Messages

I can't really explain the technicalities of the trumpet as much as I would like. It's impossible for me to put it into words. I guess you'll just have to trust me.  

With regard to ideophones etc.... I agree whole-heartedly that the harp can, and IS (in some cases) classified as strings. I was just pointing out how the 'rules' of music can often be bent to suit your own personal spin on things.

Music-masturbation?? - Har! that is great! I must remember that one... however I must insist that I'm not trying to brag, and I don't believe Eldkatt is either. If we WERE bragging, I think we'd find a far more popular thread to start posting in. We're just talking (mainly to each other), and we're not making anyone listen to us or agree with us. It's just opinion.

Yeah, the trumpet DID precede the piano by a long way, however back then it wasn't really considered an 'entertainment' instrument. It was used strictly for regal processions and other various tidbits that didn't need real harmony (the closest they ever came was just playing the 3rd and 5th. Maybe they created a suspension or two if they were lucky. But things like 7ths were definitely out at that stage). It wasn't until the concept of 'orchestras' came in that the people wrote 'music' for trumpets, and it sounded good because of its natural harmonics. Call it coincidence, but it worked...

The piano sounding fourths is kind of complex to explain, and I'm not sure how to put into words. Not every note of the scale sounds when you press a key, because there is no way of knowing if you are playing the 'D' from A minor, or the 'D' from G major. It would be cool if the piano could tell, though It basically sounds a 4th up (or down, I can't be bothered double checking) from the note you play. This doesn't require any intelligence from the piano, and it makes sense, really, since your voice will do EXACTLY the same thing when you're in the shower. Just sing a deep note and hold if for as long as you can. Depending on how steady you can hold the note, as well as how musically atuned your ear is, you can hear the 7th. You'd be able to the hear the 4th if we had better hearing, too.

Hope that kinda clears things up... sorta...

Actually, Archangel, you are absolutely right. The piano WILL sound the E, F and Bb. But, as I said, it's so soft you don't really notice. Just sit at the piano, press one of the lower C's, and hold it with the pedal. If you listen carefully you CAN hear those 'extra' notes.

I don't think I'm taking this too far at all. If I was swearing at people and telling them that I am right because I say so, then I'd be a prick. But Eldkatt and I have been discussing this issue. Not because we hate each other, but because we are genuinely interested in each other's opinions. I'm sure Bach didn't care if it was a crapophone or not, but Eldkatt and I do.



To trap, I'd have to agree with you. If it sounds good, then go with it. But it won't sound good if you're screwing with the very nature of music. Most people don't care, and that's fine with me. I'm takling to the people that do.

To Eldkatt,

I can't really list the names of any books that say the harp is percussion, but I picked up a leaflet from the Australian Conservatorium of Music that listed it as 'pitched percussion', much like a glockenspiel or vibraphone. I know there is a lot of debate going on about its family classification (strings or percussion??), but I, personally agree with the Con when they say it's percussion. I'm not trying to call anyone 'wrong', as such, because there is no conclusive evidence. Here is why: Stringed instruments are referred to as chordophones. Vibrating instruments are referred to as idophones. Violin falls into the first category, percussion in the last. The problem is, the harp is BOTH a chordophone and an idiophone. However I claim it to be (more closely related to) percussion because it relies more heavily on the vibration and tension of the strings, rather than the noise of the strings themselves.
Just to make this more confusing, a lot of music 'experts' even claim the harp to be part of the membranophones family (Vibrating Membrane instruments). I don't agree with that, however.

With regards to the trumpet, I don't think I've described my point fully, and it's caused a bit of confusion. The trumpet will work with ANY classical piece of of music, because it is designed as a harmonic accompaniment (originally) to the piano. And every note on the piano, when played, also plays the 3rd, 4th, 5th and 7th (obviously so quiet that you can't really notice). That is why the trumpet works so well with classical: it complements the piano, even when played in 3rds, or 6ths, because the piano is still sounding fourths no matter what you play. The indian raga, however, doesn't work like that. Instruments such as the Kasht Tarang, Chimpta, Bansuri, Mukhavina etc, etc, only play the base note and the fifth. That's why they belong with the pentatonic raga (I know, I know, doesn't work in all instances, but that's just music for you). Trying to play the trumpet with a sitar, for example, would give you this breakdown:
C on piano = C, E, F, Bb
C (untransposed, of course) on trumpet = C, F
G on sitar = G, D, F

So at any one time you have C, D, E, F, G, Bb playing all at once. Play it on the piano and you can tell it's a musical nightmare.

Hope this clarifies things a bit   If not, just give me a buzz

 :o


*faints*

Newb27? You won't live that name down, you realise, but welcome to the board anyway.

That screenshot DOES look familiar, though I can't place it exactly, so you could well have done it yourself. Congratulations if you did. Smack on the bum if you plagarised. I guess we'll know in a years(?) time when a game like that would normally be released...

I agree that it was a publicity stunt. No way he'd do it if he didn't think people would come and watch it...

But the media DID make it seem MUCH more dramatic than it actually was. (This bit's for DGM)

I mean, for sure he could have slipped and dropped his baby, but parents "throw" (not literally) their kids up in the air and catch them again all the time. No one ever yells at them. It's just because there's a croc in there... Needless to say it was the most placid crock they had, and crocodiles move at their slowest when on land, and it's head was a good five-six meters away from the baby (despite what it looked like in the footage)...

To DGM, also.... Yes, it was stupid to the point of being a publicity stunt which he SHOULD HAVE KNOWN would cause a stir. But he wasn't being a stupid parent. Just teaching the kids what they'd have to learn anyway.

So I'm with MillsJ on this one. I, personally, am afraid of crocs. Steve isn't. So I'd expect him to know more about crocs than me, and I'd be a stuck up prick if I pretended to know more than him. But at the same time, I'd be an ass to condone it.

It was just a stunt to get attention.

He sure as hell did that.....

Sorry, Trap. Didn't mean to argue  

Forget I even breathed.....

Edit: You know what... rather than start a fight (which I really would rather not), I think I WILL enter this contest after all, but I'll do it in a style COMPLETLY unsuited to these instruments just to get my point across, without having to add a frowning emoticon

Maybe I'll enter..... maybe.. depends how lazy I feel...

Well??

Apparently Steve's pretty big over in America, and his fan base has suddenly died because of his stunt with his son. Well, at least that's what OUR news reports say.

As an Australian who was AT that demonstration, I think the media have put it totally out of context. They've only shown the bits of footage that have Steve, the baby, and the croc in them. No mention about the seven spotters who were two steps away at all times... I don't know if anybody else saw this, but they certainly didn't broadcast it in Oz.

I know, I know, it was a stupid thing to do nevertheless, and I wouldn't do it personally, but Steve's not that stupid to put his son at risk if he truly thought there WAS danger. In a 2 minute interview I saw of him, he said that there were more children mauled to death by dogs each year than people attacked by crocs in the past 5 years. It's just 'perceived danger' and it causes a lot of paranoia.

I was just wondering what the rest of you think of him, and what should happen to him.

P.S - when I say 'what do you think of him', I don't mean as a person, because I'm sure as hell convinced that he's NUTS in the head the way he goes on and on about how beautiful everything is. I mean what do you think of his defence?

Erm...... yeah..... I got a GAAP thing too......??

I need to raise...... erm..... $160,00?? Why? Oh....it's for......government protection? We're going to.... er... Iraq, yes, Iraq...

Anyone wanna donate? Just leave your credit card and pin at my email address:

Evil_Scam_Artist_Desperate_for_Money@hotmail.com

A couple more "smart-ass" corrections.

No, Archangel, I am NOT saying that you may never put trumpets in thirds. Put them in 7ths for all I care. I'm saying that the natural reverbrance of the bell works BEST with fourths. The sitar, being a petatonic raga instrument, works better with the notes of, believe it or not, the pentatonic scale (ie - NOT the same notes as the trumpet)

To Eldkatt, the harp most certainly IS percussion. Look up any half-way decent music book.  Although it is a chordophone, it is more closely related to a piano 'without the box'. It has 47 strings and by means of pedals the tension of the strings are adjusted thus producing different pitches. It is only a string instrument if it can be plucked AND bowed, and is only a FULL chordophone if it does not have 'pedals'. By definition, this makes the harp part of the percussion family. Thus, neither is the guitar a member of the strings family, but rather part of its own group.

And, while the trumpet does have valves to make it chromatic, this wasn't my point. read my response to archangel.

*sigh*.... why is everything so subjective these days?? It was a whole lot easier when someone stood over your shoulder and told you EXACTLY what to believe...

Nice site.

It has a very professional touch. Well, what I can read of it, anyway...

Okay, I officially withdraw from this round. Despite the "use any style you want" disclaimer, it's pretty obvious that these instruments lend themselves to the Anhemitonic Pentatonic scale of the Indian culture. And trying to incorporate a trumpet into that is (imho) just silly, because it's designed for the harmonics of consecutive 4ths  :'(

Okay.... now I'm ranting..... I apologise. I just have certain reservations about the musicality of the Indian raga. Nothing personal...

Just accept my apologies, and don't let this put anyone else off entering the competition.

Thanks for clearing up the percussion thing  

I'll get started on my tune straight away (I think)

Amen to YakSpit.

I detest beer. I guess it's an acquired taste, but it SMELLS gross, TASTES gross, and it gives heaps of people a beer gut.

I'm a coffee and bailey's man. But then again, I don't drink heaps of coffee (because my dad got addicted to it, and that put me off a bit), so I guess I'm not really a drinker.

I mean, I've never been drunk enough to throw up, or do something stupid. My body tells me when I'm about to drink 'one glass too many', so I stop then.

But hey, if you like fermented, yeasty, frothy crap, it's your life

[ Repeat My Previous Post ]

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*cough*

This is a really weird instrumentation!! I keep on getting all these little ideas that work well on one instrument, but don't work with the others
But that's half the challenge, I guess, so I'll persevere...!

Good luck to all other entrants. But not TOO much...  

"Macho Man" is just a euphemism for Stuck-Up-Prick.

You don't want to be one of THEM, do you??

I have to agree with Colossal, though. Flamers only keep on flaming if they think the flamee is reading the flames in the first place (got it?). Just ignore them and they'll get tired after a day or three. Maybe a little longer, but it's better than dragging it out for however long this thing has been going on.

NOT that I really have any idea about anything...

What do you mean 'percussion?'

Typical or atypical?

Because, really, if you want to be technical, the piano and harp are both percussion instruments, along with drums and cymbals and such. So are we talking just your standard percussion, or ALL sorts?

really??

well..... as I said, I never got a chance to use it extensively, but I thought it was pretty good from what I saw.

My friend reckons it's great, though. A bit strange to 'learn' (don't ask me what he meant by that... I didn't think it was really all that different), but good.

Go figure, heh?

Damien's song reminds me of the music from '28 days later'. I assume most of you guys have seen it...

If not, you won't have a clue. If you HAVE, you're probably shaking your head, thinking 'erm....no!'

But that's what I thought of, anyway.

Where they're climbing up the 'mountain' of trolleys, and all the infected people are running after them. Or somewhere near the rape scene, when they show that infected 'freedom fighter' a couple of minutes later.... or maybe not...

*sigh*

It sucks to be non-descriptive...