POST - MITTENS

[La Lore]

I'm sad because Mittens finished.... but we have a lot of photos weeeee.

One of them...



More photos later

LorenaÃ,  Ã, :-*Ã, 

[SSH]

That one must be photoshopped!

[SinSin]

i had no idea this mittens existed but now ive read up on it i wanna go when will the next one in england be

[Privateer Puddin']

Go to next years brittens, mittens probably wont be in england again (if it is, not for many years i imagine since brittens has become pretty big as it is)

[Andail]

Welcome back! I missed you guys!
Please provide us with lots of photos and embarassing stories.

BTW who texted me a few nights ago?

[Radiant]

This was t3h awesmoe!

(hey, does this mean I get a new status line ?)

[Nacho]

BTW who texted me a few nights ago?

Blazed, Dominika, Helm, M0ds, Chrille, Quintaros, Farl and Lore, From Goldmund's telephone...

Will provide stories and photos! Wait till tomorrow! 

The sea odissey history is great!!!

P.S. Lorena made a little Stonehenge in the secret beach to honour you, Mr. Petter. 

[Becky]

We're back safe and sound and un-delayed, hurrah!

Mittens was awesome and I wish I was still there :'(  It was not long enough! 

[Helm]

I am back as well. Trip was uneventful and good. I am now with my cat, usual strange mixture of tired relief and anxious regret that signifies Mittens was a success.

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

Did you go scuba diving for sunken galleons of gold?

[Chrille]

I am also back. I enjoyed it very much. Sorry I didn't say goodbye to anyone but Helm, but I didn't want to wake anyone up.

Nacho & Lorena, thank you very much for organizing it! I'll assume Goldmund gave you the money I gave him to give you for the camping costs.

[Pet Terry]

I just arrived in Stockholm and am a zombie. I'm not sure if I should go to school tomorrow (or actually later today) or not. On the other hand, Mittens 2006 was probably the best thing that I've ever experienced, seriously. I've got a couple of photos, but only a couple. I can't upload them in a while though, but a couple of other people had cameras there as well. CJ, post the group photo before anything else!!1

Ah, what could I say! I wish it hadn't ended yet, it was so great to see the old buddies again and meet the new people (I've got most of you in my MSN contacts already, but if the rest of you want to add me, the address is in my profile). So much stuff happened, and yet it felt like the whole thing went by in a whim. I could start a list of quotes and highlights here, but nah. You'll just have to wait, har!

[magintz]

I am home safetly now, and I shall try to get my photos on by tomorrow.

Stories and such will follow with photos.

M

[Layabout]

I return from mittens with no money but many new friends. Its nice to put a voice to some of those I have known online for quite a while.

Will post the quotes I have when I am not so tired.
Thanks to Nacho and Lorena for hosting, thanks to goldmund and dominika for the barcelona drive, thanks to CJ for the england airport driving, and thanks to 1 euro for a pint of beer.

[AGA]

I am alive! I took no photos, so you'll have to wait for other people's.

[m0ds]

I am awake - thank you very much to CJ for taking me home last night! I aers appreciate it Or should I say, I arse appreciate it! This years Mittens was absolutely superb, with so many great people, great activities and great stories (+ some slightly dodgy ones! ) ... Hahahaha! Really had a great time so thanks again Mr Farlander and La Lore!!! Awesomeness

Let me be the first to quote! In Barcelona Gary cracked a joke to our sharp leader, CJ:

GARY: A man walks into a Bar... Celona.
CJ: ...What's a Celona?

ps - photos & sound clips coming soon

[Chrille]

That reminds me, m0ds. The story you told me about the bartender and your sunglasses, here's the comic I was talking about:

http://www.pbfcomics.com/archive/PBF002AD-QPI_Interview.jpg

[La Lore]

In Mittens is tradition to shoot photos to eating people



Sorry GrundyÃ, 

[m0ds]

Chrille - hehehe!!! That's cool! And although the dialogue and situation aren't so similar, that's exactly what happened!! Oh those crazy Asian burger guys!

As promised, here are the sound clips my mp3 player managed to capture. Sadly, none of the wet t-shirt competition clips came out

We're Flying!

Turbulence

Barcelona Airport

In The Car

Crazy Shit at the Campsite

Waiting To Go For A Pizza

Home From Home

In A Pub!

[Pumaman]

I am also back!

Mittens was cool as always; t'was good to meet you three new guys and I hope you enjoyed yourselves. Equally, t'was great to see all the regulars again; we missed you too Andail, don't you dare miss it next year

At Petteri's request, here's the group photo:
http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/mittens2006/DSCF0389.html

All pics are here:
http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/mittens2006/

m0dsy, I don't seem to be able to listen to your wav files, do they need any special software or anything?

Oh, and I almost forgot ... thanks for Nacho and Lorena for hosting us, to Nacho's dad for the free wine, to m0ds for starting the whole mittens thing in the first place, to everyone for coming, to Captain Power for getting us through the storm and to everyone else I've forgotten. I love you guys, but I still hate what you represent.

And if you thought Peniscola and Arse were bad, how about this:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/08/15/austrian_signs/

[Anarcho]

Did you all decide where mittens will be next year?

Don't make me start another thread again!

[scotch]

The consensus was Canada. Probably Ontario... due to the concentration of AGSers, and preferably in either some rich person's awesome house, or a rented place, but not camping if at all possible.
Flights to Toronto are similar or less than those to NYC, so we should be able to manage a decent European turn out... and all the cool North Americans are required to come.

I want it to be mittens again, already.

[Pumaman]

#Well I wish it could be mittens everyday
when the beer starts flowing and strange people come to stay
oh I wish it could be mittens everyday
So let the bells ring out for Benidorm#

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

That group photo looks like Bad News Bears: The College Years.  ^_^

[Grundislav]

I am alive as well.  Just got home, very tired and not much in the mood to sort through photos or videos, but I will post them as soon as I can.

It was great to see all the oldies and meet the new people, everyone there was awesome.

MORE BEER!

[m0ds]

Good to hear you got back, Fraaannnn------ .......and everyone else!

As we're all at the photo preview stage, I thought I'd lower the tone!





Oh, and what the hell DOES this mean, Farlander or La Lore?


(note - its on the side of a telephone style booth called "Once" - is that how many times you can pee on it before getting arrested? )

[Nacho]

O.N.C.E. Organización nacional de ciegos, or "national organization of blind people". Basically an organization which sells lottery for getting funds for the disabled.

Ergo, that things were lottery selling posts, not telephone cabins... ^_^

[Layabout]

Teh Quotes!!

Mods: I kissed 7 people tonight!
Magintz: Were they all male?
Mods: yes...
Magintz: Was one of them CJ?
Mods: yes.

Farlander: Clench your anus!

CJ: Didn't that happen during the crustacean period?

Petteri: Hello!
CJ: Hello, I'm chris.
Petteri: ...I'm Petteri.
CJ: Oh! Petteri! You've changed your style!

CJ: What's a lemur? Is that some kind of fruit?

Magintz: Two guys walk into a Bar... (snap*) Celona
CJ: What's a celona?

Roadsign: Peniscola

Random girl on street: Would you like to see Sticky Vicky after the lesbian show???

Mods(about 20 times): STICKY VICKY!!!!!111!!!

Layabout (to the blackadder theme tune): More beer more beer more beer more beer, more beer more beer more beer more beeaahhr...

CJ: What's that expression again? Merdez on a plane?
                                                 (shit)

DarkStalkey: I've never had an orange.

CJ: What's the word in spanish for competence?
Grundislav: There isn't one.

AGSers: WE WILL WE WILL ROCK YOU!
Angry man: FUCK YOU!!!!

(After telling a story about how he and his sister almost asphixiated themselves in a dog kennel they converted into a sauna)
Disco: You can't blame me, I was only 18 at the time...

CJ: The 80's were so much nicer, I remember when George Michael was a singer and not a gay.

Disco: When I was 16 I used to freeze my piss and use it as a hockey puck.

Layabout: How did my pants get over here???

There were many more quotes, but most of them weren't written down, ie. we were too drunk to remember them. I think someone else has some quotes as well.

[Pet Terry]

Haha, great photos, Chris. Though http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/mittens2006/DSCF0058.html that would be me and Farlander, not Helm and Farlander! Also, I wasn't able to listen to the sound clips, m0ds!

[m0ds]

Hmm, no idea why. They work fine in Sound Rec and Media Player 6 for me. I'll make mp3s soon

Super pictures CJ! Funny interpretation to a lot of them too! Haha Cool beans!

[Nacho]

"It was the tastiest penis I've ever eaten"

-Grundislav.

[Grundislav]

Here are my pictures!

http://www.grundislavgames.com/mittens06/

And here are some videos!

http://www.grundislavgames.com/mittens06/videos

[Quintaros]

Yay... I've been home for about 5 hours now.  And my luggage should be arriving in a few more.

It was great to meet everybody.  Thank you Nacho and La Lore for hosting.  Looking forward to seeing people again in my home and native land.

[La Lore]

My photos are here...

"You have been invited to visit a photo album

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a214/La_Lore/Mittens%20Spain/

The password to view this album is: morebeer"

[m0ds]

Awesome photos La Lore and Grundy! And entertaining videos too! Hahaha Love 'em!

[Nacho]

I've fixed the unfair fact that Chrille was not in the official photo due an early flight...

[Chrille]

Haha, well done, Nacho.

Nice collection of photos too!

[passer-by]

The early flight must explain why he looks so grumpy, then

[LimpingFish]

And Helm can make toast by just staring at a slice of bread! :O

[Haddas]

It's always with the lasers isn't it?

[LimpingFish]

No...but...I...

...

Yes. 

[Andail]

Roughly how much fun do you reckon my absence took away from this year's mittens?
Did you actually have fun at all?

[Domino]

I can't believe you guys torched KQ7, I love that game. I never finished it but got close to the end. I'm sad now.  :'(

[Helm]

HAHAHA ! SUFFER!!

[Matt Goble]

Hi Guys,

Just a quick note for now to say I got back ok, although the flight was delayed for 30 mins.

A fantastic time, great mates, cheap booze, not too sunburnt and plenty of good memories (aided by photographic evidence...)

Will try and sort out my photo's this year, I promise...

[Pumaman]

Haha, great photos, Chris. Though http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/mittens2006/DSCF0058.html that would be me and Farlander, not Helm and Farlander!

Hehe oops, must have been the dark and the long hair.

Nice pics and vids Grund and Lorena!

Also, I forgot to upload this rather exciting video of the ant stealing our nuts:
http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/mittens2006/DSCF0281.AVI

Roughly how much fun do you reckon my absence took away from this year's mittens?
Did you actually have fun at all?

My estimations conclude that Mittens was approximately 17% less fun due to your absence, Andail. In particular, we never even tried to hold a Mittolympics!


Finally, any suggestions for new mittens titles? Currently we have:
1: Mittens Initiate
2: Mittens Faithful
3: Mittens Fundamentalist
4: Mittens Guru
But now that there've been 5 mittens, we need an extra title.

[SSH]

Following the clerical theme, how about

Acolyte
Deacon
Archdeacon
Bishop
Archbishop
Nuncio
Cardinal
Patriarch/Matriarch

[jetxl]

Please, no religious titles.

How aboot police/army titles.

[AGA]

It's not a clerical theme, it's a cult theme!

[Nacho]

If we go on with the former labels, then, after guru, should come God. Or Mesiah.

If not... Why not: Pixel, Sprite, Background, Game, and Complete Game... or something like that?

[Layabout]

How about Lager, Cider, Whisky, Rum, Wine, sangria...

[m0ds]

Mittens Addict! Or was that the year before last? Anywhoo - my photos and report will be ready tres soon

[passer-by]

If not... Why not: Pixel, Sprite, Background, Game, and Complete Game... or something like that?

That's a relevant idea, indeed.

[AGA]

1. n00bs
2. AGA, CJ, m0ds, DarkStalkey

I think this covers all eventualities.

[Disco]

Heya Duders,

I am safe at home now, effective yesterday morning, or whichever one was the 25th. However, I came home to a disconnected internet and crazy phone billÃ,  :'( Perhaps tomorrow or Monday when it is reinstated I can post a bit more (can't now since I am at a wi-fi), and when I'm not sleeping at insane hours. I woke up happily at 4 this morning, which should never happen. Mittens was lots of fun and I already miss everyone. I have loads of photos and stories from Brittens and Mittens and Magintz and I's simpatico trot through Paris and Barcelona. Check back later!

[Adamski]

Despite missing the first two days due to horrible airport anti-fun, I had a great time at Mittens as always. It's always a joy to meet up with folks and see new faces every year, and although many of us were tired of the camping aspects I'm sure we all had a blast. I know I did! Many thanks to Nacho and Lorena for going to the trouble of organising things this year.

Unfortunatly I do have some concerns to raise about the increased role that alcohol played at this years Mittens. We're all adults of course, and people can drink as responsibly or irresponsibly as they'd like at these meets, but I'm sure I'm not the only one who was slightly disappointed by the social rift caused by those who appeared to see this meet as a chance to get pissed at every oppertunity rather than to spend time with the entire group. Perhaps the increased emphasis on drinking was a product of the location we were in, but this is the first time I've ever come away from an AGS meet with any misgivings. I see these events as a way to meet people from all over the globe that I'd not usually get chance to socialise with and spend time in their company, and if those people are drunk or hungover or miles away at some rubbish bar then it makes it difficult to do that, and for me it defeats the point of the whole occasion.

I hope that attitudes towards drinking are re-thought for next Mittens because I'm not so interested in flying all the way across the Atlantic to find that everyone's gone out boozing. Sorry.

[AGA]

I don't think people going out or being hungover or whatever ever affected a group activity. What else would we have done in those instances, sat in the campsite in the dark doing nothing?

[Helm]

How about not drink?

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

Will logic prevail?  Find out in the next exciting Mittens!

[AGA]

How's about you let consenting adults do what they like?

[Disco]

I can agree that Mittens might have been a little bit more interesting had there been less emphasis on drinking, but what can be done about it? I mean, all that really happened to me was a couple people made some critical comments about me whilst drunk, some of my things were kicked halfway across a site, and I was called a c**t. At least we weren't just sitting in the dark doing nothing.

I really don't want to make it a big deal about it because I love you guys, we had fun, and I already forgive the offenders for this, but can you see how people might be reluctant to spend $1062 (not being specific or anything) to cross the Atlantic (again, not specific) to spend time with consenting adults who had a bit too much to drink?

Also, sorry to Adamski, as he didn't spend that much money to get his posh sunglasses stepped on :'(

[Layabout]

As the one who instigated alot of the drinking, I would like a time to comment. I think it is a good thing if a group of people can have fun, good conversation and a bit of competative pool with a few drinks. It was never about just drinking. It was about spending time with good people. Personally I thought that having a few drinks loosened up those who were less inclined to talk.

Sure enough, some of us were a bit hungover when we went to the themepark, but we certainly werent informed that that was the next days event. If we had known, we would have gone to bed at a sensible time.

Sorry If you though there was an emphasis on alcohol. I don't believe there was. There was an emphasis on having a good time.

[Privateer Puddin']

I've never really been too keen on people drinking a lot at mittens/brittens/whatever but I can't do anything to stop them, so I choose to not go where there will be much drinking going on. Fine by me, but don't expect me to put up with you if you come back pissed

With the numbers attending these days, people do generally tend to split up a bit, just because it can be difficult to ~20 all in a circle to talk.

[Matt Goble]

I wouldn't say there was a huge issue with drinking, certainly less than Brittens last year where we did go through a LOT of alcohol.

On a few nights, I know a group of us went out to the early hours of the following morning (5:30, 6:30am) but for me, it certainly wasn't a marathon boozing session.  The fact of the matter was that it finally became cool in the evening and so you could go out socialising, with the emphasis on socialising.

If we stayed at the campsite, we either sat around the restaurant until we were yelled at, or we sat around on gravel until we got yelled at, the lights switched off & we pissed off the other campers.  21 people cannot keep quiet, even if they try.

Going out of an evening, meant having a seat, or standing around in groups, or having a few games of pool.  We didn't piss anyone off, we didn't make too much noise, we had a good time, a bit of dancing.  If people wanted to drink they did, but as adults if you drink too much, that's your fault.  If you just wanted a soft drink, that's your choice, and I did on a number of occaisons when I wanted a drink, but not something alcoholic.

Would it have been different if we had stayed at the campsite?  Did people not buy booze to drink at the campsite?  Would people not have gotten more pissed as the purchased booze would have been cheaper?

How do I see next year's Mittens?

A group of mates, sitting in a cabin, in comfort, chatting and joking and having a good time.  Some will drink, some will drink a lot, others will be happy with a glass of water, milk, pineapple juice, whatever.

21 people who are spending a week together are going to clash, go through cool spots, even say things they don't mean, because it's 21 people with their own wants and personalities.

For me, the biggest problem this year was communication.  Everyone has different expectations from these things, and want to do different things.  It is logistically impossible to please everyone.  I could say that some people should have been more considerate as what people wanted to do as a group. 

I think in future, people should & will split off into seperate groups to do their own thing, and this could be improved upon if times and dates are agreed as to when we all, as a group, meet up to enjoy everyone's company.

This year, a lack of communication meant that people were going off, and it wasn't known when they would get back, and people would wait, then get pissed off that they were waiting...

I think this year we reached pretty much farcical proportions on the last night, and at times over the week I did get pissed off because of the lack of communication and the lack of decision making.  Guys, most of you are smart enough to do some pretty amazing stuff, that I can never get my head around, but no-one can make a decision whether to go left or right at a junction in a theme park!!!

Did I have a good time?  Yes
Did I get annoyed / pissed off / frustrated at times?  Yes
Did it spoil things?  No

There is always going to be things to bitch about, and please voice those concerns here, because some of us are considerate enough to listen to them.  If I did anything to annoy anyone, PM me and we can discuss it.  I would urge everyone to do the same.

As Layabout says, the emphasis was on having a good time, which means socialising which can include going to places which serve drinks.  You don't have to drink alcohol, and everyone is adult enough to drink responsibly.

That's enough for now...

[AGA]

Almost everyone drank to some degree, and very few people actually got annoyingly drunk. Aside from a couple of people getting hungover and sleeping late (which I do naturally anyway, so...) due to late nights, this was really no different from any other Mittens. You're making far too much of a big deal about it. It didn't prevent us from doing anything we planned to.

Plus, as custard said, getting 20+ people all to participate in the same activity at the same time is pretty much impossible. This is just Mittens' evolution, and something you'll have to get used to...

EDIT: what Matt said.

[Adamski]

No worries, I don't want to make a big deal about this either because it's mostly incosiquential, but I do want to let people know my concerns. There was a greater emphasis on drinking than previous mittens, and CJs photos clearly show this It certainly didn't impact the enjoyment of Mittens to any great extent for me, but it does make me think twice about my future participation in these meets if the amount of drinking/drunkenness continues down the same path as this year. (Edit, especially if you're saying that this is what Mittens is evolving in to).

Edit: Actually, perhaps a large part of it was down to not having anywhere close that all of us could go and not annoy people. In Sweeden we were in a secluded location anyway (but there was also not much alcohol, but still an emphasis on fun) so there was no problem, in New York we had the lake to go to (and also not much alcohol), and in Greece we spent most nights on the beach. And there was more alcohol at the Greece meet, but only when we were together as a group. I guess if we had a similar situation in Benidorm there would have been less of a rift made by those that wanted to go to the same pub all the time and those that just wanted to enjoy each other's company.

[AGA]

Those that went out were enjoying each other's company too, you know...

[Grundislav]

Yes, let's look at the differences and you'll see that it really was a product of situation. (Using my own attendance as an example).

New York: At Eric's place we were in a secluded location, we had plenty of room, and there were only 13 of us, so we had lots of time to hang out and socialize.Ã,  We went out to a couple of bars one night and had a good time.Ã,  We had plenty of other things to do to socialize.

Greece: Another semi-secluded location, with the AGS Lounge and a large expanse of beach available to us every night.Ã,  This time there were 18 people.Ã,  We had more to drink, sure, but nobody got ridiculously drunk, (except maybe AGA but that was more amusing than anything else).Ã,  Fun was still had by all.

Benidorm: In the middle of a big tourist city.Ã,  There were 21 people.Ã,  The campsite was not a good place for us all to sit due to the lack of light and chairs.Ã,  Some attendees were more prone to go out and drink than others, but that will always be the case.Ã, 

I think Matt made a lot of very good points.Ã,  I'm sorry that there was a feeling of separation, but those of us that did go out most nights didn't in fact go out with the intention of drinking to the point of passing out, we were just going to have some fun and a good time with friends.Ã,  Personally I knew my limits, and once I figured I'd had enough booze I just stopped and continued enjoying the company.

One thing I noticed was the motive behind the desire to go to the secluded beach.Ã,  Someone said it was "a lot like Greece" and the general feeling was that the nostalgia of Greece wanted to be captured.Ã,  I understand this desire, but personally, I think each place Mittens is held should be experienced for what it is, and not trying to recreate Mittens past.Ã,  Then again, I could be wrong, and it was just a mutual desire to get away from the campsite.

So like Matt said, if I did anything to offend anyone please let me know via PM, but as far as I could tell we didn't come back to the campsite making an obscene amount of noise or waking everyone up.Ã,  Come next Mittens, if there is alcohol I will most likely have it, but obviously if we're sitting around in good company in a lodge, the amount had will differ than if we were all doing a pub crawl around Calgary.

On a lighter note, here's Melt the Limit 2!
http://www.grundislavgames.com/mittens06/videos/mtl2.wmv

[m0ds]

Melt The Limit 2 - awesome movie, Grundislav!!! Touching in a very strange kind of way! Though, a little weak on the plot...

One thing I noticed was the motive behind the desire to go to the secluded beach.Ã,  Someone said it was "a lot like Greece" and the general feeling was that the nostalgia of Greece wanted to be captured.Ã,  I understand this desire, but personally, I think each place Mittens is held should be experienced for what it is, and not trying to recreate Mittens past.Ã,  Then again, I could be wrong, and it was just a mutual desire to get away from the campsite.

I think the more important factor here was that it was going to be our last full night together at Mittens, and it obviously couldn't be spent in the campsite, by the pool or the Raco bar - and it would have probably been the best oppurtunity for all 21 of us to sit around and have a good old games discussion. But for some reason, people felt curry was more important. Fair enough - but there's always time to eat, and we're grown men (and women) - you don't need food ALL the time. Anyway. I say you that didn't go probably did miss out. There was little to no drinking that night, followed by some hefty adventure game discussions, which certainly had me engrossed. Maybe you had a similar time at the curry house or whatnot.

In regards to the drinking, as everyone has said in its defence - it was a matter of circumstance. I was able to drink, have a good time and really enjoy chatting with the people I shared drunk and sober nights with. In actual fact, when out in the bars in Benidorm - we had just as good a conversations as those at the campsite. And if we weren't at the campsite, we were at a water park, theme park etc - and I certainly didn't miss any of those. I didn't even miss Nacho's early morning bike ride. No-one complained about being hung-over even if they were, so I really can't see in anyway how those that drank upset or bothered the others. Mittens will get rowdier (sp) because we know each other more. Maybe in your normal circle of friends you sit in silence, twiddle your thumbs, play the PS2 and then talk about the game you just played. In mine, we don't do that at all. We go out, we do stuff, we take the piss out of each other because it's funny - yet we understand we still totally appreciate each others company.

This leads me to some confussion. What is it you want from Mittens, Adam? You yourself can see that things become more difficult as the group gets larger. I too wanted to spend most of the time in ONE BIG GROUP where we could ALL discuss. This was impossible, which was a shame. There was always a split up to two groups. The Helm group, and the non-Helm group. And that frankly pisses me off, because I too want to listen to Helm but I don't want to leave other people out. SO of course, I don't want to be split up and I don't "want" to go and get ratarsed, but I know any decent, full group conversation will be problematic because of the size of the group. Anyway On the way back we discussed tightening the numbers to a max of 15 or 20, but realised that would lead to problems because the majority of us there bar 3 this year, were former attendees.

Despite having all these thoughts, I still don't really care - because I had a fantastic time, met some fantastic people and caught up with others - enjoyed every waking and sleeping minute of the event and felt our Spanish hosts did an amazing job. Mittens is what you make it, so make it what you want. I did, and it worked fine for me.

[Nacho]

Shit, I posted a large reply, but it got deleted... :/

Anyway, as a host, sorry, I feel resposible, but we had to try this urban experience. For me it was ok, at the same level of the previous, but how mittens went is something very presonal. I can't talk by anyone.

I felt also a bit of this feeling of "separation". But it didn't annoyed me. I don't like the smokey dark clubs, I've never been in one for ages, but it was ok for me if the others wanted to go.

I know that the non drinkers can suffer a bit of annoyance for those with hangovers. They feel that they are missing the fun because the drinkers can't follow their pace, and just because they are weak and they can't handle with a "horrible vicious". I felt that with another group of friends. But, to be honest, only 4 of a possible amount of 42 (21 mitteners X 2 days) were not ok for the days of the theme and the water park. Only one missed the date. Not a bad record. With such a big group, I would have expected a KIA in one of the days by influenza or a cold... Not bad. Also, theme parks and water parks are places to be walked in smalls groups, I think... You just can't keep a group of more than 20 people together, IMO.

About the "night in the secret beach"... It was ok. The group of 8 who went to the beach would have been at the campsite, sleeping, and the other would have gone to pubs. There was not a bigger sepparation that the one there could have happened without the sleeping in the beach, if you think it...

So: The amount of alcohol is rising, and this years all the astronomical bodies have conspirated to make it even more visible... But I don't really felt like something terrible happened. Next year it will be totally different. I guess it will be more like in Greece, with just one night of wild booze, and everyone will be more involved in it. Even the non drinkers will be amused somehow, because they will know that our weakness won't slow down the fun for all the rest of the event.

Conclussion: A mix of solidarity with those who drink, and those who do not. I drink a bit, and I can move into the two groups, I think I managed to be into all the activities of mittens, even in a "little wild" party, not the big ones which came after... Ã, 

So, again, sorry, and keep my promise that next year will probably be different.

[Helm]

Consenting adults can do as they like, AGA. I'd just like to know a bit in advance if Mittens is going to go from a bunch of friendly mitteneers engaged in group fun and activities, to a group of singular concenting adults, only aligning their individual destinies for enough time to decide in which pub they'll go next. I am not saying it was that this year, but if it's going to get closer and closer, I do not really care to participate as much. I can see as many drunk people as I want here.

This years mittens was nice, I was more annoyed by bad service than the drinking, but that's an issue too. I discuss this here and not in Mittens because I didn't want to spoil the mood and get into arguments. I am not telling you what to do. I DID tell you what to do when I was hosting, and my opinion was 'no excessive drinking, no drug use' and when you Berian, got drunk and poked me with a bottle I didn't complain or call you on it because it was an isolated incident and I am not your mother, and because it was funny. But if it's going to be more and more drunk people which I'll have to deal with drunk-gloves on, it will become taxing. When people, half-drunk, get up in your face, while you've had a really really rough night and urge you to fight them, you know the drinking isn't helping.

The Helm group, and the non-Helm group.

I understand what you mean, but I want you to know I am not encouraging any 'schism' in the group. I just don't like to drink a lot and a night out in town at pubs at wet-shirt contests and karaoke (which, as a Greek I suspect I will never understand the appeal of) does not excite me. If other people would rather not do that as well, here's your two groups, Helm influence notwithstanding. This being said, and while the night wasn't good for me, I did follow you to a pub and I did have my Guinness with Grundy and the rest of you and I tried to play along. Maybe it'll be best if everybody comes half-way in their social desires, and the social desires of others in attendance of Mittens.

The bigger the group gets, and the more lack of Andailism to push us towards specific activities, the more there'll be splinters and people just going off doing their own thing. This could be avoided, simply enough, by Mittens being far away from civilization, for one. Then people extending some courtesy in what they're used to doing, while in Mittens. You can be a drunkard all you want in real life, but Mittens you should make an effort to be sober. I suffer from short bursts of numbing depression, in real life. I am not a predominantly happy guy. It happens in Mittens, as everywhere else, and when situations arise that push me even more, it's difficult to maintain a healthy 'HELLO, I AM HEEELM' attitude at all times, but I try, 'cause it's Mittens. People should try to be their best because other people paid 1,000 dollars to come meet them.

[Adamski]

This leads me to some confussion. What is it you want from Mittens, Adam? You yourself can see that things become more difficult as the group gets larger.

Don't let me mislead you into thinking that I didn't get what I wanted from Mittens this year, which was to have a great time! I did enjoy it, and I'd do the whole thing over again - horrible journey included - in the blink of an eye! Things are surely going to be difficult when there are 21 people with nowhere to go to be loud and Mittensy, but we coped. The issue that I have is the atmosphere that came through the much higher ratio of drunk-to-sober moments than previous Mittens - and as I've said it was not detremential to my overall enjoyment of the event, but it was apparent to me and several others enough to want to raise the point. 

[Matt Goble]

Right, before we go any further, I want to make one thing clear which I believe no-one will disagree with me on:

Nacho did an amazing job organising this year's Mittens.  He sorted out a good location, with good facilities.  He organised great days out and ensured there was discount so it didn't cost as much as it should / could.  He did everything possible to make everyone welcome, and did his very best to try an accomodate everyone.

As I said earlier, the sad fact is that there will always be people who will want their way all the time, and not be willing to compromise for the benefit of everyone else.

Normally I'm really bad at posting photos, mainly because I'm too bone idle and can't get the hang of these web albumthings, but below is a link to this year's photo's although at quite a low res:

http://mattgoble.com/AGS/Photos/Mittens_2006/index.htm

I don't take my camera out of an evening, because a)It's big a crap b)I don't want to loose it.  As such, this is what we got up to IN THE DAY, and WITHOUT ALCOHOL.

Let's not forget it's a f***ing holiday which we all had a great time on.  If people have a problem with the fact that there's is going to be alcohol drinking the perhaps Mittens isn't for them anymore, because quite frankly if I'm on holiday, I want to have a relaxing drink, and have a good time and not have to worry if it's my first or third beer of the day.  I'M ON F***ING HOLIDAY.

If people are dumb enough to get drunk and then suffer the next day from a hangover then more fool them , cos they'll miss out on the fun of the next day.  If people disrupt other people's enjoyment because of their drunken antics, then they you be given a good slap for being inconsiderate.  By the same token, if people are going to huff and pout because 20 other people are not doing what they want to do, then they also need a good slap for being inconsiderate.  The door swings both ways.

Yes, we all meet up because of AGS, but quite frankly I don't want to spend the whole time talking about games.  I want to talk about life, universe and everything with people.  I like to hear what Goldmund, Domminka, Helm etc think of the world, what their favourite movies are and the like.  I like to hear about Petteri's new course.  I like to hear about Grundislav's life, and the adventures he's had.  I like to hear about CJ's new flat.  And if you do these things in a restaurant, a bar, a club, on some dirt at the campsite, I don't care, but some options are more comfortable than others!

Interesting that Helm mentions Andail in his post.  When some of us went down to Brighton this year, Andail organised a couple of good party games, and then he and a bunch of the group went to a club until early o'clock.  No-one came back stupid drunk, so maybe there is an Andail influence even in drinking establishments...

I too, will never do karaoke, but Grundislav was bloody good!

Please enjoy the photos 

[m0ds]

I want you to know I am not encouraging any 'schism' in the group. I just don't like to drink a lot and a night out in town at pubs at wet-shirt contests and karaoke (which, as a Greek I suspect I will never understand the appeal of) does not excite me.

Well that's cool, and I respect & understand that you are not - and I think all the other drinkers respect that, just as you and the non-drinkers respect that we were going to enjoy going out and having a drink. Not necessarily more than the alternative, but there really were not many other options - or moreso - suggestions for other things to do. I was surprised there was no Mittolympics this year, and what surprises me more is that out of 21 of us did it really need an Andail to make such a thing happen? It was a great shame he couldn't go because I do love the games he conjures up, but would he too have faced problems with our location and come out drinking instead? Who knows

[Nacho]

Keeping consistent a group of more than 20 people is impossible. Look, I am spanish, and Helm is greek. We ares mediterranean!!! We wake up late, we have lunch late and dinner also late. So, when people whose countries with less sunlight go to have dinner at 1900, we ain't really hungry.

But Helm allways came, with no complains, to have just a dessert, or even a pint of Guinness. He did not drink a drop of alcohol in Greece... But here, he did. His sentence was allways the same: "phew, I don't want to... but I'll go to socialise".

I really appreciate the effort.

So, if someone feels that there was a "Helm group", he/she, should reconsider. It's true that there was a group formed by Blazed and wife, Nacho and wife, and Helm, but it's somehow logical because there has been something special with Helm, Blazed, Petter and me since Sweden. There is also a group made by british and nobody blames it to be the "Chris' Ã, group"! Ã,  Anyway, some people occassionally joins the group (Chrille, M0ds, Quintaros...) I don't feel that the "group" is exclusive, everyone is invited. As an example, as for the "night in the beach" thingie, Adam has told me that he would have probably come if he had the equipment. Inga was not feeling 100% because of the medication, but I think I am right if I consider her closer to this group than to the "curry group". So... with a slight change of variables, we could be talking that the beach group could have been formed by 11 members, while the "curry" one, by 10. So... it was not really a group of "disidents", but just a a split of an original bigger group, no?

Anyway, talking of splits, "disidenties" and bad stories would make the outer witness think that this has been really awfull... Ã,  Ã, I think we should make clear that there are not bad feelings, and that everything has been 99% perfect except this small issues we're discussing now, no?

EDIT:

Nacho did an amazing job organising this year's Mittens.  He sorted out a good location, with good facilities.  He organised great days out and ensured there was discount so it didn't cost as much as it should / could.  He did everything possible to make everyone welcome, and did his very best to try an accomodate everyone.

Matt... And Lorena!!!  She also exist, she is a member, and she got the discounts alone... 

[m0ds]

To be honest Nacho, I don't think anyone had any problems with the proceedings of this years events at all, except one, and he has now re-assured that the drinking factor was not even a problem for him this year, but that if it increasesd in the future - it could put himself and others off - which is understandable.

So really, there is nothing left to discuss other than how brilliant Mittens was!

[Matt Goble]

Anyway, talking of splits, "disidenties" and bad stories would make the outer witness think that this has been really awfull...    I think we should make clear that there are not bad feelings, and that everything has been 99% perfect except this small issues we're discussing now, no?

No, no Nacho, it was truly awful 

Everyone had a great time.  I didn't get burnt, now own a great hat, and have stopped making bad smells due to a lovely curry (thankyou curry).

Grundislav, MTL2 is amazing, better than some of the crap I see day in, day out.  Drop me a PM and we can sort out the best way to include a DVD version on next year's annual.

[Grundislav]

Melt the Limit 2 (As well as 1) wouldn't have been possible without everyone's awesome participation.  I'm just the schmuck holding the camera and trying to make some sense out of all the great stuff you guys did.

Looking forward to making Melt the Limit 3: You're All Chairs!

[MrColossal]

I just want to quickly say, having read this thread and talked to DS...

I share DS's concerns and want to reiterate to the people who feel they need to defend their actions against DS's post. He didn't say "SHAME ON YOU! HOW DARE YOU!" he said "This is something that was on my mind, want to talk about it?"

He didn't say "MITTENS WAS RUINED!!!" he said "This is a concern I have."

He also said "I loved my time at Mittens." I feel that some of the people trying to defend their actions are ramping up the issue with their choice of words.

That is all

Eric

Oh also, DS said "I HATE SPANISH PEOPLE!" But that's mostly subtext

[Helm]

Nacho, thank you for organizing Mittens. I enjoyed my time there. The complains do not mean I didn't, and a good sense of perspective should be applied to realize my issues with the organizing were very minor ones and didn't stop me from having a good time.

Matt: you are on holiday. I am on holiday. We're all on holiday. If we're going to have holidays together, we should all come half-way in what we want to do. "giving a good slap for being inconsiderate" to people isn't as easy a process as you make it sound like. I'd rather people took special care on their own. I don't act in Mittens as if I'm with my mates back home, stupid or silly and they'll sort me out if I go out of line, as my mates back home didn't pay 1,000 to be in my company that night.

You say you'd like to hear about all the other wonderful stuff people talk of in mittens besides AGS stuff. Well that always happens, as far as I can tell. Being drunk or not drunk has nothing to do with this. Let's not make a strawman out of the argument, it was never either GET DRUNK vs. TALK ABOUT AGS.

[Matt Goble]

Helm, you are right, we are all on holiday.  And we're on holiday as a group which we've all paid to be a part of.  As such everyone should be considerate of everyone else, whether that it down to people's behaviour regarding alcohol, or they're likes and dislikes regarding what the group does.

Nacho say's that you weren't big on going for the drinks and socialising, but made an effort because you're a considerate person.  I'm not a huge fan of thrill rides, but I was more than happy to hold the bags at the theme park while other people experienced them.  I would like to think that I am a considerate person.

You're right it is easier to talk about 'slapping someone for being inconsiderate' than it is to do, and I would never suggest that we resort to violence over such matters  .  My point / dream is that as we get to know people more, and build up our relationships, we will be able to turn to each other and verbally 'slap' each other into shape as you and your mates do at home.  We should be able to tell each other when we are being unreasonable, and when enough is enough.

You're right, it was never about GET DRUNK vs TALK ABOUT AGS, but at the same time, going out of an evening was not about getting drunk - I think we might have some crossed wires.

I personally went out because there were places other than the campsite where it was easier to talk, whether that is over a meal, a drink or the walk from one place to another.  We could stay at the campsite and get drunk, we could stay at the campsite and talk AGS, we could do both of those things away from the campsite.

The only problem with discussing this stuff after the fact is that it looses some of it's context.  It is now a bigger thing than it was.  As I said in my earlier post, what was fundamentally lacking was communication.

[Disco]

Communication...crossed wires...yes that seems right.

Now that I think of it, most of the bad things I recall from Mittens and in this thread (i.e.-hurt feelings, seperations) were because of communication problems.

I hesitate speaking of this as it's a bit embarrasing, and was going to leave it for a PM,Ã,  but now that I know I'm not alone I feel alright talking about it. Like Helm, I also often experience a near catatonia-inducing (well, for me at least ) depression, which sadly just happened to hit the night before Mittens began. Because of this, there were times where I felt quite hurt or offended by non-drunk people standing right next to me (not vica-versa), though I conjure most was due to misunderstandings. Also, the fact that I am a North American who is not used to "taking the piss out of each other" for fun didn't help either. I feel I must apologise to every Mittener for the times I left the group to wander on my own at night, feeling disconnected from everyone, and to the 4-5 people I lied to when they asked me what was wrong. I'm sorry for that, I just didn't want to cause anyone to worry. It wasn't you it was me (Wow, that really is true sometimes...thank you George Custanza).

As for the person to person problems, it's hard to tell if any of it was real or imagined or that things weren't as bad as I saw them, but I sometimes worried that I was falling out with people or perhaps that someone didn't like me or something. Anyways, I left Mittens acting cheery for everyone, but really feeling awful because I just wanted to resolve things one on one with those I felt I had problems with. However, In the few days ince I've been home, I realise that there probably wasn't such a problem in the first place, it is just likely just communication.

I'm confident that after everyone speaking their minds this year, we'll get along that much better next year. Sorry if this makes little sense, I'm just pouring out my thoughts on a dificult topic.

Still looking forward to Canada,
Kenneth

[Becky]

I think we're looking back in hindsight and blowing things out of proportion a bit here.  At times I did feel a bit frustrated at events, and I do agree that poor or fractured decision making was the root of the problem.  With a group as large as 21, we really should have been prepared that we would split into smaller groups, and made arrangements accordingly.  However, overall I think it was fine, we did enjoy our trips out as groups, and I managed to try and speak to everyone over the course of the time I was there.

I really enjoyed everyone's company, whether as a large group or as smaller groups.  Everyone was friendly towards me and I had such an awesome time, I hope to be with you all in Canada next year! 

[AGA]

I don't think any planning is needed really. People split into groups at times, sure, but it wasn't always the same few people together. Sometimes Darren (Quintaros) was with the drinking crew, for instance, and sometimes he was with the others. Sometimes Goldmund and Dominica had stuff to do, so they disappeared. Sometimes scotch, Disco, magintz and Petteri disappeared in the sea for hours. People were off having fun doing what they wanted to do. We still spent a lot of time together as large groups - the theme parks, some meals, some bar trips, late nights at the campsite, for instance. But keeping that up all the time would be very difficult, and I think we struck a nice balance. I can't speak for everyone, but I don't think anyone was especially excluded or stuck doing something they didn't want to do, did they? You might have wanted everyone to spent more time together as a whole, but that was practically speaking just not going to happen.

The only complaint I do have personally is that on the occasions we did decide to all do something together, it usually took us about half an hour of standing around to actually LEAVE. People going to the toilet, changing clothes, getting money, whatever. Kind of understandable, but come on, get a move on, people!

[scotch]

I didn't find the drinking too excessive, at least there were plenty of people not involved (along with myself), so there were always people around to hang out with. And most of the time people weren't drinking. It's preferable to talk to people in smaller groups, so I am glad we went and did different things sometimes, I don't think there was a lack of planning.

To Nacho and Lorena: The location and activities of this mittens were great, I loved it. Contrary to what this argument and some of the photos might suggest, drinking was a tiny part of the week in general, and will be less most years... we were in an alcohol fuelled tourist town, what do you expect?

Disco... do you have your videos?

[passer-by]

Are you ever going to stop this and do some photoshop ? ?
We're getting impatient here!!

[La Lore]

AGSers... I exist... and now, I have a video...

http://s12.photobucket.com/albums/a214/La_Lore/Mittens%20Spain/
The password: morebeer

Grundislav... great film
I want to see more photosÃ, 

[Adamski]

Sorry to cause such a stir with my post, it's unfortunate that the textual delivery made it sound like I felt more deeply about it than I actually do! I had discussed it with Becky a bit when we left which is why it was at the forefront of my mind, and as Matt has said the context gets lost a little after the event. Everyone has made some fair points in defense, it's a shame there wasn't anywhere more comfortable that we all could have gone to talk away from the campsite (I don't believe anyone would have chosen Home From Home over a proper Mittens Campfire if there'd been a choice!) as I do feel like I missed out on chatting to the folks who spent more time in bars than me - mostly the brits actually. It probably doesn't help that we missed the trip down and Thursday evening too, otherwise my brain would have probably felt more satisfied with the time spent in everyone's company!

The small niggles we've experienced ths year - and we've had 5 years without a single frownline so far so we're doing pretty damn well - will be forgotten in weeks and we'll only remember all the great bits such as 6 storey yellow enema slides, bone-shaking rollercoasters, spinning hammer rides of joy, flipping people over on the rapids, waterslide races, Eugene and his Bionic Arm, The Adventure Game Movie (lost in production), Exorcising Kings Quest 7, Bohemian Rhapsody vs. Acceptable Noise Pollution Levels, CJ's face as a memorabilia cereal bowl, Insane bus drivers and their ticket despensers, fun with curry, Italian Music Video critique (it's the same frigging drum sounds!), Arse Arse Arse, discovering water is secretly highly flammable, taking a boat to the island (Red Cross version), taking a real boat to the island, Bar Celona, "All you CAN eat, not all YOU WOULD LIKE to eat", Cow Trading, The AGS Male Low-Note Drone Choir and countless other nuggets of greatness that can only happen at Mittens - I'm sure there are many more people can add.

I hope no one feels there's any tension or bad blood - certainly not from me anyway - if this thread has given the illusion that there is! Things tend to appear more serious in writing than intended. But hey, that's the internet for you
At least next year we'll be better prepared to deal with organisation issues and planning, especially if we have our own cozy central living quarters as a base of operations.

[Nacho]

Yes, this been magnified, probablty because people felt that this was more an attack that a commet. This is the crap of internet, everything sounds in your head, when read, worse than told in real live, face to face... for me everything is solved.

And now, you, suckers, congratulate me for the maravelous hosting is ok, but Lorena wants her glory too! PM her!!! 

[Andail]

The initial mittens had booze, although it was actually only Candyman who got really drunk.
My mittens included very little alcohol, and no nights at pubs/clubs. I was drunk myself once but it was an isolated incident, I hope. I tried to arrange activities and force everybody to participate, so that people could break the ice without alcohol.
Mittens USA also had close to zero alcohol, which was also due to the fact that the crew was fairly small (and quite well acquainted, mostly) and we had a locale to be in. There were also activities.
Mittens Greece was quite peacefully devoid of drunkenness (except for AGA, but that was harmless and fun). People were well acquainted at this point and there was no need for special acitivities or booze. However, the group was relatively big this time and split up on occassions.
Wintermeet...only one night out, which totally rocked! Celebrating the new year dancing with Grundislav, Blazej and Dominika was awesome. But over all, not much booze.
Brightens saw Spleen as frantic as ever, and that certainly added to the atmosphere. It was a great meeting over all.

Personally I've cut back on alcohol quite dramatically, which is because of a) I'm getting way too tired and hung-over to appreciate the drunkenness, and B) I have a steady relationship, and that tends to calm down that sort of behaviour...

Anyhow, I promise to attend the next meeting.

[Helm]

Lorena, thank you for co-hosting. You are very nice

Andail: looking forward to getting together again.

[Becky]

When all the shops ressurect on Tuesday I shall take my camera to have the photos developed - I can only hope that the underwater-photo attempts didn't trash the film!

[m0ds]

Can't wait to see the underwater shots!! And Lorena, thank you for hosting us! Or co-hosting us And getting us discounts, and picking us up early on the morning of Nacho's race... You did a grand job! And like Helm said, you are very nice! As is Nacho, and everyone else who went!







Except me.

[Matt Goble]

Lorena, great job on co-hosting.  Sorry I missed you out of my huge "back slapping" to Nacho earlier.

Radiant, I missed having a go at the Pizza Card game, so maybe next time.

Adam, 'Home from Home' out of the question due to SSMS (Scary Single Mother Syndrome), but Beer's Friend next door - outside tables, pool for AGA, 1.10 for a pint if you wanted 2.00 for a soft drink.  Very easy to 'tread water' on one pint there!

Andail, you were sorely missed, although understandably so.  Make sure it doesn't happen again. 

Everyone had a great time, I think when it comes down to it, people will always want a greater time.  Like girlfriends, the grass is always greener.

Just as an aside, on the way back when the road-trip crew stopped at the CarreFour Express HyperMarket place, 1.5L of Water was 20c - how cheap is that!?!?  Just a bit far to go for some hydration each day.

Nacho, Lorena, before I forget, and so as not to start a new thread, when it comes out in Spain, you must go and see Guillermo del Toro's new film "Pan's Labyrinth" or "El Laberinto del Fauno" as it may be called.  I saw a showing over here on Friday with an Introduction by del Toro and it's amazing - kind of Alice in Wonderland during the Spanish Civil War.

[Pumaman]

Did I miss some sort of alcohol-related incident, because I'm really not sure what's being referred to here?

If it's just the fact that some of us went out to the bars for a while on a few nights, well as Grundislav says that was just a result of the situation we were in -- there was no-where reasonable to sit around and chat on the campsite, so why not go to a bar and chat instead? The majority of the time was not DRINK DRINK DRINK GET BLIND DRUNK but rather just having a chat over a pint, in a pub with some chairs to sit on. You didn't need to be a frantic drinker to come along, and could easily just drink Coke if you so desired -- it was just somewhere to sit and talk.

As has been pointed out several times, 21 people is just too many to sit around in a circle and have a single discussion; it's not going to work. Splitting up into groups is to be expected with this many people -- my only complaint would be that we should have organised things better. Saying "we'll go to the bar, you guys go to the beach, and we'll meet back at the campsite at 11:00" would have been far preferable to people randomly leaving or getting left behind, and then a panic to find them later on and not knowing how long to wait for.

Anyway, as I say, unless there was some sort of incident that I'm not aware of, I didn't see anything that happened as being a problem, and I really enjoyed the week. But I think it proves that we need Andail, and he shall never be allowed to miss another Mittens.


EDIT: So on this topic, how about these for the custom titles:
1: Mittens teetotaler
2: Mittens drinker
3: Mittens drunkard
4: Mittens hangover
5: Mittens AGA

[m0ds]

EDIT: So on this topic, how about these for the custom titles:
1: Mittens teetotaler
2: Mittens drinker
3: Mittens drunkard
4: Mittens hangover
5: Mittens AGA

Hahaha! I'd definitely take number 3!

Woops!

[AGA]

That would make you, m0ds and DarkStalkey a Mittens AGA too, Chris :O

I propose

1. Crap at pool
2. Crap at pool
3. Crap at pool
4. Crap at pool
5. AGA ARE KING

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

I just don't like to drink a lot and a night out in town at pubs at wet-shirt contests and karaoke (which, as a Greek I suspect I will never understand the appeal of) does not excite me.

Greeks are not the only people who feel this way, Helm ^_^.

Also, based on what I have read it seems that Mittens is simply not for certain people, ie, people like me that simply cannot stand being around alcohol or people consuming it.  It also seems it's not for people who are attention-needy and want to constantly have something going on and be surrounded by others.  This isn't a bad thing, really, but perhaps people should know what they're in for in advance?  Certainly I figure most of the regulars already know what to expect, but new (and interested) parties do not, and it might be nice to give them an idea in this regard so they can decide whether or not it's something they can handle. 

NO DEPOSIT NO RETURN.

Also:  Berian is a scamp, and less loveable than he claims!

[Erenan]

Yeah, as someone who would like to meet up with some of the people on here in person someday, and as someone who doesn't drink a drop of alcohol ever, period, let's just say I was a little put off by the photos I was seeing. But I am reassured by the content of this conversation. I was worried that I would feel alienated by my decision not to have any alcohol, but it seems now that that probably would not be the case, and I'd probably have fun after all.

Of course, I don't have a heck of a lot of money. And I know my girlfriend (fiancée before too long, probably) would encourage me not to go and meet Internet people in person, especially flying off to Europe or Canada to do it. Maybe those of us over here on the west coast who are interested really ought to have a meeting sometime.

[Pet Terry]

I did my best to get along with everyone, drunk or not. I even got quite drunk myself twice, and that's not something I usually do. I knew the group would split in two on several occasions, and I usually had hard time deciding which group to join. Sometimes, though, people just started gathering around a couple of people, like when Dominika and me had a discussion about differences between languages. Then people just started gathering around us, and BLAM! A new group had born. I guess it just happens.

On the other hand...

The small niggles we've experienced ths year - and we've had 5 years without a single frownline so far so we're doing pretty damn well - will be forgotten in weeks and we'll only remember all the great bits such as 6 storey yellow enema slides, bone-shaking rollercoasters, spinning hammer rides of joy, flipping people over on the rapids, waterslide races, Eugene and his Bionic Arm, The Adventure Game Movie (lost in production), Exorcising Kings Quest 7, Bohemian Rhapsody vs. Acceptable Noise Pollution Levels, CJ's face as a memorabilia cereal bowl, Insane bus drivers and their ticket despensers, fun with curry, Italian Music Video critique (it's the same frigging drum sounds!), Arse Arse Arse, discovering water is secretly highly flammable, taking a boat to the island (Red Cross version), taking a real boat to the island, Bar Celona, "All you CAN eat, not all YOU WOULD LIKE to eat", Cow Trading, The AGS Male Low-Note Drone Choir and countless other nuggets of greatness that can only happen at Mittens - I'm sure there are many more people can add.

Thanks for the list! I had already forgotten some of those things!

My photos should be up in the end of this week.

EDIT: To clarify, I didn't get drunk to just to get along with people. I just went to get a couple of drinks with people, and it just kind of happened.

[SSH]

I need to check the details out before I can be definitive with any offer to host, but if Brittens 07 is in Scotland at my house, then there will definately be some ground rules about late-night noise and drunkenness as my kids bedtime is at 8pm...

[Nacho]

No offense, but I think (my opinion...) that this makes your option unviable. It's not only the drunkness, I KNOW we can have meetings without a drop of alcohol, but a house with two little children is light years far away from the ideal place for this kind of events.

[Nikolas]

Oh I'm definately in for Britens 07 in SSH house! Along with MY Family!

Also there are at least another 3-4 family men around!

Lets have a famitens! Anywhere, Anytime, Anyhow...

[SSH]

Well, I have a garage, summer house and garden that would be the main part of the venue, Nacho. My house isn't big enough for 20+ people anyway...

[Nacho]

Then I predict 2 or 3 families in familymittens and another meeting in another side of the UK... Ã, 

AFTER READING SSH's POST: Whereas I consider that you are smart enoughÃ,  to provide the appropiate facilities, and to understand that this meetings are not 100% suitable for kids and you could be able to provide alternative fun for "adults", I must keep my opinion that the option (with 4 little kids now, if Nikolas' family joins) is not "ideal". I don't mean it's bad, actually... I can also admit that there's actually no "ideal" location, but still, this option is, IMO, too far away from "ideal".

Anyway, as Lorena and me can accept totally "light" meetings, as for alcohol and noise, it shouldn't be me who should deffend the idea of changing the location.

I'll shut up now for allowing the ones who should really claim for another location express their opinions.Ã, 

I am in for familymittens, but just if everybody agrees. And I think that not everyone will. But maybe I am wrong.Ã, 

[Matt Goble]

Is everybody now fixated on the fact that some of us like to have a responsible drink?

Did anyone look at the photo's I posted?

What did we do which didn't include drinking?  Well, we went to a theme park, with lots of scary rides and people got soaked on the log flume, and we fired some laser crossbows at Minotaurs.  We laughed and pointed when the bus driver couldn't replace the ticket roll on the way back.  Good, clean, fun, as a group.

We went to a water park, I got a little sunburnt, we went on different water rides.  I watched M0Ds, Quinteros, and Layabout go on some VERY STEEP drops - more fool them!! Magintz, Sintrena, Radiant and I almost stole some people's inflatable tubes before floating around a lazy river.  The four of us then went on the rapids, which was great fun and actually took longer than the queue which is unheard of.  Good, clean, fun, as a group.

A large group of us went over to Benidorm Island for about half a day.  The ferry ride was fun, bobbing over the waves.  We had a soft drink & an ice cream (Radiant finally got his Paella), we then went for a walk up to the top of the island, saw a few birds, a few fake birds and helped Grundislav make his movie (I love Layabout's Mountain Climb).  Good, clean, fun, as a group.

We all chilled by the pool for hours on end, talking, sleeping, reading magazines, designing games.  Oh how we laughed as CJ attempted (and failed) to tread water!  At one point, everyone was encircling him like prey!  Good, clean, fun, as a group.

We all (I think it was all) went out for pizza one evening - the first place couldn't seat us, the next place could.  It was like Brittens 2005 again at Pizza Hut.  M0Ds attacked me with a lightsabre he bought from a street vendor - we'll find out in Canada if I still bear the scar    (Almost) Good, clean, fun as a group.

A group of us played pool, and we all lost to AGA.  The only time he 'lost' was when he potted the black, twice.  We managed to put him off his game for a while by talking about sheep.  Ah, but hang on, that was at a bar, so maybe not good clean fun...

Like Chris, unless I missed something, no-one got inappropriately drunk.  Someone left a used condom on the site at one point, but there was no real tense moments due to alcohol.

To those who are posting to criticise the alcohol situation who did not go, as I said earlier, the posts here are taken out of context.  A lot of CJ's photos are from the evening and include us socialising with Alcohol.  All of mine are taken during the day, and I don't think a single one features an alcohol related incident.

SSH, Nikolas, you are of course welcome to host your own AGS-related events, but as far as I'm aware, both Brittens and Mittens have a minimum age limit of 18.

[Nikolas]

If I'm not mistaken both me and SSH are above 18...

Anyways, some months ago I was chatting with nacho and talking about coming to mittnes, and also SSh was considering it. Now it seems that it would be rather...akward the least with 4 children running around...

But indeed I do have in my mind a meeting at least betwene SSH and me sometime. I would really like to visit Scotland and well... everything will work out...

[SSH]

I wasn't expecting my kids to go to any Brittens stuff, but if its next to my house then obviously any noise is going to affect them. I don't see how an age limit of 18 is relevant. Also, the age limit is there for the sake of the host not getting legal liabailites as much as anything. Sinmce I already have legal liability for my own kids, that is also irrelevant.

Well, scotch was telling me that a few people said Scotland might be a good place for the next Brittens. I'm quite happy to organise it at somewhere other than my house, but scotch was saying that others might prefer a house nearby. I was just saying that if it my house then there would be those ground rules. I'm not trying to impose those in general, or sayign that I will host, or anything really.

[jetxl]

Lets "brighten" up this topic... with some L3nsfl4r3!

[Matt Goble]

Nikolas, SSH,

I has assumed that you were both 18 (Although, reading the papers that isn't obviously a forgone conclusion in this day and age  ).

Yes, the 18 limit is in place as a legal issue as much as anything.  But, I do remember at the first Mittens, the limit might have only been 16 (ie: same as the forums).  This caused a few problems at the time, one of which was that those of us who were legally aloud to drink, had to consider those who couldn't.  And to clarify, by drink I don't mean get legless over a couple of cans of SPAR XXX, but a nice pint in the beer garden of the local pub, like adults.

The fact of the matter is, that at these gatherings we all act like the 18+ adults that we are, which includes drinking (moderately), smoking (although I can't stand it), talking adult subjects, sometimes swearing (guilty as charged), and basically enjoying ourselves.  I would say none of this is suitable for children, whether they are supervised by you or not.

One of the running jokes from the first ever Mittens was a bloke in a tent next to where the group was set up shouting at about 11:00pm "SHUT THE FUCK UP MY KIDS ARE TRYING TO SLEEP".  Would that be you or Nikolas at one of these events? 

I don't believe that children have any business being near or part of these events, and I think that should be a considering factor when organising future locations.

I also think that this topic has gone wildly off course, and would rather see this kind of discussion more to the Gen Gen forums so that Jet can post more L3nsfl4r3, and Haddas can make people's tents dissapear again.

I certainly have nothing else to say on 'this' matter.

[Becky]

Woah woah woah!  I don't think -anyone-  who had some concerns about the drinking was concerned about absolutely all alcohol consumption ever at Mittens!  I rarely drink myself, but even I drank a few times at Mittens   Any concerns were simply over the amount of drinking -> drunkeness, rather than an absolute horror at the thought of alcohol!  Let's be sensible here, the people who weren't at Mittens do not know the true extent of any/all activities at Mittens, so please don't draw conclusions from some photos

As mattgoble keeps trying to point out - we -did- have lots of fun with minimal alcoholic frivolty.  The waterpark, themepark, island exploration (and that paella was good, too!)...it wasn't one giant booze up   Anyone who wasn't at Mittens shouldn't be overly horrified by Adamski's initial concerns which started over three or four pages ago.

Also, haha, I love the jesus tattoo! XD

[SSH]

Agreed about the OT nature. I'll continue further discussion in a new thread.

[Radiant]

Radiant, I missed having a go at the Pizza Card game, so maybe next time.

I might code it as a minigame It's called Mamma Mia by the way, in case anyone wants to buy it.

my only complaint would be that we should have organised things better. Saying "we'll go to the bar, you guys go to the beach, and we'll meet back at the campsite at 11:00" would have been far preferable to people randomly leaving or getting left behind,

I second that.

[MrColossal]

Is everybody now fixated on the fact that some of us like to have a responsible drink?

Who is this everybody you speak of? This is why I posted before saying that the "defenders" are ramping up the situation by being overly defensive.

Erenan said he was worried but now he isn't.

Maybe I didn't read this thread correctly but as Becky said no one is saying BAN DRINKING ARG! and no one is saying MITTENS IS FOR DRUNKS AND EVERYONES A DRUNK THINKA BOUT YOUR LIVERS!@!!

[Erenan]

MITTENS IS FOR DRUNKS AND EVERYONES A DRUNK THINKA BOUT YOUR LIVERS!@!! BAN DRINKING ARG! BAN PLUTO!!! LOLZ0125!

[Quintaros]

It didn't bother me at all that our large group of 20 often splintered up into smaller cells.Ã,  I think it's only natural because its very difficult to involve a large number of people in a single conversation or activity.Ã,  I tried to make the rounds and spend some time with everyone.Ã,  Some nights I went to the pubs others I stayed in playing cards or whatnot.Ã,  I had fun either way.Ã,  Almost every morning I'd hear stories of what I'd missed the night before that made me wish I could have been in 2 places at once.Ã, 

I didn't think that alcohol played much of a role in the division of the group.Ã,  My impression was it had more to do with meals as people's appetites came at different times.Ã,  We'll need more powereful walkie talkies for next year so that its easier to re-convene after a split.

[Anarcho]

You know where this is all headed, right?  Soon there will be 50 people attending Mittens each year and all the fun & games will be over.

You're going to have to change the name to "The Annual Adventure Game Developers Conference"; rent out a proper conference center at, say, an office park in Springfield, Massachusetts (think Slough); and develop a detailed schedule of workshops that will include such absorbing topics as "How to Color in RGB" and "Falling Off Cliffs and You: The Sierra Guide to Success".  You'll have to hand out name tags, charge a $250 registration fee, hire security guards, book hotels at group rates, and hire guest speakers like the third lead assistant designer for Space Quest II.

Personally, I can't wait.  Just as long as there's a good bar around where I can get plastered.

[Privateer Puddin']

Would that by anychance be called AdventureX? (I think that's what it would be called, m0ds will know )

[Andail]

I think the actual problem here is that Eric hates all drinkers and hopes they'll die.

[Pumaman]

Ok, since nobody seemed to have any bright ideas about the new titles, I've kept them broadly similar as follows:

1: Mittens Initiate
2: Mittens Faithful
3: Mittens Regular
4: Mittens Addict
5: Mittoholic

Everyone's titles should now have been updated to reflect this, so if yours is wrong, please let me know.

Also, loved Derritir el Limite, Grund ... it should go on show at Cannes!

Finally, for reference I have uploaded the Mittens Attendees spreadsheet here:
http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/Mittens%20attendees.xls
which now includes Lapaset and Becky after my omissions previously

[Esseb]

No love for the wiki, eh? You'll hurt AGA's feelings.

http://americangirlscouts.org/agswiki/index.php/Mittens

[MrColossal]

You say that as if CJ cares...

[AGA]

Springfield, Massachusetts? At least we can buy guns to shoot each other with!

[Nacho]

Ok... I left some time to the protagonists to tell the story... But if I don't see here, written, the sea oddissey story, I am going to tell it.

You choose.

[scotch]

You want the sea odyssey? Ok! Unfortunately I don't have many pictures and I'm no good at explaining the peril we were in with words, but there's a tiny video that disco took.

The Epic, Ill Fated Voyage to la Isla del Descubridor (A Genuine Mittens Adventure)

There is an island off Benidorm (1), a mysterious sloped rock sticking out of the sea which was created during a sword fight between two giants. As soon as Disco and I saw it from the beach we knew we had to go there. There are two options: the first option is to take the ferry, it costs €10. The second option is to take your €10s and buy a 6 foot, inflatable, orange boat for two (children, under 210 pounds combined) and a pair of oars. We managed to recruit two more people from the Mittens group into our crew, so a few days later we bought two boats and made our way to the sea. The boats and crew were as follows.

Princess Peach*:
- Captain Scotch
- Navigator Disco

The... Other Boat**:
- Admiral Magintz
- Engineer Petteri

We brought with us supplies comprising of water, champagne (to christen the boats with), bread, cheese, lettuce, tomatoes, potato chips, salsa, and to avoid scurvy, lemons.
We had to head out to the rocky bit at the eastern end of Playa Levante (2) to be able to escape the tourist safety barriers and get into the open seas. We messed up getting into the boats so that our shoes got wet and some of the bread. Disco and I were off first, and we quickly got the hang of rowing together. Gary and Petteri didn't seem to be doing so well on the rowing front, and we ended up leaving them behind and losing sight of them.

We rowed for a long while, and although the island was getting visibly closer, we realised it was a lot further away than it seemed from the beach. No matter, we weren't going to give up. We realised we were pretty far out for two guys in a children's small boat, so in order not to get any attention from the other big boats out in the bay we would stop and eat some of our picnic whenever they went past, in order not to look in any distress.

After an hour's rowing there weren't many boats about, and we were leaving the shelter of the bay... the waves were getting bigger, and the wind was picking up, making it hard to keep the inflatable boat going in one direction. Now and then a freak wave would take us by surprise, filling the boat up with water. My shoes were wet already, so we used them to bail out water. See video. There were a lot of large orange jellyfish about in these waters... luckily none of them decided to jump in on the waves.

Every now and then we'd start laughing at how absurd the situation was. It was about now that Disco mentioned that he suffered from RSI. We could no longer see the beach, but the sky scrapers of Benidorm were easy to spot over the waves.

We kept rowing... this must have been two and a half hours in... and we were both very tired. We started to realise we were drifting to the west of the island, and tried to counter, but however fast we paddled, we seem to be getting no closer. After a few concerted efforts we gave in to the fact that the wind was too strong and started to head for the beach. Unfortunately the wind was too strong even for that, and we ended up travelling mainly along the coast (3) rather than towards it. Disco was finding it very difficult to row, due to his RSI, and with one paddle I couldn't do much more than turn the boat.

Watching buildings on the coast drift by it became apparent we were going to go around the other end of Benidorm and off to some other town entirely, possibly one in Africa. We'd joked about it before, but now it actually seemed like we were in serious trouble. I felt bad but I had to make Disco row, and eventually we managed to get back into a position where at the worst, we'd hit some rocks and drown. A little bit further and we appeared to be heading for a secluded beach by some hotels, hooray!

But then something awesome happened (4)! We saw a speed boat coming out of the beach, bouncing over the waves. Disco decided to use the "what are you looking at? never seen some people having a picnic on the sea before?" approach again, and started to eat some cherry tomatoes. This wasn't just any boat though, it had red crosses all over it, it was the Red Cross! We tried to contain our laughter as they stopped along side us and pulled our boat into theirs. ¿Habla Ingles? we said. The man did indeed habla ingles and he explained to us that there was too much wind to be in an inflatable boat. Ah, we got it now.. We told him we had come from playa Levante, and he told the guy at the wheel to go there. They were very professional, and we tried to be too. The wheel guy radioed in that he had picked up "dos niños", to which Disco protested "WE ARE MEN!", but he didn't get it. It was so awesome.

We landed at the marina in central Benidorm (5), and a police boat followed us in. They stopped us as we got off and we had to answer some questions. Just our names, and where we were from.

"Where where you born?", asked the policeman to Disco.
"Michigan", Disco replied.

"Mexico", the guy writes on the forms. I don't know if Disco managed to correct him or not. And that was it, we were free to go. When we got onto the street the clock said it was past 5pm, we were at sea for about 5 1/2 hours. We walked back to the camp site with the boat (6), and told them this story and ate the remains of the food. Apparently Gary and Petteri stayed in the area that we set off from, and were eventually brought in by a dutch man's boat, and they got to see dolphins.

It was an awesome adventure and even when we thought we might die, we were having fun.Ã,  It was even crazier than the Brittens Storm Drain Incident. Disco is the best person to be with when you're in trouble. I'd be happy to try again some day, when there's less wind.



* Disco said that if it sank, at least he'd be able to say he'd gone down on Princess Peach.
** What did you two name yours?

[SSH]

Awesome!

Stupid!

[Disco]

I think Magintz and Petteri's boat was named Princess Peach, which is only fair since the "going down" thing was Gary's idea for a future edition of his webcomic. Our boat should be posthumously renamed to Princess Toadstool (which still applies), and is the name I grew up with. Curse you N64!

EDIT: PHOTOS!!1


We buy our boats and supplies prior to our historic journey which will be fabled in story and song


Magintz and Petteri can't keep up


A little closer, but because our lust for adventure, we must leave them behind :'(


YAY


Cool!


fuck


This is about as close as we made it to the island

At least we have a nice story out of this misadventure. Perhaps we can buy another boat during Brittens or Mittens next year and try again. We are the Lewis and Clark of the two-thousands  .

Disco is the best person to be with when you're in trouble.

Aw, schucks 

[Anarcho]

Wow, that's quite an adventure.  And that island looked pretty far away!  Not too bright!  But i would have done it too.

[MrColossal]

If Mittens teaches people anything it should be that islands are farther away than they appear...

Mittens 04 and 06 should be remembered for this.

[Helm]

But we made it just fine in Mittens 03

[MrColossal]

Did you, really?

* MrColossal places his hand on Helm's shoulder and looks in his eyes sadly...

Did you?

[Helm]

DON'T FUCK WITH ME, MAN

[jetxl]

If Mittens teaches people anything it should be that islands are farther away than they appear...

Mittens 04 and 06 should be remembered for this.

The heck you talking about. Me and Mills would have reached the island if it wasn't for that dog and those meddling kids.

[m0ds]

Did we really go to an aqua park in Sweden, because I don't remember it and I wasn't drunk at all that year...

I vaguely remember an indoor pool but I may be thinking of Scouts 10 years ago..

[jetxl]

Nope, but there was a swimming contest through jellyfish (that I won. yay me). Andail did regret participating, but that was more because of the bottle of rum he drank solo.

[Radiant]

I believe the jellyfish won that contest. Or maybe it was this Spanish woman who was kicking them around? (Jellyball?)

As promised during Mittens, since several people stated they didn't understand the game earlier, here's an updated version of META, the only AGS game that runs inside the game editor. Now improved for better gameplay, and less Cuppit.

(Infinite Monkeys aka the All-Mags-Rulesets-Combined game coming up soon, as also promised) (and sorry for shameless plugging but Cuppit held my rubber ducky hostage so I couldn't help it)

[Pet Terry]

Here are the couple of photos I took. If some of the photos aren't working, let me know and I'll fix them.

I beg Disco, Becky, m0ds and Sinitrena (+anyone else I might have forgotten) to post their photos.

[Helm]

The photos work, some awesome ones in your series. Thank you, Petteri, for posting them! I feel all nostalgic now.

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

My only question is...Why burn KQ 7 as opposed to 8?  I mean, I dislike them all, but 8 is usually the most despised.

[Pet Terry]

I'm uploading a rar-file containing all of my photos (resized), so people don't have to go and save all of my photos one by one. I'm hoping other people do this as well, and if not, expect a PM from me in the near future. Yes, I'm lazy and don't feel like saving hundreds of photos one by one!

http://www.yadapops.com/photos/mittens2006/petterismittens2006.rar

[Ghormak]

Nice pics!Ã,  Ã, 

[Becky]

Haha, awesome Ghormak

The photos are making me miss Mittens again! I shall try and get mine developed asap...I still haven't ventured back into my town since I got home ¬¬

[Sinitrena]

I've finally managed to upload the few photos I've taken. (Here)

Mittens was great and it was nice to meet you all. 

[Helm]

Welcome back Sinitrena! Took you a while to post, we were kinda worried!

[Pumaman]

Nice photos, guys! Making a zip with them all in is a good idea Petteri, I'll see if I can do the same.

[m0ds]

Great pics, Pete! Great Pete's, pic! And some nice snaps there too, Sinitrena! Good to know you made it back! I will have my photos and report very, very soon!

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

http://people.freenet.de/Sinitrena/Mittens/slides/19.html

Helm, this shirt is coolness personified.  Not as cool as my Phantasm shirt, obviously, but definitely up there.

[Becky]

Right I *finally* got my photos developed.  I apologise for the very small amount of them (7/24 didn't develop ) and the general poor quality due to the non-zoom-non-flash camera, and then scanning the photos

BUT!  I have....underwater photos!   So here's Mittens '06, from a Beckys-Eye-View.

First, Adamski and I arrive two days late, and as soon as we arrive everyone goes to the pool.
Adam gives the pool and the underwater camera a double thumbs up.
I believe this is Petteri, but I may be mistaken.
Nacho and Mark attempt to pose underwater.
Underwater, people look like headless bodies.  If you can work out who these people are, congratulations!

The Mittens sign is erected!  Hooray!
Petteri smiles.  CJ grimaces.
Nacho plucks things out of the air whilst Helm plucks guitar strings.

To Terra Mitica!  On a bus!
Helm claims a hippo for his mighty steed.
The Terra Mitica sign can be seen for miles around, even back at the campsite.
Helm and mini-helm.
Everyone watches the test of strength.
Adamski, Grundislav, Petteri, Disco and Mattgoble enjoy the rapids.
And so does everyone else!

A few days later, some of us go to Benidorm Island on a proper boat.  Here is a scenic view of Benidorm
Nacho hangs on as I demonstrate I can't take photos on a moving boat.
FISH

At the entrance/exit to the campsite...goodbye Mittens!

[Nacho]

Hehe, great collection of photos Becky ^_^.

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

This was too cool not to edit.

[Pumaman]

Hehe, cool that the underwater pics came out

[m0ds]

Great photos, Becky! The underwater ones are very cool!!



Great Watris too, Progz!