(http://www.barnettcollege.com/xmas_media/secret_reveal.gif)
GOOD NEWS ADVENTURERS!Paul
(subspark) at Screen 7 with the generous help of JJS and his wonderful PSP AGS Runtime, has ported the latest build of Indiana Jones and the Fountain of Youth to Sony's handheld device.
Enjoy the entire introduction sequence for the first time running natively on the PSP 3000 hardware.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7pFq4O3l_s (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7pFq4O3l_s)
EASTER FIGHTER RELEASED!We at Screen 7 are also proud to remind you of our 2011 new year's release, version 1.2 of the memorable Fountain of Youth Demo.
Along with some revised graphics, its most important feature is a hidden easter-egg that served to reveal a much greater release would arrive for Easter!
May we at Screen 7 proudly present:
The Indiana Jones Easter Arcade Beat-em-up!
(http://www.shuugouteki.net/paul/Development/FOY/Banner.png)
- Challenge your friends in a 2 player match!
- Choose between two awesome characters. Indy and Heinrich!
Get your fighting gear on, folks and step into the early stages of the full game's smack-out fighting system!
Grab yourself a pair of boxing gloves and take our your Post-Easter aggression over at the Extras (http://www.barnettcollege.com/screensaver.htm) section now!
If your not into knocking brain cells out so much, and more into preserving them, Screen 7 invites you to locate the hidden easter egg in our New Year's special edition of the Indiana Jones and the Fountain of Youth Demo.
(http://www.barnettcollege.com/pix/PostOffice.gif) (http://www.barnettcollege.com/pix/screenshot05.jpg) (http://www.barnettcollege.com/pix/screenshot07.jpg)
Cheers,
Paul.
New Year Special Edition?
Ooooooh, LOVELY! ;D
*downloads*
Ooh - what a beautiful new-years-gift! :D
Thanks a lot (downloading ;D)!
... and best whishes for 2011
Oh goody!
Downloading thanks!
Oooh! Lovely!
NICE!
I really liked the old demo and I was disappointed about the lack of news about the game, but caught some interest again when I saw FoY in your Signature.. and now this!
Can't wait to see what changed and I really like the screenies so far. Thanks for this gift. :)
Small update in the top post, folks... :)
Thank you Screen 7! I will certainly have a play, if only to see that ending again! Or has that changed? :=
Easter egg is a great idea.
I think there are more demos for this game than any other game, ever!
P.S. Indiana Jones and the Fountain of Demos is awesome ^_^.
That's totally a blast from nowhere!! :D Way to go people!!
My stupid pc is having issues using AGS (Its not an AGS issue. Something happened to my pc today). So I haven't had the time to download the game. Whats the easter egg if someone could post it in spoiler quotes?
I've PM'ed you the secret information, Joseph. Everybody else... go hunting for it! ;)
Cheers.
I've just finished the demo. It's great!
I'm sure that "Indiana Jones and the Fountain of Youth" you'll be an awesome game - and I'm anxious for the full version of it! :D
Congratulations, Screen 7 team!
Thanks for the kind words! Thanks for taking a look..a re-look...at our demo. Oceanspirit Dennis and the Fountain of Calin Leafshade.
There are great things to come :)
And by then I'll have a grey beard and be rotoscoped in as an NPC and it'll be awesome :=
PS Thanks to Paul for overseeing all this, and letting me be a big fat producer man sitting in a spinny chair doing FA
(http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRWCfHRMDdwNv1lmB829Ak3at-8ZL05kArZOUy_uhqGijeEeLiDGA)
"Thumbs up" is an epic Google image search!! I recommend it
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_ZsFQ2SifuyI/Sd10r-B-YuI/AAAAAAAAAHI/4BqX1sdsGag/s400/thumbsUp.jpg)(http://www.hawkhost.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/thumbsupag3.jpg)(http://tiny.abstractdynamics.org/archives/c%20tiger%20thumbs%20up%20cut%20out.jpg)(http://www.friedmanarchives.com/China/Web/Chapter23/4%20Thumbs%20Up%204x6%2072%20dpi.jpg)(http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQSM98WKcSb6riRu_SokNWbcoBF_2EPb_AiQBVFELxVfQd3YS68)(http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://confessionsofamuslimmommaholic.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/susan-boyle-thumbs-up.jpg&imgrefurl=http://blog.bedfordcheeseshop.com/fartisan/&usg=__t4qR48tt14TPY7tpq0Xu7EDzreo=&h=400&w=567&sz=34&hl=en&start=78&sig2=H7jnZNy1KWiBLC5ZV7v85g&zoom=1bnid=J2jW8vZjxzHByM:bnh=154bnw=196&ei=htwjTby5EMrJ4gbdvpjqCQ&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dthumbs%2Bup%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26biw%3D1280%26bih%3D834%26tbs%3Disch:10%2C2394&um=1&itbs=1&iact=hc&vpx=489&vpy=223&dur=512&hovh=188&hovw=267x=139y=82&oei=sdsjTdmTHMyIhQey7N23Dg&esq=4&page=4&ndsp=24&ved=1t:429are:14,s:78&biw=1280&bih=834)(http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS5DyqznCrbf-bogIXLz6sNAgqE_bX3QIxJQdeS9vkXxbISvJD9)(http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTMkri8nzCwXq8fGWdcIR69NBFkb_G3wBQKrxhhGyBI8rTRH7TEkQ)(http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRaumeWivlrwHDbAPdjNA2PpsJqXc0yvkoa_WxczKE5JvH2Cqh0)
PS saying foy is better than FoA is a dangerous game. FoA will always be better, it was the original ;)
We're on the front of PC Gamer (dot com) - thank you peoples!
So... just a roughly estimated guess... how far is the actual game? Like 20% or more like 70%?
wow! those screens are sweeetttt!!
QuoteSo... just a roughly estimated guess... how far is the actual game? Like 20% or more like 70%?
No comment. ;) But further along than one would expect!
Cheers,
Paul.
Quote from: subspark on Wed 05/01/2011 22:01:00
QuoteSo... just a roughly estimated guess... how far is the actual game? Like 20% or more like 70%?
No comment. ;) But further along than one would expect!
Cheers,
Paul.
Well... then.... GOOD, I guess... :)
Quote from: subspark on Wed 05/01/2011 22:01:00
QuoteSo... just a roughly estimated guess... how far is the actual game? Like 20% or more like 70%?
No comment. ;) But further along than one would expect!
Cheers,
Paul.
Something like 85% then!? Sweet! :)
Anyway, I'm patiently waiting for you to finish and cherishing each new update or surprise Indy mini-game (like Temple of Spheres).
QuoteAnyway, I'm patiently waiting for you to finish and cherishing each new update or surprise Indy mini-game (like Temple of Spheres).
Thats the spirit! Check Barnett College for a small news update. More news to follow soon. :D
Cheers,
Paul.
First of all, I'm too eagerly awaiting for another mini-game (actually, I'm more than excited whenever a new Indy fangame comes out - too few of them got finished unfortunately :-X )
As a bit of offtopic, does anyone know wether there are any news for the Indiana Jones and the crown of king solomon project? The site has vanished and the last time I heard about Calle, he said the game was almost finished. It'd be such a pity to lose yet another fangame. :-\
EDIT: holy Christ, the site is back online! :o
Maybe there's hope after all!
Quote from: cacaro on Sun 09/01/2011 16:28:21
EDIT: holy Christ, the site is back online! :o
Maybe there's hope after all!
In 2009 Calle said they where hoping yo release the game in a few months.
Any updates on this? Sorry for going out of topic. :-*
Just to be the worst kind of pedant: in those days Royal Mail was called "General Post Office" :P
Finished the demo 1.2, but was unable to find that secret easter egg. Don't know where to search for it... demo is really HUGE. Can someone e-mail me, send (or PM) me any useful clues about this secret, please?
Hi Tonywhite84 - try searching the island map a wee bit more :=
Andrew - only an old man McCormack could be so pedantic as you!
Hopefully subsy will update this thread -
You can now check out an arcade fighter example (one of two methods of fighting in upcoming FoY, if you don't include avoiding fights!) here:
http://www.barnettcollege.com/fighterspecial.htm
Note: It's 2 player. Single players may struggle!
Quote from: Mods on Tue 26/04/2011 16:12:51
Hopefully subsy will update this thread -
You can now check out an arcade fighter example (one of two methods of fighting in upcoming FoY, if you don't include avoiding fights!) here:
http://www.barnettcollege.com/fighterspecial.htm
Doesn't load. :(
Quote from: Ascovel on Tue 26/04/2011 16:36:34
Quote from: Mods on Tue 26/04/2011 16:12:51
Hopefully subsy will update this thread -
You can now check out an arcade fighter example (one of two methods of fighting in upcoming FoY, if you don't include avoiding fights!) here:
http://www.barnettcollege.com/fighterspecial.htm
Doesn't load. :(
Try a different browser perhaps sir? It's definitely all there ready and waiting :)
Or do you mean the exe installer?
Quote from: Mods on Tue 26/04/2011 16:41:48
Quote from: Ascovel on Tue 26/04/2011 16:36:34
Quote from: Mods on Tue 26/04/2011 16:12:51
Hopefully subsy will update this thread -
You can now check out an arcade fighter example (one of two methods of fighting in upcoming FoY, if you don't include avoiding fights!) here:
http://www.barnettcollege.com/fighterspecial.htm
Doesn't load. :(
After a great many Ctrl+F5 and a long wait the page finally loaded. :)
I'll write about my exe experiences soon.
Cool stuff. Will this be released as a full 2-player fighting game with more characters and combos, or is it simply to show off how the fighting will work in the main game?
I hope that there is some kind of mini-game, where Indy goes to the arcades (or the 1939 equivalent :-\) and challenges folks to a game inside a game.
Also, I'd love to see this used with the same tech behind the AGS awards, then we could fight each other online. It must be do-able?
Nice idea Stu! It's worth us mulling over, but from now, it really is full focus on the full game. No more mini-games (bar Saints) and no more tech demos, just solid, outright work on the full game. But if spare time allows it, I agree, a multiplayer version using the chat module would be absolutely brilliant :)
Love the main menu music.
The fighting itself is fun too - the graphics and animations in particular, although Indy jumps in a bit kangaroo-goofy way.
Anyway, anyway, combat is cool and all, but I want you to release a new Indy adventure game now. Can be even Indiana Spheres 2. Please?
QuoteCan be even Indiana Spheres 2. Please?
Hehe, consider Spheres 2 to be Passage of Saints dude, it's a lot longer than Spheres. Releasing it in November. No point releasing an Xmas game in Summer :P Thanks for the comments though! Glad you got it working.
First Post updated!
Happy Easter AGSers!
Paul.
Just played it, and it's pretty cool. I like what I see, as I said before, the new Indy sprite is just awesome.
And the whole idea of an arcade fighting game is pretty cool. This will be implemented in the game and the other player will be computer controlled or this is just a minigame for 2 players?
Awesome! ;D
Quote from: Ascovel on Tue 26/04/2011 20:10:20
Love the main menu music.
Same here, what is it off? :P.
Quote from: Peder Johnsen on Thu 28/04/2011 02:12:05
Awesome! ;D
Quote from: Ascovel on Tue 26/04/2011 20:10:20
Love the main menu music.
Same here, what is it off? :P.
I'm guessing Mr Mods got inspired by a certain tune from The Last Crusade and made something with similar feel.
I believe Mr Mods is not the composer hence why I asked what it is off (he is only credited for the installer music).
Oh my, Karatiana Jones and the Temple of Kombat...
I really don't know what to think of this, to be honest. Indy leaping about like a frog, doing spin kicks like Bruce Lee? Is this a late April Fools, by chance? ???
You already had a functional combat model in the game, but you diverted time to develop this instead? It's just pretty surreal.
If you're serious about announcers and real time combat like this, a good start would be to scrap the jumping mechanic altogether as it doesn't really DO anything anyway, and then focus on attacks that actually make sense for Indy like using his whip/gun instead of all the kicky-face stuff that he'd never do. Maybe release this as a separate thing entirely from FoY as it just looks and feels so out of place.
I dunno, I've always been a pretty strong supporter of this project but this just seems really out of place compared to the other wonderful work you guys have put into the game.
And the menu music is from The Goonies.
Quote from: ProgZmax on Thu 28/04/2011 15:08:24
Oh my, Karatiana Jones and the Temple of Kombat...
I really don't know what to think of this, to be honest. Indy leaping about like a frog, doing spin kicks like Bruce Lee? Is this a late April Fools, by chance? ???
You already had a functional combat model in the game, but you diverted time to develop this instead? It's just pretty surreal.
If you're serious about announcers and real time combat like this, a good start would be to scrap the jumping mechanic altogether as it doesn't really DO anything anyway, and then focus on attacks that actually make sense for Indy like using his whip/gun instead of all the kicky-face stuff that he'd never do. Maybe release this as a separate thing entirely from FoY as it just looks and feels so out of place.
I dunno, I've always been a pretty strong supporter of this project but this just seems really out of place compared to the other wonderful work you guys have put into the game.
I completely agree. I've been following this project for a few years now. This seems really out of place.
I disagree with you two. That's exactly what I expect from a remake and I always hated the old SCUMM punching engine.
Okay, the jumping height is pretty high and the demo is unplayable on my keyboard (MS Ergonomic 4000), but anyway in the final game this minigame is simply terrific.
PS. please consider configurable keys ;)
QuoteI completely agree. I've been following this project for a few years now. This seems really out of place.
My opinion also. I envision Indy fighting sequences to have the sobriety of the first Prince of Persia fighting sequences, minus the sword, plus combat pragmatism.
Take the old fighting sequence from the demo, slow down the punching animations to reduce commands spamming, and introduce a slightly simplified version of the fighting sequences from The Last Crusade (punch high, punch low, block high, block low, step back, step forward.)
Keep the cheap tricks, it's an awesome idea and you should add more:
Sand in eyes when you're close to the enemy (Enemy is temporary unable to block)
Tackle when you're away from him (Push enemy some step back)
Grab improvised weapon if there is one close to you (Extra damage and/or range)
Etc.
Some enemies could be immune to certain cheap tricks, some enemies could use cheap tricks of their own... Environmental hazards during fights would be nice too, remember the satisfaction you got when you pushed a tough enemy off a ledge or into a trap in Prince of Persia.
If you can re-create the Last Crusade fighting engine, with a simplified high/low instead of high/mid/low, and spice it up with all this stuff, I think figuring out how to defeat nazi in combat will be just as fun as figuring out how to bluff your way past them.
Guys, guys, please actually read the info you find in this thread and on the download page (especially before announcing that you aren't looking forward to the game at all anymore because of this Easter release).
When you play the full FoY game, you will be able to avoid any fighting at all and in case you do end up in a brawl you can choose between the old SCUMM combat (which is exactly the same you had in your fight versus the Barrier Guard in the FoY demo) and this arcade mode (not with announcers obviously - but with high jumps, punches, kicks, blocking, ducking, combos and so on).The arcade combat is making it into the game for the people that like a little more to fighting than clicking in a simple pattern and I think it does that nicely. I know it seems rather boring unless played by two actual people, preferrably with a gamepad connected, in which case it actually is a balanced and fun game much like Street Fighter II or Tekken III for instance. If that isn't your cup of tea, no problem. Ignore the Easter special and choose the classic SCUMM combat mode in the full FoY and you'll never see it again.
Quote from: ProgZmax on Thu 28/04/2011 15:08:24
You already had a functional combat model in the game, but you diverted time to develop this instead? It's just pretty surreal.
We're on our 12th year of development.
Quote from: ProgZmax on Thu 28/04/2011 15:08:24
If you're serious about announcers and real time combat like this, a good start would be to scrap the jumping mechanic altogether as it doesn't really DO anything anyway, and then focus on attacks that actually make sense for Indy like using his whip/gun instead of all the kicky-face stuff that he'd never do.
How much have you played the game? Have you tested it against other people? We have and jumping does a LOT in the hands of a skillful player. Not to mention, there will be air attacks available as well. Whips and guns will probably be available as a special combo.
I read all the info and I stand by everything I said 100%, including the jumping which just looks silly.
Well, then don't choose that mode. Why the negativity? We do what we want to do and it's been that way forever. There are some SCUMM hardcore fans and there are people who have more open minds about how a possible Indy FoA follow-up should look like, we cater to both.
Before this turns hostile, I just want to point out that the developers are making the right choice - by giving the player the choice. I don't personally like the arcade setup, but I'm sure others do.
The jumping Indy sprite it's kind of odd. Maybe if he jumped in the same way Heinrich does, it's more natural.
Quote from: ProgZmax on Thu 28/04/2011 15:08:24
You already had a functional combat model in the game, but you diverted time to develop this instead? It's just pretty surreal.
Not quite - development of the full game has not been halted or resources been diverted for 'this'.
Dear folks, we appreciate and thank you your feedback. Thanks for sharing your thoughts. To put some concern to rest, this Fighter is released as a public Beta and was effectively developed within just under a couple of months. The full game is indeed powering on at near maximum capacity - we have more than one programmer, artist and animator and Screen 7 is producing several games at once.
Some additional information for your consideration:A) In order to get this out into public hands for an Easter release, the members behind the fighter had to work around the limited resources while other team members were devoted to the FOY (full game) and an exciting commercial title
(TBA).
B) Because this is a Beta, it is not going to be as polished as any of the final releases we have produced. This is our first beta and we decided to invite our community to play it, enjoy it, dislike it, but most importantly, offer constructive and critical feedback so that we can improve the fighter largely to popular demand. While this release is a bit of fun and to be taken lightheartedly, the core of the system an extremely complex set of instructions and a monumental task that our wonderful principle programmer, Jan has taken head on! This slightly alternative public beta serves as a practical testing ground we deem critical to ensure a balanced arcade mode that attracts a positive reception between players of multiple preferences.
So again folks, thank you for your feedback so far. We encourage you to continue to offer helpful feedback like this on the FOY forums or in the appropriate channel here on the AGS forums. We value our community and gathering player feedback from critical thinkers like you folks is a favorable way for us to pick your brains on what's important and what you're likely to expect from an arcade mode in our full game.
Of course, as we move through the development stages of this testing ground, we will continue to improve the content in the game ( including the silly looking frog leap := ).
When we have enough of the system ready to transfer into the full production, the arcade will remain as a mini-game extra on the FOY site and will continue to grow on its own trajectory.
Some of the things you wont see transfered into the full game include:- The main menu,
- The announcer
- The retrotypical "WIN" / "FIGHT" graphics
- Player/opponent selection
- Multiplayer
The next big update for the FOY Fighter is expected to introduce a few exciting new features. These will include:
- Singleplayer AI - ( this remains one of the more challenging of features to develop )
- Revision of sprites and animations
- Air kick & air punch
- Multiplay characters
- Improved performance
- Several alternate arenas
- And much more!
The remaining features from the Easter beta will be massaged deep into our full production.
We invite the AGS community to help us make it a better game!
Sincerely,
Paul.
Will you do the same for the SCUMM mode, with a demo to showcase how it will play in the full game so we can help you finetune it? I ask because I found the SCUMM mode in the v1.2 demo unbalanced and easy with the right mouse button that blocks every punch.
BTW, giving us the choice between both modes is a real cool move!
Quote from: blueskirt on Fri 29/04/2011 16:04:32
Will you do the same for the SCUMM mode, with a demo to showcase how it will play in the full game so we can help you finetune it? I ask because I found the SCUMM mode in the v1.2 demo unbalanced and easy with the right mouse button that blocks every punch.
BTW, giving us the choice between both modes is a real cool move!
Thanks blueskirt! That's not a bad idea after all and I agree that the demo fight in the demo, albeit a lot of people (more than I thought apparently) really loved the way it worked, wasn't much of a challenge in any way. That was, as I said, one of the reasons to make it a bit more exciting and give it some more depth that the player can choose to make a part of hers or his FoY experience (or not!) at will.
The demo fighting did reflect the SCUMM combat system very closely, however, so I'm sure the aforementioned SCUMM FoA purists would be very upset if we ended up changing much about the classic fighting mode in FoY... As a sidenote, I have to admit I always thought that fights in SCUMM sucked incredibly hard (about the only thing that did) - so, any ideas in particular? Maybe we could get away with just changing the blocking functionality? Maybe you can block high, mid and low and have to choose the right section in order to block (then turn down the animation speed so you can, if you are quick, actually react in time)? I will also have to play the FoA fights again for reference..
Quote from: dkh on Fri 29/04/2011 16:26:51
The demo fighting did reflect the SCUMM combat system very closely, however, so I'm sure the aforementioned SCUMM FoA purists would be very upset if we ended up changing much about the classic fighting mode in FoY... As a sidenote, I have to admit I always thought that fights in SCUMM sucked incredibly hard (about the only thing that did) - so, any ideas in particular? Maybe we could get away with just changing the blocking functionality? Maybe you can block high, mid and low and have to choose the right section in order to block (then turn down the animation speed so you can, if you are quick, actually react in time)? I will also have to play the FoA fights again for reference..
Oh stop worrying so much about FoA purists, or I'll think you're building some sort of monument to FoA. It's low res, it's Indy and it's an adventure game - that's enough. The rest I want to be your version of Indiana Jones and as fresh an experience as possible.
I must say I really liked it! The animations are great, and frankly an adventure game that features an arcade style fighter as mini-game is brilliant if you'd ask me!
At this time it is still a bit quirky but that is what I would have expected from a beta.
Points of interest might be: The range of the attacks is a bit small, you might want to exaggerate the punches and kicks a bit by stretching the arms and legs. That's how Street fighter does it anyways. :) Jumping in with a attack is not yet possible, but that would be nice. I couldn't test it really well since I need someone to play it with me, but is crouching and backing up also blocking?
I know how difficult they are to program (I'm working on a fighter myself) and how much time the animations would cost but will there be any command normals, specials, grabs and combos in the future? Indy could use his whip, and you could recycle the cheap tricks.
Oh well you did a great job so far! Btw, I played it with a game-pad, I guess on a keyboard it's a bit uncomfortable.
edit:Quote from: AscovelOh stop worrying so much about FoA purists
hah, I consider myself a purist but this somehow doesn't put me off.
I am very surprised that ProgZmax's comment receives so much hostility. Didn't I just read an interview on the AGS blog where someone praised the honesty of the AGSers? So this is probably the first time I read someone NOT posting sugar-sweet praises about the Fountain of Indy Demos and he immediately gets shot down?
I am not a fan of this easter egg/special either. It totally feels out of place, the jumping does look silly - bottom line it's not what I like to see in an Indiana Jones adventure game that is meant to be in the tradition of the previous official titles. So should I not state my opinion if that's what it is? Is this thread for praises only?
To my mind, the fact that such a thing is included in the game degrades the product - regardless of whether you can choose to circumvent it (you'll have to know it's there in order to avoid it). That's my opinion, Zmax's and a few others and it's entirely up to Screen7 to make of it whatever they will. But if we can't have such discussions here then the announcements should be kept to a website only.
[/rant for freedom of speech]
@Ascovel and Wyz: Thanks for the feedback. We DO worry about the FoA purists because we, in a way, are too. But we, as a team, we're able to say that we simply want to make FoY fun for all sides and types of players. Wyz, agreed on all points pretty much, there will be more attacks including special combos and such later, animations will be reworked and so on. This is a simple holiday special to give the people waiting for the release something fresh and new.
Quote from: cianty on Fri 29/04/2011 16:57:16
I am very surprised that ProgZmax's comment receives so much hostility. Didn't I just read an interview on the AGS blog where someone praised the honesty of the AGSers? So this is probably the first time I read someone NOT posting sugar-sweet praises about the Fountain of Indy Demos and he immediately gets shot down?
His comments didn't receive hostility. Where exactly was he 'shot down'? If at all, his posts were filled with some degree of negativity - undeservedly comparing our hard work to an April fools joke for example. The rest was simply misinformed due to not reading/understanding that this combat mode will only be an option in the game, not a necessity. What honesty has to do with anything I don't know. We are always looking for constructive criticism and have a past of dealing well with it.
Quote from: cianty on Fri 29/04/2011 16:57:16
I am not a fan of this easter egg/special either. It totally feels out of place, the jumping does look silly - bottom line it's not what I like to see in an Indiana Jones adventure game that is meant to be in the tradition of the previous official titles. So should I not state my opinion if that's what it is? Is this thread for praises only?
To my mind, the fact that such a thing is included in the game degrades the product - regardless of whether you can choose to circumvent it (you'll have to know it's there in order to avoid it). That's my opinion, Zmax's and a few others and it's entirely up to Screen7 to make of it whatever they will. But if we can't have such discussions here then the announcements should be kept to a website only.
[/rant for freedom of speech]
If you have an option to have your fights be arcade or classic style, you choose the one you like and you will never even see the other one in the game, the mere fact that it exists somewhere degrades the game? I honestly didn't expect anybody to seriously share this (ridiculous, in my opinion) sentiment. We do everything to satisfy you people by offering two different fighting mechanics and now this isn't enough? It's a little frustrating you have to understand. :p
Please don't pretend like you are defending freedom of speech (thus implying we are in fact only looking for positive feedback), that is not the truth at all. I made good and valid points (amongst the other FoY staff that posted) and dismantled the points ProgZMax and you have made. In case you don't want this game mode in the game AT ALL (even though you only need to not choose it at some point and then are free to forget about it entirely), then FoY might not be for you I'm afraid.
Where did you exactly get the impression from that criticism is not appreciated? I for one welcome it, and I think we can only make a better game if we listen to players - the ones that like our work and the ones that have issues with it.
I really don't see the hostility. ???
Alright alright, maybe I did get it wrong. If so, I apologize. Call me The Wrong Man. :)
On one hand you refer to this as an April fools joke, which shouldn't be taken seriously, and on the other it's basically a sneak peek of an upcoming feature. I don't think the first aspect can be used as a reply to expressing dislike of the second.
About this aspect: "offering two different fighting mechanics and now this isn't enough" - Now this is my personal opinion but I do have an uncomfortable feeling knowing that there is something in the game which feels out of place - even if I don't have to "use" it. It affects my overall feeling about the game. Maybe I am the only person who feels that way, or at least part of a small minority, while the rest is far less picky. What I meant to convey is that to me additional features don't necessarily upgrade the product, even if I can avoid or ignore them in-game.
No worries, cianty. :D
Unfortunately, you have misunderstood us again - this is not an April Fools joke. ProgZMax brought that up in his original post in this thread by comparing our efforts to a joke game made to, I guess, troll people on the day. This is a serious beta release (that happened to be released on Easter, 3 weeks later) that shows an early version of the mechanics of one way you can play the fights in FoY. We have nowhere called it an April Fools joke release or have used that as a means to 'defend' against (constructive) criticism anywhere.
If the mere fact that the arcade fights are one of two possible selections is in the game really bothers you, which you have re-stated, then there isn't much we can do to help you (don't mean to offend you here, everybody has their own taste - the logic behind it still irritates me a bit but that's fine). In that case, I hope you give it a try anyways once it is released!
Quote from: dkh on Fri 29/04/2011 18:45:30
No worries, cianty. :D
Unfortunately, you have misunderstood us again - this is not an April Fools joke. ProgZMax brought that up in his original post in this thread by comparing our efforts to a joke game made to, I guess, troll people on the day. This is a serious beta release (that happened to be released on Easter, 3 weeks later) that shows an early version of the mechanics of one way you can play the fights in FoY. We have nowhere called it an April Fools joke release or have used that as a means to 'defend' against (constructive) criticism anywhere.
Ah, yes. I see! Sorry about that.
Quote from: dkh on Fri 29/04/2011 18:45:30
If the mere fact that the arcade fights are one of two possible selections is in the game really bothers you, which you have re-stated, then there isn't much we can do to help you (don't mean to offend you here, everybody has their own taste - the logic behind it still irritates me a bit but that's fine). In that case, I hope you give it a try anyways once it is released!
Oh, of course I still do look forward to the final product and will surely give it a try. After playing the FOY demo I am very positive that it will not disappoint me at all. Maybe even the arcade mode will grow on once the Mortal Kombat disguise is gone and the immersion sets in.
I also see how as a devolper you always want to try new and different things instead of repeating the same old concepts. How boring would the game be without evolution and the desire to try different things. I definately didn't mean to discourage such endeavours at all. Gah, I guess you can call me a difficult customer... :-\
By the way, are there any infos regarding the other current Screen7 projects?
Always good to see a new Indy release. :)
Indiana Jones is awesome!
(Just bumping this thread because I can't stand some random Icey fiasco being more discussed than Indy.)
The whole arcade thing is a cool Idea and a nice addition. When you can select the fightstyle in FOY please make it 3 choices. Oldschool, arcade or choose every time.
about this demo: The walk in animation of indy looks stiff. The arcade animations looks like in a beat em up game though. Why are there not more Samurai Shodown references?
Then I had problems confirming the selected character for player one. I was pressing punch and enter and stuff like crazy and nothing happened. Plugging in a PS2 Controller via USB Adapter and pushing buttons there finally made it work. Good thing this is supported.
And some fatalities would be a nice addition. Didn't the priest in temple of doom rip out someone's heart? That would be cool :D
Quote from: dkhThe demo fighting did reflect the SCUMM combat system very closely, however, so I'm sure the aforementioned SCUMM FoA purists would be very upset if we ended up changing much about the classic fighting mode in FoY... As a sidenote, I have to admit I always thought that fights in SCUMM sucked incredibly hard (about the only thing that did) - so, any ideas in particular? Maybe we could get away with just changing the blocking functionality? Maybe you can block high, mid and low and have to choose the right section in order to block (then turn down the animation speed so you can, if you are quick, actually react in time)? I will also have to play the FoA fights again for reference.
I don't know if I'm a purist. I prefer the sobriety (no kicking, no jumping) of the SCUMM mode that's for sure, and I defeated all the mooks but the sober Biff in the Last Crusade and the prison guard in Fate of Atlantis (yes, I beat the zeppelin ticket taker and that giant boulder nazi), but I also spent countless hours daydreaming how iconic fights in the Indy movies would feel if they were remade in the SCUMM fighting mode, like the bar fight at the start of Raiders, where you must beat a handful of progressively tougher enemies in a row but you can grab bottles scattered around between or during fights to use as improvised weapons, or the fight with Pat Roach, where the guy would be nigh impossible to beat with your fists, but the trick would be to simply make him retreat into the giant propeller, which is why I liked the cheap trick button in the FOY demo, for the cool fight potential it could bring to the old SCUMM fighting sequences.
You say you want to replay the FOA fights again for reference, may I suggest you play the Last Crusade instead? Fighting was smoother and more balanced in that game, plus you can spar in the gym at different difficulty levels right at the start, keyboard controls are enabled by default and Indy doesn't flee when you step back too much.
As a fan of the SCUMM mode, I say, simply replicate the Last Crusade fighting mode and throw in some improvement:
Replicate:You and the opponent can punch and block high, mid and low.
You must observe your opponent' fists to guess where he will attack next.
Reintroduce the green and yellow health bar.
Bring back keyboard controls, fighting difficult enemies with the mouse was suicide in FOA.
If it's possible, reintroduce health carrying over in between fights, unless you find a first aid kit or something else to replenish your health, or unless you reach a new chapter (like in The Last Crusade where your health is replenished between Castle Brunwald and the airport).
Improvement:Being able to escape from unwanted fights was a nice feature in FOA, however there should have been a button just for escaping because the most basic technique to defeat opponents in the SCUMM mode involves throwing a punch at full strength and stepping back, waiting for the opponent to step forward, throwing another punch and stepping back again... And in FOA it was too easy to accidentally escape from a battle by stepping back one time too many.
Cheap Tricks and other additions:Keep the cheap tricks. They are great.
Cheap tricks should become available only when you lose half of your starting health during a fight (the yellow health bar).
There could be several cheap tricks, with different effects, like I suggested in my previous post.
You can use only one cheap trick per fight, so you must choose wisely.
Some enemies could be immune to some cheap tricks (tackling a bulky opponent should have no effect, sand in eyes shouldn't blind an opponent who wears goggles, etc.)
Some special enemies could use cheap tricks of their own.
Some special enemies could use melee weapons. Melee weapons deal damage even if you block the blow, the only way to avoid damage is to step out of the way before the enemy attacks, not unlike Biff's and Arnold's punches in TLC and FOA. Another cheap trick idea: disarm your opponent during a fight.
Don't worry too much about purists. If the FOY SCUMM fighting mode plays more or less like it did in the Last Crusade, I think most purists will be happy. Those who don't like the cheap tricks can simply ignore them during fights, like this dude who beat Biff without giving him the trophy full of ale. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsaSJYluunA)
blueskirt, those are some absolutely excellent suggestions for the classic fight mode! These will make it straight into our considerations I promise. Thanks a ton!
selmiak, most likely there will be a setting in the game menu, not just before you start a new playthrough. Basically you access the menu and just like you can switch the text reading speed, voice speech on or off or the walking speed you can also adjust the combat mode. The default will be the SCUMM-classic setting I think. There will probably be a reminder and a quick way to switch the setting in a pop-up window before you begin the first fight. So you will be able to switch the fight mode at any given point in the game (except when you are currently in a fight already of course).
Thanks for playing and the healthy debate it's created :) Your thoughts are duly noted! You're looking at one piece of the 5000 piece puzzle, that's all, so try & enjoy it for what it is. An Indy arcade fighter. It's very out of place, but we've released two puzzley point and click mini games with a third on the way and of course the big one eventually too - why not release something that's a bit off the wall? :=
As Jan has said you will never be diverted from a classic adventure experience in the full game. We just like adding features. You know, like men like adding stuff to cars, women enjoy adding stuff to their wardrobe. And people are always getting angry emailing in saying the project is dead, so it's worth us releasing tid bits.
So far feedback has been majority positive, which is great. And the best part is if people really are "WTF?" - it raises debate, about our project, and that has never been a bad thing thus far. I think it's great for the project what the guys have done on this little trinket.
Indeed. Perhaps we'll release a short video of our SCUMM fighter system for those of you who are itching for some nostalgia.
In any case, thanks again for the constructive feedback, folks. Always welcome - always appreciated.
Paul.
I'm not sure what mode I'd choose when playing the final game, but everything's fine as long as it's optional :) Adding features never hurt anybody. I too think that blueskirts ideas are great.
Anyway, it's really cool what you guys do here and I'm happy that you still/again work on this. I'm looking forward to everything new you release!
Quotethe fact that such a thing is included in the game degrades the product - regardless of whether you can choose to circumvent it (you'll have to know it's there in order to avoid it). That's my opinion, Zmax's and a few others and it's entirely up to Screen7 to make of it whatever they will.
I don't think it 'degrades' FoY as a product. When I played it, I got the sensation of 'this is a joke game' rather than a serious element in FoY, and that was the opinion I relayed. I'm not against 'any' attempt by designers to break the adventure game mold and try something new, whether it's a fighting game or not. Do I believe you can make a competent fighting game within the mold of an adventure game like FoY? Definitely yes. Do I think this particular fighting game works with the rest of the design of FoY? No, I do not, and it mainly has to do with the inherently comical nature of the presentation (the street fighter-style round announcements and so on). Hopefully this clarifies what I was trying to say earlier without offending anyone.
Quote
Replicate:
You and the opponent can punch and block high, mid and low.
You must observe your opponent' fists to guess where he will attack next.
Reintroduce the green and yellow health bar.
I've gone this approach in a few of my games and I seriously couldn't recommend it. A majority of tester feedback has been negative because it's an issue of quantity -- or too much -- on the table for the player to have to try and guess WHERE an attack will come from, and with high/mid/low you've got a 33% chance of getting it right. The only real alternative, then is to take it into the cartoony realm of a game like Punch-Out and have an enemy telegraph their specials, but since we're dealing with direct hit-or-miss situations here rather than a dynamic animation that can be interrupted (as you can in Punch-Out), you're looking at them telegraphing EVERY punch. In this case I think a single, comprehensive block is the fairest and most consistent way to deal with it, and if you want to put a 'challenge spin' on block, allow a charged 'block-breaker' hit that will stun you (or them) if block is being abused as well as having block only partially mitigate damage so it's worth it to block power hits but not as worthwhile to sit and block everything. I think this is probably a good balance between having to block each type of hit differently vs. having a permanent, unbreakable block vs. a more draconian method of limiting how often you can block.
As far as dirty tricks go, that's the name of the game with Indy, from wrenches to dirt to distraction, he's never been afraid to use whatever advantage he could when a fight is going against him, but I'd also caution against allowing them at any time. If you want the SCUMM style fights to be more cinematic, my advice would be to add elements of scripting as you would a cutscene for a game, with boss fights that force Indy into a corner, or through a pile of debris where -- HELLO -- there just happens to be a wrench or something lying around to even the odds (think the epic confrontation with LeChuck at the end of MI 2, except with more interactivity and branching paths based on how good you are at fighting). SCUMM fights were boring because there was no story, it was just 'hey look, a kraut to beat on' and then there's a fight. There's no tension or cinema to it so people largely found them boring. Take a page from the movies and recognize that Indy rarely has the advantage and is typically fighting multiple foes or in some way outnumbered (sometimes it's a tank!). You can bring the magic of interactivity and combat together with a story 'event' where it's not just 'punch guy until he falls over' but includes some environmental interactivity. I imagine that this would be an area where m0ds would have a lot of creative ideas and input.
Just to put what I'm saying into a visual perspective, imagine that Indy has just lost a fight with a nazi assassin for control of a plane and it crashed. Teetering on the edge of a cliff (nose-first), Indy crawls out of the cockpit to see the nazi standing by the torn-open rear of the plane, determined to finish his mission and kill Indy. Now we have environmental hazards (the plane gradually tipping, chairs and cargo of various stuff strewn about) that either Indy can knock the nazi through or the nazi can throw indy into, raising the tension of the fight as it becomes clear that this is really a life or death situation for the player and not just a punch-up. Indy's goal is now one of survival; get by the guard ANY WAY HE CAN and out the tail section before the whole thing goes over, and he can do this with his fists or use the environment to his advantage. So basically you have this wide, scrolling plane where the action progresses right-to-left as Indy tries to make progress.. Obviously, tensions will rise if the nazi gets the upper hand and punches indy back into the cockpit, where he slams into the controls and we see some vines snap on the shattered windshield, signalling that time's running out. So basically, a fight like this can go back and forth and still feel engaging, or it can be a totally one-sided affair and still keep your interest because there are enough factors involved to keep it fresh. Obviously not every fight can be this awesome, but you can see where I'm going with it.
Some great feedback there, ProgZ! Thanks for your time on that.
To be completely honest, I'm itching like a ratfink for the day you can all engage the experience of FOY's introduction. You will be most satisfied. I simply can't say anymore, however.
Thanks again!
Paul.
QuoteI've gone this approach in a few of my games and I seriously couldn't recommend it. A majority of tester feedback has been negative because it's an issue of quantity -- or too much -- on the table for the player to have to try and guess WHERE an attack will come from, and with high/mid/low you've got a 33% chance of getting it right. The only real alternative, then is to take it into the cartoony realm of a game like Punch-Out and have an enemy telegraph their specials, but since we're dealing with direct hit-or-miss situations here rather than a dynamic animation that can be interrupted (as you can in Punch-Out), you're looking at them telegraphing EVERY punch.
Well, there's no guessing in FOA and TLC, if you pay attention to your opponents' fists, you will know exactly where to block since they move their fists high/mid/low to indicate where they will punch next. The difficulty with blocking is you gotta pay attention to your opponent' fists, block, punch, retreat and step front, all this in split seconds. But with an enemy sufficiently slow you could easily block every punches, there was no luck involved. I guess it all depend just how fast battles happen if FOY, which I why I suggested they play TLC instead of FOA since battle speed in TLC was rather balanced, while in FOA either CPU cycle in dosbox is too fast and you don't have time to see the punch coming, or it's too slow and the controls are unresponsive.
But I won't deny that successfully blocking was tough in these games. Personally I preferred to delay blocking until it became inevitable, by punching and retreating until I could no longer, then I started to pay attention to the opponent fists and attempted to block, throwing a punch every two seconds or so. I did suggest a more simple high/low system earlier, instead of high/mid/low, but it's hard to see how it would play or if it would be too easy or not without playing it. But I guess lack of difficulty could be compensated with tougher enemies.
I back up entirely your bit about cinematic fights.
We have for you an early preview of our SCUMM system when it was being built back in 2008. It has largely improved in the SCUMM direction and vastly diverges from the Arcade system, but if it brings hope and reassurance without giving too much away (you'll thank yourselves in the end), then this sneak-peek into the expansive history of our multidisciplinary development pipeline is just for you:
www.barnettcollege.com/movies/SCUMMFight.mp4 (http://www.barnettcollege.com/movies/SCUMMFight.mp4)
Keep cheering our team on, folks. There is so much for you to see and do!
Paul.
QuoteI imagine that this would be an area where m0ds would have a lot of creative ideas and input.
Yes, I will :) If you don't like the system you play with when you're able to use a cheap trick, you have every right to moan at me ;) Because that's the one I've designed and will take further, and with more cinematics.
Paul is right, we have more to show, and will in time. It's just necessary for you to accept we have all the time in the world to release this, not some set date - and you'll enjoy whatever is to come :) Cheers though Progz, your comments are interesting and useful to me, as are blueskits who gets his own full reply on the FoY forum.
Can you please upload that video to youtube? ;)
Or is it OK if I upload it to my account? :)
Mati, you may upload it to your own youtube! :)
Everyone is certainly encouraged to upload to youtube if they wish to share with others. I should have mentioned this in my post above, my apologies.
Cheers,
Paul.
Quote from: subspark on Wed 04/05/2011 15:42:25
Everyone is certainly encouraged to upload to youtube if they wish to share with others. I should have mentioned this in my post above, my apologies.
Cheers,
Paul.
Feeling very encouraged, I've uploaded it on the hyper-popular HardDev channel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4oh9oS1eYU
Quote from: Ascovel on Wed 04/05/2011 17:05:25
Quote from: subspark on Wed 04/05/2011 15:42:25
Everyone is certainly encouraged to upload to youtube if they wish to share with others. I should have mentioned this in my post above, my apologies.
Cheers,
Paul.
Feeling very encouraged, I've uploaded it on the hyper-popular HardDev channel:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4oh9oS1eYU
I kind of like this.
My main complaint though over what I see in this topic is not the arcade fight system (as goofy as it is), but the sprite. I think, after much reflection, that I found the nature of my problem. It all comes down, for me, to the ribbon on Indy's fedora. It's many shades lighter than the hat itself. Take another look at the film-- Indy's hat ribbon is DARKER than the hat.
First post updated with some exciting news.
Cheers,
Paul.
Quote from: subspark on Sun 05/06/2011 01:05:14
First post updated with some exciting news.
Cheers,
Paul.
That's insane! Brilliant stuff. You guys keep pulling all this random awesomeness out the bag.
yeah, the intro to the complete game looks so cool and the improvement made from the demo is such a great leap! I really want to play this game now! :D
Paul is a man of many production talents, and he has plenty more surprises up his wacky inflatable arm flailing tube man sleeve - I'm sure!
This PSP thing is freakin' cool! Next you'll be playing FoY on a Wii. Good stuff guys :)
It's worth to take another take if you cough really loudly into the camera while filming. Just when Indy spoke as well...
Other than that, this looks great.
Screw the PSP, finally some video footage ;D
But it's still really really cool. If you could also port it to Dingux (Mips as wel), I could play it on my arcade (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qI4zYo7bjM) :D That would be truly awesome!
QuoteIt's worth to take another take if you cough really loudly into the camera while filming. Just when Indy spoke as well...
Don't worry Anian, you actually only missed out on hearing our crappy temporary voiceover for the native tribesman which sounded more asian than indigenous. :=
I can guarantee you with all honesty that you saw and heard everything that was worth seeing and hearing at this stage of public-ready material.
We have no recording for Indy as yet by the way. I'm planning on bringing John Armstrong on board at some point further into production when dialog recording will begin in general. While John is known to do outstanding work for fan productions free of charge, we can't guarantee other actors of his stature will record with us without some level of payment, so we do continue to encourage our beloved community of Fountain of Youth supporters to help make voice production a more practical exercise if practical at all, to donate in order to help kick things along.
Donations have helped clear a vast amount of road for development in the past year and your help can largely improve the pace at which the game's chapters are produced by doing so. Our productivity scales linearly with the resources available to the team behind this marvel and we really hope to bring our beloved project up to a stage where we can announce the very day it will be in your hands for the keeping.
Until then, the show
MUST go on!
Cheers,
Paul.
Though somewhat schizo in its day/night lighting, that intro camera pan is gorgeous. I love the sky and water. :o
I'm glad to see FOY have a bit of an original style to it and not a straight-forward ripoff of the old (in my eyes flat) FOA style. It looks gorgeous.
Keep up the good work y'all!
I'd be curious to see the intro without the detail reduction of youtube + being on a tiny handheld. From what little I could make out, though, it looks to me like you've replaced the original sprite style with Nacho's design for Indy, etc, that he asked me for feedback on awhile back.