So.. as a second background for the Roxy Fox game..
the cafe where Roxy likes to hang out.. at night time..
there are no characters in it yet, so it isn't very cousy yet :)
Please don't say it doesn't look like a café, it's just the way like the real painting of the Broken Dreams cafe.. and addons inside are coming later..
The idea;
It's very much based on one of my favorite paintings.. the legendary broken dreams cafe.. and there is gonna be james dean-sort of characters inside as well..
Here Roxy Fox likes to hang out when she is tired after a big day of work at the detective office..
Addons coming;
There is gonna be a tv hanging at the right side in the cafe too, and maybe a chanse game.. but that comes later.. maybe some bottles too, but it's supposed to be very empty.. the characters inside (like 3 or 4 chars) will dominate the room so..
Feedback asked;
My question.. its about texture again.. is it textured and shadowed enough? or what.. remember.. i just looooove paintovers :).. i learn much from it..
Comments are always welcome too..
-DonB
(http://home.unet.nl/carl/roxyfox/brokendreams2.gif)
(http://home.unet.nl/carl/roxyfox/brokendreams2big.gif)
EDIT: some characters in it:
(http://home.unet.nl/carl/roxyfox/brokendreamssss.gif)
(http://home.unet.nl/carl/roxyfox/brokendreamssssbig.gif)
btw: for the people who helped me with my previous background, small detective office, it's almost finished.. you will all see it when the game is ready to not bring up old threads again
EDIT: detective background.. just for comparation http://www.adventuregamestudio.co.uk/yabb/index.php?topic=24000.0
Detective office will look most on:
(http://users.evtek.fi/~ilarim/paintover.gif)
Looks very different from the earlier office background. This has an abstract angle whereas the office was zero angle. All the structures look very realistic, which wasn't the case with the office. Also, the colors were more balanced in the office and it had more detail. This looks like a whole new style. Try to keep bgs as consistent as possible.
Anyways, looks good. No paintover from me this time, though :).
Hmz.. damm.. you right.. perhaps I focused too much on remaking the real broken dreams cafe..
But remember..
-It's an outside view.. not inside.. great difference in that.. inside is mostly other angle then outside.
-It will all fit together more when the "comic" characters are in it (it are animals.. no persons i work with.. which makes it all more together)
I will..
-make walls more comic, not perfectly straight..
but, like i said, i think the angle is right.. since this is for the introduction movie in the game.. Roxy is tired of a days work and gets informed by television about a robbery of a painting she has to solve..
-I don't know what you mean with more balanced colors.. tell me please.. i always like your comments
"This has an abstract angle whereas the office was zero angle" << that's the angle story right? I aint english.. so don't understand the angle types you mean..
Ildu appreciated for your fast response.. back to the thread now ;D
What I mean by zero angle is that the opposite wall that the 'camera' is shooting towards is straight. You have that in the office with the wall in the center. It also implies that the other walls (in an interior room) are seen and emerge from that straight wall. In other words, the vanishing point is pretty much in the center of the image. The noticeable vanishing point in the cafe is way to the left of the image. This kind of zero angle thinking is what separates a typical 2d game environment from a more realistic style. Of course you don't have to have all your backgrounds zero angle, quite the contrary. But it does help to convey the same kind of style, and prevent from too much variation.
The balance of colors is just that, balance. The colors in the office are very balanced. They have kind of the same hue, their brightness is roughly the same and so is the saturation. There isn't much different in contrast or brightness, except to indicate depth. In the cafe image you have very dark colors, i.e. the black shadow, working with very bright colors, and you have low contrast colors working with very high contrast colors. Also, the shadowing is way more distinct than in the office. You need to balance out these values.
What you need to do is this:
- Fill out the shadowed areas with a darker color of the actual colors. Don't use black as the shadow color. If you want to express night time, it's best to give a bluish hue to everything, except where there's artificial lighting, such as lamps. I personally think everything should be with a bluish tone, except for the cafe interior. That will direct attention to the interior and balance the colors.
- Add some kind of window material. It doesn't have to be very prominant, just make a transparent blue layer and add some fake reflections, i.e. white lines on the window.
- Add detail. You should add all the stuff you were planning and some more. For example, the tv, a garbage can, cracks on concrete, a street light, text and posters on the window, etc.
(http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/1373/hoppernighthawkssm2ti.jpg) (Hopper "Nighthawks")
Just to fill in on Ildu's reply, you see you can easily put more color into your black areas. Otherwise I think - since it's a homage to the painting - you could keep it pretty close to the original even if it differs a bit in feeling from your other BG's.
Edit: I now realize you're thinking of the parody painting, by Helnwein;
(http://img328.imageshack.us/img328/1836/boulevardofbrokendreamssm0mb.jpg)
Jesus Christ! Pay homage to the original instead!
Heheh.. tbh.. I didn't even knew there was an original, but I still like the Elvis/Marilyn/James Dean one much more..
thanks for explaining to you both..
Is this any better? (just the colors and windows),
cause I tried to make the very dark part less dark blue.. but that doesn't work out imo..
-Made it all blue-tones outside cafe
-No black in it anymore
-Windows teinted (cant do much stripes in it cause you have to see a dialog in it)
(http://home.unet.nl/carl/roxyfox/brokendreams3.gif)
(http://home.unet.nl/carl/roxyfox/brokendreams3big.gif)
EDIT: Cause of my over-darkened monitor I didn't saw there were still black spots lol.. editted
Looks good. However there actually are some black parts. You still gotta add detail to the shadows. Don't make them so prominently one-colored. As for window highlight stripes, just make them in a brighter color and less transparent. They shouldn't be full white in any situation. Anyways, looks better already. I'm warming up for a paintover, so I might do one.
Heheh Im rubbin' my hands already..
About the shadows, that was actually the first question I had about it, the texture and shadows in which i just suck..
I don't know how to add detail to shadows or texure.. but at least I can work on the windows already.
Appreciated..
Really cool Bg DonB. I like the kind of "abstract" sense of the image, but still I have some critics to come with.
The first thing I thought when I saw the Bg was that the building in the back was way out of perspective, but when I saw the real picture I saw how it was supposed to be. What I mean by out of perspective is that it seems as though the top of the building is pointing to the left, but the lower part is pointing to the right. I've tried to look at it a million times but it still freaks my eyes out, so I would suggest you did something about it (if you see what I mean).
The blue tone in the outside textures is not a bad idea to give the sense of beeing at night, but what you have done so far is making all the colours simply different tones of blue. I think you should add a bit texture colour to the blue, like for example the brick wall, make the blue a bit more redish blue. Also I think the outside needs to be a bit darker it the lightest parts.
I hope you see what I mean, and I'll try to do a paintover, even though I've never done that before :P
J.K ;)
edit: I will not do the paintover, simply because that went straight to hell, but I hope you see what I mean anyway.
Cool! Reminds me of another painting: ;D
(http://timisgod.mixnmojo.com/Nighthawks800by600.jpg)
--Erwin
Juliuz, thank you very much for your good tribution to the good of this picture, too bad you didn't succeed in a paintover.. I will try to do my best at an improved one of this with your hints and tips..
Hopefully Ildu throws up a nice paintover as well..
tonight my new paintover will be up I hope..
;D
Appreciated,
DonB
So.. some new edits.. some characters in it.. Juliuz.. I tried to make the perspective right too but that's very hard.. I see what you mean and am trying to make it work right..
By the way.. the gif animation is more of a joke.. will become much more detailed in the real game..
(http://home.unet.nl/carl/roxyfox/brokendreamssss.gif)
(http://home.unet.nl/carl/roxyfox/6.gif)
It looks cool!
I understand that the perspective is difficult to change, but I would still do something about the colours outside.
Also I was wondering if the characters sitting in the cafe is finished? I think they look a bit goofy (yeah I know it's a comic), but if I understand it correctly they still are unfinished. I like the GIF-animation though :)
All support to you!
J.K
Thanks Julius, but to be honest with ya the characters in this game are like this way.. you are right that the details ain't perfected yet and the barman isn't finished by far (the grey guy from the back).. but they are like this..
Are they really that bad? ???
I will try to change the colors outside..
I already tried it a while ago but that failed.. will retry..
Appreciated
I think the reason the characters look weird is that they're too big. In the other versions of the painting, the characters are only about half as tall as the back window. In yours their heads almost reach the top of it. If you can resize the characters I think it would help a lot.
Will do that and look how it will work out..
also.. I saw my background on an other monitor.. and think it's way too bright..
I work on a rather dark monitor so thats why I didnt found out earlier, I also saw some black lines which occured to be the same color as the dark blue on my monitor..
changes will come..
includes:
-less bright
-smaller characters
-getting rid of last black outlines
Only for the smaller couple at the bar.. (didnt do barman yet)
is this size of characters better? it seems to look better to me..
only.. if i resize them smaller they lose pixels and turn out badder graphics.. thats only thing i don't like about it.. haven't done the improvements on the smallers tho.. so they do need a small repaint which i will do soon..
(http://home.unet.nl/carl/roxyfox/brokendreamsnew.gif)
(http://home.unet.nl/carl/roxyfox/brokendreamsnewbig.gif)
Does it look better or not with this new smaller sized characters at the bar?
yes it does :)
I like your clean style. Maybe you should make the first bg too match the same clean style?
Appreciated Buloght,
that's exactly what my dilemma is,
should I use this "clean style", or should I use some textures like the first background had on the ground and all, and more details like the first had.. on this background.
I think I'm gonna clean the first background a bit and look how it will turn out.. I will keep everything but just maybe some less details like some less paintings on the wall and stuff..