This is my first post and this may sound agresive for some people, anyway I felt the need of registering because I saw some things that I thought unfair.
I've had a look to AGS Games in prodution, and I can see games with nearly no comments, however those games seem to have had a (hard) time working. On the other hand I saw really bad games (which I'm not pointig out) with comments like: 'WOW lovely pictures, those graphics are awesome, good luck' when I really think they sucks (sorry for using that word) and they also seem to have been drawn by people who have no time to paint, I mean, drawn in 5 minutes. When I think if people are thinking of making a game they have to program their time. And not do it as soon as possible.
I heve two recognize that this hasn't happened too much, but, from my ponit of view, enough times to post this.
Hello and welcome :)
I don't mind your first post. Appreciate your honesty.
I would like to pin point me (if not in the thread as a PM then), the games with good graphics that are left out and the opposite on other games.
Two things you need to remember is that first this is a community and a strong one, so some things happen because of friendship and maybe some chat or something. If someone chats with me and tells me "Yo! Nikolas, I just posted a WIP in the games in production forum", I will go and probably post on it. Other wise I may not... :-/ Can't be posting on everygame...
Then there is the issue that graphics are not all we value here. So good graphics, combined with a bad story is not a great thing. Good graphics with bad marketing on behalf of the creator is also not a good thing. I do remember a couple of great games, that well... were abandoned by the creators.
:)
Quote from: Adenis on Mon 15/01/2007 21:01:11
On the other hand I saw really bad games (which I'm not pointig out) with comments like: 'WOW lovely pictures, those graphics are awesome, good luck' when I really think they sucks (sorry for using that word)
There are no "bad" or "good" graphics. At least I don't believe in such thing. There are only people who prefer some style to other. You for example may think that this game X has horrible graphics. Ok, I respect your opinion and hopefully will everyone else. But then, on the other hand, someone else might actually really like how game X looks. So it's all about personal preferences.
You can't really do anything about this situation. People comment on games they find interesting. They don't choose wether to comment or not depending on how hard the author is working on the game.
Thanks for those quick replies.
Well I think you're right. However those people with the 'making good graphics' talent might feel depressed when they realize there are no comments cause people don't like their games. So when people don't reply and could be interested in that game, should post a message saying 'Hey those graphics are amazing, but your story dosen't seem very inresting, Here are some ideas to improve it:...'
:-\
Just a comment to make the creators realize they must continue making their games but they need to be improved.
I don't know if my game "Limbo" is one with "bad graphics" in your opinion, but I shall defend myself just incase... otherwise I don't have much to debate. ;D
First of all, people have played my previous game so they already know that I make up for below average graphics.
Second of all, just like Nikolas said, people will comment on my game because they know me on here and wanted to give their support for a friend.
Personally I don't like the graphics in "Legend of the Lost Jewel" but that's down to personal taste. I can however see that the graphics are very well drawn, but I don't like the colour style used. (EGA, VGA, whatever it's called)
Ergo I have not posted a comment there!
The game in my sig looks amazing but im afraid to post a gip because i will hog all the bandwidth with all my many views and comments.
I say, if it hasn't got quite so many posts, why not give it one!
Don't forget that some, if not most, of the games made on AGS are made by true adventure games fans of the old-school who make very low-res games. These low-res graphics may be confused by some as "bad" graphics because they only use a certain amount of colours and pixels... but it's all about how the artists use such a small pallette on such a small canvas that makes it all the more impressive when the games are finally finished.
I think that graphics can and will be rated by the experience level of the maker.
If you browse through Critics Lounge and hear what experienced artists suggest, you can end up with a whole bible on how to draw, with all the commandments on perspective, outlines, saturation, etc. And of course long list of all the typical amateur mistakes, that tend to repeat again and again. The very basics of drawing in low-res.
By doing/not those mistakes and following "commandments" you CAN make up a graphics quality scale which ends are "bad" and "good". Though, styles differ and the most strong argument and factor is always if the graphics pleases viewer's eye or not. For example, I always make errors in perspective and I'm totally unable to pick low-saturation colors from palette (unlike Anarcho or Big Brother) but mostly, people like what I draw.
So, rating graphics is possible... but complicated.
This was about graphics. But adventure games are all about the atmosphere, and this is where music, story and all other things kick in.
For a totally amateur graphics in game, I always liked to bring up Framed! (http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/games.php?action=detail&id=349). I think that no matter how much critic you are, you have to confess that this game does look quite awful.
But still, because of gameplay and story, and especially the atmosphere, this game will always stay in my TOP5 of AGS games. Simply, because the graphics won't annoy when the game is good: I was too excited while playing to notice all the errors in graphics. Infact, I felt so sorry that creator couldn't draw better, this game - if refined a bit - looked like a sure hit!
Maybe you should play all those games you mentioned to get my point. Not as a critic, but as a player.
I would like to add, everybody actually taking the time out to create a game deserves : "This looks great" or something to that effect. And in every case the idea, story or graphics looks awesome.
Once again a single element cant make the game work. I can have hi res painted art by the best artist in the world and the game can suck!
I however do agree that some more time can be spent on every area in our game development skills. In my case I feel I need to spend more time scripting and not a five minute bang up job.
Yes, well I have to agree with Adenis, I nearly stopped making my game (Nedy's Adv 2) when I realised that it didn't get any comment, but in two days I forgot it and continued my game. So, the "no-comments effects" disappear soon. :)
Quote from: Stupot on Mon 15/01/2007 23:45:32
These low-res graphics may be confused by some as "bad" graphics because they only use a certain amount of colours and pixels...
I'd never confuse low-res with bad graphics. I really like old games style. What I mean with bad graphics are things like:
(http://joecarlhr.googlepages.com/NuevoImagendemapadebits2.PNG)
Or even that would be nice graphics compared to things I'seen
Joe Carl: Good to hear that you continued with the game.
The graphics are okay, but it was a man in a prison cell pulling out a loose brick, which we've all seen before. I'll still give your game a go when it's made though!
Thanks Matt, the brick is just a false hint... Nobody imagines what Nedy has to do after pulling that brick out...
Anyway thanks
And thus, we can only know so much from two screenshots! ;)
Quote from: Adenis on Tue 16/01/2007 20:48:04
Quote from: Stupot on Mon 15/01/2007 23:45:32
These low-res graphics may be confused by some as "bad" graphics because they only use a certain amount of colours and pixels...
I'd never confuse low-res with bad graphics. I really like old games style. What I mean with bad graphics are things like:
(http://joecarlhr.googlepages.com/NuevoImagendemapadebits2.PNG)
Or even that would be nice graphics compared to things I'seen
I quite like the look of that background tbh
Really??? Come on! Don't you realize the complete lack of perspective???
Sure it's off perspective and all goofy, but would fit a goofy game with odd perspective quite well. Looks like something made by M. C. Escher. I wouldn't judge too fast.
Yeah, it does have its unique style. Definitely.
Maybe you should make a game from it? :=
There's no doubt, who said "one man's meat is another man's poison" was completely right...
Hay Joe, I was gonna say that same expression right now!
Then I got a warning message.. :o
Quote from: Chicky on Wed 17/01/2007 12:06:06
Quote from: Adenis on Tue 16/01/2007 20:48:04I'd never confuse low-res with bad graphics. I really like old games style. What I mean with bad graphics are things like:
(http://joecarlhr.googlepages.com/NuevoImagendemapadebits2.PNG)
Or even that would be nice graphics compared to things I'seen
I quite like the look of that background tbh
I quite agree. That's definately not the worst I've seen around here. At least it plays with stylization and colors, rather than being one of those generic ones we see ten of each day. It's very abstract, it's interesting and it's got inventive colors (except for the primaries on the books).
.... Are you pulling my leg???
Come on!!! I really think that picture sucks!!
Doesn't anybody think the same as me???
It's obvious you're a pro. You should quit messing with us.
I've seen varying levels of (imho) sub-par graphics in games people have taken the time to make, but it seems to be the best they can do, so kudos to them.
If I think a game isn't worth my time, I don't play it. It doesn't offend me on any deeper level, I just pass it by.
I'll admit that any initial reservations I might have about playing a game will usually be visual based ones. Maybe that's not a fair way to look at things, but there you have it.
But people should never make a mistake between bad graphics and simple graphics. Bad graphics are badly executed and inconsistent, both in design and rendering.
Simple graphics can be beautiful. :)
(http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b37/manicmatt/comapre.png)
Kinda like this, Limping Fish? One is badly executed, the other is thought out, but both were drawn with the same big blob paint tool!
Quote from: big brother on Fri 19/01/2007 21:55:09
It's obvious you're a pro. You should quit messing with us.
I'm not a pro! I like graphics in MI I & II and all those kinds of graphics.
And really think that picture (which has been drawn by me) doesn't deserves those comments... I made it in 2 minutes!!! when there are other pictures which do deserve the nice comments however they have none!
... so give them some...
Quote from: Adenis on Tue 16/01/2007 20:48:04
Quote from: Stupot on Mon 15/01/2007 23:45:32
These low-res graphics may be confused by some as "bad" graphics because they only use a certain amount of colours and pixels...
I'd never confuse low-res with bad graphics. I really like old games style. What I mean with bad graphics are things like:
(http://joecarlhr.googlepages.com/NuevoImagendemapadebits2.PNG)
Or even that would be nice graphics compared to things I'seen
Hey, I just felt the need to say this, that picture is just perfect, in my opinion... the black circle, the distorted lines, the 1st person perspective go very well together. Fits perfectly in a game where the character is having some sort of nightmare, is insane, has been drugged etc.
You should really consider making a game with those graphics. Specially if you drew that room in 2 minutes. In half hour you could have a interesting game ready.
EDIT
In addition, the black flower painting in the background is a excellent touch.
That picture would just be perfect for a disturbing nightmare sequence. Next time you want a bad drawing, use something like this:
(http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a23/FAMILIAR_QUEST/Unbenannt-3.png)
;D