Ideal age/Now mostly about Religion and Religious Upbringing

Started by Helm, Mon 16/04/2007 21:47:35

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Dan_N

Matt, if you didn't want all this, then why put up the picture and go all "omfg, i'm in love! *drool*" about it?

And, more to the point, why are we squabbling about it - over 6 pages no less -, and giving Matt the attention he apparently craves so much...

ManicMatt

#101
Dan, you are a prick.

I didnt crave attention at all. I was just happy and wanted to share that happyness with my friends on here. I even asked CJ to get rid of this thread, as I don't welcome it.

voh

This isn't even about Matt directly anymore. It's a discussion on age differences in relationships. Assuming that all this is about Matt and Matt alone is erroneous, as seemingly it's a topic that piques interest amongst those who posted here.
Still here.

Fleshstalker

Interesting topix. I'd like to add when I was 13, I had a 18 year old g/f. Still with her.

Mr Flibble

Quote from: Dan_N_GameZ on Fri 20/04/2007 23:20:47
Matt the attention he apparently craves so much...

Matt hasn't actually been taking part in this conversation, if you read it. If he was attention seeking he probably would have, and he would've given more information.

I think if he wants to date a sixteen year old, then fair play to him. They probably have a lot of common, and have fun together. Who're we to argue? I reckon that until he shows up at the playground with candy then he's safe.


I know a 13 year old girl who wants to go out with me, but I ascribe this mainly to me being more mature than people she knows. I'm 16, so if I were single I don't think it'd be too taboo. It'd possibly be taboo because she's insane, but you know, that's outside the scope of this conversation. Well okay she isn't insane, she's just emotionally dependent and needy.... but I wouldn't be surprised if she said "Play Misty for me." She's that sort of person.

But whilst her friends were very much in favour of burning down my house because they thought I was going to rape and murder her, I didn't particularly see any issue with the age thing. If I was 18, then... no, I couldn't get away with that.
Ah! There is no emoticon for what I'm feeling!

Tuomas

Quote from: Fatal Fury on Fri 20/04/2007 23:58:20
Interesting topix. I'd like to add when I was 13, I had a 18 year old g/f. Still with her.

You know, I'm intrigued. How did it come to this? Most boys are just, you know, kids at the age of 13. It's when they start to break their voice and, well I guess the pubic hair is there. Whereas girls at 18... She's been physically ready for some time already. There's like a whole grade of schooling between the two of you. How does she do it? I could understand it if it was the guy that was older, they do develope later, but... wow O_O

Quote from: Mr Flibble on Sat 21/04/2007 00:33:59
they thought I was going to rape and murder her, I didn't particularly see any issue with the age thing. If I was 18, then

You would rape and murder her if you were 18?

Mr Flibble

Quote from: Tuomas on Sat 21/04/2007 00:40:22
Quote from: Mr Flibble on Sat 21/04/2007 00:33:59
they thought I was going to rape and murder her, I didn't particularly see any issue with the age thing. If I was 18, then

You would rape and murder her if you were 18?

Oh crap, no.

I meant that dating a 13 year old when I'm 16 would be okay, but if I was 18 then I don't think it'd be acceptable.

The rape is fun for all ages! irrespective of age. Her friends just thought I was a risk for being older than her.
Ah! There is no emoticon for what I'm feeling!

Fee

#107
Crazy.. I cant believe the ammount of people here that think its ok to date CHILDREN.

OK.. so teenagers maybe a littel more mature than they were 10 years ago when i was 16, but it makes no difference. They dont have enough experience to make life changing decisions like that.

Kids fooling around with Kids is acceptable, its called experimentation, but 20+ year olds dating / sleeping with 13 - 17 year olds is unacceptable. Not to mention you shouldnt even be hanging around with children this age when you are 25.. WHAT GIVES? :/

Im 26, My Girlfriend is 19. I love her, but even at 19 i feel like a bit of a seedy bastard to be hooking up with her. Doesnt help shes so small and skinny and looks like shes 15 - 16, especially when we get up and shes walking around in her PJs like now.

IMO, untill your 18 you should stay within 2 - or + years of you age group. Once your 18, your free to experiment with older people. When i was 22 my GF at the time was 40. Dam we had a lot of fun, but the age difference leads to ALOT or fights/misunderstandings over the most rediculous things.

25 year olds sleeping with 16 year olds verges on pedophilia, not to mention its Illegal in most countries. Im not saying you guys ARE pedophiles, but the situation is very worring.

Dissapointed
Fee

Domino

There is a big difference between dating somebody young and having sex with somebody young.  If there is no sex involved, it might as well be classified as being friends. It is illegal to have sex with minors, not date them. I am pretty sure that people who date don't always have sex. I am no Dr. Ruth, so what do i know.  :-\

Mr Flibble

#109
Who said he was sleeping with her?

Anyway 16 is legal age in England. Wikipedia-ing reveals that the average age of consent in Europe is around 15 or so. Although if you're viewing this from an American perspective that might sound crazily low.

My only concerns would be that the younger girl was just being carried along on the excitement of being with such an older guy. But that's off topic. If Matt were taking advantage of a naive, little girl- then I would find that objectionable. However, I don't think that's what he is doing. Young doesn't always mean naive!

Essentially, I feel that Matt isn't doing anything wrong. Age differences tend to bring in difficulties concerned with personal development and plans for the future... but if they can make it work without problems... then I'm fine with it.

And I don't think you should feel seedy, Fee. I think you should feel incredibly jammy : D

EDIT: Domino replied as I was posting, so what I wrote was a reply to Fee rather than what Domino said.
Ah! There is no emoticon for what I'm feeling!

Domino

#110
I am not mentioning Matt, just people in general.

Quote25 year olds sleeping with 16 year olds verges on pedophilia, not to mention its Illegal in most countries. Im not saying you guys ARE pedophiles, but the situation is very worring.

Just clarifying that there is nothing wrong with dating minors, just no intercourse.

edit: Reply to Fee and not Mr. Flibble.

Fee

I know there is a difference, but i doubt anyone will deny that if you want to date someone, theres a 99% chance you want to have sex with them. If you dont, id say your crazy :P

I see attractive looking teenage girls alot. On Wednesday Nights i teach a Kickboxing class to a group of 12 - 18 year olds, Most of them girls. Tho most of them are quiet nubile, theres no way i could take advantage. To me its just not right. If my 16 year old sister was dating a 26 year old guy, i would not be impressed and there would be a confrontation.

Every culture has its own idea of what is acceptable. 100 years ago it was not uncommon to see 12 year old girl, pregnant and married to 30+ year old guys. Especially in Isolated parts of the world. This changed and became unacceptable druing the 20th Century for western society atleast. Seems over the last 10 years, things have been going backwards in that respect :(

Fee


Mr Flibble

I think there's a difference between going out with someone with the intention of having sex, and going out with someone and having a relationship which eventually includes sex.

The former sounds more like lust in my opinion, and not the basis of a good relationship. Having said that... you're right, nearly all people do enjoy sex as part of a loving relationship.

My perspective in these issues is a little different, because I'm 16. I'm allowed to drool when those nubile 17 kickboxers walk past. I'm allowed to look at a thirty year old woman in the street and think "Woah, she's really pretty."  Essentially, I have no boundaries imposed upon me.

What you said about "taking advantage"... I think that phrase is fundamental in this issue. If I were to date that 30 year old woman, people would object because they'd think she was taking advantage of me. They wouldn't say "You shouldn't date her because she'll be 60 when you're 46."
They'd say "You shouldn't date her, it's wrong."

What if that 30 year old woman was really youthful, and carefree like a child? And what if I was gnarly and mature even at my tender age? She wouldn't be taking advantage of me, I'd have all the power. I think the idea of taking advantage of someone is really more what people think about when they express concerns over age differences. IMHO.
Ah! There is no emoticon for what I'm feeling!

Fee

I believe several teachers have been jailed for that recently. One even hooked back up with they guy after she was released. If he wasnt such an impressionable age at the time they were sleeping together, i doubt the would have go together after the jail.

Your 16 and you can look if you want, im 26 and can look all i want also. Difference is at 16, you can do somthing about it.

Its when I use my previous experience to get young girls into bed that i am doing the wrong thing.

Look at it like this..
Your 16. Probly in school with a part time job (if any) no car (or a small first car) and littel experience with girls.
Im 26 with a fill time job as an Engineer, nice V8 Falcon and ive had several partners of varing age.

Say you and I are competing for the same 16 year old girl...

You buy her a rose and some Chocolates.
I buy her a dozen roses, some designer chocolares, ballons, teddybears ect.

You pick her up from school in your mothers Hyundai.
I pick her up in my Hoted up Ford.

You struggle to find the correct words to tell her how you feel due to lack of experience.
I tell her how i feel and make it sound all romantic and how we were destened to be together.

You take her to McDonalds for a dinner date.
I take her to a 5 star restraunt.


Dispite the fact you are most likely suited to someone your own age and have expressed your desires to have some sort of relationship with this girl, she barely notices because I used my recources and experience to overwealm your efforts. Hardly fair is it?

If an "old man" (like me lol) is spoling a young girl rotten, lavishing attention and gifts ect on to her they are clearly using their experience and recources to take advantage of someone at an impressionable age.

Maybe i dont explain myself right, im not the best when it comes to reading and writing, but i think you should see what i mean. No i better go before i get into trrouble lol...

Fee

Mr Flibble

No I get you completely, what you described wasn't fair at all. The girl would be overwhelmed by your lavish charm, resources, and that whole "better, faster, strongrer" alpha-male thing that would go with it.

I just think that I could be a 16 year old who was eloquent and rich, and take advantage of her in exactly the same way. I think we're essentially on the same page about this, although I'm a lot more apathetic about it.

...And for the record I do all the romantic stuff... the last present I got my girlfriend was this big hardback volume of Disney comics from the 50s. I prefer meaningful gifts like that. I'd consider it a sad day if the best I could do was chocolate and roses  :D
Ah! There is no emoticon for what I'm feeling!

Fleshstalker

Quote from: Tuomas on Sat 21/04/2007 00:40:22
Quote from: Fatal Fury on Fri 20/04/2007 23:58:20
Interesting topix. I'd like to add when I was 13, I had a 18 year old g/f. Still with her.

You know, I'm intrigued. How did it come to this? Most boys are just, you know, kids at the age of 13. It's when they start to break their voice and, well I guess the pubic hair is there. Whereas girls at 18... She's been physically ready for some time already. There's like a whole grade of schooling between the two of you. How does she do it? I could understand it if it was the guy that was older, they do develope later, but... wow O_O

Liliana is actually my best friend's sister. I would always go to his house back in the day and one day I went to hang out, only to find he wasn't home. She was only home, so she insisted if I'd like to wait. Well, I did and we were watching TV on a couch together. She put her arm around my shoulders out of the blue. I looked into her eyes and she went in for some tongue. I wasn't even nervous since I had been hearing rumors of her saying I was cute looking.

Heck, even her brother told me about her crush with me. It came to no surprise though as she would always hang out with us whenever I was around. My friend didn't really mind  since he knows me well. Though we had to keep it a secret till I was 17. Only her brother knew. It was hard keeping it a secret from our families, but we managed and it was well worth the wait. ;D

Captain Lexington

That story is a mix of creepy and awesome.

I wish it would happen to me and at the same time I don't.

You have confounded me, Fatal Fury.

Bravo.

Babar

Quote from: Fatal Fury on Sat 21/04/2007 02:58:50
I would always go to his house back in the day and one day I went to hang out, only to find he wasn't home. She was only home, so she insisted if I'd like to wait. Well, I did and we were watching TV on a couch together. She put her arm around my shoulders out of the blue. I looked into her eyes and she went in for some tongue.

Isn't that the "being taken advantage of" part? Sounds sweet and all, but at the same time, I'd think it to be somewhat creepy. I mean...you where 13.
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Helm

Monkey, this post is for you. It's full of speculation about your character. If it's too much tell me to cut it out and I will. If you can stand the public conversation, you're quite brave.

QuoteI suppose that maybe you're right. Maybe I am just insane for falling for a girl that swears she only likes me as a friend.

I would speculate that you're not crazy, just very green in matters of love and you've fallen for a girl for the first time and you think it'll be the last. I am a dramatic person and I know how it is to make a drama out of something just so it feels 'fuller' than the same-ol' other people experience. But dude, take it easy. I mean the words won't help you'll crash and burn and learn on your own, but take it easy. You'll meet many girls in your life (especially if you drop the abstinence thing soon enough) and you'll enjoy the rest of your youth.

Wait. Post a picture of yourself please.

QuoteAnd I'm almost certainly insane for thinking it would be okay seeing as she agreed to go out with me....in a couple of years.

That's not creepy 'cause she's young. It's just creepy because you sound so desperate. You say it's true love that makes you so single-minded. I guarantee most of everyone involved first-hand in this situation sees you as TOTALLY DESPRERATE and hopes you catch a strange disease in your mission on the death star and never recover so they won't have to deal with your crazy obsessive behaviour anymore. Seriously.

There's one thing newbies at relationships totally do, especially if they're bright but reserved, emotional but insecure: they CLING. You're clinging. Not even to a real relationship - a great way to destroy a real relationship in the first place - but to a promise of a date made under pressing circumstances which she plans to if it ever comes to that have with you and get out of the way as quick as possible.

QuoteBut the one thing we're all agreed on is that I am absolutely, completely and utterly insane for posting about it on the internet.

Unless you're some attention-seeker, I actually applaud you for standing up for yourself against the internets on this. I don't think you're insane, just brave. But also totally creepy.

QuoteI'm not wanting to pursue a sexual relationship with this girl. I believe in practicing sexual abstinence. That's right...I'm a virgin. And I'm proud of it.

While you're on your mission the girl you love will be penised by a boy she loves and enjoy it greatly and never give your bloated african-death-star diseased carcass a second thought.

Just keep this in mind while you're doing god's good work.

I was abstinent by choice for 3 years of my young life, not for religious but for philosophical reasons, and I don't regret it, I did it properly, I had no contact with women and didn't try to have placebo relationships where we'd hug and hold hands. The feeling of lust is the feeling of lust and you're a liar if you're telling me you don't lust after your love. If you do, you've sinned already, might as well penis and then ask for forgiveness from the lord, penis, ask, penis, ask, so on. If you're really serious about abstinence, you'll need to go the full way.

QuoteEven if things never do "work out" with this girl...I'll still be happy to have been her friend.

Though you might mean this, you're just putting yourself on the ground for people to walk over you. Your god might tell you this is a good thing to do. But life, you're alive because you're egotistical. You live for yourself. You have desires. If you want to fight them, try, I sure did. But go be a monk if you want to fight them. Don't lust after girls. Make up your mind. If you want to penis this girl - or any other, I suggest one your own age - then act like it and be an egotist. That's how it works. Love is mutual taking of advantage.

QuoteAnd it won't change the way I feel about her. She's the most amazing person I've ever met.

She'll be a 'lying harlot' to you in two years when she'll have had it by the whole soccer team while you pray to god to take away your boner. It'll be fun! Just wait!

QuoteIs it really so wrong of me to want to spend the rest of my life with her?

It's totally wrong to want to spend the rest of your life with a person that will not appreciate you, yes. You have a penis, it stands upright. Act like it. Be an animal, persue your happiness. Go have sex, and a drink, and spit on the bible while you're at it. Don't worry, god takes a joke, he made you to be like this.

QuoteWhat I want most though is for her to be happy. If she never falls for me, then so be it.

She'll never fall for you. You're clingy, obsessive, religiously fueled for confusion and dramatic. There WILL be women that will fall for this archetype though. Just not her. Leave her to the soccer team which will provide her easy non-commital sexual gratification without stupid valentines and dating. She just wants a penis, man. Not yours, though. Not god-penis.

QuoteI'm not going to deny my feelings just to appease your Creep-o-meters.

I don't want you to deny your feelings for this girl. I want you to deny god. Spit on him. Forget him. He's a liar. He gave you urges and then told you they're wrong. Forget christ, just have fun. Here's a card, call my number any time you want... I have a lodge full of like-minded friends I'd like to introduce you to... if you come, please wear black, or wear nothing at all.

Celebrate life. You got the spelling wrong. Not celibate life. Celebrate life.

QuoteBut you all need to understand that I don't want a relationship with this girl right now. I want to, when she is older, pursue a relationship with her, yes. And if the relationship never advances beyond the level of "good friends" then I'm cool with that. And now that I've stated that three different times....

Okay, you're not a paedo.

Wait though, what if she came craving for your manly assets RIGHT NOW. Like 'I was all wrong now I see how pure your feelings were for me, how much you love me like nobody else will, please help me undo your pants, I'm struggling with buttons' what would you do? DON'T LIE! It's love! Love is pure! God loves love! God wants you to be together! PEEENISSS HEEER



you paedo.

QuoteThe reason I spent $100 on her for Valentine's Day is because it was literally all the money I had.

holy shit.

QuoteI wanted to do something special for her. She didn't (doesn't) have a boyfriend, and so I knew that nobody was going to be giving her anything. I wanted to make her understand how much she means to me.

OBSESSIVE. she hasn't gone out with you. She means nothing to you. Your FANTASY of her means a lot to you. You're being dishoonest! You're being dishoonest! God disapproves.

QuoteSo now I'm sure you all think that I was just trying to win her over by giving her all this crap. Think what you want, it wasn't about that. I'm really serious about this girl.

monkey, to say you're serious about a person would first require a looong-ass period of time spent together with that person. You haven't had that. Because even if she were interested, even if you spent some time together, a 14-year-old girl changes every month, sometimes to a completely different person. You're grown-up and creepy. You can only be serious about someone you know. Go get to know someone. If you want, wait for this girl to be about 20 then get to know her and perhaps you'll be serious about her when you've been with her for a couple of years.

Or just go out and find a girl your age now and stop wasting time.

QuoteI care about her more than anything else in the world. She means more to me than anything else in the world.

CREEPY. LOSER. Stand up for your penis! You love your life! You enjoy your life! Your LIFE means more to you than anything else in the world! Everything else comes second place!



hey, tell me how it all works out.   
WINTERKILL

voh

Ouch, Helm, just.. Ouch.

Though I can't help but agree with about.. 80% of it. Not a big fan of the soccer team though.
Still here.

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