Had a big old post prepared but deleted it in favor of the pertinent - which is this:
Has any one here either gone through an AA twelve steps thing, had any other alcoholism treaments or similar, or known anyone who has, and wouldn't mind sharing their experiences or knowledge with and of? What was involved? How effective were they?
Cheers and basket fulls of kittens in advance.
I have gone through 10 steps of Anti Alias, yes.
Oh you mean That AA?
No.
I'm with the RAC.
Hello everyone, my name is Shawn and I'm an alcoholic.
I tend to drink too much beer after work. I went to a couple of AA meetings, but didn't like it.
My brother attended one of those programs for a while. He enjoyed the insights into why he abused alcohol, and how it impacted his social life. In the end he got the idea that only socializing through boozing had stagnated his social maturity, which was somehow at the root of his insecurities. Of course then he just went on drinking, but it wasn't as if he was having the stuff for breakfast. Binge drinking or spree drinking is what they call it in these parts. Perhaps he'll grow out of it.
I guess in the end you'll only get out of it what you put into it.
Baron
I've known people who went through the AA program, and several of the steps involve acknowledging that there is a god. I have a real problem with that, since it can't possibly be a necessary step in combating alcoholism and only serves to toss out atheists.
http://www.oc-aa.org/1212.htm
Worked for one woman I knew, had noticeable effects on a guy who was friend of a friend, didn't work at all for another guy 'cause he never thought it was a problem in the first place.
According to this quiz type thing, from the AA, on whether I should seek their help:
http://www.aa.org/en_is_aa_for_you.cfm?PageID=71
..I scored a 3 out of 12. 4 and I "have a problem". Considering I know I've got an alcohol problem, the AA fails to inspire me with any confidence.
"3 - Have you ever switched from one kind of drink to another in the hope that this would keep you from getting drunk?"
This one, for example. I've got a problem if I switch to a weaker drink? I used to switch to stronger stuff to get wasted quicker, but that apparently means I'm fine.
And these aren't just a few random questions, like some silly online quiz to find out which member of n*sync i'm most like, or how Japanese I am. This is something these folk claim to have spent time on.
The point I guess I'm heading towards, is that I personally wouldn't want to rely on these guys to help me, when they've got helping themselves to deal with.
Shbaz, taken from the AA site:
There’s a lot of talk about God, though, isn’t there?
The majority of A.A. members believe that we have found the solution to our drinking problem not through individual willpower, but through a power greater than ourselves. However, everyone defines this power as he or she wishes. Many people call it God, others think it is the A.A. group, still others don’t believe in it at all. There is room in A.A. for people of all shades of belief and nonbelief.
Anyhow, in conclusion, AA's not for me. I know I have a problem, I just don't intend to "fix" it. I doesn't interfere with social stuff, as I don't socialise anymore. It was never a problem for work, as I knew "work means money means booze". I had a hangover most work days, but I carried on regardless. A few years ago, I quit booze for six months. I felt a little bit healthier, but I was pretty miserable (this was back when I was socialising, too). First binge lasted three days, and I felt alive again. Currently, I'm sober as I'm between jobs (moved to a town with little prospects, not sacked or anything). It's not fun. If I had money, I'd be drunk right now.
It's not so much that I'm addicted to alcohol, as it is that I dislike life in general. If it wasn't alcohol, I'd likely be taking the edge of with something else. (Which I did for brief periods. Never "addictions" as they lasted a month every couple of years, a best. Usually just one-offs. I'd certainly do them again if the situation felt right).
I'm NOT suggesting people abuse things, though. I know it's not healthy, I just don't care, for various reasons, that I'd rather not get into here. The rest of you should seek help if and when you feel you need it, but the main step is actually *wanting* to fix things.
That quiz seems rather stupid to me, I'm sorry to say. And the whole idea behind AA and the organisation (not the fact that they want to help alcoholics) seems also rather retarded...
Or at least it seems for the extremely desperate. I mean even people who drink daily and might cause problems or at least financial problems, or etc, don't seem to really pass the test. Weird
Whoa, 3 ouf of 12 for a person who has an alcohol problem. And I got 6 out of 12. Great test :D Unfortunately I don't consider myself having a problem with alcohol, yeah they say that denial is one of the stages of the problem :D (others admit they have a problem and the rest deny it, so everybody has a problem?)
I find gathering weekly and spending an hour or two talking about alcohol making you actually want to drink more.
No I haven't attended to meetings like this, I don't have any drinking problems, but I know people who do and I can swear that there's no earthly or unearthly force that could help them aside from themselves.
To get rid of alcohol, one should live a happy life. Desperation is what makes people drink and that's the whole source of all this.
I've always had this theory that drugs nor alcohol won't change how we feel. All this euphoria, bravery, etc is inside us and drugs bring it out. But we can learn to bring it out without ANY chemical aid, so why drink?
Quote from: Renal Shutdown on Thu 17/01/2008 10:50:29
According to this quiz type thing, from the AA, on whether I should seek their help:
http://www.aa.org/en_is_aa_for_you.cfm?PageID=71
..I scored a 3 out of 12. 4 and I "have a problem". Considering I know I've got an alcohol problem, the AA fails to inspire me with any confidence.
It's interesting. I took that very test and I got 4 out of 12. And I've never been drunk in my entire life.
I guess it's about how you interpret the questions. :P
Shbaz, I'm glad someone brought that up. I wanted to say something about the religiousness of AA but I don't know anyone who's gone through it and have no experience with the place. Just what I've read.
I don't like the idea of taking someone who is not in control and telling them to give all control they don't have to The Jesus (http://thatgayjesus.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/you-dont-fuck-with-tha-jesus.jpg).
I am always drunk, even when I don't drink. What can I do? Is there some kind of accosiation for this?
Working in a pub I have had experiences with many types of Drinkers. There is no way one could define a person by how much they drink or how many days a week they drink or if they drink in a social environment by themselves or with friends as an alcoholic.
The way I see it is that if you are drunk every waking hour you have an alcohol problem.
If you crave alcohol, you might be depressed, or you might be an alcoholic. (self-medicating)
If you drink on your own, you might be depressed because you have no friends, you might like your own company more than others, or you might be an alcoholic.
If you binge drink you are either between 15-30 years old or you are depressed or you might be an alcoholic.
If you drink at home on your own, there is no problem, every likes a quiet drink. Or you might be an alcohlic.
There is no real definition of what an alcoholic is. I guess if you choose to drink an alcoholic beverage you aren't. If you have no self-control, then you are.
I don't really see binge drinking as an issue. If we all followed the recommended drinking allowance, no one would bother drinking!
Drinking is a poison yes. But it has been around for thousands of years.
Oh, and one thing I'd like to point out. DO THE AA think they are better than JESUS. He was a bit of a wino. He could turn water into the stuff, and not through a long fermentation period using grapes!
The AA should remove all references to jesus and religion out of their texts to give impartial advice, not biased by the lies of god. Even though Jesus could turn water into wine. Which is a neat trick.
Quote from: Renal Shutdown on Thu 17/01/2008 10:50:29
taken from the AA site:
There's a lot of talk about God, though, isn't there?
The majority of A.A. members believe that we have found the solution to our drinking problem not through individual willpower, but through a power greater than ourselves. However, everyone defines this power as he or she wishes. Many people call it God, others think it is the A.A. group, still others don't believe in it at all. There is room in A.A. for people of all shades of belief and nonbelief.
This is true, they say that. Most people familiar with it say it's a separate religion. Thing is, it doesn't work out practically when you involve groups of people raised in the bible belt, probably even in some liberal regions. I know it to be a fact that there's little ambiguity in my region about what god and whose god it is. The meetings all take place in churches, I've never heard of one in another public place. Often they use the opportunity to encourage attendance to their institution, which as Collossal has pointed out, is a really shady thing to do to someone in such a fragile state. This info is all secondhand from the woman I know who gave up alcohol, probably subject to widespread variation. The actual truth of it in the new century I don't know, because it's been about 20 years since she did it.
Talking about it makes me want a drink, and I've been sober for 17 days now.
I went 6 weeks without drinking beer, and then i had to have it and grabbed myself a 6 pack and sucked it down.
I do not drink all the time, but when i do, it is too many.
But for some reason i always say God forgive me and let me get through this.
I know i can beat this demon eventually.
Shbaz:
Things are probably quite different for y'all in the US and us in the UK. Closest thing to a bible belt for us lot is busy keeping some priest's pants up, which is a no doubt a good thing.
As for the meetings being held in churches? Despite the Jesus factor, they're probably the cheapest option, least busy at the times they hold the meetings, and big enough to hold the group. What other options are their? I'd like to say "hold it in a pub", but that kind of defeats the point of the meetings.
Civic centers, city hall, VFW halls (veteran of foreign war - they're even in tiny cities), schools, American Legion, Mason halls (they're all about doing things for public good, right?). Those are in every medium sized American city and also cheap, maybe even free for something like AA. Pubs and restauraunts aren't really popular meeting places here, only for short get-togethers to celebrate something before going elsewhere. There's a big stigma around alcohol consumption here that keeps most groups and employers distanced from it except for special occasions.
Quote from: Layabout on Thu 17/01/2008 16:33:39
Oh, and one thing I'd like to point out. DO THE AA think they are better than JESUS.
Oh no -_- not that again. At this point I might actually sypmathise with the AA :D
Quote from: shbaz on Fri 18/01/2008 03:09:02
schools
Heh. Imagine some random ten-year-old kid walking in. "Hi dad!" :)
Quote from: Disco on Fri 18/01/2008 03:21:38
Quote from: Layabout on Thu 17/01/2008 16:33:39
Oh, and one thing I'd like to point out. DO THE AA think they are better than JESUS.
Oh no -_- not that again. At this point I might actually sypmathise with the AA :D
Hahaha. Sorry Disco, little dig. It's my argument for everything.
As for shbaz, in the UK, the opposite is true, it doesnt need to be a special occasion for employers/employees or groups to go to the pub reguarly. It's actively encourage.
Penn & Teller's Bullshit says the AA's longterm success rate is pretty comparable to the success rate of quitting alcohol without AA. Getting statistics from television shows is awful form, mind you, and Bullshit has a somewhat variable trackrecord, but if you are considering attending AA, hunting down some reliable success statistics would probably be a good idea.