AGS 3.0 Final - it's been a long road

[Recluse]

Yes, but most of us make humor games. Not horror games. Thus this version would only lower the quality of our product...

The Current Cuppit just looks ugly, and besides, why do we need a user-friendly assistant when we have Ashen?

[airgo]

i like misj cup. makes me wanna create a game while drinking a nice cup of hot chocolate.

[monkey0506]

To go along with the general consensus here, I too think that although it could provide some sort of nostalgic humour for those who are familiar with META, using the same Cuppit probably isn't the best idea. I'm not against the idea of an adaptive, dynamic assistant to help out the beginners, but this probably won't attract more users.

Thinking back to when I first started with AGS the gray default GUI and the low-res Roger sprites turned me off of AGS in a big way. But I saw some examples of games using different interfaces which is what turned me around. I imagine that if Cuppit had been around back in those days (in his present incarnation), I probably would never have used it.

On the other hand however, I find Misj''s Cuppit to be very aesthetically pleasing. Perhaps we could use his rendition?

Other than looks, I think it would be useful if the pop-up hints had links in them which could open help file articles. For example in the screenshot posted by Misj' where it says "Read the Scripting Tutorial in the manual," I actually expected to be able to click on "Scripting Tutorial" and be taken directly to it in the manual.

And I know it's already been thought of/mentioned, but I'm just curious as to the status of a couple things regarding dynamic arrays. Specifically the ability to retrieve the size of an array and the ability to include them within a struct. Again, I know they're being looked into, I'd just really like to know when I can hope to see these features implemented. Thanks.

[Gilbert]

My thought was, while Cuppid was fun for people who know what it is (which wouldn't be beginners, especially for those who really know what META's about), it's horrible, annoying and probably unhelpful for beginners (especially when these assistants are FOR beginners).
Since Cuppid was for humourous effect in the not-AGSEditor in META, so it would be odd to make it official for the real editor. IMO it is more appropiate to have more "normal" characters like Bluecup or Roger as official assistants. OR if the assistant system could be made like those lame M$Office style that the users can choose whatever characters they want, in that case the normal Bluecup and Roger can both be included, and additionally experienced users may choose the (supposedly) annoying Cuppid for comical effects.

[Pumaman]

Hehe, I was wondering what the reaction to Cuppit might be

Really he's a placeholder because I'm no graphic designer -- I like Misj's although he does look a bit scheming and evil!

Obviously we can change his visual appearance if someone would like to contribute a new sprite for him, but overall do you think that what he's saying is useful for beginners? I think it also needs an option to turn him off permanently for experienced users.

[SSH]

Can't we have bluecup instead?

[LimpingFish]

 

"Don't forget them semi-colons, kids!"                  "Error! Error!"

[SupSuper]

Hehe, I was wondering what the reaction to Cuppit might be

Really he's a placeholder because I'm no graphic designer -- I like Misj's although he does look a bit scheming and evil!

Obviously we can change his visual appearance if someone would like to contribute a new sprite for him, but overall do you think that what he's saying is useful for beginners? I think it also needs an option to turn him off permanently for experienced users.

Shouldn't that be what the "Stop bugging me" button does? If you've seen a hint once, you don't need to see it twice. Hopefully.

And not only do I like the look of Misk's Cuppit, I also like his design. The hint looks professional and unintrusive, while the current one could get in the way, since it doesn't move and can get on top of options.

[Radiant]

Oh cool, more Cuppits!

[Misj']

Oh cool, more Cuppits!

I smell a competition comming up.

Furthermore, the competition thread would keep this thread from being cluttered...which I am more than partly responsible of. But first we would have to answer the following three question:

1. Do we think an assistant is a useful addition?
2. What functionality do we expect from such an assistant?
3. Should the assistant be continuously present or should it pop-up?

My personal answers:
1. I hardly ever use them, and wouldn't miss it if it weren't there. I might however use them
    with the following functionality:
2. A. Search option (much like in MSOffice)
    B. If - in addition to general information about the current page - I get specific information
        about the current option I'm selecting. Example: when selecting the kind of speech, I'm
        informed what the difference between LucasArts and Sierra speech is.
    C. A 'more' button brings up the designated site in the help-file
    D. The text sometimes contains links to pages in the help-file (as described by Monkey)
    E. Be able to turn him on and off (via the pull-down-menu)
    F. Two levels: Beginner and Advanced.
           Beginner would show all information, hints, etc.
           Advanced would only show the assistant; but clicking on the assistant would show the
           information, hints, and the possibility to (quick) search the help-file.
3. Based on option A and F I would say that the assistant (though not his tips) would
    always be present (much like it's annoying MS counterpart). Since it's relatively easy to turn him
    off (E) I do not think this will invade the user's privacy too much.

Just my thoughts...

Misj'

[monkey0506]

I agree with basically every point you just said Misj'. You've really put some serious thought into this.

[Ishmael]

I hope I haven't missed anything... But how do I reorder rooms? Is the only way still to change the file name, or does that even work anymore?

Do you mean change the room number, or change the order they appear in the editor's list?

The room number. And this probably will affect the order they appear in the editor, too... I was wondering since there are two files for each room now, or so it seems atleast.

And I say an optional Tip of the Day thing or similiar appearing once a game is loaded, with a checkbox or something for it in the start up wizard's first page or so, but no assistant. I've always turned them off in everything. (MS Office, that is...)

[Pumaman]

The thing about the assistant is that yes, most of you are familiar with AGS and wouldn't use it -- but put yourself back in the shoes of never having used AGS before. Do you think it would have been helpful the first time you loaded it up to have the assistant there, or would it have just been annoying?

[LimpingFish]

It may stop all those "cant add gui! pls hlp!"-type threads. Plus, it would be a boon to all those people who are too lazy to read the manual.

[SupSuper]

Yeah I can see an assistant coming handy with AGS 2.8's more "experienced developer" feel, we just don't want it to step on anyone's toes like Cuppit did.

[Ishmael]

Hello,

Code: ags

An unexpected error occurred. Please note down the following information and contact CJ.

System.IO.FileNotFoundException: Could not find file 'D:\AGS\Editor\28beta6\vt\room2.asc'.

File name: 'D:\AGS\Editor\28beta6\vt\room2.asc'

   at System.IO.__Error.WinIOError(Int32 errorCode, String maybeFullPath)

   at System.IO.FileStream.Init(String path, FileMode mode, FileAccess access, Int32 rights, 
    Boolean useRights, FileShare share, Int32 bufferSize, FileOptions options, 
    SECURITY_ATTRIBUTES secAttrs, String msgPath, Boolean bFromProxy)

   at System.IO.FileStream..ctor(String path, FileMode mode, FileAccess access, FileShare share)

   at AGS.Types.Script.LoadFromDisk()

   at AGS.Types.UnloadedRoom.LoadScript()

   at AGS.Editor.Components.RoomsComponent.CommandClick(String controlID)

   at AGS.Editor.ProjectTree.ProcessClickOnNode(String nodeID, MouseButtons button)

   at AGS.Editor.ProjectTree.projectTree_NodeMouseDoubleClick(Object sender, TreeNodeMouseClickEventArgs e)

   at System.Windows.Forms.TreeView.OnNodeMouseDoubleClick(TreeNodeMouseClickEventArgs e)

   at System.Windows.Forms.TreeView.WndProc(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.OnMessage(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.WndProc(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)

I loaded up my game, right-clicked the 'Rooms' -thing in the tree-view, selected to create a new room, then renamed the room2.* files to room100.*s, went back to the editor and tried opening room 2 from the list. Basically nothing new from the old editor, just you might want to do something about it?

I'm so used to the way the old room editor worked, as I could easily see a summary of all my rooms, etc. This new thing just confuses me. And I can't find the option to refresh the room list anywhere. I have a thing for numbering rooms very specifically, but the way the editor works now I have very little chance for that. Could double-clicking the Rooms option bring up an old-fashioned room editor view with all the rooms and their descriptions listed, and the option to load the rooms and refresh the list from there?

[Pumaman]

Don't rename files manually, the new editor keeps a track of your rooms rather than just scanning the directory for all room files like the old editor used to do.

I'll look into adding a Change Room Number option, but in the meantime a workaround would be to use the "Exclude from game"  option, then rename the files, then use the "Import existing room" option to import it back in with its new name.

[Ishmael]

Ok, thanks for the info. I can work with that, I just wasn't aware it works that way.

[Radiant]

Don't rename files manually, the new editor keeps a track of your rooms rather than just scanning the directory for all room files like the old editor used to do.

Really? I'd find that impractical. I move room files around all the time to speed up compile time (i.e. moving all files not needed at the moment to a temp folder).

[nick.keane]

Chris Jones, you never cease to amaze me! Now I can make a character that runs an animation that goes on forever... and ever... and ever.

You are truly awesome.
I'll give it a test drive right now. btw, this version is going to be fully compatable with vista right? Last time I tried to get AGS 2.72 (compiled executables, not the editor, AGSEdit) to function, I couldn't get it to work. My cousin can got the executable to work on Windows Vista Business, so I think it's just my graphics card. Of course, it could also be that home premium is a piece of shit! Meh, i'll figure out something.

I can't even imagine what v3.0 is going to look like when ya get there. kudos!