Author Topic: Abandonware  (Read 30884 times)

DCillusion

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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #20 on: 03 Dec 2004, 06:45 »
I didn't look for the statement again, sorry  :'(.  I just did a search to see if the game was still there.  I read the statement when HotU first posted the game - it was in the announcement blog.  I'll try to find and get back.

P.S. - Thanks to Strazer for following up to see that the game "SOLID" was available, and not some oooolllllllddddd title.

I hope software doesn't fall under the Millenium Copyright Laws.  If someone told me I had to buy a new trumpet every six months because my old trumpet can't play "God Save the Queen 2K5", music would become freeware every 5 years too.
« Last Edit: 03 Dec 2004, 06:52 by DCillusion »

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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #21 on: 03 Dec 2004, 15:30 »
That's strange, considering that they just re-released MSG1 with new graphics this year.  "The Twin Snakes" it was called.

DCillusion

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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #22 on: 03 Dec 2004, 17:37 »
I think the PC audience is a harder sell than the cube.  It's the only forum where Konami is competing with Splinter Cell. 

It's the same reason Resident Evil 2 was re-released on the GameCube, (with almost identical graphics), for $45.  It's on the PC, with the same higher res textures, for $20.

PC users aren't so quick to bend over and take shovelware.  Konami wants people to buy Snake Eater, (upcoming to the PC).  If they re-released Solid to Computer Users with a new price tag, They would just be embarrasing themselves.

- On the other hand, each platform a company supports, generally, has a different project director.  Maybe the PC director believes in Abandonware.  He wouldn't be the first developer with this mentality.
« Last Edit: 03 Dec 2004, 17:44 by DCillusion »


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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #24 on: 05 Dec 2004, 21:19 »
No, they do. I've seen it.

Devise the puzzles. Destroy the hero. Defeat the player.

Al_Ninio is an attention-seeking drama whore.

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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #25 on: 04 Jun 2005, 13:36 »
I've been in the abandonware scene since '99, and am still known well enough (I ran one of the popular abandonware rings from 2000 until 2004).

My opinion should be clear enough - Software that is abandoned is abandoned. If the rights are held but there are no plans to ever publish it again, why keep the rights and lock it up where nobody who might enjoy the product can get it?

It's like with Keen 6. iD owns the rights, doesn't want to release it, Apogee would love to, but can't. I emailed Joe Siegler about it years ago and he admitted that they'd love to release it as freeware - and had thought about it - but didn't own all the rights to it - and couldn't.

It's just a bunch of party poopers. Fans are fans. Revolution understood - giving BASS out on the web created a good feeling in fan's tummies concerning Revolution. When Flight of the Amazon Queen became freeware, I jumped up and shrieked from happiness.

The fact that I can't legally purchase a lot of the golden oldies anymore - and no, paying 30 USD for a second-hand 2-floppy game + 10 USD shipping to where I live isn't interesting enough - pisses me off greatly.

Abandonware serves a purpose. However slight it is - it's about bringing the games back to the fans.

And I'm like... totally an abandonware fanboi yo.
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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #26 on: 08 Jun 2005, 05:43 »
It's like with Keen 6. iD owns the rights, doesn't want to release it, Apogee would love to, but can't.

iD occasionally bundles the Keen games with "iD anthologies". If it was already free, there would be less incentive to buy one of the anthologies. Plus, they may decide to make Keen for cellphones or fridges or toilet seats or whatever new platforms are out there. If you've already played it for free that's a lost sale.

Quote
The fact that I can't legally purchase a lot of the golden oldies anymore - and no, paying 30 USD for a second-hand 2-floppy game + 10 USD shipping to where I live isn't interesting enough - pisses me off greatly.

"interesting enough"? That's a poor argument. However, second-hand games don't provide any revenue to the game makers - if that's the only way the game is likely to ever be available, then sure, why not abandonware?

I too am frustrated that I can't buy old games "new" and get royalties to the creators. I think it would be pretty neat to have a standard way to, say, paypal the developers of old games. After playing some games downloaded from the underdogs I felt I'd cheated them. For example, "Superhero League of Hoboken" - I felt a real glow finishing that, and really wanted to reward Steve Meretzky and his team. (Then I remembered the Space Bar. Did I really pay full price for that? Wah!)

Quote
Abandonware serves a purpose. However slight it is - it's about bringing the games back to the fans.

I fully agree with this. If the authors and publishers agree too, everyone wins.
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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #27 on: 20 Jul 2005, 18:37 »
I was one of the lucky ones who picked up the Sierra Anthologies in the late 90s.  I'm a pretty popular guy with my friends because of it.

I think that this is a pretty complex problem.  The point that the games are unavailable so why not enable free distribution is unassailable.  I used to feel this way about old console games no longer in development.  I didn't think twice about hoarding ROMS from discontinued systems, and then Nintendo started re-releasing them in stuff like Animal Crossing and for the Game Boy Advance. 

Suddenly they were available again, and it sounds like Nintendo is going to go even farther with their new system, offering access to "classic" games on-line.  It's rumored that this will be free, but there will still be an economic incentive to buy the new system to get access to them.

Granted these old console games are much easier to emulate and re-distribute than the adventure games we all love, but this business with console re-releases has made me think about these issues a little harder.

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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #28 on: 21 Jul 2005, 00:14 »
GTA1 and GTA2 anyone?

I've been trying to hunt down a copy of Theme Park for years. I barely snagged a copy of Theme Hospital from a bargain bin before the behemoth that is EA games quashed Bullfrog for good. It was dirt cheap (about 5 bucks) and I'm glad I grabbed a copy.

Re: Abandonware
« Reply #29 on: 03 Aug 2005, 19:41 »
Sam & Max. Oh, how I hate it. I spent almost a week looking for it, and still nothing. Only French and Italian versions. I need English! Well, I found English version, but it's 80 MBs big, and that's not very good with my 56 Kb/ps. In my country, there's nowhere to buy it, believe me, I've looked for it, so please please could you tell me where to find a normal 8-MB English version. I do respect Lucasarts and everything, but this is just unbelieveable! Pleaseee.. At least e-mail me or something... I could order it from America, England and so on, but I would get at least extra 50 bucks to pay. So, understand my suffering.. :'(
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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #30 on: 03 Aug 2005, 23:13 »
eBay.

This thread is for discussing truly abandonware software only.
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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #31 on: 26 Aug 2005, 18:21 »
I've heard something about really old ROMs (A file containing data for a console game, can be played on a computer through emulators) being legalized or something, although I don't neccesarily believe it.

If that's the case, I see absolutely no reason why abandonware can't be legalized. It's pretty much the same concept.
 

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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #32 on: 26 Aug 2005, 21:36 »
In those cases, some developers allow for the game to be converted. In this case, there are also legal roms and illegal roms.

But then, there is the idea that if you own the actual game, then you can have the rom for your own keeping on your computer. Which makes sense to me, at least under the law of being able to make one back up of your product. Then I've "heard on the internet" that you can download games you do not own and keep it for no more than 24 hours. It may be 'true' but to me it sounds just like an internet rumor run wild.
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- No, I mean it's really STUCK. Like adventure-game stuck.
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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #33 on: 28 Aug 2005, 12:10 »
Speaking about legal abandonware someone can post a list of Adventure Games declared abandonware and free from copyright owner like flight of the amazon queen?

Re: Abandonware
« Reply #34 on: 31 Aug 2005, 23:35 »
Lure Of The Temptress comes to mind.

As for legal abandonware in general, here's a nice forum thread at Neowin.net listing a lot of free stuff: http://www.neowin.net/forum/index.php?showtopic=65246

Re: Abandonware
« Reply #35 on: 18 Feb 2006, 12:35 »
I think it's INSANE not to distrubute games for free if they're not being SOLD anymore... thanks to abandonia.com I'll be able to play baldies and ascendancy even if I lose the cds one day and burnt one's I should soon make as well:P

:D

Even if My house is burnt down i mean
:P

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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #36 on: 07 Mar 2006, 23:55 »
I'm new here, so if I've somehow violated a sacred charter by posting this here, please, for the love of god, just tell me.

In case you don't know, Abandonware is the name given to software (mostly old games) that is no longer sold or supported by its publiser. Most extend this definition so that it also has to be at least five years old. Many people decide to provide abandonware for free download, which really upsets the copyright holders.

The IDSA (or whatever it's called now) has recently been cracking down on a lot of Abandonware sites, telling them to get rid of their members' software. Most sites comply, some do not. The gaming community generally likes Abandonware, as it provides an easy way to get old games that are otherwise extremely difficult to find. In fact, some gamers are under the impression that downloading free Abandonware is legal. They're wrong.

Most of the classic adventure games are now abandonware. Quest for Glory one through three, the Police Quests, most of the Space Quests (I think all, but I could be wrong), and many other classics fall into the relam of Abandonware. It's nearly impossible to get any of these games legally without heading onto Ebay or something similar. That would be the reason for the support of gamers.

Now, the gamers like it, and the publisers don't. Well, nobody likes the publishers, either. How about the people everybody cares about - the developers?

Suprisingly, the general reaction of the developers is that they're happy someone is still playing it. The vast majority of them would have no problem with releasing their old games for free so that they could still be appreciated, if they owned the rights. Unfortuanately, they don't. The publishers do.

However, these are the same publishers that are making it so bloody hard to get the games in the first place. They say that if they re-release these games, they won't make a profit, and let's face it, they're right. But what do they do then? Do they just let the games die? What do you think?

Oh, and one more thing - how badly are you allowed to swear on these forums? The rule dealies aren't very explicit on this.


actually, you can download sam and max hit the road at www.removed.com  8) (there is a game section somewhere) and at www.removed.com there are TONS of abandonware graphic adventure games (but most are in foreign languages).  :'(

No abandone ware links on the forums, please.
« Last Edit: 08 Mar 2006, 02:08 by MrColossal »
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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #37 on: 08 Mar 2006, 06:10 »

actually, you can download sam and max hit the road at www.removed.com  8) (there is a game section somewhere) and at www.removed.com there are TONS of abandonware graphic adventure games (but most are in foreign languages).  :'(

what the fuck? i searched that site for 1 hour and i couldn't find sam and max hit the road (i'm not joking).

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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #38 on: 08 Mar 2006, 08:18 »
The link you're looking for isn't actually "www.removed.com" - that means that the link has been removed by a moderator, because it leads to abandonware links, which are discouraged on the forums. (That's what the last sentence there means. That was written by Mr. Colossal)

If you're looking for that particular game, you're going to have to look elsewhere, I'm afraid. And besides, Sam & Max isn't abandonware at all. I wish it were, but it falls entirely and unabashedly under the 'warez' category ( which we don't condone at all here... You know, it being illegal and all), because LucasArts still hold an iron grip on their products.

Now, let's see if I can't say something at least vaguely relevant to the thread...

There are a lot of LucasArts games out there that I never got the chance to play, Day of the Tentacle included, back when they were available. Now that I'm an adult, and have money to spend on video games like that, it's damned near impossible to find anything on the shelves. I kick myself often for not picking up those old Adventure Packs that LucasArts had released a while back.

Of course, those Adventure Packs are a very valid reason why they aren't releasing their games as abandonware - and if the game companies are actually doing something, like updating old software to run on more recent machines, I'm all for it. I'm going to be very glad when the Sierra 'Quest series' collections come out. I lost my 15th anniversary edition of Space Quest somewhere, so that's one thing I'm going to be very eager to replace.

One thing I think is odd about abandonware, though, is that I've noticed that I have a lot less patience to play games through when I haven't paid for them. Maybe my attention span was just cut bitterly short after I turned 20, but I've noticed that when I can get something that easily, I don't feel nearly as motivated to really put any large amount of effort into finishing. And the games I do want to play through often don't work well on my computer. DosBox is a wonderful program, but a bit buggy on this ol' clunker of a laptop.

Still, the most handy thing I've found about abandonware is that I can replace games I rightfully own but can't play, like the Wizardry series - I had five through seven (And still have the manual), but lost the floppies for Bane of the Cosmic Forge ages ago. I have a CD-ROM of 7, but couldn't get it to actually install. Now I'm playing through Crusaders of the Dark Savant again, and (though realizing how sparse the game world really is) enjoying it at least a bit.

Fun, at least for nostalgic purposes.

Realized I probably haven't said anything in this wordy post that hasn't already been mentioned, but oh well.
« Last Edit: 08 Mar 2006, 08:23 by SpacePirateCaine »
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Re: Abandonware
« Reply #39 on: 18 Apr 2006, 02:37 »
I'm in favor of abandonware, under the conditions that abandoned-ness only depends on whether a game is still being widely and legally available (even if it's in a different version) and not on some arbitrary number of years (companies like Apogee 3D Realms that still most of the back catalogue should be supported) and that games are removed from circulation if the copyright holder cares enough to complain about the games being available themselves (like Bethesda Softworks or Team17 regularly do). Even though the ESA (formerly IDSA) similarly acts on behalf of its members, I dislike them.

I think expressions like "released as abandonware" and "legal abandonware" should be avoided. The latter is a misnomer, usually refering to games that have been made available for free, and the former seems to be an oxymoron. If a company re-releases a game, no matter if for free or commerically, it can hardly be considered abandoned.

What I really don't like are people claiming that abandonware is legal or those that are actively waiting for a game to become abandonware. Abandonware should only ever be used as a last resort, when a game is no longer available through its publisher nor through retailers.

Of course, abandonware being legal is just one of many myths regarding copyrights on the internet. It's just as false as saying that copyright infringement is okay if you infringe it for no longer than 24 hours. I haven no idea where that notion comes from as it seems very counter-intuitive to me. The myth about ROMs (which I for myself usually consider to be no different from PC software, some of them being abandonware, some being freeware and some being neither) being legal comes from an exception in the DMCA refering to
Quote from: U.S. Copyright Office
Computer programs and video games distributed in formats that have become obsolete and which require the original media or hardware as a condition of access.

However, this exception refers to the circumvention of copy protection mechanisms (illegal under the DMCA) and not the distribution of the programs and games themselves.

Oh, and Konami really had nothing to do with a CD-rip of the Microsoft-published Windows version of Metal Gear Solid being available at Home of the Underdogs.
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