The RoN Problem--How do we solve it???

[Captain Lexington]

So, there have been mumblings in another thread about the fate of RoN. (that is, the Reality-on-the-Norm series  ) Well, I'm game to make one. Shall we keep the tradition alive, folks?

Or is RoN dead?

Shall we start new RoN-type game series thingy?

(I really am terrible at this thread-starting post writing. I feel I am too succinct, like my measly post isn't enough to start a whole thread. That first rule is so imposing...I don't know if this is interesting, helpful, or funny! I try...)

[Steel Drummer]

I think a new series of games like RoN would be awesome. Actually, that might work, because there is a guy making a pack of (beautiful) sprites and animations... This could lead to something good.

[Captain Lexington]

Well, I PMed yht33 to see what he thinks of the idea about another RoN type game series, and I think that this could really liven up the AGS community (As if it needs it). This could indeed go someplace.

EDIT: Or of course it could just fall flat. I mean it could go someplace just as the last one did. I should save that for when the thread is more than one hour old. I am sorry, but I am dead tired. I canna think for the life of me! I promise I'll be less optimistic tomorrow.

[MillsJROSS]

As Yahtzee isn't really the creator of the idea, just the creator of the first game, his oppinions really shouldn't hold too much weight on this decision.

I think what would be more beneficial would be bringing back the Insta-Game idea, rather than new series of games. The only problem with InstaGame, is the consistency of graphics, if say more than one person submits them.

Not that a new series wouldn't be a terrible idea. Frankly, it's really up to whoever would like to create such a series. I don't really like having to work with someone else's previous game ideas and try to fit mine in with them. To me InstaGame has similar resources as RON but people have more freedom to do what they want.

-MillsJROSS

[AGA]

I don't think we need a replacement for RoN, just for someone to make some RoN games. RoN has tons of well-developed characters and locations, and all the resources you could ever need. Starting anew would be silly when there's so much potential with what's already there.

[Radiant]

I don't think we need a replacement for RoN, just for someone to make some RoN games. RoN has tons of well-developed characters and locations

Yes, and that's precisely why (in my humble opinion) a replacement would be a reasonable idea. I've looked at RoN in the past, and it's HUGE. It has literally dozens of characters and locations and such, but the point is that they all have a background history. A long background history. Basically I felt that, to do a good RoN game, I had to read up on everything, play dozens of games first, and ask several insiders for the details. It seems a very difficult place to start for new users. And, most basic plotlines in RoN have already been done.

Also, RoN is set in a quaint little town somewhere. Arguably, a similar idea in a very different setting (say, science fiction) would spark up interest again. Rigel on the Norm?

[CodeJunkie]

I haven't made a RoN game because I only remember about RoN around once a year and as Radiant says, it has grown very big now, so I'd also vote for a new series.

[Akatosh]

As long as it's NOT pirates, count me in.

[Dave Gilbert]

The idea that "RoN is too big" isn't true at all really. 

Yes, there are over 60 characters on the character page, but most of them are very minor and only had little walk-on bits. 

Yes, there are dozens upon dozens of games, but the majority of them are very small and will only take about 5 minutes to complete. 

Yes, there is a backstory, but it's no harder to follow than a season of The Simpsons or something. 

Sooo, how to solve this? 

- Since the main complaint is that it is too big, perhaps there should be a reorganization of the RoN site to make it less intimidating? 

- There should be a way to direct newbies to the series.  Don't newbies have to fill out a quiz when joining this AGS forum?  RoN could be part of that quiz. 

- Make RoN a part of AGS site.  I'm not sure about this one, since RoN isn't necessarily an AGS thing.  There should be a greater effort to call attention to it, though, via this site.  I'm not sure how. 

- Quality control?  There are a number of games on the site that, let's face it, aren't terribly good.  This could turn people away from the series.   I wouldn't want to delete these games (that's a dictatorship), but perhaps there's a way to let the better games shine through while the crap hides in the shadows.  I'm not sure how to do this, as there was a rating system at one point, but it was abused.

- Get RoN mentioned on gaming sites.  I'm not sure if this will work, as I tried it myself back when I was admin.  I wrote a whole bunch of gaming sites trying to generate some publicity for the series, and it only resulted in a small article on adventuregamers.com.  I'm not really interested in trying again, but somebody else could.

I'm out of ideas. Anyone else?

[Radiant]

The issue is not whether it IS true but whether it FEELS true. But yes, that is fixable. For instance, by splitting the character page into one with ten main characters and one with fifty minor characters. And so forth. That falls under point one of your list.

I'm rather surprised to learn that many of those games can be completed in five minutes (although frankly I would not consider those worth the download).

[Tuomas]

As long as it's pirates, count me in.

what a splendid idea! My vote goes there.

[Nostradamus]

As for making RON a part of this site, I still think the RON message board should be merged into this board as a sub-forum (or a branch of sub-forums). That way more people will know what's going in RON.

As for the series being too big as I said in the other thread, I think its possible to get a grip of everything in RON in playing all the games, which are short. And you don't have to include every character and every storyline in your game. A spin-off project could help the people who still don't think they can cope with it.
Or hey, maybe there's a place for a mini RON game that will basically be like a mass extinction of minor characters to help people focus on the major parts of RON. Then only the important characters and storylines will remain to continue.
As I just typed that I got a better idea - maybe the resources should be divided into 1) major characters and places pack - which will be the essential stuff people need to make a RON game, without stuff they would wanna skip. And 2) Minor pack\packs of characters and places for the people who want to use them.

As for quality control that Dave talked about, there are a few RON games by an author I won't mention by name so not to offend him that could be taken out of the RON chronology and put in an extras field of sorts in the RON website. I'm talking about games that featuers a RON character as the playable character but do not really happen in the RON universe nor the RON chronology and don't make much sense basically plus they have very very bad English. Anyone who followed the series knows what I'm talking about. Now there's a still an honored place for any game that anyone put time & effort into making, I just think these games will do better as a special entity in an extras or outsider category in the RON database so they will not confuse people and interfere with the chronology. Just my take on it.

[Ali]

I think Dave's suggestions make a lot of sense. As a non-RoNner, the fact that they're away from my comfy AGS home makes me suspicious of them, much in the same way I'm suspicious of foreigners.

That's an exaggeration, but the quality control issue is a big one for me. From an outsider's perspective, when looking at RoN I've been more aware of its shoddier elements. A number of AGSers I respect have a high opinion of RoN, though, so I wonder if perhaps I haven't seen the best side of it.

I also agree that the site could be arranged in a less intimidating fashion. It might be useful if there was a 'mission statement' of sorts explaining whether or not new RoN game-makers should worry about stepping on their predecessors' toes.

[Nostradamus]

As long as it's pirates, count me in.

what a splendid idea! My vote goes there.

Hmmm... that brings to mind an idea for a RON spin-off series... Hooky McPegleg has been out of RON after just 2 games, to quote from the RON website:

Spoiler

  Hooky defeats No-Beard and takes the treasure for himself, which he uses to buy his own island. (Hooky McPegleg, Pirate Postman).

[close]

Here you go, brand new place, just one character from RON that has been phased out before its due time, a whole new chronology can be started.

[Dave Gilbert]

As for quality control that Dave talked about, there are a few RON games by an author I won't mention by name so not to offend him

Das right.  To bi sure,

Anyway, I still have a soft spot for that lil town.  As I said in another thread, the goal isn't to get folks like me or Creed or Grundy or AGA to make another RoN game.  It's to get talented new people making their own. 

[Akatosh]

As long as it's NOT pirates, count me in.

what a splendid idea! My vote goes there.

Stop mis-quoting me. You're confusing people.

[zabnat]

I have planned to make a RoN game myself, but for the following two reasons I have not made one:
1. I wanted to make my game fancy so I would have to draw almost everything myself. (Haven't checked the new Character package yet).
2. I didn't want to brake the timeline, so I would've had to play all the games the characters I'm planning to use are in. And frankly as the quality of some unnamed games is not the best, this is not very luring option. There is the timeline, but I feel it's not really accurate enough.

Okay. Graphics is not a big issue. Some sprites are good enough and it's not hard for me to do my own if I want to. Anyway I would have to add more animations anyways.
For the timeline and character information I would need some spoiling text that can accurately describe the character. Collection for nicely written walkthroughs for all games would be enough for this.

Something like this could work as quality assurance: A review board consisting of credible persons who are interested in RoN. They would play the games as they like and then give ratings to them. Maybe anyone could a member of this board, but any misuse would fire them and nullify their votes.

[Mr Flibble]

Dark Comet is busy working on something RON, something very RON and something rather special. RON definitely isn't dead!

I think that for new users, it might be nice to have a spoiling summary of RON. I know I was put off at first by not wanting to play through all the games in order to know what had gone before. Maybe something in a wiki, with an overview of general history, and links to each game for people who want to research in more detail?

[Nostradamus]

On the RON website there's a Characters section that summarizes all the main plots and storylines he's been involved in , I think it's preferable that people will play the game rather then read those - in order to catch the personality and style of the character.
Anyway it's useful to refresh your memory of what characters have been through, summarize it and prevent messing up the past chronology.

[Andail]

A new game universe would be cool idea. In order to make it a successful concept, there has to be a very small group of dedicated people who can agree to work under special terms. If they make some good games, people will start to contribute with their own games. It won't work if just one person says "look, I've created a game universe, now you can all make games that take place there, but you must have your plot and graphics approved by me first!"

So don't go and announce your grand project until you have actually released a game first that sort of sets the standard, or people will hardly feel encouraged to join you. Preferably, you should provide lots of sample graphics and templates for people to use.