The limitations?

[Markmcgough]

Hi,

I was just wondering what kind of limitations are imposed when creating a 2d adventure game. For example if u were gona design a game with 16.8 million colours; The sprites would have about 256 per frame and were fairly large; the soundtrack was a high quality mp3; all this in the highest resolution possible... Could a low spec pentium 4 manage 30 fps consistently. That's assuming there would never be more than 5 sprites at once.

I'm very curoius since I was planning on doing a game like this in flash but actionscript is quite complicated & I'm not sure it's worth learning the language. I have done simple games in Q Basic. Is the scripting for AGS complicated or can u learn it inside out in a week?

I'm doing a degree in graphic design and so have a good understanding of Illustrator and Photoshop and would thus really like to create something graphically stunning. Would something like monkey island 3 be possible? I'm very serious about this as I'm considering game design as a career move.

Would be grateful to anyone who has any answers.

Regards

Mark

[scotch]

A low spec P4 should handle anything AGS can do very well, when talking about speed concerns in this engine we're usually only talking about on 500mhz systems or less, which is not a concern to some developers.

Monkey island 3 would easily be possible in AGS, however that game is in 256 colours, very good use of palettes, AGS can do 16 bit (65k colours), or 32 bit (16.8 million+alpha channel) colour as well.

MP3 or OGG soundtracks are not a problem, if you don't mind the filesize that they take up.  Sprites can also get to be rather large at this resolution but as long as you don't mind your game ending up over 100mb then you can do what you like.

The highest resolution AGS can do is 800x600x32 bit, that runs at 80FPS or so on my system, not amazingly fast, but I expect a 1ghz system would do 40 just fine, and I expect flash would be just as slow or slower at these resolutions.

AGS script is fairly easy, someone who has done some programming before could pick it up near instantly, with the help file, but a week is probably a more reasonable expectation if you're less experienced.

[Radiant]

Could a low spec pentium 4 manage 30 fps consistently.

Oh yes.

Is the scripting for AGS complicated or can you learn it inside out in a week?

Both, actually. It's easy to get started with, and you can keep improving yourself and finding new things.

Would something like monkey island 3 be possible? I'm very serious about this as I'm considering game design as a career move.

Certainly. But you may want to consider joining an existing team instead, just because creating an entire game on your own is a very large amount of work.

[markmcgough]

Wow. This program sounds really exciting. I noticed with some games the character walks side ways when travelling up the screen. Is this hard to avoid when creating a game?

@Scotch
"The highest resolution AGS can do is 800x600x32 bit, that runs at 80FPS or so on my system" That's pretty fast. Or is that a misstype?

@Radiant
Was thinking after your suggestion might start an online game project.

Does anyone know the shortest & longest time a game has been in development for using AGS?

[scotch]

No misstype but I'm used to working in 3D engines, so 80FPS for a few sprites moving around seems extremely slow in any resolution, especially on 2.6ghz..Ã,  However, most AGS games are capped at 40FPS so as long as you can reach that then there's no skipping, that speed is adjustable but less than 30fps becomes noticable.

Shortest time, <1 hour, we have "hour game" competitions, for a medium-full length game you could look at the Team Challenge games like ToaK, that was finished in around 5 weeks. Longest time... well, those that are legendary for taking long (FoY, Run Hot...) generally aren't out yet, Tierra's King's Quest remakes are a good example of a long project that has been completed, although I'm not exactly sure the amount of time they took I'd guess at minimum a year for KQ2 and they are seriously hardcore for amateur developers.

Remember that CMI took a couple of years, close to 1 million dollars and a large team of animators and other artists to finish.Ã,  It's amazing what amateurs can do sometimes but a CMI size and quality game is rather ambitious.


Edit: Yes and no on the sideways walking, usually that is caused by the characters only having side walk views, you can do up to 8 directions, which no 2d adventure has done more than iirc.  However AGS isn't particularly clever at picking the direction sprites so it will sometimes use one view when another would be a better.  As long as you have 4 walk directions drawn it's not too noticable.

[Radiant]

Does anyone know the shortest & longest time a game has been in development for using AGS?

Well, 6-day Assassin was actually created in six days. And my guess is that the various Snail Quests were created in less than that, if you want to consider them true games rather than demos.
The longest completed game is probably AGDI's Quest for Glory II remake (which admittedly isn't completed yet but it will be soon). There are quite some games that have been in dev forever and ''will really be completed soon, honestly''.

[monkey0506]

Team Projects? Bah.

It's a bit off topic (and it's not exactly a record), but I'm still working on my GUI (after only 7 months).  I'm making a MI5 game (which is how this all ties in (MI3 has been mentioned)) and it will be a tribute to SOMI.

If you want some help, I'd be glad to offer assistance.  Yes, this program is exciting.  Don't feel deterred if you see the low-res graphics in the demo game.  You can get much higher-res if you want.

you may want to consider joining an existing team instead, just because creating an entire game on your own is a very large amount of work.

Bull.  I have my 97% authentic SOMI GUI 97% completed and it's only been 7 months!  I'm doing this project completely myself, and I've ripped graphics, produced code, written a work-around for AGS to make dialog options scrollable, and other things in 7 months by myself.  That is definitely an accomplishment to be proud of.*

* If you're wondering about this GUI I'm making that is "an accomplishment to be proud of, you first must realize that it is not an easy task to produce an authentic representation of a GUI used in making a game more than 10 years ago.  I have had to work around so many things you would not believe.  Other than the dialog workaround, I also had to workaround listbox displays for my save and load menus, coming up to a total of 5 GUIs for the two menus (1 menu each (2 GUIs), 1 data entry/display (textbox/label) each (2 GUIs), and 1 listbox to coverup the selected item to prevent the highlighted appearance (1 GUI)).  Just to name a couple of things I've had to work around.

Michael Rittenhouse

[Mark McGough]

@monkey0506
Your game sounds like an interesting project. When u say MI5, do u mean the secrete service or mission impossible?

So does anyone reckon these kind of games have the potential to compete comercially. Graphic adventure games have never been about cutting edge graphics anyway. And from what I've learn't cartoon quality visuals r easily possible. I'm sure there's a market for frustrated gamers who's graphics cards arn't up to scratch. And because games can be distributed online I feel like I'm gona become a millionaire!!!

[Scummbuddy]

MI = Monkey Island

[Mark McGough]

Right. I get it now. Monkey Island 5 sounds like a pretty neat thing to work on. This I gota c.

[Sewer Agent]

To get an amazing game done you will need to either spend a lot of time on your own making this game or get in a team (this is to sell games.). I have many possible stories for games and I want to start on building them but to do that I have to get around the task of building characters (which I despise!). Also I think that if I could get a team of experts together we could create a game with amazing graphics and a brilliant storyline and we could easily sell it. If anyone is interested in making a game with me then please PM me and we will get a forum up or try to use my clan one (probably won't happen as my clan members won't like there clan leader talking about things nothing to do with the clan in our forums lol!).

Also Monkey, I think you better check the copywrite on the Monkey Island name and see if they have already copywrited Monkey Island 5.

[Radiant]

Also Monkey, I think you better check the copywrite on the Monkey Island name and see if tehy have already copywrited Monkey Island 5.

The name 'Monkey Island' is a trademark of LucasArts, Inc. and all related concepts, characters and storylines are (as always automatically) covered by copyrights. Creating a game called Monkey Island 5 would be a matter of infringement, and LucasArts would be entirely within their rights to shut you down by court order (and in fact, they have done so on several times in the past, on similarly themed games). Caveat emptor.

[Sewer Agent]

See you should always check the copywrite before making a game under the name of another.

[monkey0506]

Also Monkey, I think you better check the copywrite on the Monkey Island name and see if tehy have already copywrited Monkey Island 5.

I'm not going to use the title "Monkey Island 5", but "The Tyrant of Monkey Island" does include that phrase "Monkey Island". Ã, I'm going to cover the copyrights in the credits. Ã, If LucasArts is really that concerned, I'll just have to redo all the game graphics and change the title and all character/location names. Ã, Not a big deal. :

To get an amazing game done you will need to either spend a lot of time on your own making this game or get in a team (this is to sell games.).

You don't need to be on a team to sell a game. Ã, As much time as some people have independently put into making their games, they could have easily sold them if they had wished. Ã, Teams make any project easier (as long as you don't get too many people wanting to help). Ã, Too many people result in trivial disputes over things that aren't really important to the game, and has often been known to result in the death of a project. Ã, I'd say 5 - 10 people would probably be the most you would ever want to have working on the same game at once (please realize I'm referring only to "amateur" games; commercial games, the workers get paid, and usually don't want to be kicked off of the project, so they tend to compromise more). Ã, But then, what do I know.

The name 'Monkey Island' is a trademark of LucasArts, Inc. and all related concepts, characters and storylines are (as always automatically) covered by copyrights. Creating a game called Monkey Island 5 would be a matter of infringement, and LucasArts would be entirely within their rights to shut you down by court order (and in fact, they have done so on several times in the past, on similarly themed games). Caveat emptor.

This is true, however:

1. Ã, LucasArts has not shut down a fan-project (to my knowledge) since FOMI (Fate of Monkey Island) 5(? possibly 4?).
2. Ã, I am, unlike so many before me going to include LucasArts and the SOMI team in the credits.
3. Ã, I have to go, but there is probably more...

[Mark McGough]

Yeah, I'd like to work on the graphics of the game & idea generation/plot development. Don't have much time now but when I finish my 2nd year at uni I'd really like to team up with some people. I'd like to work with people who are good at:

-scripting
-phtography
-lip syncing
-voice acting
-ideas
-2D animation
-perhaps 3d, with knowledge of those shaders to make 3D look 2D

Anyone interested? I could design a flash website where we could develop our ideas & create a following. & then over the summer I could actually contribute significantly.

Maybe we could sell the game & divide a lumpsum from a % of the profits. There shouldn't be any costs really apart from labour, since we don't need a publisher. Thank you lord for inventing of the interent.

[Sewer Agent]

I have a website (it's a clan website but still one!). I am also trying out a little flash (well more my designer is but I might use it as well.). I would like to make a game with one or two or even three more people (too many people means too many complicantions in the % of profits e.t.c.). I have ideas (which, knowing me, will change as time goes on and even when we are making the game.) and I would liek to make a game which would look good and play well. I think this could be a real hit. E-mail me on sewer_agent@ngdclan.com and we should start discussing this and if anyone else is interested please e-mail me as well (I also enjoy the whole scripting side of the game so I want to learn more into that so I coudl do that (possibly.).). Voices would be easy lol. So e-mail me about this and if anyone else would like to be involved then by all means e-mail me.

[Radiant]

I'm not going to use the title "Monkey Island 5", but "The Tyrant of Monkey Island" does include that phrase "Monkey Island".  I'm going to cover the copyrights in the credits.  If LucasArts is really that concerned, I'll just have to redo all the game graphics and change the title and all character/location names.  Not a big deal. :

That's not true - a mere change in names is not going to protect you against copyvio charges if you are still using characters similar to theirs (e.g. an incompetent pirate-wannabe who's married to the old love of a ghost pirate). Especially if they look similar (and if they didn't look similar, why are you intending to use the name Monkey Island to begin with?)

I am not saying that they will shut you down, but you should be aware of the legal implications of what you're doing.

1.  LucasArts has not shut down a fan-project (to my knowledge) since FOMI (Fate of Monkey Island) 5(? possibly 4?).

That's also because there haven't been any infringing fan projects that they care about. They seem not to mind Maniac and Zak projects, but will likely protect Monkey and Indy.

2.  I am, unlike so many before me going to include LucasArts and the SOMI team in the credits.

From a legal point of view, that is entirely irrelevant. These are lawyers we're talking about, and you think that 'being nice' will matter to them. It won't.

[Sewer Agent]

The thing with copywrite is to put yourself in the original game-makers point of view. If someone used the idea of your game. without your permission, how would you feel? I think mentioning them in the credits won't matter at all as you haven't asked their permission to use any of their characters, storylines or names they are not going to be pleased with you mentioning them in the credits. If someone did the same to you I don't think you would say "Oh well they mentioned my name in the credits so it must be alright.". I think you should really think about whether this game is a good idea.