Nelly Cootalot II - Tech Demo

[Ali]

Oops, the outlines actually were black, I'd made a mistake. Based on your suggestions, I've given Nelly a brown outline and subtly lifted the black point. It's not as strong as loominus's first edit, but I think it's an improvement.

I also noticed that Nelly in the screenshot above is has particularly dark blacks because I've added shadow heavy-handedly within AGS. A more subtle tinting of the sprite in the shade can be seen on the right.



Any thoughts?

[loominous]

Think the integration works much better, though it's difficult to say without any foreground objects present, as the dark values could still pull the sprites infront of closer objects.

I think the brighter outline works better, though it still breaks a bit from the background. Have you tried darker colour outlines, you know where the outline is just a darker colour of the nearby fill colour (like in DOTT or newer disney movies)? Or perhaps a bit thinner, so they would correspond to the line thickness of the background?

Anyway, nice improvement!

[Eggie]

She's still adorable as balls.
I'm still happy.

[LeChuck]

I adore the graphics, music and Nelly's voice. The Widebeard character didn't sound very menacing, but maybe he isn't supposed to. I wouldn't worry about the size of the characters, I think they look great!

I found a weird bug though, where I would get stuck and not be able to move:



Edit: Haven't been able to reproduce either...
Edit2: I know it's just a tech demo, but I got this error message: The character 'Nelly' could not be displayed because there were no frames in loop 7 of view 20.

[Play_Pretend]

I know that art and color and balance aren't my forte, but I still think this looks fantastic.  I was dying to go on and play the rest of the game.   I'm glad the Navy look is just a temporary in-game thing, too, like everybody else.  But I don't think the characters look odd at all, and their multiple expressions and voices are excellent.

Nelly Cootalot is my hero!

[Misj']

Nelly's Design:
Nelly will wear this Naval outfit during the game, but it will begin (and probably end) with her wearing her pink pirate dress with a ragged black trim, with minor changes as a consequence of the shift in medium. Or are your objections to her face/giant head? I must say, I think the pony tail is cute.

I've taken another look at Nelly's design, and, well, I think the main problem - to me - is this: her Naval outfit just doesn't strike me as Naval. I didn't know she was in the Navy until she said she was. So I've taken the liberty to create a fictional concept design based on some Naval uniforms (and derivatives thereof) using the following reference images: [1], [2], [3]. I decided to go for a quite modern look rather (for recognizability reasons) rather than a more traditional look from that era.


-- click for bigger versions --
Left: Black outlines
Right: Coloured outlines

It's just inspiration, should you decide to redesign her clothing.

Edit:
And while we're ruining someone elses great work, let's give it another try

-- click to enlarge --

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

Outfit aside, I think the drawn version Misj made would work much better with the current background design than the models do.  Nice work!

[Ionias]

I found the tech demo ran superbly on my computer and I love the background graphics. However, I too have a problem with the 3d characters, but then I’ve never been a fan of 3d in any form, so to each his own. I find Misj’s versions very appealing to the eye.

[Ubel]

I had no problems with the demo either. And I also don't have a problem with the 3D characters. I think what Ali did in his newest edit works very well!

[Ali]

Thanks for the bug reports, guys. The intermittent inability to move is something I can't explain at the moment. The problem with the crash was a lack of frames in an idle view.

Misj', thanks for your efforts. I appreciate your input, but I hope you won't take it amiss if I don't take your suggestions on board. The reason Nelly's uniform is a bit odd is that she cobbles it together herself (probably in a series of puzzles each more develish than the last) in order to get a job in the Merchant Navy. Your sketches, while lovely, look too 'proper' to fit in with the story and puzzles.

ProgZmax & Ionias Thanks again for constructive criticism, but 3D was what I planned to do (in the original Nelly game, actually) and I like the way it looks overall. I hope this won't put you off playing the game, if it's ever finished.

I'm also glad a few of you share my liking of the pre-rendered characters!

[Misj']

Misj', thanks for your efforts. I appreciate your input, but I hope you won't take it amiss if I don't take your suggestions on board. The reason Nelly's uniform is a bit odd is that she cobbles it together herself (probably in a series of puzzles each more develish than the last) in order to get a job in the Merchant Navy. Your sketches, while lovely, look too 'proper' to fit in with the story and puzzles.

Since story is far more important than my ego (ok, maybe not 'far more' but 'slightly more' might be true), I do not feel offended. If she had been handed a uniform I would consider a redesign more important than when she schnibbles it all together (schnibble should be a word). But I would still like to see her wear a blue Navy-scarf.  : And I would reconsider her throusers though, her legs are a little too skinny for my taste...but that's - as the word already sais - taste.

By the way, I have no problem with the 3D look. Am wondering though...if you were to do the backgrounds in 3D, how would that turn out? - I know it's 'flat' on purpose, but could you integrate a similar look, feel and colouring in 3D, or would that completely ruin the atmosphere? - Just curious...

[Ionias]

I hope this won't put you off playing the game, if it's ever finished.

Are you kidding? ... of course not. I played the first and I'm sure I'll play the second. Don't mind me and my dislike of 3d, like Misj' said it's all a matter of taste.

[Ali]

Thanks for the support guys. I was worried that you might be some of the reactionary anti-3D types, but evidently you aren't.

Misj's pirate sketch reminded me that I hadn't posted Nelly as a pirate. After looking at it, I decided to make the pirate outfit / hair I'd modelled a little more like the sprite in the first game, coming up with this:



I've darkened the foreground, as I will in future, to help bind the characters in.

By the way, I have no problem with the 3D look. Am wondering though...if you were to do the backgrounds in 3D, how would that turn out?

I considered it, but it would take a LOT longer! Also if the game used 3D graphics throughout it would be difficult to justify making a 2D game at all. Most importantly, I think it is potentially more graphically 'fun' this way. Of course that is just my taste!

[Dualnames]

I think nelly's 3d is just quite an impressive model. I do think that ok, 2d has a certain style but turning nelly from 2d to 3d the way you are, is actually a no trouble transition for the fan. Usually 3d adventure games change control method, so that's a reason why they fail. And fans think 3d sucks because they have linked 3d with bad games, but they've forgotten the reason.

Famous examples:
Monkey Island 4: It wasn't point and click
Broken Sword: It had too many action sequences

And a famous and yet one of the best adventures of all time:
Discworld Noir:It became 3d but it just looked better, controls where good, story was awesome..

[firefly]

I've darkened the foreground, as I will in future, to help bind the characters in.

I love her this way  , though the pony tail was cute also

Blends quite better with the new background tone too



Edit by ProgZ:  There's no need to quote images in your post.

[Questionable]

I personally prefer the piratey nel! She's seems more like a character that's fun to play with!

[Paper Carnival]

The ponytail looks very cute, maybe you could try applying it to the piratey Nellie too?

[EdLoen]

(schnibble should be a word)

Off topic...
It kinda is ...


On topic...The new models looks great.  And  I actually do like the Merchant Navy outfit despite what others have said. It's a simple, yet recognizable design. And the lighter outline does help the integration.

As for the ponytail comments, as cute as it is, i see it as a good distinction between the two designs.  With her hair down as Pirate Nelly it shows how free and unfettered she can be as a pirate. Though as Naval Nelly, with her hair tied up in a tail it brings around a sense of being bound by certain things..... though that could just be putting meaning to something that was probably done "just cause it looked cool" type thing lol... don't mind me...

[Ryan Timothy B]

Nelly with the dress looks good. (also the naval nelly looks good too)

Also, I was just wondering, what 3d software do you use? (not that it's relevant, I'm just curious for my own sake. I wouldn't mind playing around with some 'real' 3d programs - I've always played around with level editors but never actually once tried attacking models)

[vertigoaddict]

I haven't tried the demo yet (because I'm in school at the moment). I've skimmed through the replies in this thread and I must say.

The sprite looks AMAZING, no, just... just... it's *speechless*

Looks like you can make Nelly Cootalot figurines or dolls, mechandise and sell them online or something (I'd SOOO want one)

As for her voice (not that I haven't tried the demo yet) Have you ever watched Disney's 'Madaline'?; I actually imagine her voice to be quite lijke hers, if you can find a voice actor who can immitate Madaline, well you're set.