Background composition critique

[frenchllama]

I'm attempting to make a scrolling nighttime street scene, however I thought before I actually go too far in drawing it nicely, I should see what everyone thinks of the basic composition. I'm kind of concerned with the lack of foregrounding - there's really nothing going on, and also a fairly useless dead space on the bottom left...however - there are several things I need to remain constant in order for the puzzles and story to work:

The street on the right has to remain clear and visible.
The pub in the background is an accessible location and so can't be concealed by any foreground objects.
The wall and gate are the main focus of the location as the character will be attempting to climb over it.

With that in mind, any thoughts for improvement?



Note: Excuse the messy sketchy drawing. I've just got myself a tablet and am trying to learn to use it. 'Trying' being the operative word.

[None]

Awesome perspective work there... two point...
Another thing you need to consider is that if this is what a character is going to be interacting with in this screen.
Think of how small your character will have to be scaled in comparison to the size of the background...

This is your background sketch at ?x240 res.
The Vertical red line is just to give you an idea of how much scaling is actually going to be taking place as your character moves around the background.
The gate seems pretty safe, but he will be quite small as he moves towards the store in the back left.
Which is okay if he's not having to 'interact' with that store.
Amazing sketch, I'd love to pixel this... especially the lighting and the lamp, will be epic.

[frenchllama]

Hey, thanks for the response. What I didn't mention earlier is that I'm designing this game at 1024x768 (I scaled it down so it wouldn't be massive on the forum), but regardless, you make a valid point.
I think I'll probably have to restrict any far-away interactions to the the door only, just as an access to the interior location. No exterior details except maybe the entire building as one hotspot etc.

[loominous]

A few questions:

What kind of structure lies beyond the walls?

What kind of town, city is it? What kind of neighborhood is it? What era?

Even in an early compositional stage it's good to know these things, so you can create as interesting a setup as possible.

[frenchllama]

1. The walls encircle a fairly large house, owned by a well-off family

2. The setting is a city, maybe very slightly more suburban. The era is contemporary, but this location is in an older part of town (I'm looking at going for a slightly Art Nouveau aesthetic). I'm not giving the city a definite real-world location so I can have more freedom, however it has basic references to England - there is a pub in the left-hand background.

3. The neighborhood is upmarket but not exclusively - just more of an affluent area

A further note, the power-lines are also necessary for the the story.

[cuestaluis]

I really like it  perhaps you could "fix" the scaling issues by making a close up BG of the pub as a separate room, to help with the interactions.
Also, for the empty space on the left you could paint some lines on the road, or make a little roundabout (sp?) visible to fill up without it taking space where you need it. But overall, I dig it.

[frenchllama]

I messed around but couldn't make the roundabout work, however, I liked your idea of lines on the road. I've inserted a zebra crossing, as well as a few elements like a drain and manhole.

I figured I might as well post my WIP to show my current solution to the bottom left corner. Bear in mind that everything is still being blocked in - the elements don't match and are rough and unfinished.


As it's still in it's early stages, hopefully any problems I haven't noticed can be caught before I put heaps of time into it.
My main concern still lies in the lack of foreground objects, but I don't see a way to incorporate any without it looking forced.

Feel free to rip it to pieces. I'm happy to go back to the drawing board. This is largely style test as well as an attempt to learn to use a tablet.

[Anian]

This is awesome! Very kinda Broken swordy.
If you feel it's a bit empty, you can always draw a trash container (in that alley on the right for example), a trash bin (is that a sketch of one in the middle of the drawing?), newspapers on the floor, puddles, road signs (like "no parking" in that alley on the right), parked cars, bicycle stands, concert posters (or that poll thing with posters on it.).
You can always add animations a cat or a mouse crossing the street, a traffic light that changes every once in a  while (or just some light coming from it at the edge of the bakcground, moving cars in the back.

[frenchllama]

Thanks - yeah I was aiming at a kind of Broken Sword aesthetic. You're right, that's a trash-can in the middle, but it's not enough on it's own. I definitely like all those ideas to fill out the scene a bit more - particularly the animations as they should help breathe life into it.

[Mr Flibble]

Parked car maybe? Perhaps in silhouette even?

I absolutely love how you've done the sky by the way.

[DazJ]

Slightly off-topic but what materials/software are you using? Is it digitally created or hand-drawn and coloured? I'm curious because it's stunning!

[Travis Anthony]

Maybe you could throw in some graffiti on the walls in the alley?  How about a garbage truck, a delivery van/truck, or something like that to block the view of that endless alley?  I don't know what kind of privacy that you're going for around the wall, but you could always throw in a hot dog vendor to liven up the scene.  As he could be, flipping, looking around, spitting, scratching, etc.  And he could be someone that the character could get added information or tidbits of hot gossip from (or even possibly an inventory item, ketchup packet, straw, etc).  Who doesn't want a hot dog after a night of heavy drinking at the open(?) pub.

One thing though, you said that the walls enclose a fairly LARGE house.   Unless it's a low-to-the-ground bungalow (single storey home) with a gradual roof, or a bungalow with a flat roof, you'd see the roof peaking over the walls.  And to my math, it's not all that large of a house at all.  Unless the house is TIGHT with the walls, the house can only be (guessing) 30' x 40' (9m x 12m), with 5' (1.5m) of yard on each side of the house, and 10' (3m) on the back.  If it's a sloped roof, the lowest pitch I've ever seen on a house is a 4:12 (rise:run).  That would mean that the roof is 5' high.  Assuming that the walls are only 8' high including the foundation height of 1' (average), you'd be looking at  5' + 8' + 1'  = 14' (4.3m) to the peak of a 4:12 roof.  Any rich house usually has an 8:12 pitch or more.  An 8:12 house would be 19' (6m) peak to ground.

Those walls are surely no bigger than 12' (3.6m) high.  A telephone pole is usually only 30' (9m) high.  Comparing that to the wall I figure that you'd easily be able to see any house peaking over the walls with a half decent roof pitch.

Basically what I'm saying is that it wouldn't be a LARGE house unless it's a two storey house.  A 30' x 40' (9m x 12m) house is only a 1200 square foot house (or 112 square metres).  Very small indeed.

Every time I look at that picture I feel as if there wouldn't be anything big behind those walls at all.  Maybe a cemetery or something similar.  I feel as if there should be a roof and/or a second storey peaking out from behind the walls if there is to be a house trapped behind those walls.  That would also give tell the game player that there is indeed a Large house behind those walls.  Especially if you draw a rich Victorian home peaking over the walls.

Picture looks good so far!  I can't wait to see it finished!  Thanks.

[Anian]

@Travis:
 - I think there's no house peeking over the walls is cause this is still a WIP
 - graffiti might not be appropriate, since llama said it's a "nice" neighbourhood, so it just might break the tone of the scene

Yeah, I somehow didn't mention parked cars, which would really help to break up the alley going to infinity feel, and would add more silhouette to to the end of it.
But Shonen was kinda on to something. The more I look at the right part of the drawing, the more it seems it kinda goes too small too fast...I always run into those kind of problems when drawing, but here it seems it's just slightly wrong, don't know how to fix that though.
Don't know if you made the perspective net and really compared all the lenghts and heights, maybe there's something you missed. If it's correct then I'll guess it should be seen when a character walks if the scaling seems natural.

Btw I still think it looks great.

[Travis Anthony]

@anian: I know that it's a work in progress.  But from what I've seen on this picture, he seems to have added everything into his WIP picture.  From vines, garbage cans, even the moon.  I just had a hard time believing that he was planning on adding the roof later.  As he seems to have added most of his detail to his sketch already.

Simply what I'm saying is that he has the moon already drawn in.  Even in the nicer WIP update.  If he adds a 2nd storey, he loses the moon.  If he keeps it a bungalow, its a small house.  Tis all.  If you only see a roof peaking the walls, it may look weird.  I think anyways.  We'll see.

[frenchllama]

Wow, lots to reply to. Again, I appreciate all the feedback. Thanks!

DazJ: I'm using photoshop and an Intuos4 tablet to produce this entirely digitally.

Travis: Very logical conclusion you drew about me not having sketched in the house yet, and thanks for your concern. I originally forgot to, but then (having realised) I ignored it as I have a really strange workflow where I work on what appeals to me the most, rather than what I should draw The moon is only there because I was out late at night and saw the sky looking like that, got inspired and painted it when I was home. There is going to be a roof/upper story peaking over the walls, and if you compare perspectives with the height of the buildings in the background, as well as take into account the fact that the house will be at the rear of the wall section (the front is an inner courtyard) it shouldn't have to block out the moon, it'll be more to the right. I find your knowledge of dimensions intriguing - that telephone pole should possibly be a fair bit taller than it is then...

As anian suggested, the hot dog vendor and graffiti probably would detract from the idea that the area is upmarket. A couple of things with the alley on the right - I think the general consensus is that it would benefit from parked cars so I'll have a look at implementing that. Also now that the issue has been raised, I notice I also don't like how the alley vanishes rapidly towards that point. I think I'll cut it off - either with the end of the road, or some kind of obstacle (a parked truck is one interesting solution).