Female teacher insults islam or something

[SSH]

Fluffy bunnies

[Meowster]

Lovely article on BBC... the opinion of one UK Sudanese man: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7122562.stm

[Nightfable]

Thanks for the article, Yufster.

[auriond]

I cannot imagine comparing insulting biological mother to a church I attend, but from atheist viewpoint it should make some sense: If you take a fairy tale seriously enough to live by it, why not have so strong feelings about arguments against it. This much I understand, at least I think I do.

Thanks for understanding It's a rare person who does actually see and understand that there is method in a religious person's "madness", although I do appreciate that acceptance is another matter altogether. I just wished to point out that we can have discussions about religion without resorting to insults (and here I just want to emphasise again that I'm against insults, and not criticism).

I don't judge any religion, but I do judge people.
Using God as a shield and excuse from humanly evil and/or stupidity is wrong.
That's what I think.

There I agree with you very strongly.

Lovely article on BBC... the opinion of one UK Sudanese man: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7122562.stm

Great article, thanks Yufster! I was just thinking that the one voice missing from this discussion was the voice of the Muslims themselves, so this was a timely post. I know and respect a lot of Muslims in my own life, and I know they would be shocked and saddened by the original article - and they would be further saddened by the general response to it. I think they would agree with Dr Hassan.

[RickJ]

Don't you think that when two people from different religions plan marriage that they ought to agree under which religious tradition they will raise their children before they get married?

It all seems reasonable on paper, but being in that situation sucks.  Just look at the very quote that you wrote:  "...when two people plan marriage..." This particular bit of dogma really makes if feel like "A couple billion people vs. one."  I realize that they have the right to impose that condition since their religion is officiating, but it doesn't mean that I have to like it.

I'm a non-Catholic.  My wife is Catholic.  If my mother should wish to take her grandchild to her own church one Sunday, is my wife obligated to protest?  Is she obligated to explain to our child what's "wrong" about our doctrines beforehand?

Is that what you agreed to when you signed the document?   I have a feeling that it is silent on that point, isn't it and that it's something that you and your wife have never talked about before right?  Now your mother wants to take your daughter to her church so that she can show your daughter off to her friends, otherwise she would just take your daughter to a Catholic church.   The only other reason for not taking your daughter to a Catholic would be to undermine her Catholic teachings which is a violation of what you agreed to when you married your wife.  If this is the case shame on your mother for even attempting this at this.

As I understand it your obligation was to see to it that she got the catholic training.  I was raised catholic in a mixed household the same as your daughter.  I just had to take some classes a couple of hours on Saturday morning for a couple of years.  So I know the drill.  Probably what your wife is objecting to is the fact that Catholics are taught that attending a non-catholic church is a venial sin and she doesn't want your daughter to commit a sin, not even a little one.     

If your daughter did commit such a sin, the Catholic church would sentence her to say a half dozen "Hail Marys".  You're bringing this up in the context of the insanity mainfested, far too often, by practicioners of Islam, where your daughter would be facing a death sentence.   You can't be serious about making such a comparison can you?   

[SSH]

She's apparently been pardoned today!

[OneDollar]

15 days in prison and deportation, she seems to be being very calm about it. Did anyone read the bottom of this article http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7123517.stm, where it was suggested that the protests were planned?

[Candall]

Whoah, RickJ... hang on a second.  I didn't make the nature of my position completely clear.

I don't have any children yet, and I have most definitely not signed any documents.  That was the responsibility of my wife.  Since I have no particular problem with Catholicism as a faith, I did not protest her signing said document.

As for my mother, of course she'd want to show off her grandchild.  Beyond that, why should she be expected to go to a Catholic service when her own personal beliefs do not hold with some of Catholocism's?  It's not an evil plot to reprogram the child's mind.  It's about being in the church that you love surrounded by the people that you love.  I'm sorry if there's no room for that in Catholic doctrine, but neither me nor my wife would dream of robbing my mother of that experience.  The question is what the Catholic Church would expect my wife to do.  Your suggestion that we haven't talked about what we're going to do when faced with this situation was a bit unfair, I feel.  We have most certainly discussed it... one thing about the Catholic Church that I do appreciate is their insistence that anyone wishing to wed under their roof be subjected to counseling.  Note that we had already talked about it even before that.

The most important point that I have to make here above all others is that I am not comparing Catholicism to Islam.  My original post was in response to someone's remark about what the Catholic Church "forces" people to do.  I even prefaced my input with the phrase "'force' is a strong word."

I absolutely do not appreciate the Catholic Church's methods of gaining the dominant hand in Catholic/Non-Catholic marriages.  I have no intention of deliberately offending any Catholics, but I won't sit on my opinion, either.

[Nightfable]

No one can say it quite like Pat Condell... He definitely got my subscription.

[Nacho]

Just wanted to pop up and say:"Glad it finished well!" 

To Caesar what belongs to Caesar, firstly the Sudanese goofed, now fixed it somehow.

[Stupot]

Half of the people in Muslim countires name their own children Mohammad.  Surely she could have argued that the Teddy bear was being named after some guy from the market.

[Khris]

Damn, thanks for those Pat Condell links. I almost fell of my chair because I was laughing so hard.

Here's another one:

Why does faith deserve respect?

[Tuomas]

My thoughts exactly on this video here. I'll quote him when I get children of my own. I really liked his reference to a tupé... And I have little respect for religion, but I do have respect for say, my mom, grandma, and my girlfriend, but yeah, not for their beliefs.

[Rui 'Trovatore' Pires]

This Condell fellow is quite something. Love the way he talks, and his presentation. Great speaker.

Oh, and he says right things, as well. But that's subjective, the former was objective.

[Nikolas]

Heh.

Very nice videos. And it works as a video, cause he is a great talker and his faces shows that!

Thanks!