iTunes DRM...what the hell?

[monkey0506]

I've never really been one for purchasing a lot of things (read as: anything) from iTunes, until I was looking around and found that at the time it was the only available way to legally purchase full episodes and seasons of a certain TV show that I watch. This was some time ago, and I do enjoy being able to pull up an episode and watch it at my leisure. There's some problems though...

The videos are DRM protected so that I can only watch them by using the iTunes software or an iDevice that is synched up to my account (of which I own exactly zero iDevices). Okay, fine, whatever. I already have the software installed anyway.

I also frequently use my roommate's computer (which is hooked to the TV in the living room), so I also downloaded my shows onto that computer (read as: I copied them with a thumb drive). When I loaded them on my roommate's computer, I got a message that I was now using 2 out of 5 authorized computers for viewing these videos. Hmm...that seems oddly restrictive if I have to sign into my iTunes account to allow them to play on that computer anyway...

Myself and my roommate also recently decided that the time had come to clean up our computers a bit, so I did a fresh install of Windows on both. Little did I know (and I was certainly not warned) that by not going into iTunes and selecting "Deauthorize this computer", I was opening up a whole other can of worms. When the systems were back up and running, and iTunes was reinstalled, the videos (which were on a separate hard drive) had to be authorized again. Okay, makes sense. "You are now using 3 [(and then 4)] of your 5 authorized devices for viewing this content." Wait, what the hell?!? This is the same physical computer, how the hell are you going to tell me just because I reinstalled Windows that I'm now using 4 of my 5 licenses between 2 physical systems?

When I went looking for it, iTunes does have published information on this, but again it's not something they go out of their way to make obvious if you're not already looking. They actually have a "Deauthorize all computers" button (which by the way, can only be used once a year!), so I was able to recover the 2 lost licenses, but it's still nonetheless aggravating to have been made to go looking for this information, and end up using my one chance for the next year to deauthorize all systems (I'd be in real trouble if anything happened to my laptop I suppose).

In light of all this, I thought it might be prudent to make a back-up of my shows (I had gone out of my way to legally purchase them, of course it would have been much easier and more convenient to do otherwise). In a recent review of the iTunes Store Terms and Conditions, they actually encourage you to back up your content, specifically including a disclaimer that at any time they may permanently remove the content from their store, and while you can still use it if you have it, if you lose it then they are not liable (which in itself is somewhat reasonable, think if Walmart offered replacement warranty on lost/scratched DVDs; of course then again, being a cloud-based service in the digital age that argument is quickly losing its bearing).

What I found most ironic about the T&C for iTunes purchased video content though is that unless it is specifically DRM-free iTunes Plus content, you are strictly forbidden from burning the files onto a disc (this makes no distinction between burning a data disc or video disc). Again, what the hell Apple? So you're voiding yourself of all liability if I lose the files, but you're forbidding me from creating physical back ups of the content? Yeah, that makes sense.

I can't and won't say that I've never pirated software (etc.) in the past, and I can't and won't say that I'll never do it again in the future. But for crying out loud, I legally purchased this content, and I am being penalized and punished for trying to have access to it. I've read many a time the opinions of some of you here on this type of issue with DRM (Darth as one example comes to mind as an advocate against it, for exactly this reason).

So thanks for listening (read as: reading) while I ranted for a bit, but in all honesty, why do we allow this system of punishing and abusing those who are following the rules to continue? For what it's worth, I could have downloaded the videos, DRM free, without paying for them, and avoided all of this entirely. Sure, it would be illegal, but the odds of me personally being caught and convicted for downloading a TV show is infinitely less likely than the probability that the DRM that is supposedly set in place to protect the legal rights of the content owners will infringe on my own right to use the content legally.

Interested to hear your thoughts.

[Anian]

iTunes is really pure evil, along with Apple all together. Their whole policy is to limit user's choices and variety and then they wrapped it all in marketing where everybody wants to pay more to be more limited and think that that makes them cool...really twisted stuff that puts to shame even George Orwell's imagination.

I won't mention which one it is, doesn't really matter, but the dvd copy software even have the option to remove/not copy over stuff from the original dvd easy as a tick on the box in a menu, as in you buy an original dvd, you have to watch an FBI warning, but if you pirate it or copy it (for backup or whatever reason), you don't have to watch it - that's the a good metaphor for DRM, it punishes the people who give them money. Yes, DRM is just a whole other extreme opposite of piracy and basically you mustn't pirate media, but you can't really buy it either, more and more that option isn't even available, you just "rent" it...that's just stupid.
Same has been happening with a lot of games/publishers as well, Ubisoft and others made a whole lot of mess out of their DRM systems.

But music is really a different beast in my mind, because the whole discography industry is punishing everyone, they basically only offer money loans to record albums, while before they offered marketing, promotion and other services. These days the real clean money is in performing and touring, people still go to shows and concerts even if they pirate everything else from their favourite artist. Radiohead seemed to have some idea where to go with it, but doesn't seem a lot of people followed.

[Darth Mandarb]

Ahhhh my favorite subject

I've reached a point now where I'm just smiling happily while watching as these big companies pile more and more logs on their own funeral pyres. 

It's extremely satisfying.

As for iTunes there are easy ways around the DRM they force on you (and it's not "illegal").  You paid for that content and it's not up to Apple (or any company) to tell you what you can or can't do with it. So long as you don't try to "sell" it of course! 

It's why I jailbreak ALL my iDevices.  I paid for that device. Apple doesn't get to decide what I am allowed to put on it.  It's mine, not theirs, and I'll put what I want on it.

I honestly don't understand why people tolerate this behavior (probably has something to do with the brilliant marketing Apple uses (like Anian stated) where people still seem to feel "elite" when they whip out their iPhones).  I mean it's like if Honda sells you a car but tells you "you can't go over 65mph" and "you can't drive it on any roads we don't approve of". 

It's ridiculous.

The "novelty" of iDevices is going to wear off (hopefully soon) and Apple is  going to find themselves in trouble when that happens.

[monkey0506]

Ahhhh my favorite subject

'Tis why I felt confident mentioning you by name.

As for iTunes there are easy ways around the DRM they force on you (and it's not "illegal").  You paid for that content and it's not up to Apple (or any company) to tell you what you can or can't do with it. So long as you don't try to "sell" it of course!

Of course I'm not going to try selling it, but to be honest, if I want to back up my shows onto a DVD, then I'm not even about to think of feeling shameful for doing so.

The "novelty" of iDevices is going to wear off (hopefully soon) and Apple is  going to find themselves in trouble when that happens.

This is one reason why I was particularly excited when Google first announced their Android OS and devices. Apple has, at times, held huge monopolies on certain markets. Think about it, who even calls it an "MP3 Player" any more? It's an "iPod". When Microsoft tried to compete, the Zune failed miserably (although to be honest, I really did like mine until it bricked 3 years later). Off the top of my head, I don't even specifically know of any other venues by which I could attempt to purchase video content digitally in the same fashion as through iTunes. Maybe Windows Media Player? I honestly wouldn't know without looking.

Apple needs competition. Their devices and software are not some infallibly superior products. Personally, when I go over to my friend's house and try to use their iPad, I find it infuriating to try and do certain things on it. And even though the mobile carriers (at least in the U.S.) try to limit what apps are available through the Android Market ("Play Store"? Ugh, Google, why? ), one of the greatest things about it being an open OS is that I can still go and download the APK file online and install it outside of the market (As an example, there's a rather popular tethering app that I happen to use as DSL is not available where I live...carriers love to mask that from the market, but the developers love to have people pay the one-time license and distribute as many copies of the APK to you as you could ever need). Most apps that don't involve things like deleting the default built-in apps, or other low-level system access, don't require the device to be rooted for you to get the most out of the device.

I don't necessarily mean to say that Google themselves are perfect, but it's one heck of a better alternative than Apple. And don't even get me started on the whole "Macs can run Windows too!" fiasco.

By the way, if anyone does know of similar music and video digital distribution services to what iTunes offers (with comparable content libraries), any info would be greatly appreciated!

[Darth Mandarb]

Of course I'm not going to try selling it, but to be honest, if I want to back up my shows onto a DVD, then I'm not even about to think of feeling shameful for doing so.

Nor should you!  You paid for the content, it's yours to do with what you will.  In fact I think you're justified in selling it too (as long as you don't keep a copy for yourself or make many copies to sell).  But if you wanted to sell it to a friend or something that's your right to do.  Copyright has gotten RIDICULOUSLY warped and perverted from its original intent.  Now it's just used to keep the money going into the pockets of corporations rather than sparking innovation and creativity as it was originally intended to do.  Shame really.

Apple are doing the same thing hiding behind the guise of "benevolent tech giant" and brilliant marketing ploys (and believe me I applaud their marketing ploys).  They use the lame excuse (and all their sheep ... er I mean mac snobs ... er I mean mac lovers love to bleat it out as well) of, "we want to keep the platform secure and have standards".  Uh-huh... rrrright!  And I have some nice lunar property with great views of the sea of tranquility to sell you.

If I go into Barnes & Noble and buy a copy of a book and read it through I can then hand it to my girlfriend and she can read it too.  Nobody chimes in about "stealing" and nobody claims "copyright infringment" or "piracy" bitching.  So why, when I purchase an eBook through iTunes, must my girlfriend ALSO purchase it if she wants to read it on her device?  It's ludicrous and greedy.  Jailbreak your device and you can share the books like you should be able to in the first place.  One of these days these greedy pigs are going to clue in to the fact that when you screw your customers over enough they will find ways to get around it (piracy).

I have a huge bone to pick with the book publishers too ... though maybe that's for another thread

[Ryan Timothy B]

I don't necessarily mean to say that Google themselves are perfect, but it's one heck of a better alternative than Apple. And don't even get me started on the whole "Macs can run Windows too!" fiasco.

Off-topic question, is there word of Google attempting to get into the computer OS market? With the new approach with Win8 and their AOL identical UI; I can see them falling down in the future. (image)

I had the Windows Phone 7 and it was honestly quite terrible (I'll talk about the name in a moment). There were features that it had I preferred, but not enough to stick with it over Android. Some of these features being the quick Rate and Review feature. Just hold down on an installed app, select Rate and Review and it takes you directly to the marketplace to rate the game. It's much better than Android's approach on that. Plus the keyboard and predictive text was far superior than the Samsung and other keyboards I've downloaded. I still haven't found a keyboard I actually like. Then to Pin the app to the home screen was super simple or to uninstall it. But with my phone, if I hold down on an App on the home screen it only gives me the option to move it around, or delete it from the home screen. Then within the Apps section, holding down on it will instantly pin it to the home screen. It's a terrible UI, but that's Samsung for you. I've used Android phones by other developers and it's much less annoying for these features.

That's one thing I dislike about Android. How they let the phone developer shit out their own designs. Some being terribly inconvenient versus others. It's nice to have a variation, but it shouldn't be the Only option. Just because I have a Samsung phone, doesn't mean I want to use their UI. It should have the option to switch back and forth between the Google default or to Samsung's, without having to jailbreak your phone and installing your own ROM.

About the terribly long name: Windows Phone 7. It's a horrible marketing idea! To me, the name itself, targets business people or guys. "Oh, it's Windows? That sounds 'computery'". If I were a head guy working for Microsoft that would be one thing I'd definitely change. Give it a name like Silver, Icon, or something catchy with two syllables. Imagine if the Xbox was called Windows Game System. I doubt it would have gotten itself into the console battle with that name. The WP7's plain uncustomizable UI is another story. It's boring and limits you to have a phone the way they think it should be. Everyone's phone being exactly the same. Why they decided to go in a different direction than their computer OS, which is what Android or iOS are pretty much like, is mind boggling. When I had that phone I was bored of it after a couple weeks. You can't even have a bloody background graphic. You can only change the background color to either Black or White. Then the button colors can be changed to fluorescent and ugly bright colors of their choice.

Now finally on topic. That's why I prefer to download the more convenient way. Free and most importantly: hassle free. Well it's not entirely hassle free, sometimes you get a rip that is worse quality than everyone claims it is. A:9 V:9, when the encoding was poor and the audio sounds like you're sitting in a can. But it's usually pretty reliable for a free service.

Darth's analogy of the car only being able to drive on roads they choose is spot on.

[Anian]

Wasn't Google developing some cloud based OS or something like that? OS is a much more complicated beast than an internet browser but I'm sure on a friday some team works on it.  (btw the "friday is for your projects" moto is brilliant and as I am aware has brought many interesting stuff to Google's palette of software)

[monkey0506]

Off-topic question, is there word of Google attempting to get into the computer OS market?

What, you mean Chrome OS (and/or Chromium OS, which is basically just open-source Chrome OS)? Personally I find the idea that a operating system should be little more than a web browser on crack to be slightly off. I might spend a lot of time online, but I also do a lot more that has no meaning or relevance to the web.

Regarding Darth's analogy, I remember years ago reading a satirical article about how if General Motors had followed the model of computing that our vehicles would randomly crash or freeze in place without warning or apparent reason, that every couple of years you'd need to buy a new engine to drive on any of the newly built roads, and you'd have to press the "Start" button to turn your engine off. Alternately you could purchase a vehicle from Apple which might seem more efficient, but it would only run on 5% of the roads, and generally wouldn't take you anywhere near where you wanted to go.

I won't say that I spent hours searching or anything, but after doing some digging around on Wikipedia and Google today, I really honestly wasn't able to find any major listings for comparable services to iTunes. I think that Microsoft still runs the Zune Marketplace despite the devices no longer being developed/sold...and/or I still think Windows Media Player might have a somewhat similar service...but mostly all I could find were streaming services and other DRM-infested things like UltraViolet.

[Intense Degree]

Apple are even worse when it comes to audiobooks.

I recently stuck itunes on my laptop and authorised it as a second device. I downloaded my purchased music fine but when it came to audiobooks (of which I have a couple) it wouldn't let me. I complained, assuming it was an error, but they replied saying that you cannot download audiobooks more than once and therefore they would not put them back on my purchase history. As a "one off" they actually did let me re-download them onto the second device (and I expect they would let anyone who complains) but seriously, If my 1st device dies or I upgrade it at all I cannot re-download what I have already bought?

I have no love for Apple anyway and I think my new Galaxy S3 and a podcatcher app will be replacing my old ipod shortly.

[Calin Leafshade]

Isnt Amazon Mp3 DRM free?

[voh]

I'll never buy anything with DRM which limits its use like Apple and Amazon do. If it ties me to a device or a certain amount of devices, no thanks. If it ties me to a server which needs to authenticate the material, no thanks.

Companies go under. I want my purchased media to last longer than those companies do.

DRM free all the way. And yes, that means I'll miss out on things. That's cool with me.

Games, though, are different. I'll buy 'em, then crack 'em (if need be, unlike, for example, GOG games). I don't play multiplayer anyway. Just don't want the DRM/phoning home nonsense.

[BCJames]

I honestly don't understand why people tolerate this behavior (probably has something to do with the brilliant marketing Apple uses (like Anian stated) where people still seem to feel "elite" when they whip out their iPhones).  I mean it's like if Honda sells you a car but tells you "you can't go over 65mph" and "you can't drive it on any roads we don't approve of". 

It's ridiculous.

The "novelty" of iDevices is going to wear off (hopefully soon) and Apple is  going to find themselves in trouble when that happens.

I don't think a feeling of superiority is really that big of a driver at this point. For most non-tech savvy people once you get used to a particular system, it is easiest to stick with that system. I also think most people are too apathetic to care, which further locks them into that system because it is too much effort to figure out how to take all your stuff and get out of it so they just buy the next version because it is easier than the alternative.

[EchosofNezhyt]

I'll never buy anything with DRM which limits its use like Apple and Amazon do.

I've never had better had a company give me better service then Amazon has.

They solve any problem I have no matter what in normally just a few mins.

[Igor Hardy]

I've recently read Steve Job's official biography and all of Apple's restrictive policies throughout the years came from his personal obsessions - they had little to do with rationality or market analyses. If he had his way entirely, iTunes would be controlled even more closely.

[EKM]

I agree with Darth's approach. I also jailbroke my iPod Touch for the same reasons. This is my biggest peeve with everything on the internet nowadays. It applies to PC video games as well. There are too many restrictions. I don't care if I stand alone on this but I hate "internet connection required" for installation. That practically means that if I bought a game disc and don't have the internet, I just wasted my money trying to do something legal.   

When I didn't know that iTunes had DRM on their movies and TV shows, and I tried to copy them after purchasing, it pissed me off beyond anything. That's why I "illegally" downloaded a software that can remove the DRM from the movies and TV shows and that's how I convert the files into mp4 from m4v and play them on ANY device. Thing is, they don't make it seem like I've actually purchased content. That's the thing with digital media content. Whether you illegally download them or legally download them, the line is blurred in what feels like ownership.

The same thing goes for the PlayStation Network. I recently purchased some TV shows there and realized I could only play them on my PC through the PSN video player and of course the PSP. They're in a format called mnv and it is a real pain. I can't to this day figure out a way to convert them, so what I did was "illegally" download a software to screen capture the video and sound in just the area of where the video was playing. Now I have all the TV shows converted to mp4 and I can play them on ANY device. I'm never purchasing from PSN ever again though. The entire process took a long long time where I had to manually stop the video after recording and then repeating for the next episode.

The good thing? They're cheaper than actually buying on DVDs. The bad thing? All the asinine limitations/restrictions.

[Ryan Timothy B]

Wow EKM. It would've been easier to just download them illegally instead of all that hassle. Considering you don't own the movies/shows you've purchased, you're actually committing the same crime as downloading from a torrent as you were by converting it for other devices.

I REALLY dislike how you can't view the iDevice games or apps on their website without downloading iTunes. I will never download iTunes (or anytime soon anyway) because I don't want it, nor do I want an iDevice. Them preventing me from checking out their games and apps without downloading their software has completely removed all chances of me wanting an iPhone instead of Android.

[EKM]

Yeah, it's ridiculous. That's why I'm not against piracy. It's because all of these big companies place such heavy barriers around what they sell that it makes me wonder what the point of purchasing is. I hate how they implement a video player within iTunes and that's the ONLY way to view the movies that I've or anyone has purchased from the iTunes store. See what I mean? That's a huge turn-off. Also, until recently, they didn't allow for the re-downloading of movies that one purchased. If by accident one deleted their movies, there'd be no way to get them back except by buying again. That changed maybe a few days ago 'cause now I can re-download all of my lost movies. Still isn't much of a convenience compared to the big picture.

I only got an iPod Touch because I wanted a compact portable device which I could use to read comics, play visual novels (Japanese adventure games), watch movies and listen to music while on the go. I also like the iPhone/iPod Touch's interface design. I'm not familiar with Android, but if they have the exact same choice of Apps, then ugh I guess I'm too late. At this point, I can't decide whether or not I prefer digital over physical (ex. owning digital books over physical books, digital movies over physical DVDs, etc).