Where is everybody

[Scavenger]

I'm still here, I'm just not working on any AGS games right at this moment, I decided to take a break to write Sega Genesis games instead for a while to beef up my knowledge of C.

[Hobo]

Haven't some of the discussions moved over to Discord? Either to the AGS one or developers own channels, also I think there are several other smaller Discord channels that have a bunch of AGS people. And I guess social media has taken over some of the traffic over the years. Smaller forums seem to be more like notice boards these days rather than places for socialising or big discussions.

But I wouldn't really draw a direct line between the forum activity and AGS engine usage/quality. I feel like thsese last few years have been one of the best in terms of great AGS games, both commercial and free.

[BarbWire]

Whoa! Who would have thought that asking a perfectly simple
question, would result in the discussion getting a bit heated in
places.

Also, I was wondering if people play a game that may involve
puzzle solving, quest solving etc. and get stuck, do they
give up on the game rather than suggesting to the devs
that perhaps a SKIP button could be added.

As I have already said, I love being a member of the AGS
community. Some brilliant games are being produced, and
I would hate to think that I could play a part in its downfall. 

Click'd, you are quite right, it did take a while for me to start
posting, because I didn't think people would find anything I had
to say very interesting.

I did, however, play several games and leave comments for a
Player Rating, so that a yellow (or is it orange?) cup could be
obtained, thereby resulting in a much deserved, Blue Cup.

Long may AGS continue to bring pleasure to the masses. 

[Darth Mandarb]

Hi, Darth. As we've discussed in the past, I know you largely consider the hazards of an"open" forum as a necessary evil within a vital community, but could you elaborate on these points? Especially in regards to "unfriendly".

I have noticed unfriendly behavior in the treatment of new members (as I mentioned in my previous post) as well as general unfriendliness towards any member who holds views that don't align with the broader views of forum goers. There's a general sense of suppressing unpopular opinions. Almost no effort is made to engage in civil discourse they are just brow-beaten into silence. No room for discussion or understanding.

We aren't quite an echo chamber here yet but I see it looming on the horizon.

Now I'm not defending the right to sing the praises of national socialism and the Nazis I'm more condemning the self-righteous attitudes and, equally abhorrent, behavior exhibited in response to it! There's a sense of it being acceptable (even noble) to exhibit the very behavior you're condemning so long as the thing you're condemning is generally considered to be "bad".

Maybe I'm just overly sensitive? Maybe I'm biased? I am always willing to have my mind changed on the matter but, so far, I've only seen more and more of the same. The end result is an old-time member who rarely engages with the community and only, really, comes around to check on the GIP.

Makes me sad.

[Adeel]

People seem to be throwing nebulous descriptions like "hostile", "snobbery", and "draconian" around as though they're largely accepted as accurately representing how the community is run. You're welcome to your opinions, of course, but if all you've got to go on is, for instance, our unwillingness to tolerate anti-trans rhetoric, or our desire to limit the spread of conspiracy theories or "alternative facts", then maybe the problem isn't as rampant as you think.

Way to go, LimpingFish. Nice of you to paint all the users' grievances as "they won't let me write anti-trans rhetoric or alternative facts". Very nice tactic.

Sorry, but if you guys have already made up your mind that everything is fine and dandy, who am I to change that? You all ask for examples, yet you all seem to have conveniently forgotten the several-pages' long threads over the past years. Nothing ever came out of those. Why would I waste my time digging them up and linking here when nothing is gonna happen now?

[eri0o]

There have been some conversations here on the forums that made me uncomfortable. This combined with a misunderstanding that happened on discord cemented that I need to take a break. I am though progressing on my game a lot more and will have my first batch of testers playing it in two weeks.

[Stupot]

Let’s not forget that we’re communicating in a very out-dated mode of messsging where the page resets every time you post. I mean, it’s amazing we get any newcomers at all, let alone new regulars.

And the old regulars stop coming for all sorts of reasons. Family, work, life. Others like Grudislav still pop their heads in from time to time but they’re actually making a career out of it and no longer have time for foruming.

Also, this is a rather left-wing place and has not been a very hospitable environment for people with views to the right of that, so we’ve lost a few members that way. Personally, I think there should be one separate board for socio-political discussions and arguments. Let them get as heated as they go but just ban it from everywhere else on the forum (especially MAGS), unless it really is genuinely relevant to that topic.

[eri0o]

I don't think this place is left wing at all. There's also a lot of anti-science that is bundled together with anti-knowledge. Want to run a successful game company? Well, this is not the community to get any useful input because the ones with no idea bullied out the people who could provide insight or guidance. Mentorship is out of question.

If anyone can reach a local community it will probably will be much more useful.

[ToeKnee]

I love the goldmine of these forums!!... and I suspect I am like many, that read them over and over...
If you need help there's pretty much every question you may have will have answers, many answers some times, before (often in various ways until the solution lands with the poster)!!
So 'help' may often not be needed... when you consider that the forums are so extensive = possible reasons that there are lots of views but less chatter in the Forum/s as a percentage of the viewing rate.

Also, I have been reading items for nearly 20 years! but only recently (re)joined since changing providers on my old Email address left me out for many years.
I am happy to still be classified as a newbie though and in that context - I must say I haven't seen anything I would call alarming about the behavior or responses in these forums and I have read many thousands of posts and their replies...

There does seem to be a somewhat 'tentative' approach to an open / flowing forum dialog so I wonder if front ending conversations with 'I THINK' or use the word 'CONSIDER' etc... de-personalises it? Plus, if you are the questioner then its always a great idea to thank the post respondents.... Their time and effort and often CODE writing for the Original Poster must be given thanks.
- The skills and the sharing that some of the 'AGS Rockstars' do is commendable and wonderful.

I am about to release a (COVID19 lockdown timeframe) created game with a new slant on old Adventure gaming style I am really interested in all feedback on - and I will say I think I can take tough talk about things that should be obvious that I have missed etc (feedback re-worded as 'offerings' is a good idea!).... however it is always nice if people post with a context of care and support!
This group is AMAZING!

[Ali]

I think it's weird for BarbWire to lament the decline of the forum, while recently being really unwelcoming to a new member making an honest mistake. But I don't think that's new. Helm wasn't particularly nice to me when I joined. What I have noticed in the last years is increasing prevalence of conspiracy theories with a sprinkling of ethno-nationalism. But I think efforts to tackle that make the forum more, rather than less welcoming. I still think the tech support is faster and more helpful than any other site I've visited.

But, if we're being honest, the forums are less busy because they are forums dedicated to a 2D game engine that specialises in adventure games.

Want to run a successful game company? Well, this is not the community to get any useful input because the ones with no idea bullied out the people who could provide insight or guidance. Mentorship is out of question.

Perhaps I missed this? Who's been bullied out?

[VampireWombat]

I personally have been using Discord to communicate with people more than the forums the last few months. And I admit, I also have been moving away from using AGS. Ironically it did start with 3D donut posts in the AGS Discord. I do still check the forums multiple times a day, but I have stopped posting as much...

As for the bullying of Anna that Ali mentioned, I don't think she took it took it too hard. I joined the Kapia Discord a couple of weeks ago and joked about how badly things went. Though I do doubt she'll likely be a regular around here. Which is a shame since she is pretty nice.

[Radiant]

What I have noticed in the last years is increasing prevalence of conspiracy theories with a sprinkling of ethno-nationalism.

That's precisely why I don't stick around. I have not personally witnessed the efforts to "tackle" that, but such topics are flat-out prohibited in certain other forums I frequent.

(although I do check the competitions forum monthly, to see the new MAGS rules on the off chance that I have time for a MAGS; and I have an adventure game in the plans that I want to work on this year)

[Snarky]

I think it's weird for BarbWire to lament the decline of the forum, while recently being really unwelcoming to a new member making an honest mistake.

Reading that thread, it seemed to me like a joke that didn't come off. But in that case, the decent thing to do would have been to explain once it became clear that it was being taken seriously.

Want to run a successful game company? Well, this is not the community to get any useful input because the ones with no idea bullied out the people who could provide insight or guidance. Mentorship is out of question.

I can only imagine that this is in reference to m0ds? Interesting take, if so. (Otherwise I have no clue what this could be about.)

What I have noticed in the last years is increasing prevalence of conspiracy theories with a sprinkling of ethno-nationalism.

That's precisely why I don't stick around. I have not personally witnessed the efforts to "tackle" that, but such topics are flat-out prohibited in certain other forums I frequent.

Promotion of conspiracy theories associated with fringe or extremist movements is lately prohibited on these forums as well. And yes, this does probably drive some members away.

[Ali]

I think it's weird for BarbWire to lament the decline of the forum, while recently being really unwelcoming to a new member making an honest mistake.

Reading that thread, it seemed to me like a joke that didn't come off. But in that case, the decent thing to do would have been to explain once it became clear that it was being taken seriously.

Yeah, I was uncertain and the lack of an explanation threw me. I hope it was a joke!

I'm not sure it's fair to say that m0ds was bullied out, bearing in mind the bullying behaviour he exhibited before he left. I take no pleasure in criticising m0ds, but I do think it was he who changed and not everybody else.

[BarbWire]

I really have opened a can of worms here, and I don't like it.
The atmosphere is becoming toxic. Recriminations and grievances abound.
I can't see how any of this has any bearing on my initial post.

Ali, thank you so much for directing people to the remarks I made about
the Anna2for2 post. I did not do this maliciously, but had read Darth Mandarbs
comment, saying 'I'm guessing this isn't being developed with AGS. I thought
it unfair that games not made using the AGS engine should be showcased on
the site. I still don't think it should be allowed. Everybody is entitled to an
opinion and this is mine.

Vampire Wombat, You have a strange idea as to what qualifies as bullying.
I doubt that Anna has been scarred for life by my remarks and appreciated
the fact that Laura took her side. As you say she is probably a very nice person
and I wish her well.

I am now bowing out. Thank you and goodnight 

[Ali]

I'm sorry if I offended you by remembering something you wrote a month ago that was relevant.

[Khris]

That post was really something, and the fact that it wasn't a joke makes it even worse.
Just wanted to second that (and everything else Ali has said), especially since I've been called out in an extremely dishonest and cowardly way by Adeel.

edit: I'm reading this as confirmation that it wasn't a joke

[Cassiebsg]

Uhm, I took it as a joke too... you saying it wasn't? 

[RetroJay]

Quite Frankly... Who cares!
For a simple question that has turned into this crap is bollocks.

[Snarky]

Happy Festivus!