Icey games' thread

Started by Icey, Mon 05/03/2012 02:58:23

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Kweepa

Here's a simile: DLC is like polishing a turd. :)

(Ah shoot, I got involved. WHY??)
Still waiting for Purity of the Surf II

Ryan Timothy B

I've yet to purchase any DLC. I prefer to play a game the way it was originally designed.
Don't get me started on the new craze of "free to play" games that Zynga popularized. It's a terrible scam.

R4L

Quote from: Ryan Timothy on Wed 16/05/2012 02:50:12
I've yet to purchase any DLC. I prefer to play a game the way it was originally designed.
Don't get me started on the new craze of "free to play" games that Zynga popularized. It's a terrible scam.

Ahahahaha.... those aren't new by any means. Years ago I was playing F2P FPS games online. The catch is, people who buy their guns and perks and what not, will have a significant advantage over you. It makes it a lot harder for free players to get by. Not to mention, you need to do some serious grinding if you plan on playing free to actually buy in game items. The games I'm talking about are War Rock and Combat Arms. I played both for roughly two years and spent most of it using the default guns. It's actually a genius idea.... Both of those games are rampant with hackers, and both companies (K2 and Nexus) don't do anything to stop them, yet people still play and buy items with real money.

Icey, please listen to people.... DLC is rarely a good idea.

Scavenger

I don't think Icey really wants to make a game. Not a true game, really. All of his works have been one step removed from being a rolling demo, because Icey is more interested in advertising and flash and marketing than he is in actual game design. He'll do anything to sound professional, get that extra industry thing in so that he can say "My game has RPG Battle Systems / Multiplayer / DLC / Lotsa Belts"... even if he doesn't actually make a game.

And he hasn't. His battle systems are all surface and no underlying mechanism. Imagine, if you will, a game being a bustling town. Icey sees this town and says "I want a piece of that.". But Icey doesn't make his town have an economy, population, or even have working buildings. Everything's a facade, made of plywood and cheap paint, in order to make something that looks like a town. He markets it as the next greatest town, but noone can ever use it, even if it looks nice, because it just doesn't work. None of the underlying parts have been
made. If you don't look at it from a certain point of view, his, it will look fake and the illusion that it is a town will be broken.

Quote from: Noctis on Tue 15/05/2012 13:04:34
I wanna make RPG games with things in it that makes it feel just a little close to a FF game ... if plays like a RPG then it's a RPG even if there is a part missing, words mispelled, and a few extras that the developer likes but someone else doesn't like.

We keep telling him "make a simple game" but his idea of a game is far, far removed from ours. He will create cutscenes, ancillery material, set pieces with no overarching plot, vast sweeping dialogues that don't make sense to anyone but him. He's creating his idea of what a game should be from his experiences as a consumer. Thinking games are all about the graphics, the secondary advertising, the bells and whistles that industry types like to throw around for more money, cryptic dialogue and epic cutscene battles with flashy moves. I don't think Icey has ever thought about games from the other side, from a designer's point of view. Not a consumer, who wants particular things, but a builder - who thinks about how things can best be implemented and what the product needs. How else do you explain his baffling and infuriating attempts to shoehorn in more bells and whistles into a nonfunctional product?

When you design a game, you have several points of view you need to think from. That of your vision, that of the designer, and that of the audience. Your vision needs to guide your hand when you design, but as a designer you also need to think about how the audience will feel about your design decision. Misspelled words, bad (or nonexistant) mechanics, incoherent plots, all contribute to a poor experience for the audience. Just because you want to include it doesn't mean you should. The old writing idiom is "Kill your darlings". You shouldn't be too precious about your works, as fighting improvement just to keep hold of your pet mechanics or plot points will ultimately doom the game. That's not to say you shouldn't have a vision guiding you - working against your vision is just as harmful. But you should be creative, willing to implement things in a fun and intuitive way, and realistic. Will your audience like this game? What does including this mechanic add? Always cut, never bloat your game. You should try to create a finished game BEFORE you add on features that aren't necessary for it's completion. Otherwise, you just have a stitched together corpse with a party hat.

Now, I don't mind Icey's artwork. It's pretty solid. But I'd prefer to see one small, solid game than a thousand rolling demos of the same incoherent Square-ripoffs that he's been producing for the past millenia. Something that is fun to play, has a nice flow of gameplay, and is thoroughly tested and is robust. I'm sure he can do it, he just needs to stop thinking like a consumer, and start thinking like a designer. All these bells and whistles - drop them like the poison they are. Make a game.

Make. A. Game.

No DLC, no multiplayer, no fake battle system with no underlying mechanics, no hour long incoherent cutscene, no "one click and you're finished" gameplay, no final fantasy characters, no japanese name you ripped from google translate.

Game.

Icey

[Made before the lat post]

Ok I peeped the sarcasm there(I think)

But I'm not like that at all. The only and the most easiest DLC to implant in AGS is the costumes for playable characters. The outfit maybe placed inside the game right from the start but you can't get it with out DLC. There is no way around it at all. It can only be done like this cause it's easy for me to do and all of you know this is the best way to do regardless if it's "fake". There are people out there who will download the game and not now the game was made with all the DLC inside from the start. But if they found out then they would find out why it had to be done like this. No matter what though, if I ask for $.99 for one small costume that you can use in not one but two games is that really a problem? You got the better end of the deal and what it's bad because I didn't let you unlock it with in the game for free? I put time not only into my games but the art so I didn't make all these DLC costumes for no reason. I made them with a purpose from the start way before the game. Sure there is free DLC that I will give a way to everyone cause I'm nice like that but would it hurt to ask for a small fee as a low what I said before? The games free and if you like it then you might want to buy a DLC costume. I'm not forcing anyone to buy a tiny extra part of the game that was never required. This is what everyone is missing, I don't roll like that.

PMQ Legends [Online], the first game I wanna release that use DLC. Why is he back on the DLC train again? Cause the game was already started and so was the DLC. So I don't wanna just let it die. All I plan to do is to make the game solid and release it. If it's good than people will download it. If people download then I'll give out 4 free DLC and the rest I'll sell each month.

It's not bad or evil. It's just the only easy way it can be done.

Ryan Timothy B

You obviously haven't learned that it's still not DLC.

How do you plan to implement this into the game? You just said it's already within the game. The sprites, views, characters, etc. When "someone" (which is VERY unlikely anyone would) purchase a beautiful costume for a character, how do you trick the customer into believing it's DLC?

You just said anyone who doesn't know AGS will think it's DLC. What are they doing? Downloading a file that AGS reads? Are they simply just typing in an unlock code? How is this person going to believe it's real DLC? I don't understand you and how you even believe someone would think it's real DLC or why you insist on still calling it that.

Right now I want to strap you into a chair and shove a nasty wool sock into your mouth; the one your aunt Jamima made for you last Christmas, that you discarded in your tighty whitey drawer. Then leave you there until you've learned your lesson about how stupid it is to make unlockable content (quit calling it DLC!) for a game that will likely not even be worth the download, let alone purchasing a dollar on.

Work on a game that is WORTH spending money on first. Quit this nonsense with the unlockable content or your imaginary DLC.

Just know this: none of us are saying "NEVER make a game with DLC ever in your life!!", we're simply saying you're too inexperienced at making an enjoyable game as it is right now. So for now, just work on a game that you know you couldn't improve on in anyway. Until you get to that point, then perhaps you can start thinking of a commercial venue. You're the master at shoving spoonfuls of shit in our faces and calling it dinner.


And one last time. This thread has zero to do with Adventure games. It should be transferred to the silliest of boards for this stupid and silly topic.

Icey

I get your point (sorry I just like calling it DLC). I already said to the one day(soon) I will make a game that doesn't need any crazy extras and is 100% complete. btw PMQ is obviously not a well known game, over the course of time I make a PMQ game and release even if it's a demo sized game. Then we have one of these big discussions and we go back and forth. I hear everyone but it may seem like I'm bipolar. I may agree but then 1 sec later I may disagree with someone else but it makes t seem like I also disagree with the last person. This is why people wont really download PMQ. Cause when you google it you are shown with a page full of links back to stuff like this. These talks are not bad at all but it ends up effecting my games.

R4L

Quote from: Noctis on Wed 16/05/2012 05:59:31
These talks are not bad at all but it ends up effecting my games.

Ahahahahahaa..... Are you joking? It's called criticism. You just need to stop riding Sqeenix's dick and MAKE A FUCKING GAME. Just like Scavenger said, you don't make games. Actually, just like EVERYONE has said, you don't make games.  These "talks" are meant to help you. You're the one making yourself look stupid.

Dualnames

#248
I like how we agreed on a topic for ICEY, and people that don't like his games or his attitude would not hijack it. Why are you hijacking this? This started around page 9. I thought for once we were better than this. Every forum member has given some advice, either good or bad, every time this has happened. What's the point of posting the same advice over and over if it's not getting through?

This happened on page 2: http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/yabb/index.php?topic=45514.msg611654#msg611654
And here we are, page 5. Possibly 6 by the time anyone reads this.

Stop any ongoing arguments, go do something productive. Let icey have his one topic there's no need to hijack it, you can always ignore it.

Edit after Babar's post.
Worked on Strangeland, Primordia, Hob's Barrow, The Cat Lady, Mage's Initiation, Until I Have You, Downfall, Hunie Pop, and every game in the Wadjet Eye Games catalogue (porting)

Babar

#249
* Babar either has the forums showing a different number of posts per page than Dualnames, or has fallen directly for Duals' trollish bait :P
The ultimate Professional Amateur

Now, with his very own game: Alien Time Zone

Icey

This is for me, pay no attention people :)
My game developement list

Shard Hunters[MAGS]


Miles's awakening: PMQ


Tifa's Ballad: PMQ [complete]


PMQ Legends + Online


PMQ Colosseum


---------------------------


LimpingFish

Quote from: Scavenger
...because Icey is more interested in advertising and flash and marketing than he is in actual game design.

Ask Icey about his clothing brand and his special-effects studio. I'm not kidding.

This is were his head is at. Look at his first post. Look at all those game projects, manga, and clothing brands. It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop, ever, until you are dead!
Steam: LimpingFish
PSN: LFishRoller
XB: TheActualLimpingFish
Spotify: LimpingFish

Atelier

Haha a clothing brand, you couldn't make this stuff up (laugh) Please explain icey?

Icey

#253
D wear clothing is something I started a year after I started PMQ(FFXIII) in 2005. The brand was used on Dave hence the D. I just recently expanded it across everyone in the world of Senpah. All the DLC costumes for PMQ [ legends + online ] are based off of D wear outfits. My friend is also a clothes designer so I'ma work with him so he could so this stuff together.

P.S. each out fit comes with a bonus for the characters(+#ATK, +#MGK, fire ability, etc)

I already explained Square Effects. Just know I'm not alone.

Atelier

I think I found the website for DWear: link

Icey

wtf, wow buddy that's not my stuff lol. I got all my designs on my HDD. The only thing you seen of D wear is stuff in my games.


Look at Chris's red hoody.

Ghost

#256
Quote from: Dualnames on Wed 16/05/2012 08:46:57
Stop any ongoing arguments, go do something productive. Let icey have his one topic there's no need to hijack it, you can always ignore it.

But why have a thread, then? If this is a thread just for Icey, and everything that causes discussion is best left out of it, this would be a monologue. Is it sensible to have one thread with totally different rules like all other threads? This has been touched a couple of times now, and if this is concensus I'll happily follow it, but do we have a thread here where Icey posts his stuff and if you don't post a nice "Wow", you best shut up? That really sounds wrong.

Discussion isn't hijiacking.

Let's say I were to start a thread where I post, whenever I want, whatever I want. I have a shitload of pancake recipes, and these are very adventure-related (just think about all the useful things a pancake can be used for)! That would make a superb thread; I could even include photos.
Would moderators protect me from everyone who asks me to quit posting pancake recipes and how pancakes could be used to open a trapdoor in an adventure game? Would moderators stand up and shout the forums down if someone took advantage of my thread to give me tips how to make better pancakes (that would be very insolent, since it is my thread!).
I doubt it: The result SHOULD be a happy share-your-pancake-recipes thread, and everyone reading it would benefit from awesome pancake!

Icey

It's just that it turns into one big ass argument somehow. It starts when I don't agree with one person or when I miss some sarcasm. I like crit but there is a type of crit I don't like. Anyone is always welcome share but some things should be left unsaid. If I agree on one thing that everyone wants then don't try to throw some extra 2 cents in cause I may go back to what I wanted to do.

Ghost

Yes. And that IS the point. As soon as someone asks for crit, he runs the risk to GET crit, and that's the dynamics that make a forum. And

...you know what, it's okay. This is going in circles again and again and the HELL I'll be told another time that I should just shut up and just ignore this thread.

m0ds

Yeah I'm sorry Icey, but you need to drop this DLC stuff, completely. It's really ticking off a lot of people, you're really not getting your head around either. So to stop these circles of discussion which really are prominent, I'm going to start issuing you warnings (which can lead to a ban) if you continue any discussion about DLC. I'm happy for you to have a thread but I'm not happy for you to continue deceiving the community here whether you intend to or not.

Quote
I already said to the one day(soon) I will make a game that doesn't need any crazy extras and is 100% complete.

Make that today, because the Icey tether is getting very close the end. You know I'm fairly happy to support you, but there is a certain point of "this is ridiculous". I'd urge others to please respect this thread and just stay the heck out of it - please, be the grown up in this situation :) Thank you to those who have calmed their tone. It lasted for a few weeks, at least!!

Icey, carry on - but I won't tolerate your blabbering about DLC that gets everyone here (myself included) extremely frustrated, and won't hesitate to start a ban process if you're going to continue to make false claims.

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