Adventure Game Studio

Creative Production => Critics' Lounge => Topic started by: Sektor 13 on Tue 28/02/2006 18:14:53

Title: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Sektor 13 on Tue 28/02/2006 18:14:53
Here it is my latest background of nature and redish sun, possibly background for menu :S

So: ?

(http://freeweb.siol.net/zagar413/KZ/niceview.png)

I am not completly satisfied with the picture, but i think it is still good enough. MAybe bushes needs some more work !?

By the way, i have 35 pictures - > from the begining to the final picture, it crudly show how it was done if anybody is interested, i will upload it in ZIP file !??
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: LilBlueSmurf on Tue 28/02/2006 18:23:50
I always enjoy seeing other peoples techniques, and I am sure there are other people that could learn from the images.  If you have em, you might as well put them up to help out others.  You should probably put it in the 'tutorial' section though instead of adding to this thread.  The picture is nice, the only big thing I see is what you mentioned, the bushes.  The highlights make them look more like rocks or a dirt pile than bushes.
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Nacho on Tue 28/02/2006 18:26:42
You can't really imagine how I hate you... And now... for making me hate you even more; How many time did it last to make this piece of gold? Please, make my day and say than more than a week!  ;)
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Nikolas on Tue 28/02/2006 18:32:58
Would you do this for us?
I mean would you?
Will you?
A zip for us?
Yes?
Really?
OMG?

A second tutorial in two days! ;D

It will come SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO handy!
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Sektor 13 on Tue 28/02/2006 18:47:46
It took me about 6-7 hours to make it, like almost any background these days.


Well this is not a tutorial, it is kind a emmm, i don't know :) , you won't see how each brush stroke was made and what exactly was use, so sorry, i don't know if this will be of any help at all... but see for yourself

-- 2.3 Mb --
http://freeweb.siol.net/zagar413/KZ/niceviewpack.ZIP

->BTW if link doesn't work yet, it is still uploading to the server so be patient.

->BTW 2 the river will be moving in the game, maybe even a nearby grass
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Mr Flibble on Tue 28/02/2006 18:59:02
Thank you, so much.
I'm very interested to see how you build things up to create such an impressive picture.
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Afflict on Tue 28/02/2006 19:20:52
 :o

WOW

Thats absolutely beautiful!
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: lo_res_man on Tue 28/02/2006 20:06:26
Can I critic this? 'Cuz if I can, it may be seen as nit picking, but were is the waterfall going? The grass seems to grow right up to it, but that can't happen.As well were is the mist? just a thought. BUT it is still jaw dropping wonderful.
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Corey on Tue 28/02/2006 20:23:46
Quote from: lo_res_man on Tue 28/02/2006 20:06:26
Can I critic this?


ofcourse you can, go ahead  ;)
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Alun on Tue 28/02/2006 20:25:32
Um, lo_res_man, I'm pretty sure the waterfall is going into a ravine, which is why you can't see the mist--it's down inside the ravine.  The grass doesn't go right up to the waterfall; that's the edge of the ravine.

Granted, possibly if this isn't obvious to everyone, maybe that means it needs to be made clearer...but it was already clear to me, so I'm not sure how to do that...
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Sektor 13 on Tue 28/02/2006 20:29:01
Yes exactly.

I never pictured this like lo_res_man did, but now if i look closer, maybe it is a bit unobvious... hmm
But i think if you resize the picture (two or three times)it is easier to see the "real" one.
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Desmond on Tue 28/02/2006 20:52:28
Looks awesome; thanks for the step-by-step as well.   :)

I think the confusion about the waterfall comes from the perspective... the waterfall and the lines on the side of the cliff/rock face are all running vertically up and down, which suggests a rather low angle.  If we were looking at a large chasm in the earth, then the near grassy field would be "higher up" to be on the same plane as the far field... right now it looks like there's a shelf, which is where the confusion comes in.  (I think the shelf is visible in the undetailed image most easily.)

Even if the ravine were really wide, I doubt we'd get a shot like that unless we were standing *really close* to the edge, or looking into it somewhat.  If we're looking in, or even looking anywhere other than directly at the horizon, having those lines on the rock face come to a vanishing point somewhere waaaay down in the ravine would help.

But the coloring is unbelievable, as usual.   ;D
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Alun on Tue 28/02/2006 21:02:22
Actually, come to think of it, one thing that might help make the ravine clearer is to darken the cliff sides as they go down into the ravine.  There's already a little bit of darkening at the bottom, but it's fairly subtle; if the cliff faces got more noticeably darker as they extended down into the ravine, it might make it more obvious that it's a ravine and not just a cliff.

Just a thought...
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Kweepa on Tue 28/02/2006 21:26:23
(http://www.kweepa.com/step/ags/critics/niceview.gif)
The gif screws up the final image a bit - sorry.

I think the oddest thing about the image is that the river seems to come straight at the edge rather than snaking around a bit, and not from any of the mountains in the background.
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: DanClarke on Tue 28/02/2006 21:30:33
Woah, awesome piece, and it's interesting to see how you build your BGs, very different from myself!

My only crit for it is that when the water flows over the edge, it's no longer under the light of the sun, so technically it should be a dark blue or grey colour to match the cold hues of the shadows. Unless of course the water is intentionally that colour...

But minor crits aside, gorgeous piece!
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Tomas on Tue 28/02/2006 22:26:57
Very nice indeed. I especially like the way you did the sky - very atmospheric. As for crits, maybe it would look interesting if you darkened the shaded parts quite a bit. They are a bit bright considering the setting sun is the only light source in this scene. But all in all, this is a beautiful piece of art. Good job!

And thanks a lot for that step-by-step tutorial thing, it's always interesting to see how people work.

PS. I actually attempted a little edit but I think I slaughtered your already beautiful painting. If you still think you want to see it click here (http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/182/niceviewedit3ap.png). You have been warned. :)

EDIT: Actually, now that I look at my edit again I kind of like it, so I might as well show it in all its glory. :)

(http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/182/niceviewedit3ap.png)
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Helm on Tue 28/02/2006 22:52:36
You render pretty well, it's the composition that's boring, in this case. A flat field, with a rentangular long stripe of water, 90 degree cutout chasm, very ordered, very unnatural.
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Snarky on Wed 01/03/2006 03:01:13
Though your point is valid, Helm, I think the obviously artificial characteristics of the landscape gives it an interesting science fiction feel, like the constructed habitats in Ringworld or Iain Banks' Culture novels.

What I find odd about the scene is how close the horizon is. Judging from the texture of the grass in the foreground and the perspective on the river, the landscapes only extends a few miles away... and then nothing!
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Das Plans on Wed 01/03/2006 08:44:31
Hey there!

Wow, this is exactly the kind of inspiration and incentive I needed! Thanks a dozen for that, Sektor. Now, there's no stopping me. I hope ...  ;)

See you!
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Corey on Wed 01/03/2006 08:51:01
this is all really cool but i still don't know how you make this stuff  :(
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Tuomas on Wed 01/03/2006 10:02:19
What I'd like to know is, where does the golden water come from. As Snarky said, it looks like there's another edge where the water falls, as the horizon stops a bit too close.

Then about the water rushing over the edge. Unlike some people said, I think the water looks just fine despite the colour. The way the river seems to flow onwards doesn't suggest to very much speed. More like calmly floating towards the edge, and therefore it would not jump far from the edge. Otherwise, the water'd need some angle and waves to it too lok like it's going fast.
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Helm on Wed 01/03/2006 10:33:26
QuoteThough your point is valid, Helm, I think the obviously artificial characteristics of the landscape gives it an interesting science fiction feel, like the constructed habitats in Ringworld or Iain Banks' Culture novels.

I agree that this feeling is achieved, or that now that you've rationalized it I cannot help but humour the notion that this occurs, it's not easy to say what goes on. I still think it's better to not risk this, and create naturalistic terrain.
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Sektor 13 on Wed 01/03/2006 16:01:23
Actually I wanted to add moving space ship on that flat part, hovering above the field...

I will try to modified it a bit...
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Tomas on Thu 02/03/2006 18:23:00
So, any takes on my paint-over? Anyone? Sektor 13, would you consider any of the changes I did for an updated version of your pic?
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Sektor 13 on Thu 02/03/2006 19:54:41
Quote from: Tomas on Thu 02/03/2006 18:23:00
So, any takes on my paint-over? Anyone? Sektor 13, would you consider any of the changes I did for an updated version of your pic?

Yes, i am already updating my picture, i have darken some "back" parts as you suggested (drawed) (i will not add the tree because i need place for "new game, load game..."signs on the left side, as the moving ship will be on the right side , althou the tree looks very good) You used some "dream" blur effect it all looks a bit dreamy :) which is good and i am considering it, I added some "bumps" to the field on the right, made a river less streight and darkened the cliff and falling water.

here it is, althou it is not final (i might darken some parts even more, like in Tomass picture).
(http://freeweb.siol.net/zagar413/KZ/niceview2.png)
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Anian on Thu 02/03/2006 22:47:58
that's beautiful that is, sorry no idea how to make it better

how cool would a siloughette figure of a warrior/spearmen watching the sunset look ;D
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens on Fri 03/03/2006 16:32:02
What you could do is place another line of mountains against the backdrop at around 60% transparent or so.  This would make the distance look less flat but still retain much of the work you've done on the sky.  Looks beautiful, by the way.
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Mordalles on Fri 03/03/2006 22:56:39
i would add mountains like progz says, but don't make them transparent, just make them a lighter colour than the mountains infront, a colour closer to the sky.
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: Tomas on Sat 04/03/2006 09:31:59
Quote from: Mordalles on Fri 03/03/2006 22:56:39
i would add mountains like progz says, but don't make them transparent, just make them a lighter colour than the mountains infront, a colour closer to the sky.

You know, I think that's exactly what ProgZmax said. :) And I agree about this. On my first paint-over I actually experimented with something like this, but I thought it looked a bit weird (the way I did it), so I decided not to show it. It looked as if the water was appearing out of nothing and what not.

If anyone wants to see it or if Sektor 13 would want to use it as some sort of reference - here it is. It's not perfect or anything, and quite sketchy, but maybe it will give some ideas.

(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/niceview-edit2.png)
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: DutchMarco on Sat 04/03/2006 17:33:06
Sektor 13, a fabulous looking piece of art. In fear of repeating other comments, there are 3 small things that keep it from being perfect (imho):

1) single mountains don't look natural. Keep the valley idea (no mountains in the middle of the horizon) but put some vague mountains on either side, behind the existing ones.

2) the waterfall will have eroded the edge. This waterfall just seems like a "brand new" straight edge.

3) I think the darker water in Tomas' drawing is more realistic, just like the darker cliff face.

I like what you did to roughen up the terrain a bit, it makes it more natural. Keep up the good work!
Title: Re: Nature on sunset - kind a picture tutorial
Post by: biothlebop on Sat 04/03/2006 19:46:33
I think the main problem with the picture at the moment is the sun and the horizon line. The river could look like that if it was new/temporary (after a period of heavy rain). I think the main problem is the horizon's blurriness and the gradiation around the sun. As it is, it looks like the planet has a huge atmosphere of gas that reflects in the particles in the air.  Since the horizon is so blurry, it suggests that it is far away and fogged out by the atmosphere, which makes the river look broader in the far edge. I'd try to define the sun better, and reduce the number of colors in the sky.