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Author Topic: What grinds my gears!  (Read 66366 times)

Snarky

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Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #140 on: 13 Sep 2016, 23:09 »
I think you guys are overlooking some major elements of Frozen to say that there's nothing original in it. For example, that bit where one of the main characters goes pretty far down the road to become a villain, while the other tries to redeem her? You'll have to stretch quite a bit to find that in earlier Disney movies (Pinocchio and Lilo & Stitch probably come closest). The focus on sisterhood and rejection of Prince Charming are also firsts in a Disney movie, I believe.

My main beef with current Disney movies is simply that I wish they would go back to 2D animation, or at least animation with more of a 2D look. Ever since Tarzan and its Deep Canvas system, and then later with the Meander system used in "Paperman", they've had tools to do really nice painterly stuff that allows them to put hand-painted/drawn things into a 3D scene (though I didn't think "Feast" worked very well: basically just looked like cel-shaded 3D), but all feature movies have this cheap videogamey 3D look. I had hoped Moana would be 2D, since the Polynesian setting lends itself beautifully to more loosely painted backgrounds. Ah well.

Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #141 on: 13 Sep 2016, 23:46 »
The focus on sisterhood and rejection of Prince Charming are also firsts in a Disney movie, I believe.

Okay, possibly being a tad unfair with earlier comments - as mentioned I did enjoy the movie, just didn't think about it too hard maybe!

The feisty heroine bit had certainly been done before in Mulan, but I guess she in a way had a "Prince Charming".  I haven't seen all of them.  Nothing beats The Jungle Book for me!

Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #142 on: 14 Sep 2016, 01:17 »
I think half of the reason for Frozen's popularity at the box office was simply down to Let It Go. Which in my opinion is a very very good, almost perfect song (coming from someone who claims to hate Disney). It was just so damn overplayed people either went to watch the film because they were swept up in the hype (largely caused by the song) or they just thought going to see the film was the only option left other than suicide to try and get it out of their heads.

Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #143 on: 14 Sep 2016, 09:56 »
It grinds my gears when "What grinds my gears" turns into a discussion about which movies are good :-D (joking)
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Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #144 on: 14 Sep 2016, 09:59 »
The focus on sisterhood and rejection of Prince Charming are also firsts in a Disney movie, I believe.

Okay, possibly being a tad unfair with earlier comments - as mentioned I did enjoy the movie, just didn't think about it too hard maybe!

The feisty heroine bit had certainly been done before in Mulan, but I guess she in a way had a "Prince Charming".  I haven't seen all of them.  Nothing beats The Jungle Book for me!
Lilo and Stitch did the sister dynamic before, and Brave was also about the relation between two female family members, albeit a mother and daughter.
Even the rejection of Prince Charming and critique of Love at first sight was done before in Enchanted (Just compare this clip to Elsa/Hans meeting!).

The only thing that Frozen did first for a Disney movie was making the identity of the villain a surprise, and even then it feels like an afterthought tacked on at the last minute.
In my opinion, Frozen is like Cars, but for girls.

My main beef with current Disney movies is simply that I wish they would go back to 2D animation, or at least animation with more of a 2D look. Ever since Tarzan and its Deep Canvas system, and then later with the Meander system used in "Paperman", they've had tools to do really nice painterly stuff that allows them to put hand-painted/drawn things into a 3D scene (though I didn't think "Feast" worked very well: basically just looked like cel-shaded 3D), but all feature movies have this cheap videogamey 3D look. I had hoped Moana would be 2D, since the Polynesian setting lends itself beautifully to more loosely painted backgrounds. Ah well.
Yes, it's a real shame you don't see many 2D movies being produced anymore, I remember growing up watching Disney and Don Bluth movies over and over again, I felt they looked like picture-books given life and they inspired me to draw things myself.
Most of the 3D movies just feel like they all look the same as well, there isn't really any big differences in style, only in budget and technology.

However, there is a good animated film of H.C Andersens tale The Snow Queen, made in Soviet Russia in 1957. It's 2D animated and stays pretty accurate to the original story as well.
Here is a link for the curious:

Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #145 on: 14 Sep 2016, 10:54 »
Was "The Princess and the Frog" in 2009 the last 2D animated movie Disney did?  (That one was very good, but I can't remember any others since then.)

arj0n

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Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #146 on: 14 Sep 2016, 11:19 »
There were 6 more. Rremember Wreck-It Ralph? :)

Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #147 on: 14 Sep 2016, 13:29 »
There were 6 more. Rremember Wreck-It Ralph? :)

2D! :P

Danvzare

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Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #148 on: 14 Sep 2016, 13:33 »
I can't really think of anything that Frozen did that other Disney/Pixar movies haven't done before.
It demonstrated that family love, is another form of love. That's all it did differently. And even I'll admit I enjoyed that. :-D

I'll take your word for it, but I'm still not watching Cars 2 (or Cars)
Speaking of Cars, I really wish that they would make a prequel Cars movie. I want to see a rusty Lightning McQueen trying to get his start as a racing car!
It's clearly hinted at in the first movie. I think it could actually make a decent movie.

Speaking of Zootopia - which I also enjoyed - did anyone feel it seemed more about sexism than racism, despite there being many obvious opportunities to deal with racism?
I enjoyed Zootopia too. Great film. Personally, I didn't feel as though it was a perfect analog for racism either. Especially with the predators which were not only the minority, but also the leaders and ones who get all the opportunities. And it seemed both predators and prey were equally speciesist to each other. So personally, I think they just wanted to create a realistic world of anthropomorphic animals.

Also, am I the only one who thinks "Let it go" should be sung as "Let it snow"?

Snarky

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Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #149 on: 14 Sep 2016, 15:24 »
Nothing beats The Jungle Book for me!

That's one of my least favorite Disney animated features! I hate how it completely ditches all the coolest bits from the Jungle Book stories, how it's all just a long sequence of "and then Mowgli runs into some other wacky characters", the utterly underwhelming ending (with Shere Khan just running away after a short squabble) and the lazy recycling of the same animation over and over within the film (particularly egregious with Kaa and the elephants).

Lilo and Stitch did the sister dynamic before, and Brave was also about the relation between two female family members, albeit a mother and daughter.
Even the rejection of Prince Charming and critique of Love at first sight was done before in Enchanted (Just compare this clip to Elsa/Hans meeting!).

True, Lilo & Stitch deals with sisterhood, but Lilo and Nani are much further apart in age, so it becomes something quite like a parent-child relationship. The Frozen version is pretty different.

There are definitely some parallels to Enchanted, but I don't count (mostly) live-action movies like that as part of the Disney animation canon.

Was "The Princess and the Frog" in 2009 the last 2D animated movie Disney did?  (That one was very good, but I can't remember any others since then.)

There was a Winnie the Pooh movie after that. It flew under the radar for some reason.

Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #150 on: 14 Sep 2016, 16:10 »
That's one of my least favorite Disney animated features! I hate how it completely ditches all the coolest bits from the Jungle Book stories, how it's all just a long sequence of "and then Mowgli runs into some other wacky characters", the utterly underwhelming ending (with Shere Khan just running away after a short squabble) and the lazy recycling of the same animation over and over within the film (particularly egregious with Kaa and the elephants).

It's hard to rationalise sometimes why you love a movie that you have loved since you were a kid - also whether you have read the book before or after seeing the movie makes a big difference.  I've always loved Phil Harris' voicing, Louis Prima's singing, the songs in general and the personality clash of Baloo and Bagheera.  Perhaps not the best if you look at it analytically, but it will always have a special place in my heart.

There was a Winnie the Pooh movie after that. It flew under the radar for some reason.

Oh yeah forgot the Winne the Pooh movie.  I want to see that, although mainly because I know my kids will love it.  I've got the book of the movie which they enjoy having read to them, but it's basically recycling stuff from the old stories.  I seem to remember someone was tasked with creating new stories for the 100 Acre Wood gang, I wonder if any of those got made into animated films?



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Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #151 on: 14 Sep 2016, 19:00 »
I think any Pixar film is worth watching!

I'll take your word for it, but I'm still not watching Cars 2 (or Cars)

Just remembered, stay away from Planes! That's the only Pixar film I thought was naff.

Snarky

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Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #152 on: 14 Sep 2016, 22:10 »
It's hard to rationalise sometimes why you love a movie that you have loved since you were a kid - also whether you have read the book before or after seeing the movie makes a big difference.  I've always loved Phil Harris' voicing, Louis Prima's singing, the songs in general and the personality clash of Baloo and Bagheera.  Perhaps not the best if you look at it analytically, but it will always have a special place in my heart.

Sure, and as far as I can tell it's pretty well regarded (as demonstrated by the live-action remake); my opinion is probably in the minority. The film does have some great songs, strong character design, fine animation and beautiful backgrounds.

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Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #153 on: 14 Sep 2016, 23:38 »
I think any Pixar film is worth watching!

I'll take your word for it, but I'm still not watching Cars 2 (or Cars)

Just remembered, stay away from Planes! That's the only Pixar film I thought was naff.

Planes is not actually a Pixar film:

Quote
Although Planes (2013) is a spin-off of the Pixar Animation Studios film, Cars (2006) and its sequel Cars 2 (2011), it was not produced by Pixar Animation Studios. It was produced by the DisneyToon Studios production company, known mostly for making direct-to-video spin-offs and sequels of Walt Disney Animation Studios films. However, John Lasseter (writer and director of both Cars movies) served as an executive producer.

And: just to be relevant to the thread:

What grinds my gears is the entire "Cars" movies' universe...

Who built all the buildings? Why are all animals mechanical but all plants are normal? Why are there farmlands? (okay...maybe corn for bio-fuel...) Where do the cars come from? Why is there a child car in Cars 2? (this implies they are born and grow up)...Also, we meet some characters' parents in Cars 2...Why am I complaining about the logic of movies that were obviously aimed at selling toys to kids (ever seen a kid with Lightning MacQueen on their shirt?...Okay: ever seen a kid with Carl from "Up" on their shirt?)...So yeah: gears ground!

Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #154 on: 15 Sep 2016, 10:42 »
Speaking of cars again. It really grinds my gears when a car is closing in on you at night and don't switch off the full headlight (not sure what the name for that is in english. Driving beam?) removes your vision completely!
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Danvzare

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Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #155 on: 15 Sep 2016, 11:12 »
Speaking of cars some more, it grinds my gears that some people have their headlights on when it's a bright and sunny morning, and some people don't put their headlights on when it's a dark and gloomy evening! >:(

I even suspect it might be the same backwards people.

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Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #156 on: 15 Sep 2016, 12:03 »
What really grinds my gears is that there are so many people who think it's perfectly okay to ding other car doors in parking lots. And even worse, park by feel. >:(

Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #157 on: 15 Sep 2016, 12:45 »
Speaking of cars some more, it grinds my gears that some people have their headlights on when it's a bright and sunny morning...
Are they Volvos, by any chance? I'm sure I'll be corrected but I heard Volvos always have their headlights in because they are from Sweden, where the sun don't shine.

Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #158 on: 15 Sep 2016, 12:55 »
Speaking of cars some more, it grinds my gears that some people have their headlights on when it's a bright and sunny morning...
Are they Volvos, by any chance? I'm sure I'll be corrected but I heard Volvos always have their headlights in because they are from Sweden, where the sun don't shine.

Yeah I learned to drive in a Volvo, and you couldn't turn the headlights off.  Same for Saab I think.  Can't remember if it was only Swedish cars though.

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Re: What grinds my gears!
« Reply #159 on: 15 Sep 2016, 14:50 »
the full headlight (not sure what the name for that is in english. Driving beam?)

High-beams