Adventure Game Studio

Well, according to SSH's blog I was supposed to announce the AGS Awards since he is on holiday.

Therefore, it gives me great pleasure to announce that nominations are now open for the AGS Awards 2008!

What are the AGS Awards?

The AGS Awards are an annual event where you vote on the best AGS games of the year.

The process has two stages -- nominations, and voting.

So what happened for the nominations?

The Nominations stage is now complete. This is where you nominate games for awards that you think they deserve to win. This year, you could nominate as many games in as many categories as you like.

The nominations page listed all the games of 2008 in alphabetical order. Have a look down the list, and when you see a game you played and think is deserving of an award, click the "I want to nominate this game" link. This will open up a list of awards that you can nominate it for. Rinse and repeat.

Can I nominate for my own game?

Of course, if you think it's deserving! You'd be silly not to!

What about the voting?

With all the nominations are all in, the 5 games that have the most nominations in each category go forward to the voting stage.

Which games were nominated this year?

Visit SSH's blog (http://ags-ssh.blogspot.com/2009/01/ags-awards-nominees.html) or open the Voting page (http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/awards.php?action=dovote) to see the nominated games in each category.

Which games won this year?

You can now download the Awards Ceremony (http://ssh.me.uk/AGS_Awards_2008.zip) to see the winners, or if you're impatient just go straight to SSH's blog (http://ags-ssh.blogspot.com/2009/02/ags-award-results.html).

Nice one Mr. Jones!

Just one minor slip: I think Marion's "Horse Park" should be in the "non adventure games" category.

Oops thanks, fixed.

Well, clearly I'm doing something wrong. I can't get it to accept any of my clicks. I was able to generally nominate a few games, but not for any specific categories. Maybe it's a browser issue, or something. Or it's entirely possible I'm an idiot. Either way, I've done my part as an American and voted. I also did it wrong, or didn't know what to do once I got in the voting booth. I think I may have voted for Pat Buchanan or Ron Paul. Possibly Kinky Friedman. Who knows? But I'm proud to say that I voted (badly).

What exactly went wrong? If there's a problem with the page then I need to fix it.

I've tested it in IE and Firefox and it seems fine, so can you be more specific about what problem you had?

QuoteI was able to generally nominate a few games, but not for any specific categories.

...if you didn't select any categories, then you haven't nominated the game.

CJ,

When I got home, I tried voting with IE instead of Firefox, and it worked just fine. It may just be that one of my Firefox plugins that's causing the trouble. I turned off "No Script" before I went to nominations page, but there might be something else running under the hood that's blocking something. Who knows?

Anyhoo, problem solved. Now that it's working for me, let me say I like this year's nominations page better than last years. Good work.

- Ponch

This system is far and away superior to all the other methods combined.

Yes.  I've never actually voted before (haven't been here long enough, this'll be the first), but it was very straight forward and simple. :P

I agree this is by far the best way to vote yet, and very easy to quickly check up on any missed games.

First year of no Yahtzee!

Well, unless AGS Yahtzee wins, that is  :=

Good luck to everyone! There's going to be some tough choices ahead...

No bias here, tho :)

Spoiler

BJ for teh win!!!1117

[close]

I love the new format !

It's days like this when I kick myself for not playing more AGS games.
Of all the games on that 2008 list I think I've only played about 10.

I nominated a few things.  I love the nomination system - nice work!   ;D

I've just nominated the games I'd like to see getting awards, and I'll second what others have already said - the new nomination system is beautifully simple to use. Well done!

I've been slacking. I've only played three of the games on the list, one of them being my own. I'd feel dickish only to nominate myself and one other (didn't complete the last).

I'm gonna do a run-through for about ~20 games I've picked out that looked promising, furiously writing small notes to help me remember what was good or bad about them.

That's a lot of games!

Usually I wouldn't vote unless I had played every game (for fairness reasons) but I don't think that's going to happen this time. I'm afraid I'm only going to play through the ones that look and sound the most interesting to me and vote off them. I know this isn't really fair but it's either that or don't vote at all.

In the last years there were "for your consideration threads" at the general discussion board.

http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/yabb/index.php?topic=33457.0

Maybe it would help out some people to decide which games to play...

Quote from: bicilotti on Sat 03/01/2009 21:49:49
Well, let's get it started ;)

Maybe a separate thread would be better? But nice to choose my favourite strip!

I already voted and must say that I did so because this time, the voting was a simple, painless and even enjoyable affair. The new layout really is well-done!

I'm glad you all like the nomination system this year -- and as requested I have created a For Your Consideration thread here:
http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/yabb/index.php?topic=36498.0
Advertise away!

bicilotti, I screwed up your post a bit while moving it to that thread, if you could re-post it that'd be great and then I'll delete the version I posted there.

Quote from: Pumaman on Sun 04/01/2009 00:19:46
bicilotti, I screwed up your post a bit while moving it to that thread, if you could re-post it that'd be great and then I'll delete the version I posted there.

Done! And let me state (along with the other forum members) that the nomination page this year is way improved: no way of forgotting by mistake a single game!

Wow, that was really easy.


Vote Ben Jordan for President... uh I mean the AGS Awards!

Hey - I am clearly logged in, as you can see, but in none of the four browsers (Firefox, Opera, Chrome, IE) I have tried I seem to be able to go to the nominations page, it always keeps on telling me to log in - ironically, it then redirects me to the forums and I am logged in again...

Quote from: kaputtnik on Sun 04/01/2009 13:57:41
Hey - I am clearly logged in, as you can see, but in none of the four browsers (Firefox, Opera, Chrome, IE) I have tried I seem to be able to go to the nominations page, it always keeps on telling me to log in - ironically, it then redirects me to the forums and I am logged in again...

Heh oops, that's what happens when you move the forums to a new server but not the games page!


EDIT: Ok, the games page has now been moved to the new server. I have updated the first post in this thread with the new URL for the nominations page.

 Hi,

   Am I obliged to nominate all the games that I want at once or can I go back anytime I want and include more nominations?

Quote from: AsimosVagan on Mon 05/01/2009 21:14:14
Hi,

   Am I obliged to nominate all the games that I want at once or can I go back anytime I want and include more nominations?

First one you've said.

Correct, you get once chance to submit the page, so make sure you nominate all the games that you want to at that time.

Nominations are still open for another 8 days, so there's plenty of time to check the list of registered games on that page and try them out before actually submitting your nominations.

Just bumping this to make sure everybody notices it.

5 days left to get your nominations in, if you haven't done so already!

Thanks to Mr Jones for single-handedly running this while I was building snowmen in Spain. I would claim some part, but my contribution consisted solely of "Please do X for me, CJ" and "Wow, what you did is great, CJ".  :=

And to everyone else:
VOTE NOW! especially in the Sound Effects and Demo categories which are running a bit short on the old vote front.

What's the projected date for the awards SSH?

Hope there's some kind of game(that's the way the awards were presented last year via game) like last year...Cheers.

Quote from: Dualnames on Wed 14/01/2009 12:21:35
Hope there's some kind of game(that's the way the awards were presented last year via game) like last year.

I second that. There was something inexplicably nifty about watching all those characters accept awards. Especially giant Nelly terrorizing all the smaller sprites.

- Ponch

Quote from: Ponch on Wed 14/01/2009 15:59:14

Quote from: Dualnames on Wed 14/01/2009 12:21:35
Hope there's some kind of game(that's the way the awards were presented last year via game) like last year.

I second that. There was something inexplicably nifty about watching all those characters accept awards. Especially giant Nelly terrorizing all the smaller sprites.

- Ponch

I have to disagree. Somehow watching that "game" made me think of the idiom "watching grass grow". And I mean that literally, I mean watching grass grow in timelapse is very fascinating. But in that presentation (IIRC) you couldn't even skip dialogs, so I never watched it to the end.

Quote from: zabnat on Wed 14/01/2009 17:27:33
I have to disagree. Somehow watching that "game" made me think of the idiom "watching grass grow". And I mean that literally, I mean watching grass grow in timelapse is very fascinating. But in that presentation (IIRC) you couldn't even skip dialogs, so I never watched it to the end.

This year there will actually be some gameplay, and if you finish the game you actually win an AGS award... ;) Seriously, though, we've already had this discussion (http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/yabb/index.php?topic=35714.msg468034#msg468034)

Yes and there will be a live "dont be a fat lazy slob who downloads it 8 days later" ceremony in #ags too!! :P

So what's the date? I swear Dualnames is permenantly drunk. I know people don't understand ME, but jeeesus, I don't understand a single sentance that guy says :P When is the award announcement date?

It's a secret

Spoiler

I don't know

[close]

I enjoyed the 'live' irc ceremony's when they were in their heyday. And yes, I believe I was a co-host back in the day, and it was hard work let me tell you. Several hours, stupid o'clock in the morning (this was before I moved to England), because DG did it GMT, to get the biggest audience numbers. There was a great amount of planning that went into it. And I still didn't win the p3n1sh award for Dickboy, the ultimate p3n1sh no effort game.

I miss the p3n1sh award.

Quote from: Mods on Wed 14/01/2009 17:52:58
Yes and there will be a live "dont be a fat lazy slob who downloads it 8 days later" ceremony in #ags too!! :P

So what's the date? I swear Dualnames is permenantly drunk. I know people don't understand ME, but jeeesus, I don't understand a single sentance that guy says :P When is the award announcement date?

Don't worry Mods.. sometimes I make sentences that really don't make sense at all, and that's when I'm sober :-*. When I'm drunk, I have trouble typing without falling from the chair. 8)

Edit: Forgot to ask, if there's an IRC AGS ceremony sort, has it been scheduled? (I  fear this has been already asked)

Edit2: Forgot to think before asking..

I can't really schedule an IRC meet until I get a rough idea at least of when the awards are ready to be announced..

By the way, your previous post explains why people never take any notice of my posts.. They don't get them...Thanksy Modsy you saved me from a lot of spended money in my phychologist. ::)

Ok, I must be drunk..permanently..Man sometimes I post like an idiot.

Quote from: Mods on Fri 16/01/2009 09:33:24
I can't really schedule an IRC meet until I get a rough idea at least of when the awards are ready to be announced..

We could just hold it tomorrow night and make up the winners like they do on Top Gear. Who needs democracy?

OK, here's how I think the schedule will go:

Nominations close tonight at midnight GMT. I'll announce the nominations on a Stickam conference room on Saturday somewhen, then hopefully post a text list and youtube vid later.

There will then be 3 weeks or so until final voting closes. It may take CJ a few days to get the voting page finalized, I guess, but voting will then close and I'll pass the results to m0ds and try and get the ceremony game ready to be released at the same time as the ceremony, which I guess will be around 8pm on a Saturday (14th Feb?) based on previous years...

I hope I can be there this year. I always seem to miss them.

Nominations are now closed!

Thanks for your time taking part guys, this year 91 people submitted nominations which is good to see. I'm sure SSH will be announcing the results and the process for voting in due course.

Quote from: Pumaman on Sat 17/01/2009 01:29:30
Nominations are now closed!

Balls.
With timing like this, I should be a drummer.

Is there any way to see what was and wasn't nominated before the voting starts?

Quote from: Pumaman on Sat 17/01/2009 01:29:30
this year 91 people submitted nominations which is good to see

I wonder how many people submitted nominations in previous years.

Quote from: Nostradamus on Sat 17/01/2009 15:57:29

Quote from: Pumaman on Sat 17/01/2009 01:29:30
this year 91 people submitted nominations which is good to see

I wonder how many people submitted nominations in previous years.

http://ags-ssh.blogspot.com/2008/02/ags-awards-2007.html

edit: almost double, thanks ssh and cj for the new nomination-form!

Nominations to be announced live on stickam at 4:45pm GMT (i.e. in 15 minutes sorry for short notice!) and hopefully to be youtubed shortly after:

http://www.stickam.com/loadDebateRoom.do?roomId=934193

Well, that was.... interesting...

I'll try and get a vid on youtube soon. Meanwhile... take a peek here! (http://ags-ssh.blogspot.com/2009/01/ags-awards-nominees.html)

Quote from: SSH on Sat 17/01/2009 17:36:44
Well, that was.... interesting...

I'll try and get a vid on youtube soon. Meanwhile... take a peek here! (http://ags-ssh.blogspot.com/2009/01/ags-awards-nominees.html)

Congrats to all the nominees. :)

Looks like I've got another year of drinking heavily ahead of me again.

- Ponch

What, neither Barn Runner got enough nominations?  What an unjust world this can be ;(.


Also, thank you to all the people that nominated Limey and his pals for so many great things!  The bloke already feels like a winner!

Aw, I missed it. :(

Well done to all, anyway. :)

OK, the final voting is now open (CJ or another mod, can you update the first page, please?)

Vote here! (http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/awards.php?action=dovote)

Well, I cast my votes, although I'm disappointed Barn Runner wasn't in any of the categories.   :(

I was about to say I was a little weird that hhgtg demo wasn't there but then I noticed some cool games that didn't even make it with worthing it more..

Wow, a lot of the same games coming up over and over again. How many people actually played ALL the games because I've gotta say, it seems a little biased towards "vote for your favourite games out of the few that you did actually play." :(

I'm also guilty of this however.

Quote from: i stole your car on Sun 18/01/2009 00:29:07
Wow, a lot of the same games coming up over and over again. How many people actually played ALL the games because I've gotta say, it seems a little biased towards "vote for your favourite games out of the few that you did actually play." :(

I'd agree to an extent. So much spread over so few titles (not to disparage any of the nominees) is a little disappointing, simply because it may not reflect all the goodness contained in the last AGS year.

But votes is votes is votes.

Barn Runner 5 is still my favorite game of 2008! :)

Congrats to all nominees.
There are so many I've missed, I have to get playing them quick.

Quote from: i stole your car on Sun 18/01/2009 00:29:07
I've gotta say, it seems a little biased towards "vote for your favourite games out of the few that you did actually play." :(

This is true, but you can look at it as another step in the elimination process.
These games were played more than others because they got more attention, whether through word of mouth or score in the database or whatever, which is usually an indication of them being good.

Quote from: CJ
With all the nominations are all in, the 5 games that have the most nominations in each category go forward to the voting stage.

Does that mean that the categories with less than 5 games* only got that many nominations?

*i.e. Best NPC only has 4 and Best Demo only has 3.

As in previous years minimum of 3 votes required for a game to be nominated and some of the less-than-5s are down to too-complex tied votes for 5th place (on 4 votes each so just above the threshold anyway)

Where's the P3N15 award?  :)

where are my games?  :'(  :=

on a more serious note. It does look like some of the popular games are just nominated in all categories. 

Think Hollywood. Blockbusters are nominated for the Oscar in nearly every category. There are some obscure names coming up once in a while, but in general, it's the same names all over - which only means that those were the most popular ones.

It seems, however, that lots of people just chose their favourite game and voted for it over and over again - I loved A Second Face for example, and I think it deserves all of the nominations it can get, but the player character was really not very notable. Well, nothing to worry about.

On another note: I am really surprised by the nomination of Man Boy for best audio - now vote the crap out of the establishment!

Quote from: i stole your car on Sun 18/01/2009 00:29:07
Wow, a lot of the same games coming up over and over again. How many people actually played ALL the games because I've gotta say, it seems a little biased towards "vote for your favourite games out of the few that you did actually play." :(

This tends to happen every year. I'm not sure whether the new nominations page this year has made it better or worse -- on the one hand it now displays all games so you can't accidentally forget the less notable ones; but on the other hand it makes it almost too easy to just nominate your favourite game in every category.

Anyway, this sort of thing is one of the reasons that the Pick of the Month and Cup Ratings on the games page exist, so that good games that miss out on the Awards still get recognition.

I also remember, that certain games were always favorized.
Take a look at the nomination history of the AGS awards:
http://www.americangirlscouts.org/agswiki/AGS_Awards

Last year it was the "Two Kindom" game. The Yahtzee and Dave Gilbert games were always very popular, both "Apprentice" games have been very popular and Grundislav has always been there, so nothing changed. It was the first year without a Yahtzee game however...

I think the main reason for this is that most people who vote at the nominations are old AGSers and know wich games to play. People like Ivy, Woltaire and Grundislav have been there for years releasing their works with a certain style. A lot of people know them and simply play their games first because they know what they get.

With all those fanatic "Vote Ben Jordan for President" messages in all kind of threads it is pretty clear that a small sub community has built up who follow a certain serie or developer.
For example the gameplay in Ben Jordan 7 was just the same like in all other parts and based on the old sierra style. Nothing new... The documentation is a two page addition to the manual. The puzzles were mostly related to given dialogues and so on...

Ivy's Nanobots had actually five player characters, so there was a five time chance to get that nomination, but if you ask me which bot I find most interesting I simply wouldn't know it...

The nice thing about "A Second Face" is, that it was just released two weeks before the nominations began. Since it is a very long game, it didn't really have time to get popular. I think the results of this nominations show the true Blockbuster force of this work, that, although being still a sleeping beauty, managed to strike through all categories.

I think there should be a limit on how many categories each person can nominate each game. If you ask me there should be a limit of 3 categories per game for each person who nominates. I don't know how to enforce that but Chris, the scripting genius that he is, can surely find a way to script that in the nominations page for next year.

Blockbuster... Hollywood, or what have you, whatever, I'm super thankful that Castle of Fire is at least a nominee (best non-adventure). Suprised is to say the least. I really wasn't expecting to see it there. I was a little dissapointed for Hammerblade since his music wasn't included in best music, but good luck to everyone that was.

I'm pretty confident ColourWise will win, and surely deserves it!

And congrats to everyone else that is nominated.

I don't understand this nomination discussion...
I like the AGS awards like they are (I don't say this because I'm nominated)

The awards were just done to have some fun and it's already cool that they even exist (Really, I don't say that because I'm nominated)

I think all nominees have been choosen very well. May god bless their asses. (See above...)

I like Ben Jordan! This guy really knows how to kick demon's balls!

I love Ivy's red hair. Would you like to be my new girlfriend?

In the end, the true winners of the awards are always SSH and Chris Jones since they did all the award scripting stuff. If you pay them you will always win. (Did I already mention, that I would never say things like that just if I was nominated?)

in the end I don't really mind too much but it kinda anoys me that you can't just make a terrible game with good music and pick up the award for best music.

Quote from: Buckethead on Sun 18/01/2009 19:12:27
in the end I don't really mind too much but it kinda anoys me that you can't just make a terrible game with good music and pick up the award for best music.

Don't say this: "Night of the Hermit" won the best sound effects award in 2001...

The thing is people can only vote/nominate a game they have played.  

I don't think people are just voting for their friends, I think they are genuinely voting for the games they beleive deserve the award... When games are released and announced in the Completed Games forum, the higher quality games always generate a buzz... people are limited for time, so they have to choose which games to play and which games to miss out.  They are naturally going to choose to play the games with the most buzz.

But this buzz is generally deserved... and I personally think the nominations reflect this very well.  Sure, it might seem as if only the most popular games have been nominated, but then they are popular for a reason - because they are good.

I'd like to hijack the thread and say thanks to all the guys and guyettes who nominated OUAC. I didn't expect it to turn up in the places where it *did* turn up at all  :) I already feel extremely proud.

Quote from: Buckethead on Sun 18/01/2009 19:12:27
in the end I don't really mind too much but it kinda anoys me that you can't just make a terrible game with good music and pick up the award for best music.

Yeah, I know :P

Quote from: Buckethead on Sun 18/01/2009 19:12:27
in the end I don't really mind too much but it kinda anoys me that you can't just make a terrible game with good music and pick up the award for best music.

Music is all part of a 'whole' though.  You can't really have a crappy game with amazing music and have people actually notice it.  Music is all about the mood it helps set in the game, which that mood is usually only felt if the 'whole' game is done properly.
Like if the character enters a dark sewer system, you want the music to help portray how the character and player should feel.  Otherwise without that mood, the music obviously wasn't good or the game couldn't carry the music.
This is only my opinion of course.


Anyway, congratulations on the nominated games!  I'm happy to see my Road Racer game in three nomination divisions. :P  Didn't see that coming.

I don't know, really. The awards usually play out in a such a way, and this year doesn't seem to be any different.

I'm going to be honest though; I am genuinely surprised that Geltz managed to get nom'ed in every category it was eligible for. Not because I don't think it's a good game, but, as somebody touched on before, it only had two weeks on release to find such high favour. Such a high nom result in this case is going to raise eyebrows, weather we like it or not.

For those that think there should be a limit on how many categories a game can be nominated for, I don't think that would be fair or much use. It would only end up punishing games for daring to excel in more than whatever number of categories would be deemed appropriate.

EDIT: Though, now that I think of it, Geltz has no original music (correct me if I'm wrong) as the soundtrack is composed of extracts from the works of Carl Orff, and therefore is nominated in a category for which no actual original content has been created. :-\

This may make me seem awfully pissy about the whole thing, but sweeping nom patterns will, as I said earlier, raise eyebrows.

Hey Limping,

I took place at the chat session for the nominations and directly mentioned, that the sound track was made by extracts of Carl Orffs music. I also asked directly to cancel me from the nominations in the music category.

The answer I got was: "So Carl will get the award..."
But for me it's still Ok: Please kick me out of that.

Hello Le Woltaire,

I hope you didn't take my post as implying some sort of covert attempt to deceive on your part, or as a questioning of your ethics. :)

I was instead pointing out the problems of blanket nominating, where people simply nominate their favourite game in every category, regardless. This can be down to a number of factors; blind fan nomination, players not actually realizing that the music they are hearing isn't an original composition, etc.

I think a clarification of the category might be in order, altering the name to "Best Original Music"; though if people simply don't take the time to read the game's credits, I'm not sure if this would help.

Again, I'm sorry if it came across that I was accusing you of anything, and I wish you the best of luck with the awards. :)

Quote from: LimpingFish on Sun 18/01/2009 22:38:54
For those that think there should be a limit on how many categories a game can be nominated for, I don't think that would be fair or much use. It would only end up punishing games for daring to excel in more than whatever number of categories would be deemed appropriate.

I understood the suggestion to be that each individual voter could only nominate it in a certain number of categories. If different voters nominated it in different categories, it could still end up getting nominated in as many as it deserved.

On the one hand, I think this solution would be unfortunate in that people might not be able to nominate the way they really felt (and could lead to weird split-vote scenarios). On the other hand, it would force them to think more carefully about which aspects of a game are really award-worthy.

The complete domination by a few games seems to be worse than usual this year. What, three games nominated in just about every category (apart from the special ones)? I wonder if higher participation has led to more casual players nominating only the most popular games. Well, at least it means I won't have to play a ton of games before I can vote.

Congratulations to everyone that got nominated!
As for the discussion about games and their makers being always nominated is just how things go and it's only natural.
Indiana Jones will always be seen by millions of people in the world even if H.Ford is 80 years-old!
And remember that a good game will always come up from the slumbers if it's really good.
I was happy to see my little demo to be picked, and because it wasn't, I intend to make the full version the best I can. It's the only way to go guys.
I also don't think it's very polite to talk about games that one did not like, specially on this thread.
We must accept the peoples choice.

Quote from: Essex on Sun 18/01/2009 15:40:57
Ivy's Nanobots had actually five player characters, so there was a five time chance to get that nomination, but if you ask me which bot I find most interesting I simply wouldn't know it...

Six, actually. Not sure how that nomination would work, either.

Quote from: Le Woltaire on Sun 18/01/2009 17:21:14
I love Ivy's red hair.

You're voting for my hair? Surely that's not fair to everyone else.  :-[

Edit: Also, thank you for all those nominations! I actually laughed when I saw them all, it was pretty surprising. :) Thanks again for playing and supporting my games. I sincerely appreciate it, especially because I'm trying to make a living at this now. It's quite scary sometimes, but seeing things like this really helps.

I'm quite happy with the short list.
Just damn look at those games -- if any of them was released commercially back in the golden age of adventure games, they would all be well-loved classics.
There's not a dud between them.
It's great that the community has rewarded "A Second Face", the game that I feared would be too original and courageous to fare well in a democratic vote.
And rightfully nominating "Sydney treads the catwalk" for the best player character proves that it's not always thoughtless blanket voting, as some of you suggest.

Really, look at the nominations again. Programming. Animation. Voice work. It's not so uniform as you whine.
Sure: ASF, Ben Jordan, Nanobots, Ben there and Limey are all over the place. But can you point to an AGS game from 2008 which is better than the 5? Maybe I haven't played a lot, but I cannot think of a better choice.

My doubts?

"Chatroom" deserves more than one nomination, but what would that be? Gameplay perhaps? Original story?
"A Second Face", as much as I love it, and it's my favourite game of 2008, doesn't have very good puzzles (I hate the fishing one...), although the textbox dialogue system can be a part of the puzzleness factor. The player character is quite mediocre as well, and the music is not original. Not that it matters much in this case.
And "Ben there, Dan that" I find very annoying, but that's the matter of personal taste.

And remember what Werner Herzog said: awards are for dogs and horses! :-)

Hey, thanks, Goldmund! I'm very happy Chatroom got nominated, but I wasn't sure what to expect since it seemed to be more of a sleeper 'hit,' if a hit at all.

As for the rest of the games, this year I haven't actually found the motivation to finish all of them. I've played most of the major ones on the list, but I found myself basically dropping games mid-way through with no plans to finish them to the end. The short ones I can muster up the time to finish, but it's been a real struggle for me to get through the longer ones every time I get stuck. (Sorry! It's just a personal problem.)

Quote from: LimpingFish on Sun 18/01/2009 22:38:54
.....it only had two weeks on release to find such high favour. Such a high nom result in this case is going to raise eyebrows, weather we like it or not.

I don't think that the release time has really something to do with the results, it is maybe more a question of the number of downloads and the distribution of the game.

I found out some info after looking at the major nominees database entries:
"Ben Jordan 7" was downloaded 1600 times in five months.
"Nanobots" was downloaded 1250 times in six months.
"A Second Face" was downloaded 2200 times in three weeks.

The other thing is that all the major nominees used teams, with voice actors or beta testers, that usually become potential nominators and voters.

Last year ATOTK was brought by a team of 17 persons. As far as I remember 50 persons took part at the nominations. It is pretty clear that some of the team members always vote for their game, which is not a crime, but with such a high number of team members and such low voting numbers it can actually influence the result.

Quote from: Essex on Mon 19/01/2009 01:03:45
I don't think that the release time has really something to do with the results, it is maybe more a question of the number of downloads and the distribution of the game...
"Nanobots" was downloaded 1250 times in six months...

To clarify, that only accounts for the number of downloads from the AGS site. Both Vince and I distribute Nanobots from our respective websites, and other game sites have asked and received permission to host and distribute it. So, the actual numbers are hard to figure out, but the AGS count is definitely a lowball estimate.

Quote from: Essex on Mon 19/01/2009 01:03:45
The other thing is that all the major nominees used teams, with voice actors or beta testers, that usually become potential nominators and voters.

Last year ATOTK was brought by a team of 17 persons. As far as I remember 50 persons took part at the nominations. It is pretty clear that some of the team members always vote for their game, which is not a crime, but with such a high number of team members and such low voting numbers it can actually influence the result.

That's actually a good point. It's debatable whether we could label this as unfair, though. But it does mean that a one-man game could automatically be at a disadvantage. I don't see how such a situation could be addressed, though, without implying that some form of abuse of the system is in effect.

Every awards season brings with it new discussions about how the process should be structured, and numerous voting/nomination/qualifying foibles are argued over. This can sometimes have the knock-on effect of tainting the nominees, which isn't really fair, and shouldn't be an issue when it's the fault of the system. I'm still of the opinion, as I've expressed in previous threads, that an overhaul of the award process in it's entirety, is past due.

Not to stop games from sweeping the boards, but to protect the developers from accusations of voting abuse.

Well, I personally was really worried to find wonderful The Vacuum (http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/games.php?action=detail&id=1066) in the only one nomination. But at least it's there and I really hope it will got the well deserved award. If you haven't played this game yet, don't be heartless and ignorant, play it now and really consider voting for it!
Also I'm kinda shocked Quest for Yrolg didn't make it to graphics-related nominations... It just doesn't make sense. I like BJ and all but come on, it doesn't make it graphically superior to anything.
And it was nice to see that not only I nominated ManBoy for the music, hehe.

Anyway, congrats to everybody who got his game nominated and to Ivy as well. :) You all have what to be proud of.

Quote from: Essex on Mon 19/01/2009 01:03:45
The other thing is that all the major nominees used teams, with voice actors or beta testers, that usually become potential nominators and voters.

So, Essex, to sum it all up, you don' like the Rogers as they are now. Now, for pars costruens, any suggesion on how to improve them?

Quote from: Snake on Sun 18/01/2009 16:31:01
Blockbuster... Hollywood, or what have you, whatever.

I wasn't saying that to disapprove of any of the games that are nominated in lots of categories - I was simply saying that very notable games that manage to attract lots of interest among the gaming community will always be, say, present in a way. I was going to compile a long explanation, but I think Goldmund already put it very well.

The AGS awards are for the AGS community, and games that make it beyond those forum and community borders and are well received deserve community awards both for drawing attention of the Indie gaming world to AGS and for helping the genre. And giving out AGS awards also means: giving fans of the genre who do not know much about independent game development, yet, a lead.

Quote from: Essex on Mon 19/01/2009 01:03:45
Last year ATOTK was brought by a team of 17 persons. As far as I remember 50 persons took part at the nominations. It is pretty clear that some of the team members always vote for their game, which is not a crime, but with such a high number of team members and such low voting numbers it can actually influence the result.

That's true, but by the end of it, we only had around 4 regular people on the team (the rest became busy with real life, and most were no longer active in the adventure game community), so I really don't think we had 17 people nominating ATOTK for everything, heh. In terms of nominations, I'd say that games with higher profiles or games that become much-loved favourites tend to receive more nominations anyway. I'd personally like to see more discernment when people nominate games for particular categories, but it's not really surprising that people would nominate their favourite in every category (they, of course, would like to give that game the best chance of winning something).

Every year people have suggested this happens and they underestimate their peers on the forums: in looking at the actual votes in previous years I can see that this hardly happens at all. I can't see the nominations in the same way this year, but I can see the final votes, so I'm sure that it won't happen again (it hasn't so far).

Well, if some of you take this award very serious and would like to change the way it works, I see only one possibility:

Make it like all other awards: Use a jury.
The jury can be elected by the community.

Then the jury will decide in a discussion what game gets what award.
In real life it is like this. I took part in a lot of music, painting and architecture competitions and there was always some kind of expert jury that kicked me out...

But if this award is taken serious like this, at least there should be a prize or something...

Another thing is that nominations don't say anything: Last year for example I got nominated here for eight awards. I didn't get a single one. When there are only five games left the selection becomes somehow harder.

Well, let's face it we can't have our favorite games on the list. Barn Runner is my fav for this year but it didn't got nominated. Why? Because I for example lost two years in this community to press that download button. So it's really normal. And well BJ is fun. but when it comes to voting for best documentation doesn't mean that the overall best game with a txt should get it..just a thought. Go Tinkerbell!!!

I´m surprised the Vacuum and Life of D. Duck II didn´t get more love. Other than that the selections seem very reasonable to me, based on what I´ve played :)

kaputtnik:
What I wrote wasn't meant to be taken as an argument. I agree %110 percent :)

I was only saying that whatever was happening, I was very suprised and thankful that something that I shit out was an actual nominee.

I agree it's for the community, but the community certainly gets its chance. It seems a fairly small number of people vote (and nominate) each year. One hundred of all our members? :/ It'd be good of CJ to send a mass PM and notify the other 4000 inactive members ;)

I think an email reminder would be a good idea as well :)

And thanks for the Beauties & Beasts nomination! :D

Perhaps, next time, if someome took it upon themselves to do the rounds, visiting other forums and plugging the AGS awards.
And perhaps if more of a big deal was made about the awards on the front page.  I know it's up there in the little 'recent news' box but I should imagine that goes largely unnoticed.

Quote from: Stupot on Mon 19/01/2009 17:41:59
Perhaps, next time, if someome took it upon themselves to do the rounds, visiting other forums and plugging the AGS awards.

As a slightly-active member of the AdventureGamers forums I considered this, but getting other forum members coming over and signing up just so that they could vote would possibly be counter-productive and could lead to the kind of "fanboi" nominating for every category that people have been speaking out against. If the problem is that most AGSers don't play enough of a cross-section of the games then getting outsiders in would hardly help. That also applies, to a lesser extent, to inactive forum members.

Just to clarify, I don't think unfair voting practices are taking place to such an extent that it influences the end results, and I don't want it to appear that I'm of the opinion that everyone is guilty until proved innocent.

What I am saying is that, with the current system, we couldn't really spot if someone was engaged in such practice and, conversely, we couldn't prove that someone wasn't. So when a game does really well at the nomination stage or the end voting stage, it wouldn't take much for someone, who may feel they were unfairly overlooked, to cry "Fix!". And we have nothing in place to repute such accusations except the hope that our community wouldn't go in for such shenanigans. Admittedly, as far as I know, this has never actually happened. Maybe I'm just overly cynical.

Quote from: Stupot on Mon 19/01/2009 17:41:59
And perhaps if more of a big deal was made about the awards on the front page.  I know it's up there in the little 'recent news' box but I should imagine that goes largely unnoticed.

There was a recent thread concerning that very idea, but nothing much came of it (and floods of people weren't exactly scrambling share the workload, anyway :P ). To be fair to everybody involved with the awards, particularly SSH, these things don't run themselves and there's only so much free time that can be devoted to such.

Quote from: Le Woltaire
Well, if some of you take this award very serious...

I don't know about "serious", but I like the awards, and I like the idea of someone striving to improve their games to win one. It's nice to have an incentive to aspire to, regardless of the lack of standing the awards may have outside the community. The awards usually get a mention on a number of outside websites, though, and winning games may arguably benefit from this. :)

Quote from: LimpingFish on Mon 19/01/2009 19:59:24

Quote from: Le Woltaire
Well, if some of you take this award very serious...

I don't know about "serious", but I like the awards, and I like the idea of someone striving to improve their games to win one. It's nice to have an incentive to aspire to, regardless of the lack of standing the awards may have outside the community. The awards usually get a mention on a number of outside websites, though, and winning games may arguably benefit from this. :)

I see the social function of this award: It brings people together at a certain time of the year so that they have a little discussion about the games that were released during the year...
That is all.

Being nominated for this award doesn't mean anything, it is just about taking part at the community and that you release something during the year.

I know and have worked with a lot of persons who have won several awards while they make underground games. Noone of them made a career or got successful, or something... Some of them run out of funds and can't allow themselves to produce more games anymore.  And the games they made are widely unknown although they deserve more attention. If someone says: "I was nominated for the AGS awards" on the street, people would look at them and think: "Who's that crazy gone garbageman?" It doesn't mean anything...

It's all about meeting some people, and have some happy time while making a game and savouring the last remaining time of your youth, before you end up in a common office-driven world, that forces you to work for your retirement pension and nothing else... We shouldn't destroy these happy times with formalistic behaviour...

Quote from: LimpingFish on Mon 19/01/2009 19:59:24
What I am saying is that, with the current system, we couldn't really spot if someone was engaged in such practice and, conversely, we couldn't prove that someone wasn't. So when a game does really well at the nomination stage or the end voting stage, it wouldn't take much for someone, who may feel they were unfairly overlooked, to cry "Fix!". And we have nothing in place to repute such accusations except the hope that our community wouldn't go in for such shenanigans. Admittedly, as far as I know, this has never actually happened. Maybe I'm just overly cynical.

Well, I can see the IP address, username and votes of everybody who has voted...

Quote from: LimpingFish on Mon 19/01/2009 19:59:24
There was a recent thread concerning that very idea, but nothing much came of it (and floods of people weren't exactly scrambling share the workload, anyway :P ). To be fair to everybody involved with the awards, particularly SSH, these things don't run themselves and there's only so much free time that can be devoted to such.

It wouldn't need to be anything too extravagant.  Just a bit of big bold text, a link, an accompanying image (doesn't have to be anything new, just reuse the logo that's already on the awards page).

Le Woltaire: But this basically says to me, because these awards have no cache outside the immediate community, that beyond their lighthearted worth, they are by and large valueless. That makes me sad. I think improving the awards within the community would be a step towards validating them in the wider gaming world. But let's face it, the man on the street wouldn't recognize 99% of the awards various organizations give out, regardless of the area of expertise they are awarded in. This doesn't reduce their validity.

And if they are, as you say, primarily for the benefit of the community, then a community jury or committee makes even more sense. As it stands, the awards play out more like the public vote systems of those TV talent shows.

And I kissed goodbye to the last remaining time of my youth some hazy summers ago. ;) 

Quote from: SSH on Mon 19/01/2009 21:09:40
Well, I can see the IP address, username and votes of everybody who has voted...

Which only let's us verify that each set of votes is unique, thus only preventing a certain type of abuse. I'm not claiming that it's possible to address other types of abuse that may take place, or if there even is a need to, just that we might consider reducing the possibility, to avoid any rumblings from disappointed parties (that may or may not arise).

Look, this isn't me being snippy about who wins what (I was too lazy to even release a game last year), I just think that the current system is tired and under-appreciated, and that the awards might benefit from a change.

I really, really think people need to take the awards much less seriously.  I think we should all follow Grundislav's example: a very humble, surprised if he wins/isn't bothered if he doesn't approach, which is exactly how I go about it.  I don't care who nominates what for what or who wins as long as the voting is conducted in a fair and just manner, and aside from SSH's tendency to be a bit overzealous with his approach I have no doubt he tabulates all the votes honestly.

The awards have always been just a bit of fun to congratulate authors we feel made games that entertained us.  I think we should keep things simple and fun, without stress or feelings of inferiority/superiority or fingerpointing or 'this needs to be fixed because this game DESERVES more'.

We really don't need any of that.  Just relax!

Yeah, that's right, ProgZmax.

Also what Goldmund said about Werner Herzog: "Awards are for dogs and horses." fits very well.

By the way, it's Grundislav's birthday today, not sure if someone noticed this...

Indeed, Progz is right (overzealous at what?) but I also don't see how the other possibilities for the vote would make it more valid or more respected outside AGS or anything...

You goddamn tree-hugging hippy scum! Here I am trying to make the whole thing more elitist and you undermine me with all your touchy-feely crap! You people deserve everything you get!

When we're overun by "w00ts" and "dudes!" you'll appreciate my iron fist of totalitarian rule! You will! Obama won't look so sweet then, will he? No!

...

Oh, screw the whole thing. I'm calling Dial-a-Hooker.

Quote from: SSH on Mon 19/01/2009 21:09:40
Well, I can see the IP address, username and votes of everybody who has voted...

Ah! My privacy!

Personally, I like the AGS nominations the way they are -- for and by AGSers. I'm not sure bringing in "the outside world" would be a good idea. And the new voting page was a great improvement over old way.

As far as the awards go, they serve as a nice center for this community. Every year, the nominations are announced, and we have the very conversation we're having now ;)

And on the plus side, it makes me get off my butt and try some of the games I missed that I'm going to have to vote on shortly. (Luckily, none of my own games have ever made the grade, so that saves me a little time ;) )

Personally, I'm not for making big changes to the way we've been doing this. I like it just the way it is and it seems to work well enough. Sure, every now and then, a game steamrolls all the others. But that happens with other, lesser awards like the BAFTAs and the Oscars, right? When that happens, just shrug it off. We have to set a good example for Hollywood, after all. They look up to us (as well they should).

- Ponch

Quote from: LimpingFish on Mon 19/01/2009 22:48:03
You goddamn tree-hugging hippy scum! Here I am trying to make the whole thing more elitist and you undermine me with all your touchy-feely crap! You people deserve everything you get!

When we're overun by "w00ts" and "dudes!" you'll appreciate my iron fist of totalitarian rule! You will! Obama won't look so sweet then, will he? No!

...

Oh, screw the whole thing. I'm calling Dial-a-Hooker.

Since you're Irish you should appreciate the words of James Joyce who writes in one of my favourite books, Finnegans Wake: "Thingcrooklyexineverypasturesixdixlikencehimaroundhersthemaggerbykinkinkankanwithdownmindlookingated"

And this represents my true opinion about all this...

Don't mind me. I have a habit of failing to see the forest for the trees. And of talking myself into a corner.

Fish adjusts the "Days without Foot entering Mouth" counter to "0"...

Hooray.

I've instituted a "most cheated" poll for the nominations over on my blog (http://ags-ssh.blogspot.com/2009/01/post-poll.html) in case you wish to vent your frustrations there. Winner will be made the next Pick of the Month unless they've already been it.

Well, if the way the AGS awards go bothers people, I can always set up BHT awards :D

Maybe worth reminding people that this is the last day of voting. 15 hours left to submit your votes according to the clock on the page.

I myself still need to finish a couple of games before I know who to vote for in each category.

Voting is now closed!

Thanks to everyone who voted, and to SSH for organising everything!

I didn't manage to play through all the nominees in time to vote. ::)

Oh well, maybe next year, eh?

Good, good, now off to tell us who got what...

Thanks to all who voted. Ceremony is well in production, but I'm still awaiting stuff from a few people...

Quote from: SSH on Sun 08/02/2009 19:20:48
...but I'm still awaiting stuff from a few people...

My stuff'd be in your letterbox.   ;)

Thanks in advance for making this possible in the first place, SSH. It's really something to look forward to, and I loved last year's witty ceremony! Making a true "show" was a stroke of genius, and I hope this'll become a tradition.

*cough* (http://ags-ssh.blogspot.com/2009/02/with-all-due-ceremony.html)


CJ/mod, can you update the front page withthe ceremony link, please?

Finally ;D.

*DOWNLOADING*

Haha.  That was the bees knees, SSH!  Really well done!  Best AGS Award Ceremony this year!

Can we nominate the AGS Awards Ceremony 2008 for the AGS Awards 2009? Seriously, awesome presentation.

And congrats to all the winners. Haven't played them all yet, so this was fantastic input on what to play next. The games I recognize surely deserved the awards they got.

Excellent job with the ceremony SSH & Friends!

Awesmoe indeedy, SSH! And congratulations to all the winners!

Aye, 'twas right cool, sir.
Well done to you, and everyone who submitted stuff.

Annoyingly, it gave me an idea for something I should have thought of in time to submit.
Oh well.

Also, it gave me a warning file with a string of sounds that didn't play.


And, of course, congrats to all the winners!

Never thought you'd use those sprites.. Congrats to all the winners...

   Congratulations SSH for a nice presentation.

   You are making it hard for yourself to do something better next year.

   Congratulations for all the winners, I played every nominated game and I had fun with all of them.

   I am particularly happy because all my favorite games of 2008 win something: Nanobots, QFG2VGA, Limey Lizard and Once Upon a Crime. :)

A 12 meg zip file for an awards ceremony?  Might as well be an adventure game!  :=

Very nicely done ;).

Well, indeed, Progz. Sorry that it's so big: I can try and produce a cut down version tonight, as I haven't pruned out  the unused characters, sprites, etc. I could maybe see uif I can shrink some of the audio, too.

Can I just reiterate a big thanks to everyone who helped me with this. Sorry to ProgZ and Grundislav for not including the voice files they sent me, as I was having all kinds of sound problems and also my custom speech thingy makes it harder to use speech. I'll have to try and fix that for next year!

Feel free to let me know of any bugs: I think the pause, fast forward and skip fwd/back work OK, but I haven't tried every combination at every point in the ceremony.

Quote from: SSH on Wed 11/02/2009 12:29:53
Feel free to let me know of any bugs: I think the pause, fast forward and skip fwd/back work OK, but I haven't tried every combination at every point in the ceremony.

The last music that you choose to listen from music awards continue to plays till the end of the ceremony.

I love how I get a thanks for "donating" my caveman ;)

Great Awards! Great Games! Great year guys!

Quote from: AsimosVagan on Wed 11/02/2009 14:06:03

Quote from: SSH on Wed 11/02/2009 12:29:53
Feel free to let me know of any bugs: I think the pause, fast forward and skip fwd/back work OK, but I haven't tried every combination at every point in the ceremony.

The last music that you choose to listen from music awards continue to plays till the end of the ceremony.

That's deliberate because I liked listening to the BJ music so much...  :=

"Possibly the most passed-over character ever" indeed!

I kept hoping against hope that Prick would just grab the cup and run for the exit! I was chanting (quietly, so as not to upset my co-workers), "Do it! Do it! Who's gonna stop you? Nelly? She's half the size she was last year! And the androids are all scared of you! Get past Hasselhoff and you're home free!"

Sadly, it was not to be. I can only assume it was because SSH didn't have time to code a big action sequence so close to the deadline.

So congratulations to the winners. And thanks to SSH for going through all this work again. Awesome work as always. And nice kilt, man.

- Ponch

----------
(I also got a bunch of sound errors when it was over. Is it safe to assume those were gunshots and explosions from the action scene you didn't have time to code?)

I had a nightmare with the sounds. I just had one sound effect in there for Roger's highbrow joke, but all those imported characters with footstep noises somehow kept all triggering it, even though they used different sound numbers. So blame everyone who sent me a char with footstep noises...

Congrats to all the winners, nominees and indeed everyone who made a game in 2008... and of course to SSH for running the Awards and making the ceremony.

Here's to another year of game making!

Whipped this up during my lunch break. All I have here at work is MS Paint, so no fancy photoshopping.


Thanks for making Prick one of the presenters, SSH. I really didn't expect that and it was a nice gesture. Plus it gave me the opportunity to waste time at work today! :D

- Ponch

That SSH sprite always cracks me up.

Great work, SSH! And congrats to all nominees and winners!

Thanks to CJ for all of his hard work in improving the awards voting stuff this year, and for updating the games DB just now (yes, check your game page to see your shiny trophies!) However, CJ, still none of the 3 Best Innovation winners over the years have that on their pages (Linus Bruckmann, _access and Colourwise, I think)

Hehe, Ponch, you rock, man :)

SSH! Great job with the awards ceremony, I enjoyed it immensly...

...and CONGRATS to all the winners!

Great awards ceremony, thanks SSH! Congrats to all the winners as well :D.

Ponch, that newspaper page is hilarious! You have the right to remain awesome ;D

The ceremony was fabulous; congrats to the winners. I actually laughed out loud when the SSH sprite wandered out.

Excellent awards ceremony.  Congrats to all the winners. :P

Oh, and what was with the weird walk path of all the characters?  They all seemed to be getting stuck for a second on the same location, almost added to the humor of things I guess.

Sorry I'm late to the party! I've been in crazy crunch time mode this week trying to hit my next Puzzle Bots milestone.

Thanks for all the love shown to Nanobots! I'm glad so many of you enjoyed the game. And heh, I'm glad Magic Smiling Cat got his day in the sun. Too bad Francisco's audio file wasn't in the game though, it was pretty spectacular. :)

And now, back to work...

Quote from: The Ivy on Thu 12/02/2009 21:02:50
And now, back to work...

Yeah! We're waiting for the next award winning blockbuster ;D

Great ceremony.
Well done to all the winners.
Now go and give yourselves pats on your backs.

Thanks for all your nice comments folk. The stuck bit on the walkpath is becuase the curtain they come out from behind is only 1 pixel in front of the rear curtain, so there's a very narrow point that they need to come out on, but if they stay there some characters with a "curvy bottom" look like they're halfway up the curtain. So I need to make them walk down a bit.

Quote from: The Ivy on Thu 12/02/2009 21:02:50
Thanks for all the love shown to Nanobots! I'm glad so many of you enjoyed the game. And heh, I'm glad Magic Smiling Cat got his day in the sun. Too bad Francisco's audio file wasn't in the game though, it was pretty spectacular. :)

I've put it up at http://ags-ssh.blogspot.com/2009/02/get-free-msc-in-funny-dialogue.html

Thank you for the honour bestowed upon Beauties and Beasts, it was a wonderful surprise! :D

YEAH - Congrats to all the winners!

Mostly Progz who really diserve the peace nobel prize the acheivement award.

Congrats to all: Nice dialogs for Marvin indeed, suprised he did a talk and then more surprised you had Ghost draw this:

(http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q53/JustLedZep/CW_speech_1.png)

Quote from: Dualnames on Sat 14/02/2009 18:28:18
Congrats to all: Nice dialogs for Marvin indeed, suprised he did a talk and then more surprised you had Ghost draw this:

Indeed, Ghost's talent & courtesy are beyon awesome :)

Quote from: bicilotti on Sat 14/02/2009 18:40:24

Quote from: Dualnames on Sat 14/02/2009 18:28:18
Congrats to all: Nice dialogs for Marvin indeed, suprised he did a talk and then more surprised you had Ghost draw this:

Indeed, Ghost's talent & courtesy are beyon awesome :)

You (bicilotti) come at Tokbox or else..Ghost's real put a smile in my face with this one.