Author Topic: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)  (Read 951 times)

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SPOILER WARNING! Please don't read any further if you haven't watched the series and want to avoid spoilers.

Is anyone else watching Star Trek: Discovery? I'm really enjoying it.

I've read rumours that the Discovery might be a section 31 craft. Some are saying it's the mirror universe (unlikely, I think). There's also a theory that the Discovery's spore drive might propel the crew into the future. It's certainly fun to speculate though.

Oh, speaking of the spore drive, I couldn't help but think of AnasAbdin when watching it. The Discovery's spore drive is Tardigrades powered!

What do you think of the Klingons? I don't like the look, personally, but I'm still holding out on an in-universe explanation that ties it together with both the 60s Peurto Rican gold lamé look and the 80s/90s/00s heavy metal lobster-on-head look.

I've got to say, I liked the series more at episode 3 than I did after episode 4. Episode 3 left me thinking it was some kind of weird X-Files ship where weird phenomena were present, but ep 4 cleared that up and now the whole things much more grounded again.

What do you guys think of the series so far? What do you like/dislike about it?

And while we're talking sci-fi, there's a lot on at the moment (the Orville, Red Dwarf). I watched the first few episodes of the Orville. I was expecting to hate it but I don't. I mean, I really don't like Family Guy and Seth Macfarlane in general, but it's better than I was expecting. The jokes are flat, Seth isn't much of a character, but if you can get past that, it's a good B-show for Star Trek: Discovery. The effects are surprisingly good. The stories are good and touch on some relevant social issues, though one episode clearly rehashed a Twilight Zone story. It's got heart and you can tell that Seth is a big Trek fan.

Enough of my thoughts. What do you all think of Discovery (and other sci-fi that's on right now)?

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #1 on: 12 Oct 2017, 11:00 »
What do you think of the Klingons? I don't like the look, personally, but I'm still holding out on an in-universe explanation that ties it together with both the 60s Peurto Rican gold lamé look and the 80s/90s/00s heavy metal lobster-on-head look.
I don't think these current Klingons have an explanation. But those 60s Peurto Rican gold lamé Klingons got a pretty good explanation years ago. Which I'm sure all the Star Trek fans here already know. :-D

Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #2 on: 12 Oct 2017, 14:47 »
I'm enjoying Discovery so far.

I'm making an effort not to read much of the fan theories, so I don't get spoiled/disappointed because they do or don't follow the one I would like the most.

My main issue with the Klingons is that they are not re-dubbed. The prosthesis make a mess on the actors  ability to speak, making their dialogue too slow and broken. They should have had the actors talk faster and not caring much about the sounds and then re-do the dialogue later without the make up, so they wouldn't have that kind of speech impediment.
I'm really hoping they will add some of the other Klingon designs, just so they can establish that these are just how some of them look, and tie-up with the TOS and TNG/Movies looks.

As for the Orville, despite what some of us feel about Seth MacFarlane's comedy, he has always been a die-hard Star Trek fan (with actual cameos on the TV series), so I wasn't surprised to see his show become a sort of alternate reality version of the Next Generation. It did feel weird how the pilot episode was so heavy on the jokes (a lot of which didn't land), but they were mostly absent by the third episode.


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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #3 on: 13 Oct 2017, 13:21 »
I'm watching, and loving, The Orville to get my Star Trek fix because there's no Star Trek show on right now as far as I'm concerned.


Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #4 on: 14 Oct 2017, 02:58 »
I'm watching, and loving, The Orville to get my Star Trek fix because there's no Star Trek show on right now as far as I'm concerned.
I'm a bit disappointed in Discovery as well. I don't like the "spores" for instantaneous travel or the use of an alien species as a super computer mapping the stars. It doesn't feel like a science fiction show at all, more like a science fantasy show. Then there's the 1000 light year mind meld - So does that mean Vulcan's have sub space (faster than light) communication and that humans are capable of receiving this? I feel it's trying to do what Stargate Universe did with the communication stones that would transfer the conscience of the people holding the stones on each end of the universe. It allowed them to speak to earth, but prevented the show from having that Voyager feeling of being alone.

I also thought the introduction to Captain Lorca was mirroring that of the poor introduction to Captain Picard, with "I don't like children" vs Lorca's "I have light sensitivity". WTF.

Edit: Oh right and I forgot to say but Orville IS awesome. Has its weak moments where it could have been funnier, joke opportunities that were missed etc. It feels very Galaxy Quest which I absolutely loved more than any Star Trek movie.
« Last Edit: 14 Oct 2017, 03:01 by Ryan Timoothy »

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #5 on: 14 Oct 2017, 08:57 »
I got hooked on the series from the first episode. Honestly I think it's very well made and looks a lot like the movies. I can't decide whether to like or dislike the intricate details as the show is still revealing its elements. But so far it looks interesting and different.

Oh, speaking of the spore drive, I couldn't help but think of AnasAbdin when watching it. The Discovery's spore drive is Tardigrades powered!

I have a theory *ahem* I think the writers/producers/directors/designers/Uhura have been following my progress on Tardigrades and have seen my videos (specially the ones in this update). I will wait for a couple of more episodes before I sue them (laugh)

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #6 on: 14 Oct 2017, 14:37 »
I'm watching, and loving, The Orville to get my Star Trek fix because there's no Star Trek show on right now as far as I'm concerned.

Meanwhile I'm quite enjoying Discovery (it's not the greatest show in the world, but good clean spaceship fun), while I think The Orville is one of the most wretched things I've ever seen committed to screen. Like, I cannot comprehend how professional producers and a real honest-to-god TV network allowed such a boring, misconceived, and botched concept to make it to air. It actually makes me angry.

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #7 on: 16 Oct 2017, 12:31 »
Meanwhile I'm quite enjoying Discovery (it's not the greatest show in the world, but good clean spaceship fun), while I think The Orville is one of the most wretched things I've ever seen committed to screen. Like, I cannot comprehend how professional producers and a real honest-to-god TV network allowed such a boring, misconceived, and botched concept to make it to air. It actually makes me angry.

Star Trek Discovery (STD... fitting) is CBS's desperate attempt to capitalize on Game of Thrones' success. They tried, and failed miserably, to make Game of Thrones in Space. It feels nothing like Star Trek and shows how incredibly out of touch w/ the fan-base CBS truly is. First; they put the nix on Axanar (which in only a few short teasers looks infinitely better and more treky than STD), then they put in those draconian "rules" for fan-films (absolutely ridiculous), and then they change things (the Klingons appearances and ship designs, holographic coms that sit on tables in the other rooms? seriously?) just to name a few.

Then on top of all that they try to launch their pointless paid service by piggy-backing it on a cherished franchise they have ruined.

All around not Star Trek and shameful.

As for the Orville and your... colorful... feelings about it. I thinks that's a tad harsh but if that's how you feel so be it.

I mean it's Seth MacFarlane ... I'm not sure what you were expecting from the guy known for fart-jokes and vomit humor?

I went in expecting silly and spoofy (a la Galaxy Quest) and was pleasantly surprised.

It's fun, doesn't take itself too seriously, and feels like Star Trek to me.

To each their own.
« Last Edit: 16 Oct 2017, 13:08 by Darth Mandarb »

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #8 on: 16 Oct 2017, 13:14 »
Star Trek Discovery (STD... fitting) is CBS's desperate attempt to capitalize on Game of Thrones' success. They tried, and failed miserably, to make Game of Thrones in Space. It feels nothing like Star Trek and shows how incredibly out of touch w/ the fan-base CBS truly is.

This, mutatis mutandis, is pretty much what fans said about the Battlestar Galactica reboot.

Quote
First; they put the nix on Axanar (which in only a few short teasers looks infinitely better and more treky than STD), then they put in those draconian "rules" for fan-films (absolutely ridiculous)

I followed the Axanar story a little bit, and that whole project seemed incredibly scummy, openly defying copyright for profit and making absurd claims to justify it, actually challenging whether Star Trek was effectively protected by copyright at all. They got deservedly smacked down. The rules seem a bit over-the-top, but that's what you get when some people try to exploit their indulgence.

There's no inalienable right to fan-fiction, it depends on both sides playing nice. And with Axanar, (people claiming to represent) the fandom violated that. Now you can't have nice things. I know who I'd blame.

Quote
and then they change things (the Klingons appearances and ship designs, holographic coms that sit on tables in the other rooms? seriously?) just to name a few.

Haha, yeah, it's great, innit?

Quote
Then on top of all that they try to launch their pointless paid service by piggy-backing it on a cherished franchise they have ruined.

Not a fault of the series itself, and anyway it's on Netflix outside the US.

Quote
I mean it's Seth MacFarlane ... I'm not sure what you were expecting from the guy known for fart-jokes and vomit humor?

I expected a comedy, which I quickly realized it wasn't (to the point of being painfully unfunny). But as a straight sci-fi show it's just... dull. I think the big hurdle for most sci-fi shows is to make us believe in the world it creates, so we care about the characters and their problems. And I can't remember the last time I saw a show that was more unconvincing than The Orville. From the sets and production design to the casting and acting, at no point does it feel remotely real. And just to rub it in further, the dialog is peppered with contemporary pop-culture references, as if we were ever in any danger of thinking that these were real characters talking about things in their own world, rather than some Hollywood screenwriter imitating not-even-jokes from today's talk shows.

If you enjoy it, good for you, but I hope it's canceled soon.

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #9 on: 16 Oct 2017, 15:00 »
I'm moderately enjoying Discovery, though I'd prefer if it had fewer lens flares and more ethical quandaries. The Expanse, on the other hand, is so good. Almost every dialogue scene in Discovery could use Chrisjen Avasarala saying "Get to the f****** point."

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #10 on: 16 Oct 2017, 16:02 »
Haha, yeah, it's great, innit?

Quite the opposite.

However, I really have no interest in one of our famous back 'n forth debates when it really just boils down to our individual tastes. If you're enjoying Star Trek Discovery I hope it lasts many seasons for your enjoyment!

Let's just agree to disagree and carry on.

The Expanse, on the other hand, is so good.
I have just started watching this. I am in complete agreement (so far). It is really quite excellent.

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #11 on: 16 Oct 2017, 16:23 »
If you're enjoying Star Trek Discovery I hope it lasts many seasons for your enjoyment!

:)

The Expanse, on the other hand, is so good.
I have just started watching this. I am in complete agreement (so far). It is really quite excellent.

Oh I wanna see how you look after watching season 2 (nod)

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #12 on: 17 Oct 2017, 02:49 »
What do you think of the Klingons? I don't like the look, personally, but I'm still holding out on an in-universe explanation that ties it together with both the 60s Peurto Rican gold lamé look and the 80s/90s/00s heavy metal lobster-on-head look.
I don't think these current Klingons have an explanation. But those 60s Peurto Rican gold lamé Klingons got a pretty good explanation years ago. Which I'm sure all the Star Trek fans here already know. :-D

Yes, of course. I meant that I wanted to see continuity -- why we haven't seen flat-headed Klingons yet when they're due to (re)appear in 10 years.

I got hooked on the series from the first episode. Honestly I think it's very well made and looks a lot like the movies. I can't decide whether to like or dislike the intricate details as the show is still revealing its elements. But so far it looks interesting and different.

Oh, speaking of the spore drive, I couldn't help but think of AnasAbdin when watching it. The Discovery's spore drive is Tardigrades powered!

I have a theory *ahem* I think the writers/producers/directors/designers/Uhura have been following my progress on Tardigrades and have seen my videos (specially the ones in this update). I will wait for a couple of more episodes before I sue them (laugh)

I think this will act as publicity for your game. You should be able to use the Tardigrades link as marketing. Certainly, everyone will know what a tardigrade is now.

I'm moderately enjoying Discovery, though I'd prefer if it had fewer lens flares and more ethical quandaries. The Expanse, on the other hand, is so good. Almost every dialogue scene in Discovery could use Chrisjen Avasarala saying "Get to the f****** point."

Agreed about the lens flares and ethical quandaries. Better lighting in general would be appreciated. I watch it with the lights off and I get annoyed at how much of the great Klingon costume design work gets obscured most of the time because the lighting is so bad.

I tried the Expanse. Does it get better after the pilot? It seemed overly Canadian to me, like there's this vein of cheap sci-fi shot in Canada -- Travelers, Continuum, etc. -- that are built on a budget (few effects shots, mostly bottle episodes). It seemed very reminiscent of that, so much so that I switched it off about three quarters of the way through the pilot. Also, regarding Discovery's dialogue, I haven't had a problem with that, but if you're saying the Expanse does it better, I can't agree. The dialogue I witnessed seemed laboured and packed with clichés.

I went in expecting silly and spoofy (a la Galaxy Quest) and was pleasantly surprised.

Actually, it's interesting to note the different approaches here. I think the Orville underpromised and overdelivered, whereas Discovery hyped us all up and now we've got nowhere to go but to be disappointed.
« Last Edit: 17 Oct 2017, 03:12 by Gurok »

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #13 on: 17 Oct 2017, 10:41 »
No matter if you like Discovery, Orville, both, or neither. You've at least got to be happy that there are finally some space operas on TV again.
We had an entire decade with no space operas! The closest we had to one was Doctor Who, and that is definitely not a space opera.
And now look! We have six of them at once!

Sorry, I'm just really happy that I can finally watch TV shows set in space again. :-D

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #14 on: 17 Oct 2017, 11:26 »
If you're enjoying Star Trek Discovery I hope it lasts many seasons for your enjoyment!

I'm enjoying it just fine, but I can barely keep up with shows I think are great (I'm two seasons behind on Fargo, I haven't got around to The Handmaid's Tale, and I hear The Leftovers is supposed to be good, too), so I wouldn't grieve if it went off the air. We are pretty spoiled for choice these days.

We had an entire decade with no space operas! The closest we had to one was Doctor Who, and that is definitely not a space opera.

Not quite true (without even getting into whether DW is space opera: in many episodes it definitely is). Between Battlestar Galactica going off the air in 2009 and The Expanse, Killjoys and Dark Matter launching in 2015 is just over half a decade*, and in between you had stuff like Ascension and the first season of The 100 (both 2014). I'll also give a shout-out to Other Space (2015), which is the show many people were probably expecting The Orville to be (basically an American Red Dwarf).

Quote
And now look! We have six of them at once!

Care to list them?

* Edit: And I forgot about Stargate Universe (2009–2011), which narrows the gap even further.
« Last Edit: 17 Oct 2017, 11:35 by Snarky »

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #15 on: 18 Oct 2017, 13:02 »
Quote
And now look! We have six of them at once!

Care to list them?
You just did. :-D
Also, fair point. It was only half a decade. But it felt like a full decade!

I can barely keep up with shows I think are great
Same here. (nod)
I'm about a season behind on almost every show I watch.

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #16 on: 18 Oct 2017, 14:12 »
Hmm... I only count five if we're not including Doctor Who:

1. ST Discovery
2. The Orville
3. The Expanse
4. Dark Matter
5. Killjoys

Are you counting Rick & Morty? (Aww jeez, R&M first aired in 2013, so if that counts there were only a couple of years without any space opera on TV.)
« Last Edit: 18 Oct 2017, 14:16 by Snarky »

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #17 on: 18 Oct 2017, 17:43 »
I tried the Expanse. Does it get better after the pilot? It seemed overly Canadian to me, like there's this vein of cheap sci-fi shot in Canada -- Travelers, Continuum, etc. -- that are built on a budget (few effects shots, mostly bottle episodes). It seemed very reminiscent of that, so much so that I switched it off about three quarters of the way through the pilot. Also, regarding Discovery's dialogue, I haven't had a problem with that, but if you're saying the Expanse does it better, I can't agree. The dialogue I witnessed seemed laboured and packed with clichés.

If you found the pilot a little dry and meandering, then I'd suggest you press on. However, if you just didn't like it, you made the right call.

Apart from Miller's trilby hat, I didn't find it to be heavy with cliché. As a series it's full of obvious choices that almost no sci-fi shows actually deal with. Gravity only works when you're moving. Moving really fast hurts. Forcefields don't exist - missiles punch holes in space ships and all the air gets sucked out. Belters talk like Afrikaner South Londoners.

Also, the Expanse's characters are given interesting things to do while they deliver expositional dialogue. They're at work, or in conflict. By contrast, the first two episodes of Discovery are heavy with characters standing across desks or in front of screens explaining things that they already know to each other. It's not as bad as the first episodes of Babylon 5... but not many things are.

But over all, hooray for sci-fi on TV!

Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #18 on: 23 Oct 2017, 08:48 »


Adam Jensen from Deus Ex: Human Revolution shows up in Star Trek: Discovery, so as far as I'm concerned, the show now has a cyber-thumb up from me. (Well ok, I also liked the way things took a hard left turn down Battlestar lane and a hard right onto gritty avenue in episode 3. As a serial-cliche-inverter and plot-twist aficionado, I had to tip my fedora to that bit.)

Also, Doug Jones.

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Re: Star Trek: Discovery (and the Orville, I guess)
« Reply #19 on: 12 Nov 2017, 02:12 »
 
Quote

If you enjoy it, good for you, but I hope it's canceled soon.

I can understand why you don't like it and why folks don't like Discovery. But I wouldn't wish cancellation on either as there are people who enjoy one or the other or even both. I suggest for anyone that doesn't particularly like one show to just change the channel or just choose not to watch it. As for me... I quite enjoy the Orville. I think the sets are decent. I enjoy the aspects that are ridiculous. I always say that if I were to watch a show so it can be realistic, then I will just watch a documentary or reality show. It's why I enjoy shows like the Orville or Dr Who or movies like Star Wars or justice league. You have to learn to not be so critical and just enjoy something for what it is. That's why I enjoy watching these shows. Darth, you and me will be the only Orville watchers here. Now go make an Orville adventure game!!!! ;-)
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