C&C - Background

[Metamorfo]

Please, what do you think?

[Helm]

you can start by taking out the lensflare.

[DanClarke]

It's a nice image, very CMI esque, i have a few poiters for you:

-as mentioned, lose the lens flare, it doesnt add anything to any images, unless theyre photographs of  the sun.

-the lighting on the trees suggests the light source is coming from the right, rather than the centre where the image is seen.

-There shouldnt really be a curvature to the see, as you never actually see the curve of the horizon, unless you look from a great altitude.

-i think the trees in the distance need more detail and depth.

Apart from that it's cool, keep on it

[ildu]

Yes, please take out the lensflare. Ok, so this is a CMI fan game, so I'll treat it as such.

I don't see much wrong with the linework. The composition is a bit misleading. By seeing the image, you really don't know where the character is supposed to enter and exit. Also, there seems to be a lack of foreground objects. Sure the bushes are totally black, which is style Bill Tiller uses for shadowed foreground objects, but they are only black if they're really close to the 'camera'. The bushes in your image are too far from it. Also the lower right corner shouldn't be totally black.

I think the problem doesn't lie really with the linework. It's more about the coloring. If you look at Tiller's linework and compare it to his (or the two colorists' in CMI) finished work, it's easily seen that most of the mood is created with the coloring. Ã, The coloring in your image lacks depth. It's also quite stale. You need to balance the yellow, green and blue with some purple, red and orange. Bill Tiller said that the sunny day coloring was emphasized by adding blue to shadows and yellow to highlights of a green object. The coloring is good, but it doesn't give that umpf feeling. Also, lower the contrast a bit.

Here are some sunny day backgrounds from CMI:

http://www.billtiller.com/images/lucasarts/mi_09.jpg
The lower half of this image has a green-yellow hue, and it's balanced by the purple-blue hued upper half. No significant foreground objects, and the composition is pretty good. You can pretty much see that neither side of the image is an entry-exit point (less visible about the left side, though). The seemingly white buildings are very bright yellow and the shade is bluish purple. But because the shading isn't so radical, you get the feeling that this isn't the brightest time of day. There is no black color in the image, except for the linework.

http://www.billtiller.com/images/lucasarts/mi_10.jpg
I don't exactly know what the deal is here. If you remember, in the game, you walk off the grassy knoll and come onto this screen. I guess this is supposed to give an alternative angle to the playing field. If so, I don't know why the barrel appears where it shouldn't. Anyway, in this image green is very dominant. Some purple and blue are balancing it. The foreground object is almost black, which means it's really close and therefore large. The composition isn't so good to my thinking. Apparently, the entry-exit point is the horizontal line at the point where barrel is.

http://www.billtiller.com/images/lucasarts/mi_21.jpg
Now, this is a very interesting and colorful image. The left side of it is very bluish, balanced with a bunch of colors. The varying colors really make you distinguish the sign and particularly the red-colored arrow. The right side of the image has a greyish, brownish hue. The composition is great with three very clear paths to walk to. The shadowing is also very cool-looking. As you can see the shadowing is bluish gray and the highlights are bright yellow. This may be the one you should try to emulate most.

http://www.billtiller.com/images/lucasarts/mi_31.jpg
This is very different from the other images. The dominating hue is clearly blue. The composition is quite good, emphasizing the depth very well. There aren't a lot of very bright highlights, so it gives the impression that it's not the brightest time of day. The contrastingly colored objects add to the depth and make that area of the image much more interesting than the rest. The suggested distance from the cove to the ledge is so great that hardly any foreground objects are needed.

http://www.billtiller.com/images/lucasarts/mi_35.jpg
This is a very very informative and interesting image. If you look at it from left to right, you'll see that it has different stages of color balances. The leftmost are is bluish, but when you slide that from view, the middle of the image is very brownish and basically contains no blue, except for the speck of the sky we see and the tiny fountain. Then when we go the rightmost area, the dominating hue is again purplish blue. The composition is excellent and the depth is incredible. Again the depth is so great that no foreground objects are needed.

I'm not saying this to spite your effort. I'm being harsh because I see promise in this. Your backgrounds look great but they could be much better. I'm sure some even expect that. Curse of Monkey Island is truly a very difficult act to follow. Anyway, hope this helped you. I used up some time to conjur up all this talk. Much of it should've gone into my numerous late school assignments, *sigh*...

[Metamorfo]

Thank you very very much for the critics!!!!! Specially ildu! 

I did some modifications:



-lose the lens flare
-the lighting on the trees suggests the light source is coming from the right
-There shouldnt really be a curvature to the see, as you never actually see the curve of the horizon, unless you look from a great altitude
-the trees in the distance need more detail and depth.
- the lower right corner shouldn't be totally black

I tried to balance the colors too!

[Bartimaeus]

This looks really awesome the style is great.
:o

[ildu]

Looks better already. The colors seem to not hurt my eyes anymore. So it's much less saturated.

Here are still some pointers:

- You still didn't take out the lensflare
- The sky shouldn't be so clearly leveled gradient (neither should the water)
- Shade the clouds the same way as in CMI
- Balance out the shading in the foreground tree on the right (it looks restless) and maybe tone down the burn
- Darken the shaded bits of the rocks (there should be more variance in a sunlit rock surface and a shadowed one)
- Saturation isn't color, so put the right color where it should be (such as brown on the coconuts and the far-off trees)
- You need to take out the black from the foreground bushes
- Maybe you should smoothen out some of those tabletting edges (you need softer gradients)
- You still need more opposing colors

What i would do with the sun is to take the lensflare out and just leave a clear bright sky. The leaning trees in the front, being the best indicators of the light source, are already showing that the light is coming from the right. The fact that the main indicator tree is leaning back, it kinda shows that the light is coming from atop, so naturally the source shouldn't be seen in the image. Ahh, I didn't see the rocks. They clearly indicate a rightmost light source. So why don't you just take the light source out and let it be. No one will notice.

The clouds in the CMI backgrounds are a very important aspect to emulate. After all, they are the filling of an otherwise empty blue sky. The clouds in CMI are so full and rich that you just wanna pucker up your lips and kiss them. Unlike clouds usually, they're portrayed as 3d-like solid objects rather than transparent, tearing gas. First of all, the clouds have a dark outline. Second, they're 'silver lining' highlights are larger and hugely compliment to the fullness. Third, they have a darker inside, with a distinct coloring. This coloring has a lot to do with distinguishing the time of day. If it's reddish, it looks like a late afternoon. If it's more bluish, you get the feeling that it's noon. And also, the more darker and less saturated the coloring is, the more it starts to look like a stormy sky. See examples of clouds in the examples I listed earlier.

The foreground objects are supposed to frame the image and now they're kinda ruining it. To illustrate my point, try lifting your browser window so that most of the black doesn't show, just the tips of the bushes. Looks much better and balanced, doesn't it? You gotta give life to those bushes. Seeing as the player enters in the lower center area, the bushes are probably the first thing the player will see.

Ok, so now about the tabletting edges. There are some places where it's obvious that you've been fiddling with a tablet. The rightmost foreground tree is one indication, the highlights in the palm tree brances is another. You need to smoothen some of these out. When you see marks like that, it totally takes you out of the immersion (at least me). So when coloring, remember to vary the brush, vary the size, turn on pen pressure for the tablet, etc. And if nothing else works try to smoothen it manually so that it looks natural. A good way to check if you have a naturally shaded image is turn it into grayscale. In grayscale, it's much easier to spot the subtle nuances in shading.

As I already listed, you need more opposing colors to balance the blue, green and yellow. Maybe you should add more objects to the sand, preferably showing off a red color. Maybe some cloths from the shipwreck. Or you could try turning the sail of the ship to a dim red color. How about having a big wacky wood sign under the leaning tree that says 'shipwreck->' in bright red. Opposing colors are a way to make the image more interesting and I think this background needs just that. Also, when you have a color that is distinctly different from the general hue, it attracts the eye of the viewer. Same works for highly saturated colors in a less saturated environment. This way you can lead the viewers glance to the important areas in the background.

If you have any other questions you wanna ask, or if you have any other backgrounds that need assessing, please PM me or e-mail me. I would be more than obliged to help. Anything to give me an excuse to ditch my schoolwork .

EDIT: I forgot to mention it, but if you want this information from the horse's mouth (or so to say), seeing some of these links:

http://www.adventuredevelopers.com/featuredetail.php?action=view&featureid=16&showpage=1
In this one, Bill Tiller talks mostly about the importance of composition.

http://www.adventuredevelopers.com/featuredetail.php?action=view&featureid=17&showpage=1
In this one, he talks about depth and perception.

[Igor]

Looks great! I really like the line work.. keep it up

[Pet Terry]

I realise some of these things have already been said, but...

- Do I even need to mention the lens flare?
- As Ildu said, the image lacks red. The sand could do with a slightly more red in it, perhaps.
- The colouring of the trees in the background looks a bit hurried. I mean, the tree trunks especially. Make them brown, rather than green.
- Again, as Ildu said, I can see you've tried to imitate CMIsh clouds, but something is missing. The shading. Follow Ildu's advice (that is, if you really want to make the clouds exactly like in CMI).

Other than that, very nice work. I'm looking forward to more of your stuff, it's very inspiring.

[Nikolas]

I'm not a graphic kind of guy and I'm sorry for high-jacking the thread, but why taking out the lens flare? I like it.

[Gilbert]

Don't ask...

Anyway, whenever there's a L3N5 FL4R3 you'll expect one of the first comment is to remove it, before we old AGS members die of fatal heart attacks.

[n3tgraph]

Besides, it only makes your great background look flat....

[Phemar]

Wow, that's a fantastic image! Really CMI-esque.

The only thing that's really bugging me is that lens flare/sun. It's kinda detracting from the image.

[ManicMatt]

WOW!! I wish I could paint like that!

Sorry but I have to agree with the majority here, the lens flare isn't working.

It's looks like it's from a 3D game or something. it's a fine lens flare, for a lens flare, but it's not suited to the game.

Personally I'd like lens flares to be gone from all games! It's only something seen in a camera, and it reinforces the idea that we looking through a camera, and ruins the immersion. (Another example is in GTA Vice city, when the rain slid down the camera. It was unsurprisingly took out in the sequel)

[Afflict]

WOW!! I wish I could paint like that!
... it's a fine lens flare, for a lens flare, but it's not suited to the game.

I second that. The art is AWESOME! just get rid of the flare it is not suited in the cmi style, unless maybe you draw it into a more of a cartoon look...

[Nikolas]

I am under the impression that if metamorpho does not take the lens flare of his image noone will play his game when finished...

[Elliott Hird]

^ That's correct.

Sorry, same c&c as everyone else.

[DanClarke]

ive also noticed something else about your clouds, it's evident you drew those after the tree, because you can see where the lines tend to 'fit around' the palm tree. Id sugeest just drawing them as normal then rubbing out the excess lines.

[Metamorfo]

I made MORE modifications! 

the lens flare isn't working
Shade the clouds the same way as in CMI
Maybe you should smoothen out some of those tabletting edges (you need softer gradients)
They clearly indicate a rightmost light source. So why don't you just take the light source out and let it be. No one will notice.



Now?

[ildu]

It's looking much much better. When I compare the last edit to this one, I see that this one is much more balanced. I don't particularly like the darker tone to all the objects in the front, but it does work and it does add depth.

- The clouds are much better, but they could do with even more fullness, meaning a darker shadowing.
- I think you need to make the shadows of the closest right rocks a bit darker. It will give even more depth, since it should be darker than the farther bunch of rocks.
- I guess the foreground bushes are good enough, but i'd like to see them a bit lighter and detailed.
- Soften out the gradients on the water.
- The shading on the rightmost palm branch is still uneven.
- Try adding just a little more detail to the sand. Add slight bumps and stuff. Add more detail to the forefront sand and leave the farthest part untouched. Having that gradient of detailing will emphasize depth as well as give the image fullness. It will also make navigating on the background much easier. Use these as reference: http://www.billtiller.com/images/lucasarts/mi_03.jpg and http://www.billtiller.com/images/lucasarts/mi_41.jpg.
- Maybe you should lessen the contrast just a tad and maybe turn down the brightness even less than a tad.

Seriously, if you do these things, it'll be golden. And then this rumble of demands for improvements will end.

And do contact me if you want advice on other backgrounds. I don't need my name in the credits, I just wanna help. This is a learning curve for me as much as it is for you.