in Mandle's ability to not use this information. That wasn't exactly fair to Mandle and I would like to apologize here again. I knew what I was doing and thought it okay because it couldn't make a difference for the outcome of the game.

Now, what was the problem?

Kastchey had lost in Day Phase 4 (with such a slight chance to a different outcome that it really is close to zero, refer to tzachs posts. His analysis was more or less spot on.). He knew he had lost, I knew he had lost, but the game rules do not consider this situation, but clearly state that the game ends when a) all players of the scum side are killed or b) the good side cannot reach a majority lynch vote any longer. Neither was the case yet in Day 4 or in Night 4, which meant that the game was supposed to go on (for about 72 hours) even though there was no real reason to. With the exception that not all roles were revealed yet, and the good side technically didn't know who the Party Host was, the outcome was clear.

Now, Kastchey suggested to give himself up so as not to drag the game out, which I agreed to. But we both didn't want to cut the enjoyment for any players short, which might have happened if he outright forfitted or if I just stopped the game. So, we agreed to him trying to get lynched, just to avoid dragging out an unwinable game without destroying it. Mandle's opinion was to let the game run its course.

Now, we (that is, Kastchey and I) also agreed to leave a final decision up to discussion. I take any and all suggestions and opinions.

Did it feel right to play it out as per game rules even though the winning side was decided? Or should I have cut the game short?


On a completely different note, it is interesting that the game structure required the good side to lynch one of their own to ensure a victory. What a strange situation! And interesting to learn that it can be beneficial to other roles than the fool to lynch themselves.

tzachs

Thanks for the great hosting and story-telling again, it was fun.

Regarding the rules, I don't think that you at any point should have stopped the game on your own, but a rule allowing the last murderer to forfeit sounds about right to me.

Another rule I'd like to discuss, is that dead people were not allowed to post on the thread anymore but can still PM everybody. I found it kind of silly. Mandle PMed the entire group, which is exactly like posting in the thread except outsiders (and the host) can't enjoy what's happening. So, I think, either this rule should be cancelled, OR, an interesting alternative would be to change it into a "last words" post. Anybody who dies is allowed one last post in the thread and then no further communications with that person are allowed until the end of the game (this would shift the balance a bit for the benefit of the murderers though).

Quote from: Sinitrena on Fri 31/08/2018 15:56:03
On a completely different note, it is interesting that the game structure required the good side to lynch one of their own to ensure a victory. What a strange situation! And interesting to learn that it can be beneficial to other roles than the fool to lynch themselves.
I agree, that was a fun discovery (not sure if it was that much fun for cat, though).

Sinitrena

Quote from: tzachs on Fri 31/08/2018 16:15:52
Another rule I'd like to discuss, is that dead people were not allowed to post on the thread anymore but can still PM everybody. I found it kind of silly. Mandle PMed the entire group, which is exactly like posting in the thread except outsiders (and the host) can't enjoy what's happening. So, I think, either this rule should be cancelled, OR, an interesting alternative would be to change it into a "last words" post. Anybody who dies is allowed one last post in the thread and then no further communications with that person are allowed until the end of the game (this would shift the balance a bit for the benefit of the murderers though).

I agree: It is silly, a "last words" post would make more sense, and yes, it would shift the balance to benefit the scum side. I think it would be better to not allow "ghosts". The problem is control. We would have to rely entirely on the honesty of all players. But maybe we should. It would be more logical, in world.

Kastchey

Yes, I had similar thoughts to tzachs during the game.

In addition to what tzachs and Sinitrena said, I think disallowing "ghost" would make striking known town accomplices a more viable move for the wolves and reduce the possibility of a checkmate.

For example, I might have tried convincing tzachs today that VampireWombat is the murderer. VW would deny. But with the current ruleset, tzachs would have simply been told by Mandle or dayowlron who is telling the truth, so I did not even consider this move.

So it might actually have even more impact on the game than just commenting and sharing opinions ;)

Kastchey

Or maybe the better wording for my last sentence would be that it would shift the balance towards the scum side very specifically by providing them with more ways to win the game, in addition to preventing both closed communication other people cannot enjoy and help in guesswork to the town players who are still alive.

Which is probably exactly what tzachs and Sini meant, I just thought I might add a specific example for this.

dayowlron

Quote from: Kastchey on Fri 31/08/2018 16:54:37
Yes, I had similar thoughts to tzachs during the game.

In addition to what tzachs and Sinitrena said, I think disallowing "ghost" would make striking known town accomplices a more viable move for the wolves and reduce the possibility of a checkmate.

For example, I might have tried convincing tzachs today that VampireWombat is the murderer. VW would deny. But with the current ruleset, tzachs would have simply been told by Mandle or dayowlron who is telling the truth, so I did not even consider this move.

So it might actually have even more impact on the game than just commenting and sharing opinions ;)
That is true the outcome would have been very different with that rule in place. If we do decide having a "last words" then I wonder that if the psychic is killed if they can reveal everything they know. Could make for an interesting dynamic.

Nice to be on a winning side for once.

Quote from: Sinitrena on Fri 31/08/2018 15:56:03
On a completely different note, it is interesting that the game structure required the good side to lynch one of their own to ensure a victory. What a strange situation! And interesting to learn that it can be beneficial to other roles than the fool to lynch themselves.
It wasn't that we had to lynch one of our own to ensure a victory as much as it was that we had to lynch someone other than Josiah and VampireWombat. We thought that cat might have been the party host and by lynching someone we allowed for the odds to work in our favor. 
Pro is the opposite of Con                       Kids of today are so much different
This fact can clearly be seen,                  Don't you know?
If progress means to move forward         Just ask them where they are from
Then what does congress mean?             And they tell you where you can go.  --Nipsey Russell

Sinitrena

Quote from: dayowlron on Fri 31/08/2018 17:24:10
Quote from: Sinitrena on Fri 31/08/2018 15:56:03
On a completely different note, it is interesting that the game structure required the good side to lynch one of their own to ensure a victory. What a strange situation! And interesting to learn that it can be beneficial to other roles than the fool to lynch themselves.
It wasn't that we had to lynch one of our own to ensure a victory as much as it was that we had to lynch someone other than Josiah and VampireWombat. We thought that cat might have been the party host and by lynching someone we allowed for the odds to work in our favor. 

I meant compared to not lynching anyone. Lynching cat or tzachs meant a win the next day, lynching Kastchey would have been an imediate victory. Because a ghost revealed that josiah was trustworthy and because josiah knew that VW was the Psychic, there was no chance of either josiah or VW gettin lynched. Yes, lynching either of these two would have given Kastchey a chance to win, as would not lynching anyone. But you all knew that, therefore, lynching one of your own did gurantee the victory for the good side.

Kastchey

Yeah, that's how I understood it too.

By the way Sini, are you a fiction writer? If you're not, you should be.

dayowlron

Quote from: Kastchey on Fri 31/08/2018 17:56:23
By the way Sini, are you a fiction writer? If you're not, you should be.
Agreed. I wish I could write that well.
Pro is the opposite of Con                       Kids of today are so much different
This fact can clearly be seen,                  Don't you know?
If progress means to move forward         Just ask them where they are from
Then what does congress mean?             And they tell you where you can go.  --Nipsey Russell

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