I'm pretty new to the forums and I'm working on my first game. I'm a musician and I was just curious as to what kind of gear/equipment setup people use to compose music for AGS games. Any info as to process or gear would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks.
Cubase SL3
Finale 2000
EWQL Symphonic Orchestra Gold, Gold xp pro
EWQL Symphonic Choirs
Pianoteq v.2
Synthogy Ivory
Bela D. Media DIVA
Manybass
Manytone Upright bass
EWQL VApor
EWQL Adrenaline
Toontrack DFH superior
and various smaller libraries...
A simple P4 2.8 GHz, single core (3 1/2 years old actually), 2 GB RAM. Keyboard is Casio PX 110. Headphones are Sennheiser HD600.
That's all
For MIDI I'm still using Cakewalk 3.1 as I'm a retrospective person :p constantly developing my technique. On the rare occasions that I do not compose MIDI I use Cubase.
Good luck with your music!
Software:
Cool Edit Pro
Fruity Loops Studio 5
That and a Shure SM57 mic to record real instruments (guitars, bass mainly).
Renoise. Formerly I used SKALE tracker and before that Fast Tracker 2.
"Secrets" had music I made with Music 3000 on the ps2, and on-hold game "Limbo" has music made using Fruity Loops and a load of plug ins.
Quote from: Nikolas on Wed 10/10/2007 06:17:12
That's all
That's all?! You're a one man symphony orchestra!
For the record, I use:
Cubase LE (that came bundled with...).
...An Alesis Photon25.
Various VSTs and SoundFonts. All non-commercial.
Hooray!
Surprised nobody seems to use Reason. Great suite!
question from an ignorant person here: Are these programs easy in use? for example if I would get them (or atleast one) can I make music for my games then even though I have no musical experience?
You won't be able to make music without knowing how to do it. Well, you could hammer in random notes, but the product would most, most likely suck teh big one. It's like using Photoshop, it's a great tool, but somebody who has NO IDEA of art (how to shade, how shadows work, how to dither, how to outline etc.) won't be able to make good art with it.
You could buy Dance Ejay! Or you could just plug in a microphone and record an instrument, plug in a keyboard etc. :)
Ejay is not a proper composing program, its more like kindergarten toy. If you like to mess with loops, at least use Acid Pro, which is decent and very easy to leearn.
I actually still use acid pro, and I have a full recording studio running. It's a good way to learn to, if not WRITE, at least compose (well, throw together) music. But it's a fairly powerful tool if you spend enough time with it, and get enough third party plugins. They have a trial you can download from the site.
A suggestion (also a reference to my earlier post)... Propellerhead's Reason 3, together with its various plugins, is very difficult to beat as a composition and production program if one is to use MIDI surfaces as input devices.
The use of that, in conjunction with a powerful mixing and production suite like Steinberg's Cubase 3 or the latest version of Adobe Audition, really ups your chances of producing professional, studio-quality sound for your game.
-- Suggestion: electric guitarists - if you're going to record, my tried and tested best method is to sling a mic over the amp (most decent mics will work, since a guitar's frequency range will generally be captured effectively by anything from a Samson Q7 live mic to a Shure condenser); route said mic through a PA system and line out the PA into the computer. I strongly recommend against lining an amplifier out directly into your computer, as this will cause freq clips and will also produce a less true sound than the former method. Just a tidbit of info intended to help the six-stringers among us. --
EDIT
Here's a short piano riff loop I made entirely in Reason, using sampled sounds exclusively from the program's two sound banks.
...Simple Piano Riff Loop... (http://www.leighbrendonbarnes.com/ben/stuff/simplepianoriff.mp3)
You are most welcome to use it in any of your games, gratis, if you deem it worthy... only please tell me before you do so I can get a good play in when your completed game's online. ;)
SONAR is splendid.
If you have a playstation 2, then Music 3000 has a learning curve of sorts. When I first had that program, years ago, I'd use mostly pre-made loops for my songs. Where as the last time I used it to make an album, I just used pure samples of music in the program and composed my own tunes. It was quite flexible too, in the way that it advertised it could be used to make pop, dance, indie and rap music, and I made an industrial album. I then moved on to Fruity loops, made a crap album, then made a great album. (IMO obviously)
My brother (who has had no formal music training) uses Fruity Loops too, and he's encouraged me to try it out myself. The formally-trained me simply couldn't wrap my brain around it though. The one tune I did compose myself for my game was done in NoteWorthy Composer, in front of my piano, painstakingly typing it out note by note. So, I guess FruityLoops is supposedly easier for people with no musical theory knowledge, although I can't say for sure since I never got the hang of it.
I'm not a musician by any means so I can be forgiven for not having all this fancy software. I started getting to grips with Anvil Studio, a fairly simple, but useful MIDI composer, and I'm content to stick with that, when I get round to restarting my project(s).
I can make some passable tunes with it that won't destroy the gameplay, so that's good enough for me.
[Edit]
How are you getting on with The Marionette, Auriond? No pressure... ;)
I like NoteWorthy composer.
SilverTrumpet actually uses her nose for maxmimum melodic effect.
Now that's not nice. She can't help it that she's fallen ill now can she?
Although her [virus-induced] man-voice is rather melodic. :=
Quote from: m0ds on Fri 12/10/2007 02:44:45
SilverTrumpet actually uses her nose for maxmimum melodic effect.
Yes mods, don't make fun of the nasally ailing. :( ;D
Quote from: Bluesman Ben on Thu 11/10/2007 13:20:54
Surprised nobody seems to use Reason. Great suite!
I do. But the question was what do the
composers here use to compose music for their games :) I don't consider myself as a composer since I don't have any musical talent what so ever and am tone deaf (that's why my games music was so awful).
Quote from: Bluesman Ben on Thu 11/10/2007 20:59:06
A suggestion (also a reference to my earlier post)... Propellerhead's Reason 3, together with its various plugins, is very difficult to beat as a composition and production program if one is to use MIDI surfaces as input devices.
Depends on the style of music one does.
Generally cubase, Sonar, Logic, Pro tools are more oriented to orchestral music, and "film composers" (game composers as well), while Reason and Fruity loops is more oriented to loop based music, although I've heard amazing stuff from both programs.
Still I find Reason lacking greatly for my own personal needs and what I do.
I have to say that starting music can be rather... easier. I mean there are great tools out there, which with the click of a button you get ready made loops. Heck there are millions of FREE loops out there. I mean, putting 2 loops together could very well be music. So, yes, with the right tools you could do music, and I know plenty of people who don't actually know or read music, and yet write great music!
FruityLoops Studio 6
and for hardware,
Roland Edirol PC-50 MIDI keyboard.
Enough to rock.
I use Reason, occasionally ReWired through Audition. And I'm not going anywhere from it. Just hoping to get a keyboard soon to speed up my composing.
For making Midi I use Guitar Pro, since I'm a guitar player mainly.
I'd say that getting a keyboard rather slowed my music making down. Why? I'm too lazy to use it and trying something on MIDI keyboard and composing that something are two different things.
Yes, I wanted keyboard like hell. Before this, when trying out a melody (inventing it), I played it on pc keyboard, and this is - of course difficult and frustrating. And yes, MIDI keyboard makes melody tryout alot easier.
But hooking up the keyboard, playing, memorizing, re-entering everything with mouse to piano roll... well, it takes alot more time and kills inspiration.
Now, it takes super inspiration-filled day for me to plug the MIDI keyboard in at all. I must be in real creating rush to do that. Apart from these ultra rare days, it collects dust.
Quote from: InCreator on Fri 12/10/2007 18:44:39
But hooking up the keyboard, playing, memorizing, re-entering everything with mouse to piano roll... well, it takes alot more time and kills inspiration.
I thought the point was to play the melody directly to the software, so you don't need to enter anything with mouse to piano roll?
Quote from: InCreator on Fri 12/10/2007 18:44:39
But hooking up the keyboard, playing, memorizing, re-entering everything with mouse to piano roll... well, it takes alot more time and kills inspiration.
Huh? What program do you use? usually there is a record button ;) and you can edit the notes later manually.
Quote from: Nikolas on Fri 12/10/2007 10:15:01
Quote from: Bluesman Ben on Thu 11/10/2007 20:59:06
A suggestion (also a reference to my earlier post)... Propellerhead's Reason 3, together with its various plugins, is very difficult to beat as a composition and production program if one is to use MIDI surfaces as input devices.
Depends on the style of music one does.
Generally cubase, Sonar, Logic, Pro tools are more oriented to orchestral music, and "film composers" (game composers as well), while Reason and Fruity loops is more oriented to loop based music, although I've heard amazing stuff from both programs.
Still I find Reason lacking greatly for my own personal needs and what I do.
Yep, oh granted, Reason and FruityLoops generally can't be used as standalone programs.
Quote from: Bluesman Ben on Sun 14/10/2007 21:01:13
Yep, oh granted, Reason and FruityLoops generally can't be used as standalone programs.
Huh? Why would FL not be usable as "standalone" program? I don't quite get that part. Don't know about Reason, but FL can be used and comes with more than enough generators/filters/fx etc. to compose and program a complete song with good sounding instruments. Without plug-ins or anything.
The only things I've been using are Reason and my mouse and computer keyboard, unless I've needed second-exact timing in which case I've rewired it through Audition... I don't see what's not standalone in that.
Quote from: dkh on Sun 14/10/2007 21:48:36
Huh? Why would FL not be usable as "standalone" program? I don't quite get that part. Don't know about Reason, but FL can be used and comes with more than enough generators/filters/fx etc. to compose and program a complete song with good sounding instruments. Without plug-ins or anything.
Sure, to echo Nikolas, it depends on what kind of sound you're hoping to attain. Reason and FL are both great for simple loops, riffs and effects, etc (and obviously, Reason grows exponentially more powerful with extra ReFill patches), however, often, a program like Cubase is often necessary to enhance the composition process tenfold by enabling you to splice a file and put it back together again (a la Talk Talk's later, more ambient work), record instruments that are not keyboards or other such MIDI surfaces, and heck, even use a parametric EQ.
Allow me to rephrase, then... Reason and FruityLoops respectively are often not viable for complete score composition unless your will is to create tracks which conform to the programs' respective restrictions, or unless working with full recording suites is not to your liking. :)
Quote from: Bluesman Ben on Mon 15/10/2007 21:19:32
Quote from: dkh on Sun 14/10/2007 21:48:36
Huh? Why would FL not be usable as "standalone" program? I don't quite get that part. Don't know about Reason, but FL can be used and comes with more than enough generators/filters/fx etc. to compose and program a complete song with good sounding instruments. Without plug-ins or anything.
Sure, to echo Nikolas, it depends on what kind of sound you're hoping to attain. Reason and FL are both great for simple loops, riffs and effects, etc (and obviously, Reason grows exponentially more powerful with extra ReFill patches), however, often, a program like Cubase is often necessary to enhance the composition process tenfold by enabling you to splice a file and put it back together again (a la Talk Talk's later, more ambient work), record instruments that are not keyboards or other such MIDI surfaces, and heck, even use a parametric EQ.
Allow me to rephrase, then... Reason and FruityLoops respectively are often not viable for complete score composition unless your will is to create tracks which conform to the programs' respective restrictions, or unless working with full recording suites is not to your liking. :)
Check newer versions then, or something (again, I can only speak for FL). It HAS instruments "that are not keyboards/MIDI" and it has EQs in all sizes and varieties.
And what do you mean with "splicing a file"? Slicing a recorded track? That's all possible.
General music, game or non-game related, I use Cubase LE (I'm still in the process of learning how to use it, sort of), which came bundled with my Lexicon Alpha unit.
If I just want to slap together a simple midi, I use Power Tab Editor (http://www.power-tab.net/). It is, for all intents and purposes, a tablature editor for guitar or bass. But it has a feature that allows you to play a midi of the song you've tabbed out, so you can see how it sounds. You can also change the sound of the instrument during playback to, say, a piano or koto etc, and then export the midi itself. It does take a little bit of general music knowledge, such as notes, rests, rhythm slashes, etc.
Quote from: dkh on Mon 15/10/2007 21:35:08
Check newer versions then, or something (again, I can only speak for FL). It HAS instruments "that are not keyboards/MIDI" and it has EQs in all sizes and varieties.
And what do you mean with "splicing a file"? Slicing a recorded track? That's all possible.
Aha, cool, I shall... seems functionality's improved a lot since the last time I used FL. Thanks for the heads up!
Oh, boy - this all sounds so complicated! I'd love to try out composing in MIDI but a lot of the programs mentioned above are so expensive and I'm a broke student (I don't suppose there are any free ones out there?) I'm really clueless about music software (women and technology, eh? :D)
I play solo piano and guitar which I record to MP3/Wav with a Samson C01U Studio Condenser mic. It's good for acoustic recording, but I feel rather archaic using only this method. :-\ Then again, some people don't mind it - it creates a simple, raw sort of feel (think the About A Boy soundtrack) or in minor keys, a somewhat chilling effect. Sometimes less is more, right? ???
I'd really like to hear anyone's opinion on this or if anyone else records this way...
Hi!
I would actually LOVE to record a real piano, for a change. But at that point, I would need something rather good in recording equipement which I don't have, and a decent piano. The other problem would be that the piano would need to be tuned perfectly for any recording, otherwise I wouldn't be able to mix it with any samples (which are recorded "perfectly" (with various errors in pitches and intonations though))
About your question:
I can suggest you try www.reaper.fm . It's shareware, which equals free for you a student. If you have a tiny bit of money with 99$ you can get 4.5 GB of orchestral samples from http://www.kirkhunterstudios.com/ , which I can't say it's really expensive.
For free stuff you can head off to www.kvraudio.com, make sure you register, cause it's free and will not create problems with traffic, and pick up the various weird free stuff around.
Various other people have done some weird, and other more successful stuff.
http://www.cgempire.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2431 for free Kontakt2 (but also the wav files) of various weird stuff, and prepared piano, etc.
www.gregjazz.com, our Greg has done some excellent recordings and samples for various stuff.
The above links should keep you occupied and happy for many months (until you've searched everything that is). After that and when you surpass that, you might need to spend a little more, but nothing too fancy. :)
Hope it helps, and welcome again
Nikolas
Sonar 7 PE just arrived in the mail. ;D
OHOHOHOHOHOH!
Tell us! review it! Please! (I plan on asking for sponsorship actually)
It looks really sleak and nice and awesome and all that!
COME ON! TELL US!
a couple of mics, some voices, some guitars, violins, keyboards, base, an m-audio card, nuendo.
Reason rewired into Adobe Audition makes a perfect suite; Audition can record any real instruments, with the Reason tracks played simultanously automatically, and should you need to EQ anything it's all in Audition. As for splicing, just exporting the track to Audition from Reason and doing whatever you want with it there. It's different, sure, but as efficient as anything.
The new version of Audition looks pretty cool from what I've seen. A friend of mine uses it at his home studio, and although the older version was behind in its capabilities, this new version gets it in the ballpark.
@Nikolas: Yeah, Sonar is awesome! I'm still getting around to customizing the interface to best suit myself. I feel like I'm barely scratching the surface of its capabilities though. Yesterday I just started messing around with the Sonar ACT feature, which lets me intelligently map knobs on my MIDI controller to controls on VSTis and stuff. Very handy!
Most of the VSTis that come with it aren't that amazing. Mostly bundled light versions of stuff, but the included effects are REALLY nice.
Hmmm...
Can anyone give their opinion on Sibelius, pleasy-please?
What exactly are you looking for Rui?
I'm not a Sibelius user, but could say a few words I think...
First of, Sibelius (and Finale, and Notion) are all notation programs, and not sequencers. Sure you can sequence a tune, and make it sound pretty swell, but I don't think they handle loops, etc, or audio (none of them).
So sibelius (and finale, not so much notion) are a perfect choice for someone who would like to make scores. If you're into that, it's a matter of opinion then. Both, Sib and fin have their strengths and weaknesses, so just download the trial versions (I know that Finale has, but not sure about sibelius) and see which one feels better.
Only very recently Sibelius added VST support (which means that you can use whatever "instrument" you want with it), but it appears that there are still a few bugs floating around, and the updates have not fixed them. (<-not 100% sure here! Check elsewhere as well)
In all, in order to say more, I need to know what you want it for. Otherwise, I'm not sure where to concetrate really...
Ah. Thanks, didn't know the difference. Notation's what I want, so I'm using the correct tool. Thanks!
I use Sibelius to create MIDI files, and then generally I use Audacity to record the MIDI playback into an OGG, which I then use in my games. This is not the best approach. Sometimes I then use Audacity to manipulate the cruddy MIDI sounds. For example, everything but the sound effects in Torture-Escape (http://www.geocities.com/myrrwyn/Erenan_-_Torture-Escape.ogg) was created in this fashion. The sound effects were, of course, either free sounds found on the Internet or sounds that I recorded myself with a crappy ten dollar computer microphone.