Kandymans adventures in game production land...
Here is the idea, I make a series of games that teach people design principles, and game creation techniques.
It works by moving the character through a series of stages, which i have decided to define as "LANDS". There would be a storyline, but mainly to enhance the entertainment value of playing through the learning experience.
There could be storywriting land, storyboarding land, creation land, and finally scripting land.
You can imagine all sorts of possibilities while at the same time emparting ideas and knowledge on to people...
plus the design tips imparted are translateable into all other fields of creative production...
i can imagine the scripting land something like a matrix take off...
Who would like to cowrite this with me???... as a community we could all contribute ideas knowledge, and principles of learning... i would like to track down and incorporate those adventure game writing tips that "adventure developers" released a while ago.
This is quiet a different idea to the Demo Quest, and one i think will be quiet useful, and will serve as a guide to all those who imediately ask... "how make game.... tellllll me nooooooooooowwwww!!!11!1!1, why game not funny,Ã, arrrrgghghghghghg...."
ok i'll get off the soapbox now... oh, and the crack....
I think it's a fair idea. Although, as you say, it'd need to be a series.
It would be a pain for someone who's only interested in scripting to have to complete Storyboard land, Music land, Character Plot land and Art land first.
Apart from that, I'd say go for it. It would become a universal link for every newb that passes by these hallowed doors.
i'd like an adventures in How To Get Volume Sliders In The Game and Not Just The GUI So I Can Make A Little Music Mixer Game Land.....
you are persistent boyd, I will grant you that ;D
Heh, I like this idea, making it as a series is the best option imo. Heck, I might be interested in co-designing/writing it! I have several projects atm, but I can always spare time for game design :).
Boyd: Hmm, I wonder if that's possible actually.. ;)
Also, I think that not only newbies will be interested in this, as I know I as a designer love reading design tips and articles, and there's always something that a person isn't too good at when it comes to game making. Also, with an interesting story going in the background, it could
I'd envision it as the main character starting to make a game, and going through each and every step in the game making. So, unlike the demo quest, there wouldn't be multiple interfaces designed in scripting land, juts one. The interface for the "outer game" would be different though. This should be open-source, but actually it doesn't really have to be, maybe just scripting land.. It's more about teaching the whole game making proccess than teaching the engine. Ah, hell, I have lots of ideas all ready. :)
i was considering something like durring game design the creator is knocked unconcious, and has to move through his subconcious creating his game from a number of different angles...
who ever i co write each one with can be the main character for that chapter...
for example say i team up with mods to write a music creation land, then the game would start with mods sitting at home creating game music to go in sequence, when say for the sake of temporary ridiculousness is struck unconcious by the kandyman ninja... mods slips into dreamland and now has to write music is a storybased setting, having characters explain how chord structures work, loops, tracks, sound filters, and principles behind creating atmposphere, and style... all with there own puzzles...
so that after playing through the player can go away and then apply their new knowledge to using any music creation software, as they are principles and not software based tutorials...
i think this proccess would greatly help everyone...
we could all work together on titles, and list principles, ideas, methods, over various fields that can then be broken down and wirtten into the game storylines??
opinions?
i would love you to help Ginny, what is your design/creation strengths
I was thinking of doing something similar, so I might help co-create it you, Kandy.
Actually I had similar idea too, but as I haven't even started it yet, go for it.
Sounds great. Which reminds me, I need to finish my anatomy tutorial.
Awwwwwwweeesssome... ok... logical steps to begining...
i think starting a forum topic where people can submit, ideas and principles that they use and have helped them... going through old tutorials, and looking at other tips that have been listed.
then amalgamating those into a cohesive story arc.
i think the creation of an irc channel with set meeting times for those interested in contributing would be also a bonus.
I'd love to work with you DG, and Ginny... the best title to start would be "concept design" the question should be asked though would it be best to work on story only first, then graphics as a seperate title... although "story boarding" is a key step in story development... though dependant on the creator may just be boxes, with lists of actions...
opinions?
should i start a forum thread for contributions??
time to start concieving...
I was just thinking, the music one would be REALLY hard to do, because everyone has different methods of composing, and we all have our different favourite software.
It'd be a jolly long game if you endeavoured to explain the workings of EACH of them. You'd have to explain how to do loops in about 5 different programs...
Quote from: Peter Thomas on Wed 19/05/2004 12:00:57
I was just thinking, the music one would be REALLY hard to do, because everyone has different methods of composing, and we all have our different favourite software.
So? That's the same with graphics as well, and, to some extent, scripting (everyone has their own techniques & stuff). Everyone has their own styles & ways of doing things, and this project could show them all.
I think we start with "concept design".
Quote from: Peter Thomas on Wed 19/05/2004 12:00:57
I was just thinking, the music one would be REALLY hard to do, because everyone has different methods of composing, and we all have our different favourite software.
It'd be a jolly long game if you endeavoured to explain the workings of EACH of them. You'd have to explain how to do loops in about 5 different programs...
dude this is the point i'm making... for starters, alot of people don't understand what things are. let alone how to find them in different software. The games are aimed at teaching people skills NOT software. Explaining what a loop is... what it can do, how when coupled with other effects can create interest style etc...
the idea of these games is to teach skills, concepts, ideas, and practices... that when interpreted by the palyer and then used CREATE the players own style...
it wouldn't teach you to make music like MODs, it would show you how music is made so you can create your own in a new and interesting way... blah blah... etc etc
DG you are right... but would you include "story boarding" as part of concept design....??
I think story boarding would be a part of the concept design process, but more so a later stage.
I also thing that before we begin, we should do a concept design of the game. We need a model or a process of game writing so we can implement it into structure for our game.
For example, would the concept design process follow a pattern like this:
1. Getting Ideas
2. Developing Ideas
3. Planning
4. Story boarding
That's nothing set in stone, but it give a basic idea of the structure we might want to follow.
You need voices to make this work!
I'll do it! :-p
Also, before storyboarding, writing the story, xhatacters, puzzle charts, and possibly interface if it has some significance (and it should, usually), brainstorming, dialogs, decisions, naming, etc. There are many stages and aspects to cover.
Kandy: You could say my stregths lie in story design, puzzles, and to a lesser extent scripting. :)
Aye, I think we need to group such categories into related sections.
For example, the brainstorming, storyboarding, character, decisions, etc should be a part of concept design or pre-production.
The actually game development process would included game creation elements.
Or, here's another idea...
We could just list a series of elements (such as storyboarding, character, interface, etc) and let the player choose the relevant section as opposed to a showing a chronological development of a game.
Hmm, but that would break the flow of the backstory wouldn't it? Then again, if it's supposed to be more of a learning experiencse, the different elements can be chosen in any order. You must complete all the elements to finish the game, though, but the order is non-linear. In fact, how about allowing the player to move between sections, doing them simultaneously? However, characetr design, artwork, puzzles, dialogs, storyboards, music and scripting can't be done without the concept and story, which need to come first.
Also, what about the later stages, like pre-beta testing, beta testing, fixing bugs and problems, implementing suggestions, more testing, possible voicng. Advertising and updating thr public is also a part of it, though some prefer to just release it when it's finished. It'd be nice to demonstrate building interest at the right time. Bonus elemets: easter eggs, bonuses, points, secrets, manual writing or something, finishing touches and such.. Maybe I'm just covering too many aspects here. But, here's a general layout of how it could work:
1-Idea Generation-
Could use tips from a thread there was on this forum once, about finding inspiration.
2-Concept design-Story writing-Characters-Setting-Mood-
Switching between designing a concept, an idea, an interface, something original, and writing a story, the characters, the setting (place and time, mainly), and the mood or atmosphere.
3-Puzzles-Dialogs-Storyboards-Graphics-Scripting-Music-Advertising-Voicing(optional)-
Juggling all these elements. You can perform them in any order, or do them simultaneously, switching between them. All the sections could be like diffferent "lands" as Kandyman said, and transporting between a set of lands would be possible. Advertising could be less of a land and more of a place to update and get responses from virtual people, sorta like the forums maybe. Or could be cut out completely, by choice.
4-Testing-Finishing touches-
Well, basically a bit of beta testing practise, and polishing.
5-Release-
Then, release at last! ;)
[
-Bonus "lands"-
Sorta like bonus levels, of lots of things that are ot neccessary, but can do good to the game: easter eggs, concept art, custom functions, etc... These would be optional, of course, maybe even secret, like you need to find them first.
]
Surely, some people don't work by this plan, some like to draw straight away, or scirpt or make music, some may even start the game with an idea that cam from scripting and music, and go from there, designing the characters while drawing them, and not storyborading at all, writing the story, dialogs etc on the fly. However we cannot cover all methods, and it's most suitable and comfortable in my opinion to go by a (loose) plan, though still always leaving things open to some changes.
What do you think? :)
kandymans adventures in concept land is now in the concept stages....
w00t! Let me know when you need those voices ;) (Or anything else non-art, music, or programming related)
You can get our coffee.
Right! Two sugars and cream, right DG?