http://adventurecon.org/
QuoteAdventureCon is America's first convention for adventure game fans by adventure game fans.
Hmm.. I seem to remember a Mittens USA in 2004, but the only
special guest was me. :=
If we do host a Mittens in the DC/Maryland area, I should be able to get Sid Mier and some other local developers, but if you all can go to Vegas for this convention you can hear their guest speakers such as Al Lowe and Jane Jensen. Even more exciting for the non-Lucas babies here. [Looks at his forum name] Enjoy ya Sierra-babies.
Las Vegas, sweet! But no way! :p It all sounds pretty good though Scott!
Hopefully someone will go and represent :)
Oh boy. It's being managed by Howard Sherman! (http://www.davelgil.com/wordpress/?p=178) :-/
Maybe I shouldn't go.
good old Howie.
This sounds interesting but not having a car and hating planes makes such things improbable.
I'm asking around the IGDA underground to see if there is any buzz about this, and if it's worth going to and/or exhibiting at. I'll let you know what I find out.
Thanks for the info, Scummy.
You could always swing by AZ and give me a lift, Dave. Roadtrip? ;|
I'm always up for a weekend in Vegas ... and with adventure games in the mix? Who could resist!!
Wow. I would check that the guests have actually agreed to attend before shelling out the $300.
I've asked around, and while I haven't heard from alot of people, but I've heard a few bits of good advice.
The main question that came up was "Will there be a large turnout?" True, Jane Jensen and Al Lowe are big names, but who outside of the adventure community (which is itself quite small) would be willing to travel all the way to Vegas, book a hotel, and buy a con pass to see them? By that same token, who WITHIN the adventure gaming community would do the same? It's a tough question.
The other issue is Howard Sherman himself. His reputation is, shall we say, kind of mixed. My opinions on the man are documented (and he might not want me there as a result!), but it's the main reason why I hesitate. His marketing campaigns are heavy-handed and egocentric and (from the little I've seen) I see the same tactics being used on this adventurecon thing. An Adventure game convention is something I'd want to support, but Howard always makes me feel icky.
I shall give it a month and see what the buzz is before making any decisions. I doubt that all the convention space will be sold out before then, so I'll wait. I might go as a adventure fan instead of a developer, just to see.
A weekend in Vegas is never a total loss. If the convention sucks, you can always go see Cirque De Soleil or something.
I don't like the look of this.
Sherman gets some convention space, probably free, on condition that he can get as many people as he can into the Mirage hotel.
Choice quotes:
"Howard Sherman used to be a homebrew developer himself and he was always looking for inexpensive ways to reach people...."
$500 dollars for table space.
$750 dollars for a table or "booth".
$1250 gets you double exhibit space, but Howard doesn't go into details.
So the profits from fifty copies of my $9.95 homebrew adventure goes on the cheapest space available. If 200 prospective customers attend, a quarter of them have to buy my game to recoup space costs.
"Please note that due to the extremely deep discounts being offered during early registration, you are entering into a binding, non-refundable contract when you purchase AdventureCon exhibit space from Malinche Entertainment Corp"
And no refund if it's all a sham!
"If you're making your own travel plans and hotel arrangements you may wish to consider this invaluable Las Vegas Travel Guide written by none other than Howard Sherman. You're guaranteed to save money. You might even win some if you follow his gambling advice!"
That's my favourite quote.
"From personal experience, Howard recommends going with the exhibitor packages that include your hotel stay at The Mirage. There's no bigger hassle than having to "commute" back and forth and waste valuable time. Plus, being on The Mirage property means you gain continual exposure to AdventureCon attendees and other guests at The Mirage before and even after the show. Since The Mirage is always at 99% occupancy, you get access to thousands of potential customers at every turn."
Yes, I'm sure he does. And what an apt choice of hotel name. Maybe that's all you'll find when you get there.
Sure, poking fun at Howard Sherman is easy, and maybe the whole thing is above board.
Regardless, do adventure game creators, almost exclusively indie-based, need to pay for this kind of exposure to, let's face it, people who probably already know about them?
The indie adventure game market is pretty much based on e-distribution, and those developers looking to publish their games in a physical medium are probably looking for something bigger than what Howard is proposing.
You get advertising in the areas that matter (online adventure forums, communities, etc) for free, with some spillover into the more mainstream gaming press, already.
Sounds a bit pointless, really.
EDIT: But then I am a cynical fish at heart.
QuoteRegardless, do adventure game creators, almost exclusively indie-based, need to pay for this kind of exposure to, let's face it, people who probably already know about them?
An excellent point, fish. The people who are interested enough in schlepping out to Vegas for this con probably already know about the games that are available there.
Howard Sherman organizing this thing isn't bad per se. What irks me is that his self-promoting instincts are kicking in full swing again. He mentions his name, or his company name, or his products, on every page of the site. If he were truly serious about organizing this and pushing the adventure genre, he'd remain behind the scenes and not promote himself. When I go to a con, I rarely know who is organizing it, nor would I care. I discovered Malinche's involvement after 5 seconds of looking at the site.
The literature on the site is sophomoric at best, with lame references to Zork that wouldn't have been funny twenty years ago. The site's been up for only 8 days and he's already changed the date of the con.
I wouldn't mind paying the money for the space costs, assuming that I get something for it. What kind of exposure would an indie developer hope to get at this sort of thing? I am curious as to what kind of press plans on coming. I can't imagine that the mainstream gamign press plans on being there.
Most industry conventions are for meeting your colleagues, scheduling business meetings, going to lectures or speeches, and in general to "be seen". This con could possibly offer those things, but as of now I don't see it happening.
The consensus amongst the IGDA crew is "This sounds sketchy." I might go, if the site improves or if there is some significant media buzz about it, but not as an exhibitor. Failing that, I'll wait until the con is over and if it turns out to be a hit I will go next year.
Come to Mittens! It's free, and more people will actually attend!
Sounds like a con all right!
I really can't forsee a significant turnout, especially considering the ridiculous price tag. Oh well, good luck to them. I wouldn't go if I were you, Dave. At least, not this year.
Hm. I found this on gamedailybiz: (http://biz.gamedaily.com/industry/news/?id=15375)
"This is a fantastic opportunity for the world-wide adventure community to show its support for gaming's oldest and most popular genre," says Randy Sluganski, owner of Just Adventure, the Internet's most popular adventure game site, and AdventureCon co-founder.
Randy Sluganski is a co-founder? That makes a little bit more legit, but I'm surprised that Randy's name isn't anywhere on the adventureCon site.
"Internet's most popular adventure game site" - !
Quote from: Dave Gilbert on Thu 01/03/2007 02:53:59
The site's been up for only 8 days and he's already changed the date of the con.
Now how could there be confirmed guests with dates changing? And what about anyone who booked flights/hotel/vacation for the previous date? What a mess.
Quote from: Dave Gilbert on Thu 01/03/2007 03:26:48
Randy Sluganski is a co-founder? That makes a little bit more legit, but I'm surprised that Randy's name isn't anywhere on the adventureCon site.
more?
I was under the impression that gaming's oldest genre was Pong?
Also, Jane Who? :)
Quote from: SSH on Thu 01/03/2007 08:19:12
Quote from: Dave Gilbert on Thu 01/03/2007 03:26:48
Randy Sluganski is a co-founder? That makes a little bit more legit, but I'm surprised that Randy's name isn't anywhere on the adventureCon site.
more?
I'd say so, since Randy is someone who promotes adventure games as a whole, while Howard is, well, Howard.
QuoteAugust 29th - Panel discussion Featuring Scott Adams, Al Lowe, Jane Jensen and Howard Sherman.
Well he didn't put his name first anyway ;)
I was totally excited when I saw that it was a con for people that grew up on those kinds of adventure games (just like me, just like most of us here I suspect), but yeesh! $349 just to get in? (Unless you buy early now and receive a whole $50 off. ::) What a way to sucker people in to something non-refundable now.)
And the two workshops they have listed are "Insider's Secrets to Winning Adventure Games" and "How to Beat Impossible Situations in Adventure Games"? Is there an echo in here? And you mean, like, other than reading a hint file?
To me this whole thing sounds like Howard Smarmin' trying to make a great deal of money for not actually giving people anything much. And yeah, the whole site/plan/everything seems badly organized and nebulous. "Even more honored guests are *sure* to join us!" and "Ms. Jensen schedule is not yet confirmed" alone would make me hella nervous. And the continued "stepping into the pool at the Mirage is an adventure!" and "getting your streusel at breakfast is adventurous!" references over and over make me sick. I wouldn't risk it.
QuoteRandy Sluganski
Quote$349 just to get in?Ã,Â
::)
Perhaps they need to pay for a new forum.
If I had the money, and even if the con was really on or not, I'd still have an amazing time in Las Vegas. With or without Al Lowe :p It'd be nice if these designers roamed around a bit more like Ron Gilbert :)
I had emailed James (listed on the site as director of sales) but never heard back from him. I instead emailed Randy and he was much more prolific and forthcoming about answering my questions.
I might be attending this con as a speaker or panelist, depending on what they decide. Alot of the content is a bit up in the air, which is actually quite normal from what I've seen. I was asked to speak at GDC in January, a whopping 3 months before the con itself. This adventurecon thing won't happen for 6 months, so they have time to get their stuff organized. One hopes.
Despite my feelings about Howard I do hope this succeeds. I'm willing to help, within reason.
Quote from: Dave Gilbert on Wed 28/02/2007 21:42:13
A weekend in Vegas is never a total loss. If the convention sucks, you can always go see Cirque De Soleil or something.
Or something, yes.
It seems that I am going to this con as a speaker/panelist.
So, um, see you in Vegas?
I like adventure games and all, but certainly not to the tune of $349... we're the nicheiest of the niche, and I don't think the vast majority of adventure gamers really care enough to be shelling out for this either. The 'offical website' reeks of those eScam pages you see when you click the wrong link in your junk mail folder too (Adventurer's Workshop - The Insider's Secrets to Winning Adventure Games! Increase the size of your Adventure Game by 3 inches! Sexy Adventure Game singles waiting for your call!).
I'm afraid I have visions of you and the 3 other panelists sitting alone in a very echoy hall, Dave.
At least make sure that you get paid up front, Dave - and avoid any personal expenses to be refunded later.
good luck with it.
Never trust anything with
con in the name!
Looking at the website is quite funny really. They're celebrating a genre which nowadays has very little commercial value yet they're still expecting adventure creators to turn up and pay $500 for a table to showcase their game. Or $1000 if they want to stay a couple of nights, too.
Who exactly are the big developers that would go to that, or who are the small ones that would benefit spending all they've made on their games so far? They should be inviting and giving people like Dave Gilbert a table for
free! Maybe charging the large adventure game companies $500, but there are still very few of those.
QuoteYou get space for one table or booth and two show badges for just $ 750
Right. So for $250 extra dollars I get two more paper badges? What happened to doing a random task for someone to gain tack like that? :P
QuoteSince The Mirage is always at 99% occupancy, you get access to thousands of potential customers at every turn.
I love this line. I could walk out into the centre of Oxford which also has 99% occupancy and probably find
more potential customers than Adventure Con. Do they really think the people occupying a hotel are going to give a shit about adventure games?! This is an absurd "reason".
QuoteHoward knows all about this. You'll find Malinche's resident Implementor in the Mirage exercise room wearing a Malinche t-shirt, poolside wearing a Malinche tank-top and at a blackjack table wearing, you guessed it, a Malinche shirt.
LOL, does the Janitor have one too?
QuoteThe Big Deal Exhibitor Package - A double shot of exhibit space and four AdventureCon show tickets. A stunning deal at $1,250.
...if you're a big games company or a rich developer. Neither of which will be attending, so why not knock the $1000 bit off?
QuoteDon't wait on this.Ã, If your company has even the slightest intention of being at AdventureCon we urge you to grab this hyper-generous offer on exhibit space while you can.Ã, As the saying goes -- you snooze, you lose.
And my new saying is "if it's got Con in the name, hpyer-generous in any of its descriptions and phrases like 'you snooze u lose', its probably bullshit". If this was ECTS or E3 then yes, charging people these kind of prices would be reasonable. Becuase then you're hosting your stuff to a specific games-related audience. Not a bunch of wealthy Americans who've come to the city to gamble. Howard SHOULD know this ><
QuoteBecause it's never been done in the United States before and adventure game fans are long overdue for an event all their own. Why should France, Germany and England have all the fun?
I'm pretty sure England's never had an adventure convention. Apart from AdventureX, but that never even happened - becuase I was in charge :P
Well, I wish them luck. All I can say is if I was in Las Vegas and in that hotel it would be "nice" to stumble across, but it would never be something I'd specifically set myself out for. Ronfest was free and to my mind would be far better than any convention. The only thing that would sway me would be some real names in the adventure game scene NOW and some real exhibitor company names. There are no company names of exhibitors listed at all.
Still, I hope you get something out of it, Dave :)
If anything else, maybe some ideas for your own convention in New York, for the underground scene. And for people who would rather pay $50 for a table rather than $500. :P ;)
I wouldn't get paid to do this. From my limited experiences with cons, what happens is that you are comped a pass to the event itself, and sometimes hotels are partially covered. This would be fine. I have to admit my curiousity is piqued about this whole thing. I'd be willing to foot the air and hotel fare if the con itself would be free. Plus, I like speaking and there are worse places to be stuck for a few days than Vegas.
Depiste my initial feelings about this, I'm willing to give it the benefit of the doubt - for now. I know that it takes awhile to generate a roster of speakers and panelists and events and such. I'm speaking at I-Con next week, and I wasn't even officially asked to go until two months ago. This adventurecon thing isn't for another six months, so my general feelings are to Wait and See.
So, er, nevermind. I'm not going to Adventurecon.
Apparently a free pass wasn't included in the deal, and I would be expected to pay the full $350 plus hotel for the priviledge of speaking. To get a free pass I'd have to run 2-4 workshops and be on more panels. I politely declined.
Plenty of fish in the sea, Dave. No reason to get tied down so quickly now that you're famous.
Go to it the year you can afford to bring us along too :D
Shame about that, though. But like I said, you should blatently get a free deal - however, they're catering for a strange super-rich audience which I'm pretty sure doesn't exist.
Cross-country travel always effects me in a very stupid way and I wouldn't be much use leading a workshop, let alone 2-4 of them. Unless they were workshops on the values of taking naps.
I know of some people who are interested in going, but the high price puts them on the fence. Most cons like this are usually $50, or $100 tops. $350 is way too high.
Perhaps the price will come down closer to the date when they realise only Randy, Howard, Scott, Al and Jane are coming... or maybe they'll just cancel the whole thing.
So I was on their email list thing, yes?
And they sent me an email saying 'AdventureCon Welcomes: Chris Jones.'
Mein Gott!
Has CJ sold out?!?
I go straight to here, and search for this thread, to see if CJ has said anything.
Nope.
Of course, I think, he's embarrassed.
Then I think 'Read the email, genius.'
So I run back and read the email.
"If you know Tex Murphy, then you know Chris Jones."
I don't know Tex Murphy, and therefore, I decided, I don't know Chris Jones.
So, it was the 'Tex Murphy' Chris Jones, of Access Software, not our pal CJ, and also not Chris Jones of Obsidian Entertainment, who worked on the Star Trek Interplay games (which I love!), and went on to do Fallout and all those RPGs we so much about these days, like Neverwinter Nights 2. There are a good deal of Software Developers named Chris Jones.
Hopefully this little anecdote is counted as constructive and I will not be admonished for posting it.
I mean, this thread isn't that old, right?
Do yourself a favor and play the Tex Murphy games. They're (or several of them are, at least) excellent.
Perhaps I'll host my own AdventureCon in my bathroom, and call it AwesomeCon.
Then people will give a crap about it. And it's free!
The price has been lowered by about $60, although it's still too expensive for most. My main wish for Adventurecon is that he'd get some guests who are working in the industry now. Anything less would just enforce the stereotype that adventure games are old/dead.
Of course, most of the people working on modern adventure games are not in the U.S., and it would too expensive to schlep them over. At least, that's the impression I get.
Quote from: Alliance on Mon 02/04/2007 13:16:49
Perhaps I'll host my own AdventureCon in my bathroom, and call it AwesomeCon.
Then people will give a crap about it. And it's free!
And I'll take pictures!
http://forums.adventuregamers.com/showpost.php?p=403503&postcount=23
A lower, much more reasonable price. Will this make anyone go?
No.
The fact that prices have been dropped so drastically (It all had to do with food, apparently. Go figure.) will most likely have the opposite effect. Now they just look badly organized and desperate.
An awfully cynical way to look at the situation, sure, but had all of these "barriers" been sorted before announcing the event things might be different.
I assume people who paid the old price will be refunded? Since they aren't getting a buffet now...
http://www.adventuregamers.com/newsitem.php?id=1431
I think we can learn lessons from AdventureCon -- so with that in mind, I can now announce that Mittens has been moved to 12-19 September and will be held in Beunos Aires; additionally, Brittens will now be taking place the week of 29 April - 5 May, will be held in Barcelona, and to attend you will need to have a ticket which you can now get for the low low price of $199.
And instead of our main attraction, CJ himself, we've engaged Santiagarro.
"We can also say with 100% certainty there will be no hotel sales made from the AdventureCon site and no packages of any kind will be offered. AdventureCon will simply sell AdventureCon show tickets. We will negotiate a special discounted rate for all attendees staying at the hotel but that's where our involvement with your travel plans ends. Howard really wasn't thrilled with the idea of Malinche staff tracking hotel reservations for potentially hundreds of people anyway. Malinche is a text adventure game company, not a travel agency."
Malinche is a joke. And Howard loved the idea of selling hotel packages enough to do it the first time around, and also gave his recommendation for potential attendees to take full advantage of the Mirage hotel's facilities.
I wouldn't trust Howard Sherman as far as I could punt him, and JustAdventure isn't doing itself any favours by being associated with this fiasco.
You're right! Guess they've never been to Mittens. Tents would suffice.
I need to someday go to Mittens. It's one of those "things to do before I die" things.
Sigh.
I had hopes for this. I really did. Despite my feelings about Howard and Malinche, despite the whole thing looking like a train wreck waiting to happen, despite my intentions to not go, I was hoping to be proved wrong because the adventure community could use something like this.
I feel like the prophet of doom who is disappointed when the end of the world actually comes.
Someone with some actual business sense should try this again. Even if it was really small, it could be fun. Just don't charge an arm and a leg to attend and focus on the fun rather than name dropping yourself as many times as possible. Also, pay a small amount of money for a webdesigner so the con doesn't feel like a "con", sheesh. Oh, and get a better name. I suggest "ConQuest!"
or ConJest...and it could even be made into the acronym CJ!
1. Hire some space for a weekend. Most hotels, not just expensive vegas-based ones, have conference facilities available. Christ, there's a hotel five minutes walk from my house that hosts a Sci-Fi convention every year.
2. Inquire about getting a couple of industry names to attend. As long as you're paying, and as long as they have the time, you'd be surprised at how relatively easy this could prove to be. (That's relatively easy.)
3. Sell tickets.
How hard can it be?
The funniest thing about AdventureCon was the Howard-penned guide to Vegas that he was flogging. If that doesn't smack of seedy money-making schemeage, I don't know what does.
I await the unveiling of AdventureCon Mk.II with interest...
Atlantic City is within driving distance of NYC (well, a few hours anyway), so I might go just for kicks. I admit my curiosity is piqued. It's like a train wreck that I won't be able to turn away from.
Quote
We Reached Out to 50 Adventure Game Companies.
45 did not respond.
Of the 5 remaining - three responded positively and two negatively.
The dates were wrong. The prices were wrong. The location was wrong.
We'll get it right in 2008.
A steering committee is in formation & planning for AdventureCon 2008 is under way.
Perhaps this will happen around the time FoY and Run Hot is released.
I haven't laughed so hard in a long time.
I'm so surprised, and disappointed.