Question regarding game design

[NickyNyce]

Hello everyone,

     I have a question regarding game design. As an adventure fan I've played games that have you pick up meaningless items that don't appear to help you at the moment, and other times you need to come across a certain situation where you then can go back and pick that once useless item up because you now think it may help you.

In games where you are trapped or in a strange place, picking everything up makes sense, but otherwise I have said to myself why would I pick up this stick or rock, so on and so forth. Do you guys as ( gamers ) care much about this ? , Do you find it annoying that you now need to go back to places to try and pick things up you could not before ? , Do you find it silly to pick up meaningless things that appear to make no sense carrying around with you ?

What do you guys think about these simple but yet important game design choices

[Igor Hardy]

It's much better to be able to pick everything right away then to need to wait until you stumble upon a specific puzzles that requires that item. The opposite solution is just plain frustrating for the player - in general any method of blocking the player's actions is. And no player wants to try the same actions over and over again in case the main character changed his/hers mind about them. Nevertheless, depending on the storyline context the kleptomania factor can indeed sometimes feel very weird.

On a related note, there are situations where, because of the story events order, you - the designer - really need to block the player from certain interactions until sometime later in the game. Those bits may end up feeling awkward/frustrating too.

[NickyNyce]

It is a bit tricky, I never really hated picking everything up because everyone loves to have lots of items, at least I do anyway, but as a story unfolds I think it be necessary in a non escape type game to have "some" items that are left until needed.

I believe your right about not wanting to have the user get annoyed having to go back and forth,  I think it does need to be done close by if you are going to do so. As for picking everything up, it can seem silly to pick up a rock for no apparent reason.

Adventure gaming is a bit tricky when it comes to picking up items and why, but most important I guess is to keep the user interested and to not make too many fetch quests

Here is a thought though, if the designer words things correctly ... like... I'm not going to carry that around with me unless I really need it...and leaves the user thinking, O.K maybe I need to come back for this, I think you can get away with it if it's close by and not having to go a long way to go back for it. I think this opens up the adventure a bit instead of grabbing everything for no reason

[Igor Hardy]

Here is a thought though, if the designer words things correctly ... like... I'm not going to carry that around with me unless I really need it...and leaves the user thinking, O.K maybe I need to come back for this, I think you can get away with it if it's close by and not having to go a long way to go back for it. I think this opens up the adventure a bit instead of grabbing everything for no reason

There's already a technique used in fairly recent games like A Vampyre Story and Tale of a Hero where the player character says pretty much what you have proposed here and doesn't pick up the item, yet it appears as an icon in his inventory anyway. Then, when you use the item on some other object, the character automatically goes to fetch the item from the location it was left in.

[NickyNyce]

Yes, I do remember this now that you mention it, I like the idea, and it stops the player from going back to get the item, yet you don't need to pick everything up. Thanks for the idea AGScovE3l.

[Hernald]

The 'A Vampyre Story' way of remembering items can work, but it's best if you are prepared to do all the cut scenes retrieving the items when they are to be used.
Not being allowed to pick cumbersome items up until you know you need them helps with realism.

[Radiant]

Do you find it annoying that you now need to go back to places to try and pick things up you could not before ?

Yes. I consider this poor game design.

[Igor Hardy]

In 2008 there was released a gritty sci-fi adventure game called Sunrise. It wanted to be super-realistic to the point that the player character never says the same thing twice! Things like not carrying around anything that doesn't fit into a pocket go without saying. Nevertheless the game was deemed extremely frustrating by players in Germany (where it was created) and in the end it was never translated to English (despite initial announcements). I recommend trying out the demo if anyone is curious, it leaves quite an impression:

http://www.sunrisethegame.de/

[WHAM]

If you look at tutorials or guides into making puzzles, one rule will show up often: let the player see the obstacle / puzzle and THEN have them search for the way to overcome it.

So preferrably, the player should be guided to encounter the "key-stuck-behind-some-bookcase" and only then should the player be likely to find the magnet, the string and the stick.

Unless  you are making a one-room game, this should not be impossible to manage. If you want to hide items in earlier rooms, you could even make getting those items a puzzle in itself (item unreachable or somesuch) and the solution to those can only be discovered when the player discovers the other puzzles.

I hope I'm making at least some sense...

[Armageddon]

Something that's REALLY annoying is when you're playing Zak McKraken and you're near the end. And you forgot to pick up your Fish in a Bowl.

[NickyNyce]

@WHAM...total sense... ...I was just brainstorming on some puzzle ideas

[Mati256]

I remember in Jack Orlando you could pick up almost everything, you ended up with a lot of useless garbage in your pockets.