http://galskap.nu/ext/5194.html
Damn I really want that vegetable peeler permit.
For future reference, this was not written by John Cleese.
It is, however, funnier if you imagine him reading it out loud.
Stupid Americans...
Common now, the only place that really deserves any kind of taunting in America is New Jersey. Stupid jughandles... stupid people with their bad directions... bah.
I guess I'd have to be either british or non-american to find this funny...
Quote from: Ghormak on Wed 26/10/2005 04:14:59
For future reference, this was not written by John Cleese.
It is, however, funnier if you imagine him reading it out loud.
Damnit! I don't believe it, I don't want to! Proof?
Every single piece of humour on the internet gets attributed to John Cleese eventually.
proof 1 http://www.snopes.com/politics/satire/revocation.asp
further examples http://www.snopes.com/politics/satire/cleese.asp
heh... I get the humor in that, and he has a few good points... But I hate when foreigners generalize all Americans into one lump category... But I guess we do it to, and I hate that also.
Bah! STEREOTYPING IS BAD!
I also have problems when they mix serious issues with irrelevant jokes...I mean, the low (or non-existing) global awareness, the weapon-laws and some other points are important and serious.
Whether you pronounce Pitsburgh "burra" or "berg" is not.
And if John had written that, it would have been much funnier.
The first paragraph made me expect some kind of serious political commentary, but--if there was any--it was heavily diluted with comments about how there are linguistic differences between two geographically and culturally very different areas. Well spotted, anonymous author. As a more effective solution to this outrageous ignorance of how things should be pronounced, I propose that we all go back to speaking good old Proto-Indo-European (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proto-Indo-European_language).
Quote from: Andail on Wed 26/10/2005 14:50:02
I also have problems when they mix serious issues with irrelevant jokes...
Sometimes, in order not to insult the person you're talking about you have to make irrelevant jokes. This way it rather easy to avoid any conflict. Someone saying the this text is not serious enough will hear about the weapon laws, the ignorance of all people etc. Someone who decides that this text is insulting, will be asnwered by all the pronounciation facts. It does work...
And he's right. The only thing that bothers me is that the same thing happens with the Uk and the rest of Europe. On the matter of jokes, that is, because other than that none of the problems reported in Johns' text even exist here in the Uk.
Quote from: Nikolas on Wed 26/10/2005 18:58:48
Sometimes, in order not to insult the person you're talking about you have to make irrelevant jokes. This way it rather easy to avoid any conflict.
Why should you want to avoid conflict, though? I'm of the opinion that we would benefit from a lot more conflicts about these topics. Avoiding conflicts in this manner also completely nullifies the possibility of convincing anyone of anything. It becomes nothing more than a harmless joke, and, although jokes can be entertaining, that's not enough.
Well, it's not the conflict that John (if he wrote this) is after, but awarness. And he succedes.
Quote from: Nikolas on Wed 26/10/2005 21:04:44
Well, it's not the conflict that John (if he wrote this) is after, but awarness. And he succedes.
or perhaps it's... *GASP* comedy?
Political comedy nonetheless....
I'm okay with a friendly jab or two, but I'm so tired of hearing that Americans lack global awareness. Especially from people that don't live in America...How would you know what level of awareness we have here? You aren't here....
America, to me is much more aware of things like cultural diversity compared to many other countries. So does that mean I can make fun of how little european countries know of this? I could, but that would be dumb, and ill informed. Kinda like saying America is globally unaware.
Let's talk about it. :)
Please don't be offended by this post. But feel free to argue. (F***, was that needed?)
First of all let me say that I agree with you. I find it silly for someone to talk about something that he/she hasn't met. And of course about global awarmess, I have again to agree. I know almost nothing about Australia, or India or places on the other side of the globe, I wouldn't expect an American to know a lot about Europe. And furthermore, me as a European citizen (bullshit...), let me say that we do have some complex feelings about our superiority. Which is bullshit. And we tend to believe that America was discovered by Europeans and blah blah, which is all bullshit. We believe that you should be aware of everything but not us. Bullshit!
One problem though, I do find in this matter is this: You are the No. 1 nation in the planet. Everyone take it as you want. I'm not putting down the other nations or something like that. Just take it.
As nation No.1 you have the most publicity and the most responsibilities to the whole planet. And you have decided to take these responsibilities (your goverment). You seem to be around every war that has taken place in the last ...x years. And generally you seem to be everywhere.
The word seem(s) is in bold for one good reason. Everything I've ever known for America I know from American mouth. Mostly from American movies, then music, then books and so on. All images I have of America are controlled from Americans. I am open minded and this can be easily proven by the fact that I took my whole family and moved to the Uk in order to study but also to meet other people and other communities. I have family in Germany. This at least gives me an idea about Greece (my birth country), Uk, Germany and France where I've been. And for the rest of Europe I do have an idea about what's going on.
But not for America (or Australia for that matter). The diffence between America and Australia is that I get loads of information for Amercia which all seem to agree on certain points. And all this information comes from Americans. And it is so much that has influenced the whole world.
And thus I arrive to my point. About cultural diversity. There is little of that. You have conquered the world. The only thing left is Ethnic, which is bullshit again IMHO (won't discuss it here...)
After all this I can arrive to some conclusion by saying that, at least for me, everything that I have in my mind about America has come from American hands and mouths. And along with the fact that every stone we turn we find an Amercian (soldier???), underneeth it is rather difficult not to make judgements.
But again I agree completly with you! Just trying to justify this attitude towards America.
and so I edit it because it doesn't matter!
Nikolas, there are a few key points that I have to agree with you on, but there are a few things I have to disagree with.
First of all, everything you hear about america is from american media, not american people. Everyone in the american media is looking for a story, which is essentially a case of greed: they want the money for THE story, and it doesn't matter how many people it screws over. You can't know americans based on the american media, otherwise you'd think we live in pretty much a big craphole. I was talking to someone who lived in canada a few years ago, and he was talking about america like there was fleets of hobos, and few to none americans who owned a house. I live in america, and I've never seen a hobo in my entire life. Most of the people me and my family knows owns a house. The media no matter where you are is pure bullcrap. From the all of the british stuff I've seen, I'd think that most of Britain thinks they're better than everyone else. Even as I'm writing this my older brother is ranting about "Royal Mail" He keeps yelling "WHATS SO DAMNED ROYAL ABOUT IT!?".
Anyway, back to my point (assuming I have one... :-\) I like many other on these forums live in america, and all have different oppinions about our country. If you live here you'll really get to know the country. I'll probably never know any other country like I do america, as I've been raised here my entire life and was taught everything American. The only thing any country can really be aware about is important events in other places, which for the past x years we have been doing.
I also gotta say that this guy is severely pissing me off with his god damned "pronunciation tips".
And mrcolossal, you're post is confusing me more than its confusing you...
I'm putting this for my brother's sake, who specializes in kickass rants.
Here in America, we consider England to be like a Mother to us. Like All mothers, we expect to put them into a home, and absorb all of their assets. Aluminum is infact spelled with an I not an A! Sound it out! Fancy is an adjective, and should only be used as an adjective from today forward, thus the queen can not (grammatically speaking) fancy or not fancy anything.
As for Utah, Why shouldn't she 'fancy' it? It has a U in it?
U, Much like the United Nations is overused in all places besides the United States.
As for burgh's I don't see why you would completely butcher the poor word. There is no a at the end of it, and the H is silent (duh). As for Our trailer trash which appears in the Jerry Springer Show, Once your population drops the cockney act, well drop the illustrious guests of Former Mayor of Cincinnati Jerry Springer. Microsoft, whom could buy and sell the queen like a sack of potatoes, can call the Superior more evolved American English Whatever they want. As for British English, you had a good run, but its our language now. In fact we should rename it American. As for our Brothers in the South Pacific, I can distinguish an Australian Accent. The question is if you know the difference between a New York Accent, and a Mid Western Accent.
As for British Sitcoms, They will be eradicated. No one like them, I don't even think you could tell me you like sitcoms with a strait face. We invented Sitcoms, and they were horrible here, and then you stole, only to destroy them. As for the queen, I might not get it, but what has she done for you lately? I mean Tony Blair, and George Bush are both important, intelligent, and most of all Influential; the queen is obscure, and unneeded. After all this isn't the middle ages. Sure we can sing God Save The Queen, but she's the Queen of England! Why does she need saving? If anything America Saved the queen on a few occasions. (that's right, we kept the royal jewels safe in fort Nox for years).
Also someone has to explain to you guys that to be royal, you have to actually have association with royalty. Royal Mail? Royal Tube (im told thats what you call subways)? Royal Trollies? Royal Taco? Unless the queen comes down from Buckingham Palace and rides the trolly, while eating the taco, its not royal. Like here in America, We dont call things Presidential unless our president has something to do with it. And what about Knights? In my humble opinion, unless your riding on a horse with a jousting pole your not a knight. You have Sir Elton John, Sir The Beatles. Whats the deal? We have Billy Joel, and Lynard Skynard, who beat the crap out of Elton John and the Beatles, but we don't call them knights.
Football, although poorly named, will keep its name. We have so many things that are so much better then everyone else, that we can have one poorly named sport. As for the World Series, As far as I'm concerned, when the Russians put a man on the moon, then they can give a shot at beating us at baseball. Until then Sit down and shut up.
As for Guns, that's a sore spot. Im hoping that everything is all in good fun, but you don't even joke about taking away our guns. Its our guns that make us better then you, and better then everyone else. As for American Automobiles, We understand the sleekness and style of German Vehicles, but why don't you produce a god damned car that doesn't cost more then the queen of England's life is worth. (Bentley Rolls Royce im talking about you!)
What's with the Treachery with this whole metric thing. You're the ones who came up with the standard system. what is multiplying by 12 that hard for you? I mean you invented it and now you complain about us using it? Plus just take a look at your money. Pound Sterling? that sounds pretty standard to me doesn't it?
As for FREEDOM FRIES (renamed to spit in the faces of the french) We do occasionally call them chips, but that's only when we are ordering them with fish, or if we suffer head trauma.
As for Tea in Massachusetts... well you can have it. Were long over the whole tea thing. Drink a coffee, or maybe a coke. Although America does produce some poor quality beer, most of it is made for teenagers to buy when they're short on cash. No self respecting citizen can be found with a Coors Light or even a can of bud in their hand. They are cheap as dirt, 30 for roughly 13 pounds sterling (my great American keyboard doesn't have the crazy L thing on it). In accordance to the lack of quality beer, we will Make it all produced by Sam Adams Brewery named after one of the great founders of the greatest nation on earth.
Here in America, gasoline is expensive. We pay nearly $3.00 a gallon. (remember gallons? they are those things that aren't metric). Now for a senior citizen country like the UK who's all out of oil, $6.00 a gallon may be acceptable, but not here in the US of A! we have our own oil, and we don't need to pay into socialism with high taxes on our commodities.
Lawyers Therapists and Guns are our hearts and souls. We don't have the stress free lives, that you enjoy, we have to work hard to stay the greatest nation on earth. We have the best army ever, the highest standard of living (except in Luxemburg, where we launder our money) the best data communication system. Sure the internet is a European idea, but it wouldn't exist if it weren't for America. Don't Believe me? Ask the UN who was unable to enforce "Changes" to the internet because of American National Sovereignty. We donate more money then everyone else. Most of all we have a negative balance of trade! Talk about charity! So after providing for all of the deadbeats around the world were tired, and stressed, and just have too much money (it's a great feeling) so we hire shrinks and lawyers, who then become rich, and hire their own shrinks and lawyers- It's the circle of life.
As for JFK Forget about it. Its not worth it.
You guys can try to collect taxes from us. In fact I dare you. Then you can try to take away our guns. Good Luck And God Bless America.
P.S. Shawn of the Dead sucked!
-Osiris
(just wanted everyone to know the counter argument. Dont get mad at our amazingness)
Quote from: Nikolas on Wed 26/10/2005 21:04:44
Well, it's not the conflict that John (if he wrote this) is after, but awarness. And he succedes.
My point is that he (and he's not John) does not succeed. All the stupid stuff makes it quite easy to ignore the tiny bits of serious stuff. Very bad rhetoric.
I edited my post and remove all of its contents after having read King Nipper's post. It's simply too awesome a piece of debating to allow any further response on the issue.
Well done, King Nipper, you blew me away :)
Some highlights:
Quote
We have so many things that are so much better then everyone else, that we can have one poorly named sport. As for the World Series, As far as I'm concerned, when the Russians put a man on the moon, then they can give a shot at beating us at baseball. Until then Sit down and shut up.
Quote
As for Guns, that's a sore spot. Im hoping that everything is all in good fun, but you don't even joke about taking away our guns. Its our guns that make us better then you, and better then everyone else.
Quote
Lawyers Therapists and Guns are our hearts and souls.
Quote
You guys can try to collect taxes from us. In fact I dare you. Then you can try to take away our guns. Good Luck And God Bless America.
Quote
just wanted everyone to know the counter argument. Dont get mad at our amazingness
We'll try, King Nipper, but don't yell at us if we fail!
Quote from: Andail on Thu 27/10/2005 09:25:51
...they don't push their culture onto other continents.
But we are the ones that like it. We are the ones that take it in and want more.
King_Nipper: Yes it is the media. As always, you come to the reescue with my poor English. I couldn't remember the word, so instead I used the words mouths and hands. Thanks for that.
All the last 3-4 paragraphs are your opinion. And you seem to argue on whose country is better. I don't see why sir :P Elton John is worst than Billy Joel. I love them both, and of course the sir could be missing. The same for sir :P Jamie. But it is indeead bizzare that the only two countries that have their God dealing with what they find most precuious is England and America. God save the Queen! God bless America. Would you imagine a nation yelling God bless Jaque Chiraq? I don't think so.
I study in Royal Holloway, University of London. After one year in London, I just realised that Royal has nothing to do with the Queen, or maybe only the part that she was in the opening (she or her parents or their parents...). Other than that it is in their culture to name Royal everything. We in Greece have Nationalized everything. National Bank of Greece. Nationa scholarship fuondation. National this, national that...
On the matter of global awarness it's seems to me that you made it a little worst for America. All we're saying here is that you have to judge things by seeing a little bit out of your normal environment. To go a little further.
Squinky: I tried defending you the best I could, and also tried to explain some things. But Andail in the end is quite right. The States are affecting the whole world thus everyone can judge the States. Maybe not for everything the non-Cleese says. But for the part that changes our humble lives we can. Furthermore a little analysis will always bring the problem back to the roots. And the roots are in America, don't you agree?
Does anyone else spot the curious contrast of intention between
Quote from: King_Nipper on Thu 27/10/2005 03:07:50
I also gotta say that this guy is severely pissing me off with his god damned "pronunciation tips".
and
Quote from: King_Nipper on Thu 27/10/2005 03:07:50
Aluminum is infact spelled with an I not an A! Sound it out! Fancy is an adjective, and should only be used as an adjective from today forward, thus the queen can not (grammatically speaking) fancy or not fancy anything.
[...]
U, Much like the United Nations is overused in all places besides the United States.
As for burgh's I don't see why you would completely butcher the poor word. There is no a at the end of it, and the H is silent (duh).
?
I could argue against all these points on a linguistic basis, but I won't, since I don't take them seriously.
Sorry Squinkmeister. I don't know where Andail is from, but I'm an American, and a very well educated one at that, and I have to say that this country does indeed have low global awareness. In fact, we have extremely low self awareness. The British love the queen, but somewhere deep down they know the old hag is really just a figurehead and Tony Blair is the one running the country. We, on the other hand, don't seem to know a hawk from a handsaw. If the media tells us something, we are quick to believe it. No self-respecting American would ever believe that the driver of the cavalcade is the one who shot JFK, or that America was founded by a society of religious nuts who believed it was their job to bring about the end of time as the "Great Beast" spoken of in Revelation, and have been in charge of the country ever since. Most Americans could care less that they really are ignorant, and lazy, and selfish, and have some of the lowest test scores in the world (even though, and don't get me started on this, the percentile system is a stupid thing to use for that. If everyone suddenly became stupid as dirt overnight, everyone would be in the 100th percentile, now wouldn't they?) Most Americans don't care that the rest of the world may not want their help. We scoff at the French because the French were smart enough not to get involved, like we should have. Our president can barely speak proper English (100 percent of Americans who don't have jobs are unemployed... More and more of america's imports are coming from other countries...) and hides his face like a scared puppy when people find out he had information that could have saved the country on severeal occassions but did not employ it (9/11 being one such event).
Nipper, I agreed with you, but not so much your brother.
A) they invented the language. Thus, WE invented the silent G. Burgh is indeed pronounced "burra," as in, a shortened form of "burrough." Although I have always found "colonel" and "worcestershire" odd....
B) Royal mail, royal tubes, royal buttocks, etc.. are royal not because the queen uses them, but because she orders their creation and use.
C) Fancy is a verb. Our American adjective fancy comes from something being nice enough for someone to fancy...
D) We don't like British sitcoms here in America because, on the whole, we are not smart enough to understand them.
E) Knights... We do have "knights," but it is a religious title (Knights of Columbus, for example)... In Britain, the Queen is in charge of religion too. A "Knight" is a "Defender of the Faith," although since the queen can do or say what she wants, they can be, like Elton John, "Defender of the Gayness" and still be knights. Just because you picture knights from movies doesn't mean that's what a knight is. Shoes used to be made of wood, but today we call rubber things covered in fake leather shoes...
F) Guns: Agreed it is stupid to take away our guns, but not because they make us better. It is simply because to take away guns means taking away guns from people buying them legally. Criminals can still get them, and then the rest of us have no defence.
G) All therapists are is a way for people to blame their problems on something else. "I am mad all the time because my mommy didn't love me..." No, you're mad all the time because you're an asshole.
I agreed with most of everything else, I reckon...
Europeans may be more aware of American TV than Americans are of British TV, but as for global awareness, I haven't really seen anything that would put Europe (or Canada and Australia etc.) out ahead of the Americans. They've copped a bum rap there. Most countries are embarressingly ignorant.
....but at least we're better than North Koreans...yeah!
Well, it's not my country that invade other nations on regular basis, or pollute the world worse than everybody else.
Since USA is affecting the entire world, I think we're justified to pass judgement. Even though we don't live there.
Oh, yeah, I also forgot:
Lawyers aren't part of our heart and soul, either. Just as a therapist is only there to blame our problems on our mothers, lawyers are there to blame our problems on McDonalds. "I'm overweight because I ate too many McDonalds hamburgers, and I burned myself because they didn't tell me the coffee was hot." No, you're just a fat, clumsy bastard who probably dropped the damn coffee because you couldn't fit your fat bastardly little stubs of fingers around it, and if you didn't know it was hot, you're a stupid fat bastard who doesn't need to go around ordering coffee..
On the matter of British television. Do you see my avatar? Doctor Who was the crappiest show EVER made, but it was still much more creative and entertaining than any of today's modern American tripe. Our television is made to pander to American morons. If you are in England watching TV and can't understand it, they don't care. It's your own damn fault for being too stupid. In America, they dumb down the television to the level of the people, rather than expecting them to push themselves to the limit of their intelligence and try to make sense out of something rather than just declaring it "stupid" and moving on to something with a lot of gunfights and swearing, which is all we seem to be able to handle.
Even books are the same way. The Hobbit was written for children. The Chronicles of Narnia were written for children. I was five years old when I first read the Lord of the Rings through. Most American children prefer "The puppy sits on the mat. The cat plays with the yarn..."
Billy Joel and Lynerd Skynerd (sic) were not anywhere near as famous worldwide as the Beatles or Elton John. You might have used Elvis as an example. Regardless of whether or not you like him, your opinion doesn't mean he was not a worldwide sensation. Unfortunately for the US, that's still only one against two... plus, they had many more worldwide musical sensations.
I'm not too sure that the British did come up with the "standard" measuring system, but I may be wrong. Metric is a much more superior system, as it is based on base ten mathematics. Why base our system of measurement on base 12 when we count in base 10? I am ashamed that I don't know metric, and instead use the ignorance of standard.
Only Americans would be stupid enough to think renaming "French Fries" "Freedom Fries" is a spit in the face of the French. They were probably relieved that we stopped associating them with something they had no part in in the first place. Ohhh, no, the French decided to stay out of a war they had no part in, we won't call a greasy potato stick after them... How terrible. They gave us the Statue of Liberty. If we have such a problem with them, why don't we tear her down. Go on, you first...
Esper, I think that the French came up with the metric system. Here in England they still don't use metric...
And using 12 instead of 10 does make sense. 12 is a perfect number. Divide by 1,2,3,4,6 and 12 where 10 is divided only by 1,2,5 and 10. The semitones are 12, the months are twelve, the hours of a day are 2x12.
I personally think that England and America are very much alike. I find them simmilar in a lot of issues. And I get a feeling that as we move through time, England would very much like to use some kind of huge device, leav the European continent and travel the Atlantic towards America.
The thing about lawyers ad therapists is that it's stupid. It's basically based on a system of political correcteness and it sucks! A simple example. Everywhere you turn your head here in London you see signs. Most of them are simmilar to :"Watch your head." or "Wet floor". Well, this to me means that people are not capable of watching their heads or if the floor is wet. If you amplify this fact a little more you get McDonalds attack.
??? You and I had this conversation the other day. You do too use metric. Kilometers, kilograms, those are metric. And, to tell you the truth, the standard system is the oldest form of measurement around. I only just realized that when you talked about the calendar and the hours... Now that I think about it, the standard of twelves instead of ten (again, tens is better... We have ten fingers and toes, that is why we count by tens) is based on ancient pagan cultures, like the Sumerians and the Babylonians. You also will note that twelve is an important number in occult numerology. There are twelve signs of the zodiac, for instance. The reason we have a base 12 system for time measurement, excluding the fact that it actually works quite well, is because the Hebrews stole it from the pagan cultures around them in an attempt to become more advanced. If what I said before were true (about a religious cult having founded america) it would make sense that America uses the standard system because they took it from the Judeo-Christian "standard."
I maintain that metric is the more logical.
(oh, and this brings me to answer a question by Helm the other day in a thread that is way too old to dig up, regarding why I consider hypnosis "occult," which kind of works in here. The word occult doesn't mean "of a cult," it has to do with that which is not fully understood, from the latin occultus, meaning "that which is hidden." The moon actually "occults." It simply means a part of it is obscured. Hypnotism, and the pagan use of twelve, being "occultic" does not mean Satan worshippers use it, and this is a stupid modern-American-Christianized ignorance. It simply means that we don't understand everything about it.
Nikolas, using 12 as base makes sense indeed, as it is a much better number than 10. But americans still count with 10 as a base in general, even though some of their measurements are based on 12.
They still count up to 10, then add a second number to the first 1 up to 20, where they add the second number to the 2, etc.
If americans would have consistently used 12 as a base it would be a superiour system. But they don't.
Europeans use 10 as a base consistently, both numerical and in all measurements.
Even though this is very irrelevant in comparison to the political issues brought up in this thread, I just wanted to sort out things.
technically speaking, you don't, as Nikolas said, use base ten in measurements of the passing of time.
Well, true. I guess there are more exceptions. And the brits have all sorts of strange measurements. But as I've said, this was never really my main argument.
QuoteP.S. Shawn of the Dead sucked!
Them's fighting words, boyo!
I want someone to answer me this question:
Do you think that any society, if seen in the same circumstances as another, would behave different?
You might answer yes, but History would probably deny you...
You might assume that yours is better than any/some other nations, but I, sincerelly, don't think that we, as Spanish, can say we did a good job when the time of the "big Empire". I don't think we would have been able to be better than "Chad" if we had to face the circumstances they had to face from the beginning of their history (enviroment, temperature, invassions, location...)
I think that brits, frenchs, russians, Turks, Italians are in the same situation as Spain...
Americans are behaving as all ruler nations of the world did in the past and will do in the future. Aggressives, supperbs and colonialist. Now quote a rules nation which has behaved different when they were in the position that americans are now.
Being annoyed of it can make you feel better, but it is a complete waste of time. It's better to take it with humour.
There might be a humoristic group that will say something like this, in 2,000 years:
(year 4,000 actor Shon Kliss)-"So, what have the americans done for you?
-Planes...
(year 4,000 actor Shon Kliss)-Ok, ok... planes, but... omitting the planes, what have the americans done for you?
-Telephone.
(year 4,000 actor Shon Kliss)-Ok, the phone, but what else?
-Cinema?
*crowd* Oh, yeah! Cinema, do you remember how boring the weekend was before of that?
(year 4,000 actor Shon Kliss)-"But cinema was invented by the Lumiére brothers, you traitor, don't believe the imperialist and his propaganda about that suckey, Edison!!!
(Ashamed actor)- I was talking of good cinema...
(year 4,000 actor Shon Kliss)-Ok... But apart of good cinema, what have the americans done for you?
*crowd*-Internet, Computers, Coca-Cola, saving us from communists and rocketry!
(year 4,000 actor Shon Kliss)-Ok, Ok... but apart from planes, telephone, good cinema, the Inernet, computers, Coca-Cola, saving us from communists and rocketry, what have the americans done for you?
(Shy actor #1)-Helping in both World Wars?
(year 4,000 actor Shon Kliss) -Helping us in...? Fuck You!!!!"
That's a good point too, although I don't think it's what you intended. We Americans have only ever provided the world with things that have made them fat, lazy bastards who want everything handed to them.
Plus, look at "history" to see the people who have ruled the entire world at some point in time or another: The Babylonians, the Medo-Persians, the Greek, the Romans, and the British have never lasted in their full glory more than two hundred years. Of the entire above list, only Britain still exists as a world power, and even then not to the extent as America. We, who have not learned from history, are doomed to repeat it.
Base 12 (and base 60 systems, they overlap alot) systems are derived from much the same source as base 10 systems. The Sumerians most likely counted using phalanxes, touching each with the thumb on the same hand. 4 fingers * 3 phalanxes.
Apart from arithmancy, there's no intrinsic benefit in one over the other.
Esper. I can see that you love being American.
Why don't you come and live in Europe. Irland, Greece, Spain, take a pick. That will be easier for you. And you'll end up thinking the same for every country.
Take for example Greece. All Greeks love to cheat. If they could they wouldn't pay and taxs and they wouldn't work. Talk about lazy. There is no national office that does a proper job. The only Greek person I know who would be doing his job right is Helm! And there is no trust amongs Greeks whatsoever. I mean here in England you make a phonecall you arange everything that nees arranging. You taxes, you banking. No problem. In Greece you have to keep photocopies of everything, in case something goes wrong (which always does) so that you can prove that you cheated them, but in a legal way.
Every country has it's good and bad points. It's bad that America is worst than the rest. HAHA! No, It's just that America gest all the publicity.
At least you are not a lazy bastard.
But if you really insist I will have to believe you. Since you are an Amercian I can take your work. And I don't mind.
ALL AMERICANS ARE LAZY FAT BASTARDS! Sorry for the capitals. I just want squinky to hear me. (hehe). I can say that cause an American told me! ;D
Oranges: The only problem is that the system the whole world uses is based on ten. (decadic?) When you base your numeric system to 12, basing your numbers to 10 you create a problem. Of course 12 is much more convinient as I said earlier, but still. Everytime I try to compose something I end up screwing bad because of the math. I mean pitch #44 is A. pitch #56 is A and so on. And even worst and octave (8) has 12 semitones. Nothing to do with ten. Fuck!
Farl, you have perfectly good cinema (I happen to love Almodovar), you can drink tasty wine and juice instead of Coca-cola.
The telephone and the internet would have developed in some way without americans. That's like saying the world would never be able to use screws and bolts properly without the Swedes, because we invented the wrench.
The reason you are very americanised, and believe you could never survive without all these american stuff, is because the americans have a very aggressive way to franshise and market their products.
As for saving the world from communists and rocketry(?), well, both of them sort of exist, and looking back at the Carter-era, it wasn't handled in a very humanitarian way.
Would any other society behaved differently? No, and they haven't, looking back at the Roman and British empires, they all tend to be arseholes.
I'm sorry for postwhoring, but I really like this topic.
The Oranges, that is a brilliant supposition, and not one I think I might have come up with. I wasn't considering opposable thumbs. However, you'd think they would use Base 8 or 16 if that were the case, since 12 is one-and-a-half pair of hands (or one pair of hands and half a pair of feet, but the feet don't have opposable digits).
And I wasn't certain that anyone else here would know the word "arithmancy," as obscure as that topic is. If anyone knows what it is without looking it up, I offer ten dollars worth of Las Naranjas' money as a reward.
EDIT: Nik, I just saw your post. Americans are fat lazy bastards. I am lazy too, and it's because I'm so indoctrinated in the American way of things. Oh, and by the way, fix the key you were talking about, it came out to be a 8)... Somehow...
Also: Not to mention time signatures. Who the hell came up with 8/6 time? That's like two and a quarter waltzes.
Quote from: esper on Thu 27/10/2005 12:47:24
And I wasn't certain that anyone else here would know the word "arithmancy," as obscure as that topic is. If anyone knows what it is without looking it up, I offer ten dollars worth of Las Naranjas' money as a reward.
In Greek the word number is called: Αριθμός. Which is pronounced Arithmos. Do you see any connection between arthmancy and Arithmos? In Greek of course it would be αριθμητική pronounced Arithimitiki.
My money please, both of you.
Call 0800 696969 for free Greek lessons!
I'd also like to apologise for my excessive posting, but I've had some boring days here :(
That's indeed an interesting fact. Oranges has a habit of showing up and making heaps of sense.
(Although I prefer the time when he was a clear-cut socialist :P)
So what does arithmetike (see, you don't even know your own language... that's eta, not iota) mean? You haven't earned your bread yet, jokerÃ, :P
EDIT: To a non-nativer English speaker, that might sound aggressive. I'm sorry, Nik, I'm only joking.
Well arithmetike (I spelled the prononciation wrongly, so?), means arithimitcs. And if you check the greek work it is eta and not iota...
Quote from: esper on Thu 27/10/2005 13:02:21
see, you don't even know your own language... that's eta, not iota
That's what I said!
And no, arithmancy doesn't mean arithmetic. The key is the suffix "MANCY."
{This is getting way off topic now}
Quote from: esper on Thu 27/10/2005 12:32:09
That's a good point too, although I don't think it's what you intended.
Oh, cool, if I make good points that's because I wasn't intending to. It is great to know that a member pressumes that I am severelly idiot.
And Petter, Almodóvar is terribly boring for me. I preffer Amenábar Ã, :).
Anyway the good cinema joke (being the life of Brian an English film) is something I think monthy Python would include in this hypothethic film. Saying european films are bad in an English movie is the kind of things they do, and I love because they can have a laugh about theirselves.
Refering to other things, as many times you people do, focus on my examples better than in the spirit of the posts. I know the rocketry started in Germany, by Von Braun, but I don't think any historian would kill me if I said it was "developed" in the US. Anyway, the spirit of the post is that pressuming we could do better is going too far. And no one has still replied to me we could.
You just say, "well, they should have learned, no?" Why? Had the brits learned of the romans? Had the Romans learned of the babilonians? Why are we demmanding to the americans something we were not able to archieve?
And I am not very americanised. Actually, I see the world as a global town and I think I form part of America, as occidental, (in the same way you are Ã, ;)). I wear levi's, ride a trek bicycle, have a Ford, use Windows, hear the doors... But I am not totally pro-yankee. I hate McDonald's and family man. I do not automatically accept something if its american. I just choose. In some sort of way I do not watch flags, basically because I am terribly annoyed by the "spanish pride" that press like to boast anytime something sprouts, like a F-1 driver, or a new tennis player. I actually preffer to hear the driver, or the tennis player.
My press is annoyingly devoted to Fernando Alonso. I think he is very unpleasant. He annoys me and I preffer Kimmi. The press here is devoted to Rafael Nadal, the tennis player. I've heard him in interviews and he does not call my attention... I've seen Dani Pedrosa, the motorcycle ryder, and I like him. I want him to pass to Moto GP and win Rossi, which is a dork for me. I love Lance, as you can see in my avatar. And my favourite national team is... Sweden, because I like Larsson and Ljumberg.
So, I am not terrible pro-yankee, as you can see... It is just that they do not annoy me because I don't think my country or my community (Europe) is better. Maybe we can flip the omelette and say that you are very Europeanised, or Sweded! Ã, :) Maybe I am 20% pro yankee by definition, but you are 20% anti, recognise it!
Nothing serious, because you are because you are uthopic and you do in care of the traditions and beliefs of your contry, I like your attitude... It is just that I am less uthopic, I fear... I would like to believe still that my attitude could change anything, but I lost the push sometime between 21 and 23...
Anyway, I've written this will and I just can be happy for realising that I like you, and you like me, and no matter we're 40% points away in some topics. Ã, :D
/me kisses Petter
Ease up, Farl, you misunderstood me. I know you know what you're talking about. I was saying that you made some points that I could use against what you were saying, which I then went on to do. I meant no offence. Regardless of your spelling (I'm joking) and based on these and your past posts, I think you are actually very intelligent, and I admire your skills as an artist.
So try not to get all pissy in the future, okay?
Dude, I'm like 80% pro-american, personally. I watch american movies, read american books (Graham Greene and Paul Auster being my favourite writers) and I love Conan and Simpsons, etc.
It doesn't mean I don't think that the majority of the american population is a big fat mass of ignorant, self-centred fundamentalist bullies with little or no global awareness. Their political system is a joke and their leader is a caveman in a suit.
It's contradictional, perhaps.
ESPER: No No!!! I am terrible pissed!!!!!!
Actually... not... My humour is quite "Ringo", I like to make me pass as sillier as I am, and I love to use any little mistake to put together in the same sentence "idiot" and "I". Ã, :)
And please, use my points against me, I am quite sure the spirit of the thread is quite correct...
EDIT: Andail. Being 100% neutral in the scale of valours I jave just invented, being 80% pro american is is equal to being 20% antiamerican. IT is my table and I set the rules. >:(
And... Where in my post is implied that I do not believe that "think that the majority of the american population is a big fat mass of ignorant, self-centred fundamentalist bullies with little or no global awareness. Their political system is a joke and their leader is a caveman in a suit"?
The problem is that I agree with you, but my post does not mean "I think America is great". My post says "We haven't did it better than them, therefore, we wouldn't do it better if we were in his situation, now..."
[joke]As you can see, I am using the old and bastardish resource of forcing you to say "I think we are better than the americans" to go on the discussion, subsequently destroying you with the subsequent demagogic reply "Nobody is better than other". ;D
So, we can save all this time and declare me winner. \o/ Weeeeeeeeeeeh![/joke]
From the three of you I consider Esper the most Antiamericanized. Then comes Andail nd last Farlander.
Look America is the "biggest" nation in the world. And actually it has the size of Europe, or even bigger.
If I was an American I wouldn't give a fuck about what happens to tjhe rest of the world. I would have enough land to "play with". Think of it this way. The United Nations of Europe. What od we know about outside of Europe. Virtually nothing. We are one and the same.
America. due to to the fact of being a great Nation, had to pay a price. The price was the ignorance of their people and also the bad image to the rest of the world. I don't think thayt I've ever seen a leader being loved. No one! Why should we love America. It's not that it's doing something wrong. It's the fact that it's a leader.
Of course Bush is stupid, but then again I base my conclusions to poor facts. And I know that the worlds is not controlled by Bush. Bush is just a pappet.
One last thing, befoe I leave you:
@Andail: America is a whole lot differnt thing than the Americans. From this community I've come to met some people closer than others. One of these people is and American. Anotjher is Swedish, one from thwe Netherlands and a Greek guy. One of them is American! And I really like him! But I do hate the American politics, and everything that has to do with hamburgers, political correcteness, wars etc etc...
Hambourkers? In the same list as war and politics?
Oh, never mind, hamburgers are actually just as useful to us in America as politics and war.
And it's funny to note that in your list of the top three antiamericanized AGSers, the most antiamerican is an american.
Sure America does have some problems, but they are few and far between. Sure we do have some messed up communities, (frisco) and some very messed up stereo types which may have basis in reality. The matter of the fact is that most American critisizm stems in jealosy not by other peoples, but by their media outlets. The press is viciously anti american. Not only all over the world, but in America too. Storys surface about how the Americans polute the world. Russia, china and india, all polute more then us (on our dime might i add). In fact, Americans reccently have become the cleanest industrial nation propotionally to their output. Still pepole blame us for poluting the world. I have a friend, who is Brazilian. She often tells me how she can feel the global warming, and the UV rays, caused by the American factories. She tells me that she learned in Kindergarten that it was the Americans who were poluting the world, and to not be like them. When she told me this, i couldn't help but to retort "Isn't it the Brazillians who burn the forests so they can plant crops, only to leave the field baren a year later?" Everyone has their problems and they find it easier to blame it on someone else, and as Americans we are the biggest target for scapegoating. I'll revise my choices: Frank Sinatra, Elivis Presley.
I happen to know quite a few English people, and they are all very nice. I personally don't dislike England, I only dislike the Englishmen who are so dense that they accuse Americans of being short sighted, and buy into cheap stero types. That seams to be short sighted to me.
Say what you will about George Bush, but he's done a decent job. I'd bet no one here agrees with me, but he isn't as "stupid" as the media likes to portray him. He's done some pretty slick things, that really shut up the opposition's claims that hes stupid (in america atleast).
Now it is my deep personal belief that a union should be formed, between The United States, the United Kingdoms, the Austrialians, the Canadians, and the Israelis. the combined resources of this union would be able to solve most major problems around the world.
On the note of a future deep friendship, I would like to say God Save the Queen, Oh Canada, my home and native land, Advance Australia fair, Muzzeltoff (spelling?) and God Bless America!
~Osiris
Hopefully when you're older and more world-weary you'll read back on your political thoughts (or more likely regurgatating what your parents and peers think) as a 13 year old and realise how ludicrous they sound.
that was posted by my 17 year old brother... and hes joking (i hope)
;)
I didn't realise you were only 13.
For your information, USA is the biggest polluter in the world, both per capita and in sheer quantity. Please browse the internet for charts, if you aren't taught that kind of things in school.
Brazillians burn down rainforest because they're poor, and are paid to do so by rich industrious countries.
Your union-ideas are the ramblings of an ignorant child and do not merit a reply.
As a moderator, I'd also like you to note that we have a 16 year age limit here, and also that your account is personal, and that you are responsible for whatever is posted using it. Your brother is welcome to create his own account.
Quote from: Nikolas on Thu 27/10/2005 13:51:07
If I was an American I wouldn't give a fuck about what happens to tjhe rest of the world. I would have enough land to "play with".
The thing is that America, the nation, does give a fuck about the rest of a world. More of a fuck than many other nations. This is also the difference between this and the situation with Brits and Romans, or Romans and Babylonians. They really didn't give a fuck about eachother. Minding your own business (so to speak) can justify ignorance, but a certain degree of involvement calls for a certain degree of awareness.
I only have one last point to make:
"Hail Hitler"
Don't Like it?
that's what you'd be saying if it werent for America...
Originality 0.
We would all say that if it weren't for England, Russia or France too. They all both gave and took more beating than USA.
But please don't let us continue the debate in this direction.
you silly americans and your automobiles and fancy hats... ^_^
France??? Good Lord, the fastest surrender in history, and a "resistance" born in 1946...
Let's be serious, one thing is discussing and the other "forcing" conclussions. Americans did more than the french. Actually IMO the guys which contributed more were the greeks, the delay the Wehrmacht suffered in Greece prevented reaching Moscow. (Remember that the campaign in Greece delayed Barbarossa two weeks, and the Germans were at 8 kms. of the centre of Moscow when the rain stopped the advance of the armored vehicles).
Mussolini did a great job too, without securing the mediterranean, Not attacking Malta and Crete. Hitler had to sacrifice the Fallschirme unit for conquering Crete, a great loss for Adolf, we can say...
Even the italians rebelled against the germans more fierce than French never did.
Sorry... Maybe I have been hypocrital criticising you for being anti-americans... I am an "anti" as well. Anti french. (Anti la grandeur, anti la politesse, anti la politique...) But not anti Frenchs, ok?)
Thanks Villeneuve, great job in Trafalgar! ...sucker.
It's a huge holiday in Greece actually. Its called Αριθ ημέρα (auhee day). When they refused to join the axis. My dad's side of the family left sparta with hunting rifels to take on the German tanks in the mountains when they came.
I am going to throw in my hat on this debate. Its one of those things taht no one can convince anyone else anything, like Whos your favorite Rugbee team (see an olive branch). ;D
Rugby, football or soccer? Because we could discuss about that too... ::)
Farlander: Thank you so much.
I'm Greek and I know about WWII, but try to keep my mouth shut, cause everybody thinks that I say these things because I'm Greek. But you're not. Thank you!
Eldkatt: I'm talking about the ignorance of the Americans. And the global awarness. And I'm talking about the American citizen and not the America or the goverment or Bush (who might be an idiot, he might not. He sure looks like one though).
King_Nipper and his brother: I'm trying all the time to justify America and Americans but you havd to move on from the role of "We saved the whole world." thing, which comes out a little bit like "You're nothing without us". What day are you talking about. If you're talking about the day we said no to Mussolini, that's on the 28th of October (tomorrow...). And yes it is a big day for Greeks.
I had other synonyms. I chose one that was used in Harry Potter with the most explicit suffix and got lauded for it...
It's just distressing to think that people view the United States as full of all this bad crap. Just because we are in the spotlight, for whatever reason, dosen't mean everybody should look for things wrong with us.
We are all people, and probably have the same groups of people, problems, and other things, just different sitautions....We all have problems...
I am not a patriot, or really politically minded. I just think it's lame to label people, wherever they are.
Quote from: Squinky on Fri 28/10/2005 00:51:52
and probably have the same groups of people, problems, and other things, just different sitautions....
Nice assumption. Move to Europe and see if you're correct. I've lived in both Europe and US so I have my views in place.
Got me there. I'm sure you've learned a lot in your whole 15 years on this earth.
So, I'm supposed to believe that Europe is this magical place where the problems of the world disapear? Not buying it....
People are people...
Wasn't he complaining about violence in the former Yugoslavia last month?
Quote from: Squinky on Fri 28/10/2005 02:52:01
Got me there. I'm sure you've learned a lot in your whole 15 years on this earth.
So, I'm supposed to believe that Europe is this magical place where the problems of the world disapear? Not buying it....
People are people...
I never said Europe was a place where problems disappear. I was stating against you believing that everyone in the world thinks the same. Your priorities and mindset are completely different from Europeans, Eastern Asian, Middle East. I'd love to think that we're all just friendly human beings living together, thinking the same, living with the same mutual plans and ideals. I've been to the Middle East, Eastern Europe, Western Europe, and United States and that isn't how it works.
Telling yourself that we're all same in our minds really is ignorance.
I never said we all think the same. I said we all have problems, but there are basic human compulsions that play out regardless of your location. I didn't think this needed further explaination.
I can go a couple hours from where I live and meet folks that have completely different value systems than me, but they still are human. That is my point. Every culture has problems...
Quote from: Squinky on Fri 28/10/2005 03:14:46
I never said we all think the same. I said we all have problems, but there are basic human compulsions that play out regardless of your location.Ã, I didn't think this needed further explaination.
I can go a couple hours from where I live and meet folks that have completely different value systems than me, but they still are human. That is my point. Every culture has problems...
Theres even some compulsions that can feel a bit different, but now you're speaking alot more clearer and I understand what you are trying to say. I understood that you meant that we all thought the same in that previous post and it made no sense to me.
Is it 'cos he black?
Maybe it's because Sh*tar is 15.
Quote from: Gilbot V7000a on Fri 28/10/2005 03:39:26
Maybe it's because Sh*tar is 15.
Yes, I'm 15. What's your point? If you are going to try to insult me by discrediting me, atleast do it over the fact that I never made a released AGS game. Making fun of my age isn't anything more than an "e-cliche".
Hehe why? If someone was to be made fun of never released any AGS game, I'll be the largest target. :=
Curse you oranges, for using Harry Potter as a reference!!! At least you, unlike alot of other people, understand that Harry Potter uses a lot of real terminology and even historical names. Nicholas Flamel, for instance, is a real alchemist, and the Hand of Glory is an actual occult artifact made from the severed hand of a thief that is supposed to keep other thieves out of your home. Floo powder, on the other hand, is what happens when you freeze dry the contents of your nose.
Arithmancy is, by the way, the art of divination by numbers. Las Naranjas' money is no longer on the line. Instead, he must send it all to me.
EDIT and, Shitar (is that a legal name?): I understand more than anyone, probably, how age should not be a factor in dealing with people. I work with kids alot of the time, and I have seen an eleven year old that would do a better job as president than the one we have! (insert any "but ANY eleven year old would do a better job" jokes here) However, when it comes to political matters, alot of the time, people who are under the age of eighteen have never had any sort of dealings with the govornment at all. All they know about it is what they see on the news and what they see from their parents. So forgive Gil for passing judgement, but it is very possibly a valid judgment.
Quote from: King_Nipper on Thu 27/10/2005 19:37:41
I only have one last point to make:
"Hail Hitler"
Don't Like it?
that's what you'd be saying if it werent for America...
You just lost the discussion by default.
Godwin's Law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law) has been proved yet again.
Quote from: voh on Fri 28/10/2005 19:18:48
Quote from: King_Nipper on Thu 27/10/2005 19:37:41
I only have one last point to make:
"Hail Hitler"
Don't Like it?
that's what you'd be saying if it werent for America...
You just lost the discussion by default.
Godwin's Law (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law) has been proved yet again.
Wow... you owned him. Zhukov and the Russians were responsible for nearly 75% of all German casualties. Do the math.
You do realize that I'm not even taking part in this discussion anymore, and that I lost about 2 days ago, right?
We actually do know that...
Em, who am I talking to, you or your brother?
Do be honest this post is to ask you why can't your brother make his own account. Thank you... :D
Because he only wants to discuss in this thread, that's all. And no, he's not going to anymore. Just that shitar and voh still seem to think I am.
No, shitar, I'm not discussing anything politically related. That's not discussing the subject of america at all... that's throwing in the towel for the second time.
Quote from: King_Nipper on Fri 28/10/2005 23:21:34
Because he only wants to discuss in this thread, that's all.Ã, And no, he's not going to anymore.Ã, Just that shitar and voh still seem to think I am.
lol you're discussing right now...