Bye Bye Bass ... and good riddance!!

[BernieLaraemie]

I'm in Niagara Falls, and we have no smoking indoors.  It's good, because then bars aren't smoky.  It's bad, because the bars don't often follow it and they get fined and have to close.

As for the bass issue, if the bass nullifies the treble, it's too loud.  If I can recognise the song from the bassline and you're down the street, that's bad too.

When I worked at a mall, I'd play Elton and Queen's greatest hits, because they were the only things in my collection "lite" enough.  And the urban store across the way would haev games with the record store to see who could be louder with their dance tracks.

Now, I love dance, I love bass and I own several items from both stores, but when I'm next to our store's stereo and I can't hear Elton (who is screaming about what a b*tch he is at full volume) there is a problem.

~~Bernie

[Sylpher]

I guess I have to stand up against the majority. I do agree that this in no way justifies it, but you have to keep in mind that many of these people break much higher risk crimes on a nearly daily (or nightly) interval. The reason why the music is so loud isn't because they want to annoy or distort the sound at all (some might...) They do it because when bass is loud enough you can feel it punch, literally. It may come at your discomfort, too which I am truly sorry, but there are few feelings that match driving in a tightly assembled sporty car with the 'drums' pounding so hard you can feel them.

Again, I agree it doesn't justify anything.. Just hoping you understand a bit more of why it is done. Personally, poorly modded mufflers are much more annoying then bass. Often times a poorly assembled muffler can be heard from a much greater distance.

This has been a pretty long ongoing battle in Arizona and California. And although you may be happy to hear the law passed.. It won't do much. The only way they can prove the dB output is to set up special sensory devices that can measure each car that passes. They may do this once in awhile to scare people, but the majority of time and resources will be put into other, "more important" things.

The old "your word against the cop" argument is just a scare tactic too. If someone acctually gets a ticket for this all you have to do is go to the courthouse and dispute it. A majority of the time it will be dropped simply cause the cop won't want to spend time to fight it. And if the cop does deceide to show up, all you have to do is request proof of the incident (Much like a speeding ticket.. unless a cop catches you on radar and records it they cannot give you a ticket for speeding) unless the cop has one of these specialized devices, out and ready (which is fairly rare) the charges will be dropped.

That isn't all! The actual driving manual here states that (and this was before laws got much more strict) no extreme traces of any sounds can be heard from your automobile at a distance greater then 50 ft, or over the level which emergency sirens cannot be heard. So, all the cop has to do is prove he was greater than 50 ft and heard the music.. aye? NO! Oye, I'm way too tired to explain why, but basically proper systems are setup to be extremely loud at a close distance, but not travel very far.. The ones that you can hear inside a building and such are dumb kids who just got a job at Best Buy and don't know what the hell they are doing.

I can see how it is annoying, but honestly.. I live in a city where there are literally more auto/audio/mod shops within a 5 mile radius then libraries, schools and I would even guess taco shops (and there are a lot of those) combined. It is extremely popular here.. and driving around on any average day I might (might!) hear 1 or 2 people with extremely over bearing systems, and maybe a half a dozen with systems I can somewhat hear (with my music shut off).

It may be a bit annoying, but unless it happend at every single stoplight every single day (which has never happend to me and I drive halfway across the city every day).. I, personally, don't think it is as big of a deal and as much of an annoying ordeal as most are making it out to be.

And for the record... I keep my music at a moderate level. You would have a difficult time making it out, let alone really hearing it if your windows are up. Dealing with people, even if what they do annoys you, is a part of life. I have pulled up next to plenty of people who are smoking, and the smoke travels in ample amounts in my car compromsing my health and really it is really just nasty and rude. I'm not going to yell at them to put it out or hope for laws that require people to not smoke while in their car.. I'll simply roll up my window or pull up closer to the car in front of me.. Unless it is a traffic jam I'm not going to be there very long, and it doesn't happen often enough to really affect me or my health in any great (or even small) way. But it is annoying as all hell.

In short.. accept it. You are only making things harder on yourself being all frownies because honestly.. it isn't going anywhere.

If it wasn't apparent, because I am much too tired to make my post roses and kittens. This is simply my opinion.. I am sorry if I made it seem like more then that.

[passer-by]

I admit I'm a person who has the music loud only when I feel like singing along and I don't want neighbours to suffer... but I don't mind loud noise in places like clubs or cafes or parties, because music is part of them...although I prefer it when IÃ,  can hear people's voices. But in a car, what is the purpose of it?Ã,  (Yes, I 've read your post, Sylpher,Ã,  still can't see a reason...)

They do it because when bass is loud enough you can feel it punch, literally. It may come at your discomfort, too which I am truly sorry, but there are few feelings that match driving in a tightly assembled sporty car with the 'drums' pounding so hard you can feel them.

My question is" How they can actually drive in that noise??"
I've seen professional drivers making it in much more difficult situations, but the average person usually can't drive when they are "distracted". Not to mention that in this particular case they like disobeying rules anyway...

And although you may be happy to hear the law passed.. It won't do much.

I'll have to agree.

but basically proper systems are setup to be extremely loud at a close distance, but not travel very far.. The ones that you can hear inside a building and such are dumb kids who just got a job at Best Buy and don't know what the hell they are doing.

This doesn't seem to be the case when I'm stuck in a car in a trafifc jam behind somebody who likes their music loud, or when they are parked under my windowsÃ,  at ungodly hours...and I'm a working person.

Dealing with people, even if what they do annoys you, is a part of life......

Too true, but it doesn't make it right. Annoying people is not as serious as a theft, for example, but it still doesnt make it right.Ã, 
What about when there are peopleÃ,  around who rely on their senses to cross a road?

[Darth Mandarb]

but there are few feelings that match driving in a tightly assembled sporty car with the 'drums' pounding so hard you can feel them.

So you don't care that it's annoying to most of the people around you?  I mean, if you're traveling down the expressway booming bass I could care less 'cause chances are people can't hear that.  But traveling [slowly] down a side street there's simply no cause for it.  It should be turned down.  (heavy traffic on the freeway should cause it to be turned down as well ... bad enough I'm stuck in traffic but I have to be annoyed by bass as well)

The only way they can prove the dB output is to set up special sensory devices that can measure each car that passes.

Actually it's being left up entirely to a cop's descetion (which I say bravo too!) and requires no measuring equipment.  If he can hear your stereo from more than 25 feet away, you lose.

The old "your word against the cop" argument is just a scare tactic too. If someone acctually gets a ticket for this all you have to do is go to the courthouse and dispute it. A majority of the time it will be dropped simply cause the cop won't want to spend time to fight it.

I'm trying to find what the "victim's" rights are after the ticket is issued ... I believe, from what I've heard on the news, that it's not something you can contest.  You simply have to pay it.  But I doubt that's the case (I sure hope it is though)

It may be a bit annoying, but unless it happend at every single stoplight every single day (which has never happend to me and I drive halfway across the city every day).. I, personally, don't think it is as big of a deal and as much of an annoying ordeal as most are making it out to be.

Well ... if I were to leave right now to take a drive, I would be choking on bass at every stop light I get stopped at.  Gas stations, parking lots, it's everywhere and it's rediculous.  These dolts down here have contests to see who can out-do [IE louder bass] the other.

In short.. accept it. You are only making things harder on yourself being all frownies because honestly.. it isn't going anywhere.

We'll see about that ... my father and I are working on a "little device".  I won't say more about it ... but it'll be a hoot if/when we finish it!!

I found this article from the Tampa Tribune and I'd like to talk about it.  In this article they interview a genious of a man named Mike Mills who spouts such mind-blowing wisdom as;

"You can hear a person talking from 25 feet away ... Twenty-five feet is absolutely ridiculous. If I sneeze or talk 25 feet away, I should get a ticket, too.'"

And this little gem about luxury cars with ultra-quiet interiors.

"They purposely make it so quiet [drivers] can't hear ... an ambulance until it's on top of them... That's simply no different from having a stereo on.

Okay first of all, a person talking from 25 ft. away sounds like a whisper and isn't causing the items around you to bounce and rattle you fuckin' dolt.

And secondly, it is VASTLY different than a car stereo.  The luxury cars are designed to "balance" the noise levels while specifically allowing high pitched sounds, such as emergency sirens, in.  AND the quiet interior of a luxury car doesn't annoy people around you.  What a moron.

One more little chunk of intelligence from good ol' Mr. Mills:

"[Your car is one of] the very few places where you can hear music ... how loud you want it. You're going down the road not hurting anybody."

Maybe not physical pain you jack-ass but it's annoying and dumb.

I can see why Mr. Mills is up in arms.  After all, he makes money off installing these pointless stereo systems that cause annoyance to FAR more people than they give pleasure.

So a vast minority of people derive pleasure from something that causes discomfort to the majority ...  So I guess the majority should just accept it huh?

Gosh ... we wouldn't want to offend these idiots by forcing them to obey the LAW!!

[shbaz]

The only way they can prove the dB output is to set up special sensory devices that can measure each car that passes.

Actually it's being left up entirely to a cop's descetion (which I say bravo too!) and requires no measuring equipment.  If he can hear your stereo from more than 25 feet away, you lose.

The old "your word against the cop" argument is just a scare tactic too. If someone acctually gets a ticket for this all you have to do is go to the courthouse and dispute it. A majority of the time it will be dropped simply cause the cop won't want to spend time to fight it.

I'm trying to find what the "victim's" rights are after the ticket is issued ... I believe, from what I've heard on the news, that it's not something you can contest.  You simply have to pay it.  But I doubt that's the case (I sure hope it is though)

Speed tickets are left to a cop's discretion too, but that's not his point, the point is that if they can't prove something and provide measurable evidence then it's simply hearsay and most of the time if you go to court to contest it the ticket will be thrown out or at least reduced. Many, many municipalities have laws like this, including my hometown, and they are simply not enforcable.

I don't ever hope for a law that is entirely up to a cop's word against someone else's, if you've ever been pulled over by a cop having a bad day you'd know what I mean. Going 5 mph over the speed limit (like everyone else on the road) and have a look of youth about you that the cop doesn't take to? Get prepared for a bogus ticket on how loud your exhaust is (happened to an older brother) which you will need to go to court to contest and have revoked (in case someone wants to argue with this, he had paperwork proving it was legal).

I don't like listening to it either, but the law is unenforcable and may allow for harrassment.

[Dart]

I'm in Niagara Falls, and we have no smoking indoors.  It's good, because then bars aren't smoky.  It's bad, because the bars don't often follow it and they get fined and have to close.

Ottawa (the LOVELY city I used to live in) had that same rule too: no smoking in any bar or restaurant. Any. And if you're caught smoking, you'll have to pay the fee of $500.

Heh, this made non-smokers happy, but apparently some restaurants went out of business for this reason. Oh wells.

[Sylpher]

Wee, more awake!

I agree it is annoying. I agree it is inconsiderate. I was just trying to shed some light on why people do it. In my experiences the less you care about it the less it annoys. It is much more about self(ish) satisfaction then overtly trying to annoy someone. Then again, some people are out to just annoy (if you have ever played any game online for a good amount of time you can agree).

My question is" How they can actually drive in that noise??"

I used to think the same thing. I used to drive with no music at all and my windows down so I could be completely aware of all my surroundings. Which is silly and over paranoid. Very few situations require you to explicitly hear rather then see and react.

Well ... if I were to leave right now to take a drive, I would be choking on bass at every stop light I get stopped at.  Gas stations, parking lots, it's everywhere and it's rediculous..

I think you are exaggerating. I could be wrong, but it just doesn't add up.

I'm trying to find what the "victim's" rights are after the ticket is issued ... I believe, from what I've heard on the news, that it's not something you can contest.

I doubt it, being that is unconstitutional. Everyone has the right to contest charges against them.

Too true, but it doesn't make it right. Annoying people is not as serious as a theft, for example, but it still doesnt make it right.

I agree. However, it is a minor inconvenience. I can think of much more annoying and completely lawful things people do in public which you have to put up with. Unless it is a much bigger issue of distrubing the peace (The only law that really holds water on this, imo) in which someone is parked across the street from your house and has it going non-stop for half an hour or such, or systems start getting so crazy they crack your windshield or something it isn't really that big of a deal.

Then again.. I enjoy listening to Lightning Bolt.

[Las Naranjas]

I agree with Sylpher that it's stupid and annoying, but not a criminal matter. You might as well pass a law to ban wearing pants around your arse....

Restrictions on smoking are another matter, since bass doesn't give illnesses to passive listeners, plus, you carry the stink of other people's smoke in your hair and clothes long after they've gone, bass dissapears into the ether.

Thing is, if we were to really crack down on stupid behaiviour in cars, we'd have to simply ban the damn things. They cause more death and injuries than almost any other element in society, and the intelligence of anyone who gets in one drops aout 40% as soon as they get behind the wheel, leaving them a degrenerate blob of anger who blames their speeding on cops or...well...thinks that loud bass is a criminal manner.

[Alun]

You might as well pass a law to ban wearing pants around your arse....

That's been tried, too (though the bill ended up being defeated).

[passer-by]

Restrictions on smoking are another matter, since bass doesn't give illnesses to passive listeners, plus, you carry the stink of other people's smoke in your hair and clothes long after they've gone, bass dissapears into the ether.

As a non-smoker, I agree ...especially with the remark about the hair , grrrr .
But I'd like to add that loud bass is like any loud nise to me. Loud noises do cause health damages (ears, nervous system etc, no time to specify, but I can list my sources later if you like).
Oh, and what about sleep?? Isn't it unhealthy to be unable to sleep, because someone with the music on woke up the dogs , who woke up the neighbour's baby, who keeps crying all night from then on?

Thing is, if we were to really crack down on stupid behaiviour in cars, we'd have to simply ban the damn things. They cause more death and injuries than almost any other element in society,

We could also ban electricity or fire, too many deaths. :-\Ã,  Or golden flip flops...annoying.
On the other hand, we could just improve the condition of the roads, give the drivers better driving lessons, some education on the code and information about the damages they causeÃ,  when they are irresponsible.

and the intelligence of anyone who gets in one drops aout 40% as soon as they get behind the wheel

I don't think it's the car, but their ego. Most people drive carefully and responsibly, but it takes one big ego loose in the streets to cause an accident...

[TheYak]

There are some pretty good arguments on both sides of the issue.  I don't think it should be illegal unless it can be determined to be a case of disturbing the peace and - even so - warrant a minor fine (on an upward scale for repeated infractions e.g. $10, $25, $50).

I'm not sure about laws in other states or countries, but there's basically no limit to your stereo volume if you're driving on a highway (which can be streched to include all roads 45MPH and over, as well as any road with three or more lanes) in California.  The extreme bass annoys the hell out of me, but I suck it up and deal with it while I'm driving.  If I wanted to, I could be doing the same thing, I just choose not to exercise that right.  I have my music at very loud volumes, but it's seldom very audible beyond 5-10 feet from my vehicle (windows down).  The way low frequencies travel, however, it has a way of going through solid objects and causing not only audio annoyance but physical disturbance. 

"It's my right," or "you need to lighten up" are piss-poor arguments when justifying why your music needs so much bass versus somebody complaining that the audio is annoying, having your chest pulse with the beat is annoying (and, for some, nauseating), having walls shake and rattle and (as I've witnessed, but only twice) pictures falling off the wall that've been there for years. 

I work the graveyard shift.  I am constantly irritated by the daytime  noise, but it's something I have to deal with.  The schedule is my choice and they do pay me a differential.  However, there's a pretty significant difference between lawnmowing, dogs barking, kids screaming and construction taking place blocks away.  For one, these are either beyond one person's ability to control or basic upkeep necessities.  The bigger difference is that I can insert earplugs and block out most sound.  The one exception I've found is the bass coming from stereos of passing idiots blasting their music in a residential area or - worse - the same sort of fool with his SUV's trunk open blasting loud music.  I'm sure it's enjoyment for many, but there are certainly some that are showing off their stereos more so.  I'd like you to be able to enjoy your music... just respect my right not to have to listen to it while in the privacy of my own home.  If that request doesn't sound reasonable, then it's not a symptom of youth as much as one of a lack of character.

(All "You" references meant in the collectively vague sense)

The smoking in cars argument hits both the offense and defense (which is admirable).  It's irritating but blockable, whereas the bass is not (again, I don't see much problem with the bass in high-traffic areas).  The argument that somebody is endangering your health is amusing.  Exactly what quantity of toxins do you think you're inhaling just by driving with your window open (or vent blowing non-recirculated, probably non-filtered air)?  It's more than you get from an inhalation of cigarette smoke.  In fact, the amount of toxins you ingest while in the average 1/2 hour traffic jam is as hazardous as if you'd smoked (not second-hand) 1/4 pack of cigarettes in a 24-hour period.  The toll-collectors for the Golden Gate Bridge get paid quite a lot of money for a very simple job ($19.00/hr to start. Minimum wage is ~$7.00) - primarily because they've got horrible healthcare coverage in what's considered a "Constantly hazardous work environment."

I will agree that it's irritating, and not being as used to the smell as you are car exhaust, smells bad.  I would also go a bit further and say that the smokers who smoke in their vehicle with stopped cars all around them (like in a traffic-jam) on a day where people are likely to have their windows rolled down are being pretty damned inconsiderate.  The same for those who smoke right next to businesses' entrances, allowing smoke to waft in with every arriving or departing customer.  Those who smoke at a playground are being pretty inconsiderate as well, even if there's enough breeze and space that no children are inhaling it, it seems pretty irresponsible to demonstrate the bad habit in front of them.

[MaiSacNjo Mouf]

quote]

That's awesome!!  Eddy Izzard rules!
That guy is so funny! 
This is from Dress to Kill, if you guys havn't seen it, watch it.  Seriously.  Do it, do it.

[magintz]

Damn, this title got me both outraged and annoyed. I Read the title and being in an adventurey state of mind whilst browsing these forums instantly thought "Beneath a steal sky... gone.... and good riddance?!?!!"

Gladly I was relieved to find it was't a typo in the title (Bass instead of BASS). Way to go Florida, lets hope some other places pick up on this innitiative.