Hi all,
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/bt-citadel.gif)
This is a very rough, 1st. sketch of a citadel/jailhouse for my upcoming game. The cylinder shaped building is located on a huge rock and is viewed from a cliff. A bridge provides access to this rock. The gameworld is alien, in case one wonders about the two suns.
I'm wondering what you people think about this image. Are there things you'd do different? Are there errors that should be fixed? Personally, I have mixed feelings about this composition so constructive feedback is greatly appreciated!
Update:
Here's a fast mock-up of the colours:
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/bt-citadel-col.png)
--Erwin
funky, what's the Strange boxw that comes through the Building?
Quote from: Mephistophilis on Mon 26/07/2004 13:51:54
funky, what's the Strange boxw that comes through the Building?
What box? You mean that line from the frame which is around the entire image? You can ignore the frame.Ã, :)
--Erwin
alright, well funky is all i can really say for now, but if there were two suns positioned ike you have would the not like a really long sun because of the glare?
At the moment it almost looks like an Escher drawing, with the rock coming up out of the ground rather than off in the water.
It's quite hard to see that the cliff falls off a long way. Presumably that would be better in the final image with some colouring.
It's maybe a bit odd that we're looking down on the cliff and half the bridge, but the base of the tower is tilted away from the camera.
Having the suns there means that for realism a lot of your image is going to be in deep shadow.
I like the image. Of course the layout depends on what the room is for. If you're just walking back and forth over the bridge it works fine I think.
Steve
Quote from: SteveMcCrea on Mon 26/07/2004 15:00:46
At the moment it almost looks like an Escher drawing, with the rock coming up out of the ground rather than off in the water.
It's quite hard to see that the cliff falls off a long way. Presumably that would be better in the final image with some colouring.
It's maybe a bit odd that we're looking down on the cliff and half the bridge, but the base of the tower is tilted away from the camera.
Having the suns there means that for realism a lot of your image is going to be in deep shadow.
I like the image. Of course the layout depends on what the room is for. If you're just walking back and forth over the bridge it works fine I think.
Steve
Yeah, I'm aware of the tilted angle of the bridge. The cliff is also on a slope. I'm aiming for a playful, interesting perspective.
Colours should add more depth to this image, so I think I'll just go ahead and colour it.
--Erwin
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/bt-citadel-col.png)
--Erwin
i like it but there's a few things i dont think are right:
-the shadoow recessing on the side of the bridge should be the same on the far side, its been reversed for some reason.
-the dirt next to the foreground of the bridge looks very blurry, doesnt suit the style at all.
-the tower seems too far away conidering the length of the bridge
Apart from that its really cool, i love the pencil sketch in particular :D
I really like the warm colors you've chosen and the tower's contrast against the sky.
It reminds me of the art in Cartoon Network's Samurai Jack (US cable), which is a good thing.
One small critique - Everywhere in the picture you've used very clean bezier lines, but at the foot of the bridge, the border between the bridge and the red dirt is smudged. For consistency's sake, I would prefer a nice clean curve there instead.
Quote from: blackbirdâ,,¢ on Mon 26/07/2004 19:16:50
funky...
but where are the suns
The image isn't completed yet, but only about 65% finished. :)
--Erwin
Quote from: DanClarke on Mon 26/07/2004 19:35:16
i like it but there's a few things i dont think are right:
-the shadoow recessing on the side of the bridge should be the same on the far side, its been reversed for some reason.
Yes, I was experimenting a bit with shadows there. I'll have to fix this.
Quote-the dirt next to the foreground of the bridge looks very blurry, doesnt suit the style at all.
I'm trying to make it look like strokes of sand have been blown over the road and against the wall of the bridge because of the wind. I'm still working on it, but it's not easy to get it into the same style while keeping it look good.
Quote-the tower seems too far away conidering the length of the bridge
You're right. I'll have to decrease the size of the bridge on both sides, especially on the far side.
QuoteApart from that its really cool, i love the pencil sketch in particularÃ, :D
Thanks! :D
The image's far from completed, though. I'll be sure to post a next (final) version soon :)
--Erwin
Quote from: big brother on Mon 26/07/2004 19:44:00
I really like the warm colors you've chosen and the tower's contrast against the sky.
It reminds me of the art in Cartoon Network's Samurai Jack (US cable), which is a good thing.
One small critique - Everywhere in the picture you've used very clean bezier lines, but at the foot of the bridge, the border between the bridge and the red dirt is smudged. For consistency's sake, I would prefer a nice clean curve there instead.
Yeah, I see your point. What do you think about the sand on the road, though? I mean, does it fit the style or should I change it as well?
--Erwin
The sand on the road is fine, just the dune that it comes from isnt crisp enough. The rest looks good.
I know I'm really not helping you reach a decision here...
But I think the sand on the road would look better if it was crisper.
You could try upping its saturation and have a darker outline underneath.
Let me know if you would like me to post an edit.
I think all the outlines should be sharp. You could then maybe have some translucent blown over stuff over the sharp outlines.
great composition btw.
Those patterns on the bridge side have opposite light sources, unless the light is coming from the center of the bridge.
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/bt-citadel2.png)
Well, I've tried to implement a lot of your ideas and this is how it looks so far. Again, the image isn't finished yet but it's getting close.
I've tried to make the lines a bit more defined, while not losing too much of the blurriness. I've tried straight lines and that didn't look too good in my eyes. I've also changed the clouds, the patterns on the bridge (as pointed out by Neole) and added some detail.
I've also placed a character on the bridge, to illustrate the scaling of this image.
The image has been shrunk down, btw, so it might look more blurry then it really is.
I'll continue working on this image tomorrow. Any further ideas/suggestions/comments are of course greatly appreciatedÃ, :D
Big Brother: I'm really interested in what you'd do with those strokes of sand, so go ahead if you pleaseÃ, :)
--Erwin
At first, when the oencil sketch was opening I had a very different vision, something as the jail was Alcatraz and connected to the city like San Francisco.
It was really weird and cool.
Now I see where you're getting and it's ok.
This is somewhat what i saw in my head in that second when it was half open.
(http://www.inet.hr/~slorenci/other/citadel.gif)
edit:
hmm, but now that i've seen these other versions, i just can't get the picture back into my head...
:(
C. 8)
Yeah, Czar had the same thoughts I did. Like the scene in that one Batman movie.
There could be some shadows on the bridge where it touches the island thing. Maybe casts from the building.
I like it alot.
Perspective of the bridge is off. Like it has a twist in it
The middle column on the citadel needs to contrast against the top of the building. On my screen, the column and top blends together.
Looking even better!
I liked the earlier clouds more, but this gives it a very stylized look that I think you should keep.
Squashed sun looks great. Brambles dont fit in well. Either they shud be stylized or removed IMO. Not sure bout those curved things on the mountains.
Only other thing I can think of changing is the curves on the front red ground. Its contour is too bumpy, I think it would look better with a couple of gentler curves instead of all those little ones.
If that mist thing at the cliff base could be animated (even with 2 frames) that would be fabulous, but it looks great anyways.
Quote from: kingsize on Tue 27/07/2004 21:17:24
I like it alot.
Perspective of the bridge is off.Ã, Like it has a twist in it
The middle column on the citadel needs to contrast against the top of the building. On my screen, the column and top blends together.
Hehe, I know the bridge has a twist in it. That's on purpose. :)
But you're right about the middle column, though.
--Erwin
Quote from: Neole on Tue 27/07/2004 22:37:22
Looking even better!
I liked the earlier clouds more, but this gives it a very stylized look that I think you should keep.
Squashed sun looks great. Brambles dont fit in well. Either they shud be stylized or removed IMO. Not sure bout those curved things on the mountains.
Only other thing I can think of changing is the curves on the front red ground. Its contour is too bumpy, I think it would look better with a couple of gentler curves instead of all those little ones.
If that mist thing at the cliff base could be animated (even with 2 frames) that would be fabulous, but it looks great anyways.
Nooo, not my beautiful brambles! :P Seriously, though; what's wrong with them? How would you improve them?
I'd love to animate the mist, but I have no clue how to do it properly (or realistically). All I can think of is slowly cross-fading between two pictures.
Funny you mention the curves in the foreground. I was just changing the curves in the background, in the area just before the hills start.
--Erwin
Ok, here's an edit of the sand on the road.
I hope it doesn't look too much like sludge now, but I used the pen tool to draw the outlines (as well as the slight purple shade and the darker red on the underside).
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/erwinedit.png)
On your updated pic, I actually really like the brambles, but maybe that's just me (I'm a sucker for dark foregrounds).
The brambles are very unstylized compared to the rest of the picture. They also look too cluttered and too tiny (almost rectangularish in that their width and heights are almost the same). I would prefer them more stylized (like the clouds) and make them taller than they are wide. Plus all the brambles look very similar, they should be different in shape direction and size. Also the foreground brambles can be very dark, but the more distant ones could be lighter colored to convey a bit of distance.
If the mist is a separate transparent layer, you could just move it a bit and change the curves with the smudge tool (set to mazimum opacity, or therabouts). Use 3 such variations and it should work and look like moving mist. Sort of like ripples on a lake or waves on a sea you can animate with just 2-3 frames.