A Hunter-C&C

[big brother]

Well, they are GAME sprites. Better color management means an easier time animating.

PS. My paintover only used 1.5 colors!

[CaptainBinky]

They are GAME sprites, yes. But not DOS game sprites. Agreed, that few colours can make animation easier, but more colours doesn't necessarily make animation hard. Liberating yourself from a strict palette *can* make animation more painless. It's swings and roundabouts. All I'm saying is you don't HAVE to worry about colours.

[Saberteeth]

Better color management means an easier time animating.

Hah, not for me. I don't mind more colors. Even if there are more colors in a character, the quality of the animation is about the pose and the frame detail.

EDIT: Captain Binky, you know what I'm talking about.Ã, 

[big brother]

I'm not sure I understand the reasoning...

How can more colors make animating painless? A smaller indexed palette is always easier to manage than a larger one, whether or not you are "worrying" about colors. Low color is also a way for a spriter to showcase her talent through strong color choices and application.

Are you even talking about pixel? What does DOS have to do with it?

[CaptainBinky]

I'm not sure this is the best place to have this discussion, but I shall continue anyway.

When I say "not worry too much about colours" what I mean is...

If I were making a VGA type game (or any video display with a limited colour display) then I would have to be very careful about colours and use, say 128 for my backgrounds and then start dividing up the remaining colours between characters and restrict myself to, say, 16 for the main character.

Now I use DPaint just as I would if I were making a restricted palette game, but because I haven't got to worry about restrictive colours, I can use all 256 colours (if I want) as potential colours to use in the animation - I may have a gradient of 16 skin tones for example. When I'm animating, each frame probably will have no more than 32 colours in it because too much shading can be slow and tediius to animate. But in total, over the entire animation, the number of colours may be 50, or 60, I dunno I haven't counted. And I haven't counted because I really couldn't care. It's not important to me how many colours are in the sprite, just whether it looks okay.

If your particular style is low colour art, then by all means choose 6 and go with it. But it's not the case that you should HAVE to use few colours, or that it makes you a better artist if you do. Using low colours is a skill, for sure, but it's just A skill, not THE skill when it comes to making 24bit games.

I've worked on Gameboy games where I've HAD to use a limited palette. I have those necessary skills. I choose not to use them because this is a hobby to me not my job. I get limitations imposed on me by my job all the time (albeit the polygonal kind), I see no reason why you should need to impose similar limitations on an AGS game when no actual limitaions like that exist (unless you choose to use 8bit of course).

Edit: Oh and when I said DOS, I meant as in CGA, EGA, VGA, etc. i.e not 24bit

[big brother]

I agree this is a total hijack. Maybe I should edit this post later with a paintover so it's somewhat relevant.

Binky, I understand your point. But the majority of artists hear don't have your experience. They should learn the rules first, too, before they break them. That is why low color is emphasized. (i.e. If it looks good with 6 colors, it will look good with 50, but NOT necessarily the other way around)

When I'm animating, each frame probably will have no more than 32 colours in it because too much shading can be slow and tediius to animate.

I see you DO agree with me.

I don't think the majority of people on these forums use DPaint (at least that should not be assumed). Most of the programs used here automate palette management, counting colors for you (a la Photoshop or the GIMP).

[Saberteeth]

I agree this is a total hijack. Maybe I should edit this post later with a paintover so it's somewhat relevant.

Yes well, that WOULD be a good idea.Ã, 

But the majority of artists hear don't have your experience. They should learn the rules first, too, before they break them.

Em, yes that would be great. I mean, let's face it, you don't want to get on the wrong side of the guy who made Apprentice, right? I understand the rules, don't worry about that. It's just that I like my style better with more colors. If you want, I'll show you how my hunter pic would look in let's say, 6-8 colors?

I don't think the majority of people on these forums use DPaint (at least that should not be assumed). Most of the programs used here automate palette management, counting colors for you (a la Photoshop or the GIMP).

If you are prefering in particular to me than let me dissapoint you: I use DPaint for my bgs and maybe even for some of my characters(animation is a different story, but that's not what this is about).

EDIT: The magic of eight colors!


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[sergiocornaga]

Behold the magic of three colours:

 



I'd have to say I agree with Big Brother on this one, but not to the extent shown here. Basically, just don't use photoshop filters 'cause they add a whole lot of colours  that you don't want. Not that anyone is doing that here...

Oh, and in terms of an actual paintover (well I do like the extreme contrast on the legs) I changed the feet a little. They don't look quite as authentic anymore, but slightly more footlike.

[Mad]

I'm not quite sure about the moustache bit of the beard (I hope I'm interpreting this correctly), it still looks a bit like a mouth.
Nontheless your sprite is still really good, so I tried to keep as true to it as possible and pushed just a few pixels here and there to define some forms better: the collar, lapels, knees.
I also thought the black to be a tad to harsh and changed it to a dark brown.





I hope this works for you!

[CaptainBinky]

Definately think that that moustache needs to move up by a pixel to stop it looking like a mouth...

[Saberteeth]

Look guys, that's great'n'all but I don't need to see your skills of CGA graphics, mkay? I need help with this sprite! Yes, i got some ideas but I don't like the basic coloring
Oh, and let's clarify one more thing: I don't want the moustache anymore!




*Used Captain Binkys paintover
*Added a beard!
*Changed some of the colors
*lightened the coat

[skw]

Comparing this one to the other characters placed at your site, I can say it's OK and fits the style pretty well (although the others are less "colorful"). Look at your first post in that thread and see how much you improved. I like it!

Actually, there's a nice color scheme but you've forgotten about adding some to the palette.

Oh, and good luck with the IJ game! I'm looking foward to play it!

[big brother]

A little late, but an edit nonetheless!

I think it speaks for itself...



In case you aren't listening, OMG IT'S ONLY 2 COLORS ISHEFEKINGINSANEOMGLOLZORZ!!!!1

[Saberteeth]

Yes well, there's no need to be sarcastic.

EDIT: Still good though

[CaptainBinky]

It may not be my place to say this to people who have been posting here for far longer than I have, but I assumed that the purpose of a paintover was exactly that, not posting an entirely new sprite (unless the thread starter expressly asked for poses, I guess).

Er,Ã, 

edit: having said that, that's a pretty cool sprite BB

[lemmy101]

> OMG IT'S ONLY 2 COLORS ISHEFEKINGINSANEOMGLOLZORZ!!!!1

hehe

That's nothing! check this out!!




0 colours! I win

I intend to do a retro 40's style point-and-click programmed onto a punch card at some point using my fabled 0 colour sprites. I plan for dialogue options to be printed out on ticker tape too.

To try and bring this post from the brink of pointlessness just want to say I agree with Binky's sentiment that the number of colours doesn't really matter  to me now-a-days. I respect the skills neccessary to pull off a sprite using few colours but rarely feel it adds anything to the sprite unless the style of the game itself is to use a specific small palette (Like the Herman Toothrot game).

In fact when I remember old speccy games I subconsiously remember them as high-colour, high-res graphic fests. It's more the style of game, and the style of art, music and such that gives me that nostalgic feeling.

Cheers,

Lemmy

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

HIJACKING THREADS IS VERBOTEN! 

Some of this discussion was actually relevant and useful, but let's not get off on a rant, people.  Keep this thread within the limits of Saberteeth's hunter.

I don't think there's a problem with using alot of colors, but looking at your sprite I can see more 'effective' ways of using the same colors.

1.  Made the shading more consistent
2.  Lowered gun hand slightly





I think the sprite itself is very good and hopefully this will get you moving on to the next one.

[KristjanMan]

Umm no offense but the guy you drawed ProgZmax doesn't remind me a hunter he looks like some guy with a gun. Then again it might just be me. Aboute the sprite that needs help: for me it's fine the only thing i don't like are the boots something weird about them just can't tell what

[Saberteeth]

ProgZ, that's not what I was looking for. I've moved on and made the side view:


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If you see anything wrong with it, please do post...

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

I've already tried to explain what is wrong with the sprite, and this has carried over to the side view:  ineffective use of shading.  You have too many samey, low-contrast colors that don't stand out enough to justify themselves, and the shading itself is erratic.  Case in point, the legs:





On the left you have light colors scattered into dark without taking into account lighting or contrast, and the results are erratic.  The version on the right uses fewer colors and the higher contrast ones in your palette, though it would definitely benefit from new, high contrast shades of blue that aren't quite so saturated.  The darker colors get, the tougher it is to discern differences between them, so if you want details to stand out you absolutely MUST understand contrast.  This is not meant to insult you but to help, which is why you have posted to the critics lounge.  Big Brother in particular will no doubt agree with me that your sprite will greatly benefit from less saturation and higher contrasting colors.  The third version uses somewhat lighter, higher contrast colors to give you an idea of how to make details stand out.  I hope you find this useful.