Stuck for your latest game idea? Want to fly? Basically want to do whatever you want, whilst you're asleep?
Okay, so "whatever you want" may be a little un-true, but the ability to guide your dreams has inspired me a lot and it's something I'd like to be able to do.
TerranRich started a thread a while back about lucid dreaming and explained about how he gave it a shot. However, it sounded to me more like an OBE (out of body experience) than a lucid dream but, Rich, I could be wrong! He felt his thread didn't get the justice it deserved so I'm starting up a new one.
Lots of people have the ability to lucid dream and last night I was reading up on http://www.lucidity.com about how to achieve it and what not, and it sounds thrilling.
The basic principal is that when you're dreaming, you are aware that you are dreaming, and therefore realise that actually you are just in your bed perfectly safe and therefore can "guide" or "take-control" of your dreams. And pretty much do as you like.
The website explains several fairly easy steps to learning how to be a lucid dreamer. It appears that firstly you have to start realising that when you're awake, you're awake. That it is not a dream. But then also you have to imagine your surroundings as if it WAS a dream. (This bit confused me).
So, has anyone achieved this state? And have you done anything wacky? I know that if I ever have the ability to lucid dream there are LOADS of things I'd like to try out.
My only concern is the Games Factory theory. Basically that means, before I got the Games Factory, I visualised making racing games, 3D games and so forth, and then found out all it was good for was platformers. So, an expectations thing.
None the less, i'm intruiged and want to try it. I'm bored of shitty-dreams I can't control and would love the oppurtunity to be able to go to sleep and lead a "second" life as such. And what's good is that you don't even have to be religious :p
So if anyone's tried it, done it, can do it or knows ways of achieving it - please, let me know.
:)
m0ds
I keep meaning to try it but havent got round to it just yet. Sounds cool, though. Duzz has whole section about lucid dreaming on his site (http://www.wintermutestudios.tk/) that got me gripped a while ago.
I tried this a while back, but my sleeping patterns are too erratic and my dream-recall too poor (I tried keeping a dream diary, but I could never think to write in it when I woke up) for it to have been really succesful; however, I do recall one instance where I felt like I was in a lucid dream, and I started flying around (I wasn't really in possession of enough of my faculties in order to be able to think of anything original to do) but when I woke up it felt more like I'd dreamt about having a lucid dream, if ya catch my drift.
I might give this another go once I've got a bit more flexibility in terms of sleeping patterns, though; it's a very interesting phenomonon.
There are certain moments in my life when I can be quite good at directing my dreams... Some other times I just can't remember anything, so I can't really say if I'm lucid or not, but let me tell you how it works:
You must be very analistyc... I can control my dreams when I know that they're dreams. I've been told that only the human can remember dreams, because they can differenciate between dreams and reality, while animals can't (And it should be tricky if a cow awakes up thinking it can fly...)
Allways there is something that shows that you're in a dream... I.E. the buildings are different, if there are not happening more major things around (Flying pink elephants or something like that...) so... be aware of any sign of something strange in everything that is around you, in your life.
This is an ability that you must train while you're awake...
After that, the next step is quite difficult... If you're in a dream and you know it, your power is overwhelming, so... it is very easy to expoil it all! I remember that I was once dreaming that I was getting away from a killer... When I've realised of the absurd of the situation (I was in a strange abandoned factory of a big city, nothing similar to what I have to face everyday), I realised that I was dreaming, and then I decided to give a lesson to the killer. The result was absurd, I converted into a superhero and started to fly. This situations finally make you awaken up...
But if you archieve to go on dreaming it's thrilling, bacause,I don't know why, but every little think you have can get true while you're dreaming, which means that if you've felt pessimistic thae previous days, things in the dream can start to go badly... Till you recover the "control" the situation is very exciting...
Well... I don't think that many people here can face dangerous situations ofter, so, strange things happening in dreams can be quite exciting, don't you thing?
I'd rather not have control over my dreams. I like being surprised by what my subconsciousness comes up with. Just the other day, I had a dream that I was on a rubber raft with a band of pirates looking for Captian Chedder's sacred purple cheese.
M, thanks for the link to Duzz's site. The only bit thats confusing me still is the whole reality check thing.
QuoteText keeps changing and moving. Look at a word or phrase that you keep with you, and study it carefully to see if the words or letters move around, then look away, and back to see if they’ve changed. Alternatively you could look at your digital watch, and see if it reads correctly.
Okay, do I do this when I'm awake or asleep?
QuoteThe first time I counted 6 fingers on my right hand then another time 8, and it was all funny colours. Another time my left hand had the right amount of fingers, but they were all spread apart, it’s usually different, but never like my hand is in real life.
And what about this one? When do you do this? When asleep or awake? I mean, I don't understand how I'm suddenly going to see 8 fingers if I'm awake :p
Oh, and Farlander! That was very insightful and intruiging. I have a friend, Owain, who claims about 50% of his dreams are lucid - and knowing him they probably are. I think lucid dreaming is a gift - and it sounds like you have the ability to do it :)
m0ds
Another way is through self-hypnosis or meditation. You need to be able to relax to the extreme, where your entire body is numb and you will go into a waking sleep. Once you are totally relaxed, you will feel your heart begin to thump very hard, and it freaked me out the first time it happened so I wasn't able to do it again for a while. After your heart starts thumping really hard, you will eventually start to dream, or some people believe you leave your body. At this point, you are in total control of what happens. Another weird thing is that I was able to control my heartbeats.. maybe not something to mess around with.
QuoteOkay, do I do this when I'm awake or asleep?
Both. If you do it enough while awake, you'll (hopefully) eventually start doing it while dreaming. And if you check your watch while dreaming, check it again and notice that it doesn't say the same thing, you know you're dreaming. Yippee, lucidity!
Aha! So, when I experience it when I'm dreaming Ghormak, and see that the numbers have changed or something, I will eventually start realising that I am dreaming.
Gotcha! w00t :)
EDIT: One dream springs very clearly to mind, and it wasn't so long ago. I have no idea if it was a lucid dream but it almost seems to, if it's not, then it was just a realistic weird dream.
What I remember is sitting at my computer, and chatting on IRC in #ags. I kept asking everyone how it was possible that I was asleep yet sitting at my PC and using IRC, and everyone seemed confused and stunned. It just felt like I was sitting there typing for about half an hour. The next day, I almost went back on and asked if everyone remember chatting to me.
:)
I recall doing this when I was younger, Id have dreams that sometimes would span the entire week with me being this 'other life' during the dreams (about a day of the life total over a week worth of nights dreaming)
Quote from: m0ds on Tue 24/02/2004 16:03:24
What I remember is sitting at my computer, and chatting on IRC in #ags. I kept asking everyone how it was possible that I was asleep yet sitting at my PC and using IRC, and everyone seemed confused and stunned. It just felt like I was sitting there typing for about half an hour. The next day, I almost went back on and asked if everyone remember chatting to me.
Ah yes, being stoned on irc. Quite the passtime, eh mods ::)
Yes, Lucid dreams are totally awesome. I used to be really awesome at them. Then, one day, I got so good at controlling my dreams that I told myself I was going to GET UP WHILE I WAS STILL ASLEEP. I started by trying to lift my arm. It was really odd, because I kept lifting it in the dream and telling myself, "no, not good enough, you have to lift it in real life". It was like some sort of frikkin' dream magic. And then finally I managed to do it, and my arm felt so unbelievably heavy... and I let go, and the next moment I woke up because my fist had fallen on my face.
After that, my lucid dreams just went on a downhill spiral.
I used to be able to do some things when I was younger that could be considered 'lucid dreaming'.
I remember once I managed to say to someone in my dream - a famous (and beautiful) Brazillian actress - that I was dreaming. I mean, not like saying "This can't be true!" but as actually saying "I'm in my bed right now and this is my dream."
I also managed to 'fly' when I realised I was dreaming and, more often, I used to... how can I say... "play" with every female in my dreams... like, 10 in a row ::)
However, nowadays, although sometimes I still can realise I'm sleeping, when I do that, I tend to wake up. It's like being awake and sleeping at the same time - 'IN' my dream I realise I'm about to wake up, and I can hear both "Worlds" - the "sounds" from my dream and the 'noises' IRL - for a few seconds before waking up... :-\
Why, just last night, I was dreaming that I was driving from Canada to Okinowa, and I accidently stumbled into the long forgotten psychadellic love tunnel created by the feet of drunken, homosexual chinese men wearing leather. They waved to me and shouted, "Join us, and we will lick your armpits and dry you of your ball sweat!" Naturally, I started driving faster, when Robert DeNiro popped up out of nowhere, and stood right in the middle of the street. He seemed to be having an epileptic seizure, and was wearing a wedding dress. I couldn't stop in time, and ran him over. His body popped open and spewed forth many copies of Penthouse and National Inquirer. I grabbed a copy of National Inquirer, and saw that m0ds had recently gotten a sex change opereration from Yufster. M0ds had also changed his name to m0dsette. At the end of the tunnel, BOYD1981 was riverdancing and singing a song in a high-pitched voice. I ran him over too, but he managed to get back up and chase after me. He did catch up, then pick up the car, and flung it into the air. After about two hours, I landed in Scotland, then realised I was dreaming, and woke myself up.
Would that be lucid dreaming?
Nope, that'd just be you making a twat of yourself and turning a fairly interesting thread into a stupid, immature one.
:-*
Well, it's a good thing that dream never happened, eh?
Quote from: Robert Eric on Tue 24/02/2004 21:05:43
They waved to me and shouted, "Join us, and we will lick your armpits and dry you of your ball sweat!" Naturally, I started driving faster, when Robert DeNiro popped up out of nowhere, and stood right in the middle of the street. He seemed to be having an epileptic seizure, and was wearing a wedding dress. I couldn't stop in time, and ran him over. His body popped open and spewed forth many copies of Penthouse and National Inquirer. I grabbed a copy of National Inquirer, and saw that m0ds had recently gotten a sex change opereration from Yufster. M0ds had also changed his name to m0dsette. At the end of the tunnel, BOYD1981 was riverdancing and singing a song in a high-pitched voice. I ran him over too, but he managed to get back up and chase after me. He did catch up, then pick up the car, and flung it into the air. After about two hours, I landed in Scotland, then realised I was dreaming, and woke myself up.
*sigh* That sorta thing happens to me in REAL LIFE!!!
Lucid dreaming -- been there, done that. Actually, the first step to getting lucid dreams more often is just to get dreams more often. What works for me is to keep a notebook or post-its by my bed, and when I've just awoken from a dream, write it down. Even just a couple of unconnected words will work. The whole purpose is remembering your dreams. I find that if I don't write it down, my dream can be easily forgotten.
Once you get in the habit of writing down your dreams, you'll be able to have a dream every night, and pretty soon, a majority of those dreams will be lucid. For example, I've had two lucid dreams in the past week.
I get really great ideas for games and movie plots from my dreams, too. It's a great way to get good ideas.
I hate people who have lucid dreams so easily :'(
A year or so ago, I spent about two months FULLY concentrating on lucid dreaming. And where did I get?
Abso-friggin-lutely nowhere.....
Life is cruel.
Why are me and Mark the object of so many admiration and fan stories?
Are we both that sexy?
Yes.
Yes.
(Was there ever any question?)
Yes, the question was this: Are me and Mark that sexy that people have fantasies about us?
And the answer is Yes. Yes, we are.
Peter, it's a shame, but I've read that if you think about it too much then it just won't happen. So, try not to concentrate TOO hard and give it another shot! In the same way that if you think about what you dreamt too hard, you forget it (I liked the way the site said 'Other thoughts and memories compete for your attention, thus causing you to forget your dream') I guess if you try and "do" it too hard (Lucid Dreaming that is, RobertEric) you just won't be able too.
Geoff, lets say I wake up from a dream and write down the one thing I remember about it, for example, Curly ears. By writing that down, how will it help me "remember" my dream? :/
And Yufster;
(http://screen7.adventuredevelopers.com/fun/nakie.gif)
:)
Quote from: Indiana Psychonaut on Tue 24/02/2004 22:01:05
Yes, the question was this: Are me and Mark that sexy that people have fantasies about us?
And the answer is Yes. Yes, we are.
Actually, the answer is no; neither you nor Mark are even remotely sexy.
Well, Mark is, but that's beside the point; it's more the fact that you two are so completely and utterly besotted wth
each other that makes you popular with the AGS fanfic community.
Now who wants BOYD/RE slash fiction?
Nickhead. The reason people dream of us is simply because we promote ourselves too much.
After reading my messages, you'll then read "m0ds" at the end of it. Though people don't always read sigs, you've probably read "m0ds" at the bottom of my threads a million times, subconciously. Also the fact you've probably seen hundreds of images of me. LOL.
I think thats why people dream of me/Yufster.
:D
m0ds
;)
Well that's just bullshit.
Vel and Mills are the two people who have pimped (or 'promoted', as you chose to romanticise it) more than anyone in the community, and yet I haven't read a single fic focusing on them, despite the fact that they are an obvious pairing for a steamy lemon.
So, Mike, honey; I believe I have completely refuted your point, and that you owe me oral sex for such an unjustified contradiction of my statement.
/me unzips
Actually, I haven't had a dream since I stopped drinking booze. *shrugs*
I always had a hard time having lucid dreams, even when i was in my prime, (ie did reality checks all the time in real life) I only had a good lucid dream about once a week. It's harder for different people. The other thing you should know is that it takes most people a month or more to have their first lucid dream, after starting to try and have them. Some people have them the first night though, so don't be discouraged.
I find I can become lucid lucid once a week still if I start writing down my dreams again, but I can rarely get the motivation to do it for more than a couple of weeks.
Reality checks (RC's) are just so you know if you're dreaming now or not. Right now you're probably pretty sure you're awake, but when you're asleep you think the same thing, so you should do RC's all the time. They're hard to remember to do at first though. RC's are also useful if you think that you're probably dreaming but want to know for sure before you jump out a window or something.
Another thing that's good to do, related to reality checking, is to just imagine what you would do if you suddenlly realised that you were dreaming. This helps prepare you for when you DO become lucid, and stops you getting to excited and waking up. (most people wake up really quickly the first few times they become lucid.)
The thing with people who 'don't dream' is that they actually still have all the dreams, they just don't remember them. If, before you go to bed, you remind your self to remember your dream as soon as you wake up, and write down anything you can remember (even if it's something useless like '...went through a door...') you should be able to start remembering more and more.
How often should you do reality checks exactly? Seems like in a single day you could do it too much if you're not careful or if it becomes one of those compulsive-obsessive things. What about doing it at set times every day would that work?
unless you already have obsessive compulsive tendencies, i doubt you could do it TOO much. Generally the more the better, but working by a schedule works too. But The schedule should be something like, every time you "go to the toilet, or eat something" rather than "every hour" because then (hopefully) in your dream, when you eat something, you'll do a reality check.
How in depth do you reckon a reality check should be? Just a thought? Or a full pause, stopping and taking in everything about you for a few minutes.
?
PS, here's what I managed to jot down from last night in my "dream journal". This is the first time I've ever jotted my dreams down so its a little patchy :D
- Walking under an underpass of some kind, smelly, almost like a cow-shed but not unpleasent in anyway.
- Large house (no real exits?) with servants inside. Don't remember much.
- Board game - waiting for radio for clues to advance. A couple of other people playing it too. Was feeling happy but kept getting distracted / pulled away from the game.
- Violinists and a celloist playing, talking to me. I believe they were all on my back patio. (sp)
- Helicopters, several large ones (chinook's) flying about in strange formations and unusual movements.
- CB radio.
Also, I looked at a photo this afternoon which shows a guy called Martin Rant (an old friend) which triggered my memory and I remember he was in one of the dreams I'd had last night.
Anyway. This is just the start. YEY.
There is another thing, that's kind of weird. The last couple of nights I've been having problems closing my eyes. Well, keeping them closed. I'd rest on my pillow, close my eyes and I can't stop them from jittering under my eyelids, causing me to have to open my eyes again to be comfortable. Weird. I thought I just had something in them, but it happened again last night. It's teh gey. I don't think it's related to any of this, it's just annoying and is stopping me from getting to sleep :p
:D
Quote from: m0ds on Tue 24/02/2004 22:21:16
Geoff, lets say I wake up from a dream and write down the one thing I remember about it, for example, Curly ears. By writing that down, how will it help me "remember" my dream? :/
Yes, it will help you remember your dream. At least that works for me.
Actually, you probably want to write your whole dream down at first, but later on, you won't have to write anything and still be able to remember it.
EDIT: It's also good to write down what you smell or hear in your dreams, rather than just things you see.
Writing down your dreams is fun. I normally remember my dreams vividly when I wake up, but if I later in the day try to think about what I dreamt, I usually don't remember a thing. But if I write down a just a little about the dreams, it is enough for me to trigger my brain to remember the whole thing.
Here's an example of what I wrote down this morning when I woke up:
"I was participating in some kind of therapy theatre play at the stage of my old elementary school, and my old religion/psychology teacher was the director. When I got home, I had recieved 2 new text messages on my phone. One of them had a carton of apple juice attached. The carton was leaking, so I had to start drinking from it so nothing would spill. I drank until I woke up."
Because I wrote this down, I remember the dream very well. I know exactly what I mean by "therapy theatre play", but I don't have the faintest idea how I would explain it to anybody.
Yeah, isn't that funny how you forget it even twenty minutes after you woke up? Then again, sometimes you remember more of your dream as the day goes on.
I haven't had any lucid moments in dreams, but I have been able to meditate and control my heartbeat. I swear I became sadistic and made it stop for a few seconds. During that moment, my legs became very numb and it was a very surreal experience. Then i released my control and things went back to normal.
I want to try it again sometime. :D
Okay, that's it. I'm starting a dream journal. I've had way too many cool dreams I can't remember, except that they were cool.
Feh. Let's see what happens. Maybe I'll even get to Lucidity someday.
At certain times in my life I've had the ability to control some dreams to some extent.
Last night becasue of this thread, It reminded me to give it a go (but only a a subconcious level).
I woke up earlier than I wanted to get up so I tried to get some more sleep. Quite often when I wake up early it's in the middle of a dream, and if I can get back to sleep quickly enough I can continue this dream. I can also lead the dream in ways that I want too. I was totally aware it was a dream and at this point I actually remembered this thread.
It's still quite warped and changes like a normal dream, but you do have thoughts you can knowingly add.
I haven't had a dream for years where I could fly, but I used to have them all the time (especially when I was less than 10), and I could float around, but once I caught on I was dreaming I'd always slowly decend back to the ground, I could take off again for a while but as soon as I thought about it I fell back down. But the actual feeling was amazing.
some people say they don't dream, but that is not true, you dream several times every night, it's just that you don't always remember them.
From my experience it's easier to remember your dreams if you wake up during them, and they fade fast if you don't write them down (unless they're a nightmare that you'll never forget)
It is also easier at this point to start manipulating your dreams if you can get back to sleep. It can also be similar if you feel yourself waking up.
I remember studying something in a Psychology subject I did at Uni about the different levels of sleep, and REM sleep or something was the level where you were deep sleeping and where dreaming occurred (note this is vague & I could have dreampt it)
So I'd say it is usually when you are coming out of this state ready for waking that you are actually somewhere inbetween conciousness's, therefore you are more likely to be semi concious and control certain aspects of your dream (at the same time your dream can confuse your normal thought.
I suppose a good example is when your alarm is going off & you are interrupted in your dream by some siren or bizare noise. But It can suck sometimes when that Chick of your dreams is there and you can never see her face (lucky you can still see the other parts)
Now here's an awesome thread I wish I had seen earlier. I am totally in to this stuff, although I haven't successfully managed a lucid dream yet (for a few years, anyway).
Though I do have my dreamcall up to about 2 dreams per night.
As for reality checking... does anyone have any suggestions? I simply CANNOT remember to do reality checks. I even have bits of paper all over my room telling me, "REMEMBER TO DO FREQUENT REALITY CHECKS".
I never do!
There's always the easy way out: buy the novadreamer (http://lucidity.com) for a few hundred dollars. Lucid dream induction device. 8)
This might not be completely on-topic, but last night as I was going to sleep I tried meditating. I didn't know whether I wanted to control my heartbeat or try ethereal projection. I actually ended up speeding up my hearbeat to an insane speed, and I could feel my heartbeat pounding so hard, with so much force, it felt like it was about to explode out of my chest.
I have no idea what that happened, but it eventually slowed down and all is good. It was weird, though.
Quote from: terranRICH on Thu 26/02/2004 13:59:37
This might not be completely on-topic, but last night as I was going to sleep I tried meditating. I didn't know whether I wanted to control my heartbeat or try ethereal projection. I actually ended up speeding up my hearbeat to an insane speed, and I could feel my heartbeat pounding so hard, with so much force, it felt like it was about to explode out of my chest.
I have no idea what that happened, but it eventually slowed down and all is good. It was weird, though.
Happened to me too, I'm not sure why that is, but my friend told me that it happens when you are asleep anyway. Apparently you're just too asleep to care. You were in the waking sleep I referred to earlier, it is said that after the stage you were in you can leave your body or have a very realistic controlled dream. It takes a lot of self control to get to that stage however, and I've never been able to do it.
I'm surprised how many are familiar with lucid dreaming. I've tried it as well and at the time I read pretty much about lucid dreaming and OBEs and stuff like that.
To anyone that isn't familiar with lucid dreaming, I'd like to point out that one of the best parts of it is that everything feels as real as it does when you're awake. If your successful, that is. Sometimes not but I think it's a really important part of it which hasn't been pointed out yet, I think.
The things that I would've wanted to hear from the very beginning are ways to not get too excited (thus wake up) and how to prolong the lucid dream. As Duzz already pointed the good way to not get excited, I'll just tell how I was able to continue staying lucid when I thought I was drifting back to the passive state. I read from Stephen LaBerge's book that when you start losing lucidity, start spinning or falling back. The falling back technique worked well for me. The sensation is probably enough to keep you interested in that moment and thus stay active or something.
The reason I stopped trying lucid dreaming is that it's pretty confusing sometimes. I mean, figuring when you're awake and when you're not, as the dreams can feel very real. For example, if you think you wake up and think "yeah, finally a lucid dream" and then you wake up again, and after perhaps several times you really get up. It's just pretty scary.
But it was definitely a nice experience and I will keep it in mind if I ever feel the need to overcome a subconscious fear or anything like that. When dreaming you're in close connection with your subconsciousness so by what I've read, it's possible to overcome fears and stuff through lucid dreaming.
Anyway, the other major reason for me not going on with lucid dreaming is that I like to pay more attention to living in real world. Basically, you can have great sensations when on computer, or watching a movie or a dream. But for me, it's important that the feeling is 'real' in that fashion. But that's just me and this might not apply to others at all. And I mean the not being able to do stuff awake when you can do it asleep part.
Nonetheless, a very fascinating subject. I was really surprised to see Mods bring this up. No offence inteded. :)
Quote from: Pessi on Thu 26/02/2004 15:52:32
Anyway, the other major reason for me not going on with lucid dreaming is that I like to pay more attention to living in real world. Basically, you can have great sensations when on computer, or watching a movie or a dream. But for me, it's important that the feeling is 'real' in that fashion. But that's just me and this might not apply to others at all. And I mean the not being able to do stuff awake when you can do it asleep part.
My experience says that for recognising that a dream is a dream (And then, make it "lucid") you must be very aware in the "awaken" time, because many times the dreams are located in real places with things "that seem to be out of tune".
That's why you must be very aware. That's why I like the periods when I can have that dreams... But I can understand Pessi's feelings, as dreams are something very personal and every person can experience them in different ways.
I had a lucid dream once many years ago.
I did the traditional thing and went for a fly.
Haven't been able to do it again, despite doing some research on it and trying various techniques.
I used to know a guy who said he could almost always control his dreams.
I think the problem with that would be that real life would become overly boring and annoying.
On a note perhaps not so related, but interesting nontheless, has anyone found themselves jolted awake from a semi-conscious state with a very, VERY real feeling that they were falling? No dream or anything, just a sudden shock of waking up and feeling like you were falling. Happens to me pretty often, usually when I'm lying around on the couch watching tv or something similar. Not a pleasant experience.
Haven't experienced that, Rodekill, but it sure is interesting. And unpleasant, I believe. I'm sure most of us have experienced that when asleep but when awake? :o
On the guy who could control his dreams most of the time, the book I was talking about claims the following:
"The claim is often made by yogis and other specialists in "inner states" that they are able to retain consciousness throughout the entire night, including during dreamless sleep. Wrote a twentieth-century Indian master, Sri Aurobindo Ghose, "... it is even possible to become wholly conscious in sleep and follow throughout from beginning to end or over large stretches the stages of our dream-experience."
I'm sure you didn't mean that great a control but as this is kind of related...
Quote from: rodekill on Thu 26/02/2004 17:33:57
On a note perhaps not so related, but interesting nontheless, has anyone found themselves jolted awake from a semi-conscious state with a very, VERY real feeling that they were falling? No dream or anything, just a sudden shock of waking up and feeling like you were falling. Happens to me pretty often, usually when I'm lying around on the couch watching tv or something similar. Not a pleasant experience.
I know EXACTLY what you're talking about.
It does happen to me quite often (usually during the first few minutes I go to sleep).
It's like "before you sleep, though you're sleeping already".
Err... lemme explain it better:
Let's say I go to bed, then close my eyes and start thinking about anything, then, when I realise, I'm falling from somewhere and wake up inmediatly! Then I say to my self: "Wow, was I dreaming already?" Cos you have a VERY real feeling that you're falling, and your heartbeats accelerate and sometimes I see I was sweating, though I had been in bed for just about 5 minutes...
Sorry if I couldn't be very clear - it's really hard to express those things (and even harder in another language ;D )
Anyway, is that what happens to you, rode?
Shawn, sometimes when I'm drifting off to sleep my mind will suddenly spring to thinking about falling off a bike, or getting hit by a car or something and my body will jolt violently for a split second, causing me to wake up again. I usually have a chuckle afterwards tho because it feels so surreal. Is that what you are talking about? It's just like a brief spasm, not always all over my body, sometimes maybe in my arm if someone hits me etc.
Pessi, I can see your concern that "real" life is perhaps more enjoyable because at the end of the day, it is just a dream.
But what inspires me is the ability to lead a normal day by day life and then go to sleep and have some more fun. If you know you're dreaming when you're dreaming then I'd imagine that eventually you'd understand that what you're feeling, seeing and doing is just an "illusion". I wouldn't say my day-by-day life is very exciting, so I've got no concern about being able to control my dreams and do stuff in them.
You may not be similar but like RE it is understandable that some people want to dream what they dream. I don't. I hardly remember any of my dreams, they never mean anything and even if they do relate to something in waking-life present, past or future I would never be able to figure them out.
I've got a book on dreams that basically says; "Lucid dreaming is the devil! You shouldnt lucid dream because then you'll erase or change any messages you're being told in your dreams!" - which I think is rubbish. I don't like being pushed about in waking life and I don't really enjoy it in dreams. I'd like to take control. This way I think it'll help me in waking life, i.e. how to be more social etc. I can test conversations and so forth.
The only problem that remains is that it IS a dream and therefore whatever happens WONT be the real outcome! But it'll give you an impression :)
Plus, I'm never going to be able to fly. So, why not dream it and enjoy it - but dream it realistically :) I liked Duzz's plans of things to do! Hehehe.
No offence taken ^_^
:)
It's exactly like what Felipe described, and close to what Mods described.
Unpleasant.
Unlike bouncy boobie signatures...
when i was younger i could just imagine myself playing super mario brothers and playing on the first board mario would be jumping over holes, jump jump jump jump, and then i'd purposefully make him fall down a hole after ALMOST making the jump, my body would jump along with mario and i'd wake up
I experience it too, but not really the way you are describing it.
From your description it sounds like you're sure that you've already fallen asleep and started dreaming when you experience these falls. It's not that way for me. I can be lying in bed, eyes closed, just thinking about things, trying to sleep... and then BAM it feels as if the bed has disappeared! I guess it means I've already fallen asleep when that happens, but it certainly doesn't feel that way.
that happens to me now ghormak, when i was a kid it was Mario, now the bed just disappears...
I guess that's where "falling asleep" comes from?
What you're describing comes from what's called "hypnogogic hallucinations" (from the greek meaning "into sleep").
It happens when you're first drifting off to sleep and starting an initial REM period. You body is fully paralized (apart from the eyes) during this period, but when you're first entering it, if you're not paralized yet, you can sometimes jolt awake. I hit my self in the head once when I visualised my bike handle bars falling of my bike while I was riding. (I laughed out loud when I realised what was happening =) )
If you concentrate when you're falling asleep you can notice the hypnogogics start. You'll start having really strange thoughts, and a vivid imagination. This can be used to have a lucid dream, because at this stage you can still have consious control of your thoughts. If you try and hold on to the thought that you're going to be asleep in a few moments, and will start dreaming, you can become lucid. (this takes a lot of concentration though, and I'm pretty lousy at it)
QuoteAnyway, the other major reason for me not going on with lucid dreaming is that I like to pay more attention to living in real world.
I actually feel the exact opposite, when I'm really into lucid dreaming, I find that I can see the world in a whole new light. In a lucid dream, I can look at a tree, and marvel at its complexity; the textures and feel of the bark, etc. But in normally in waking life it's just another boring tree.
The element of ultra-reality that I enjoy in Lucid dreams, I started to feel in waking life too. Especially when I'm uber bored, commuting home from uni or something, I'll suddenly have a lucid moment, and everything will seem bright, and new. I can marvel at the sky or the people driving around, etc.
Another element of 'lucid living' is that I've started to do things that I would only really do in a dream. I'm usually a pretty restrained kind of guy. But I've been trying things that are 'out of my comfort zone' more often. Seeking new experiences. I think I've also become more creative since I started LDing. I'd never even tried drawing anything untill december 2002, I just didn't think I was creative enough. (But that's probably more to do with the fact that AGS is so cool)
QuoteI've got a book on dreams that basically says; Lucid dreaming is the devil!
A lot of people seem to think that they'll lose normal dreams forever, which I could imagine would piss dream analysts off, but even if you can manage 1 lucid dream every night, There's still an average of at least 5 other dreams a night. Plus you can analyse your own dreams why they're happening:
-"so, mr pink bunny rabbit, what you do symbolise?"
-"I represent your repressed sexual feelings towards your mother."
-"oh."
I'd like to benefit from it in the same way, Duzz. I'm sure many people would.
QuoteI've started to do things that I would only really do in a dream. I'm usually a pretty restrained kind of guy. But I've been trying things that are 'out of my comfort zone' more often. Seeking new experiences.
Like what?
:)
Well the best example would be "draining" (http://www.caveclan.org) The first time it involved climbing onto a ledge on the inside wall of the yarra river in the middle of melbourne, and then walking through a tunnel about a kilometer long, and popping up out of a footpath on the other side of melbourne, with onlookers looking at us strangely. That was a very dreamlike experience, and something I would have just said 'nah' to if I'd been asked before, unless I was really drunk anyway =P
The worst dream of all: Dreaming with something completely amazing... And forget what it was when you awake up!!!
I once dreamed that Beethoven and Mozard where at heaven and they had to compose a song for God. They did it and I remember that I felt something completely amazed.
But I forgott the tune :(
I had that same experience. I one time dreamt that I had written and could perform the greatest song ever to exist. when I awoke, I could remember the tune fairly well, and I REALLY should've recorded myself humming it. A few hours later, it was gone.
I wonder why memories pertaining to dreams are the most fleeting?
Quote from: Ghormak on Thu 26/02/2004 21:46:05
I experience it too, but not really the way you are describing it.
From your description it sounds like you're sure that you've already fallen asleep and started dreaming when you experience these falls. It's not that way for me. I can be lying in bed, eyes closed, just thinking about things, trying to sleep... and then BAM it feels as if the bed has disappeared! I guess it means I've already fallen asleep when that happens, but it certainly doesn't feel that way.
That's what I meant with:
"Before you sleep, though you're sleeping already." :)
QuoteI guess that's where "falling asleep" comes from?
LOL
Quote from: terranRICH on Fri 27/02/2004 03:46:50
I wonder why memories pertaining to dreams are the most fleeting?
It's because of the way the brain stores memories. Each memory physically alters the brain, creating a "wrinkle" as it were. At first the wrinkle is very shallow, but the more times you think about that memory the deeper the wrinkle becomes. If the wrinkle doesn't get deep enough fast enough, it smooths out and the memory vanishes.
Besides how many times you think about something, it also has to do with the number of different ways you access the memory. Remembering is one way; writing it down creates a secondary access pathway. Telling someone about it creates a third way of accessing the memory -- the more ways there are to access the memory the longer it takes to fade. If you're a programmer, think of it like reference counting and automatic garbage collection.
On the topic of lucid dreams... I almost always have some degree of conscious control, and always have. I've never had a flying dream, lucid or otherwise -- though I have occassionally had dreams where I jumped off something and just sorta hung in the air. For me, dreams are kinda like being on the holodeck in Star Trek, or in the Matrix. I can freeze the program, rewind it, alter it, change to a different program; but at the same time the program still has its rules which cannot be broken even when I try. I don't really need "reality checks" or any other special technique because dream objects are never as "solid" as real objects to me -- again, it's like a holographic environment: all fascade, no substance. I also look rather different in my dreams than I do IRL; probably a result of my personality being much more heroic than my physique.
Whoa, I didn't notice any of these threads before, I should read this forum more often..
Anyway, I have been interested in lucid dreams for quite some time, and have very recently finished a project on the subject of lucid dreaming (a few days ago). I've had some lucid dreams, and I'm glad to see many people here are interested in them too.
I am very interested in how lucid dreams can bring about creativity for game making. This can happen in regular dreams too, but more rarely.
I'm gonna read the thread now :P.
P.s. Does anyone have any information about the healing quality of lucid dreams? As it turns out, excercising skills, even those of malfunctioning muscles for example, can induce healing.
About falling asleep, I often get a similar feeling when waking up, like I was on top of the bed and fell down with a thump. It used to puzzle me, though not really scare, but now I think it might be an OBE.
I haven't read the thread yet, but has anyone had shared lucid dreams before? Apparantly it's possible to share lucid dreams, or have precognitive lucid dreams which take place in the real world at any time or place, and thus you could try observing the future (all in theory of course) or changing things in the real world. This concept really intriques me, and also it may be connected to deja-vus I often have.
Ryukage - Wow, that's some very interesting information. It's a mystery to me how the brain of the person can remember and "feel" so many things...
Perhaps these wrinkles dissapear with time when being unused? Could this be a method to forget something? Also, maybe going over memories while in a lucid dream could sharpen the memory?
Now I have a headache :).
I went through a lucid dreaming phase back in high school. I tried like hell to do it and was only slightly successful. Here's a few tips I remember.
The main thing is that you have to be able to recognize a dream when you have one. There are a few ways to bring this about. The most basic is to try and prove that you're dreaming every half hour (by making the carpet pink, or something small). If you get into the habit of doing this, eventually you'll find youself doing it within a dream itself. It's supposed to be one of the key excercises, but I would always forget to do it. :-D
Another tack, which was MUCH more successful, is to keep a dream diary. Keep a notebook next to your bed, and attach a felt tip pen to it with a cord. AS SOON as you wake up, jot down everything you can remember. Mark down what happened in the dream, your impressions of the dream, and what it might mean (if anything).
I diligently kept that book for months, and at first my entries were small and not very interesting. But as time went on, the entries became longer, more detailed and more complex. Basically, my brain was being trained to remember and recall more and more about my dreams. Eventually, this will make it easier to bring about a lucid dream. This actually happened a few times.
The lucid experiences I had were few but memorable. In one I was walking around my old summer camp. I remember feeling this wonderful wave of familiarity as I walked around. Like Duzz, the textures and colors were so VIBRANT! It seemed more real. I couldn't keep it going for long though, and I "woke up," although I only dreamt that I woke up.
My second lucid experience was truly bizarre, and kind of scary.
I was sitting in a circle of about two dozen people, and a middle aged woman was walking around the circle, asking each of us in turn: "Are you the one having this dream."
When she came to me, I said "Yes! Of course!"
She looked at me closesly, clicked her tongue, and said "No. Not you."
She continued down the circle, and eventually came to a teenage girl. The woman looked at the girl and said "You're having this dream. Do you know who I am?"
The girl looked up and said "Mom?"
The woman nodded. The young girl burst into tears of joy, and clung to the older woman with a vise-like embrace. They held that position for awhile, and I woke up soonafter.
Not sure what it "means," but it sure freaked the mortal piss out of me.
This isn't a lucid dream... But it's weird anyway!
It was right after christmas. My friend was on sleep-over at our house. I had gotten GTA3 that christmas, and it was the only game i played. We played it until 2 a.m and when I fell asleep, I dreamt that I was standing in a bus from GTA3. It was in 3rd person perspective too! Like in the game!
Anyways I get REALLY easily sick in buses, so I woke up at about 7 a.m, ran to the toilet and threw up :P. It wasn't all that fun. I felt someone was punishing me. I'm so gonna sue Rockstar games
What about aspects of time when you're lucid?
I mean, say you were guiding your dream could you repeat something several times, if you're able to stay in absolute lucidity? Your body has to wake up some time... I'd like to know a bit more on this.
Wow, fascinating stuff. So the first thing is to actually be able to remember your dreams, and progress from there to trying to control them.
I was wondering, does sleep-walking figure into this at all, or is that something totally different? You know, like where people wake up to find that they're in their car, crashed into a tree, in their pyjamas.
Is that a result of taking the lucid experience too far and starting to control your actual body from within the dream - as Yufster was talking about - or is it something else entirely?
I think sleep-walking is more when the dream controls your body. You don't have to be lucid to sleepwalk... or sleeptalk fot that matter!
I myself am afraid of the dark(result of too many horror movies as a child).
I had my cousin over to our house from sweden. She uses to sleepwalk. I woke up in the middle of the night when the floor was creaking, guess how freaked out I was! So I grabbed the closest knife to my bed (2 on my nightstand + 1 under my bed) and shouted: "Bring it on!" Then I turned on the lights and my cousin was standing in my room with a newspaper in her hand! I led her back to her bed. I'm glad she didn't do this every night.
P.S
I realize most of you think I'm a total freak having knifes all around my house like Rambo or something (Well not like Rambo, he has so small knifes), but it's only because I've started collecting knifes since my grandfather recently died and left me his knife from the wars (Finnish-Russo). I haven't yet got a monter to put them in so they lie around my room. My most violent act so far is slaying a snowman. It was childish and useless, but so am I :P.
There's another aspect of lucidity that I've experienced. I'm not sure if you guys have talked about it yet.
I was waking up from a lucid dream, and I felt myself waking up, so I tried to stay asleep. I actually soon found myself in a state between sleeping and dreaming, where I could actually see through my eyes in real life, and be dreaming at the same time.
Quote from: Geoffkhan on Sun 29/02/2004 00:09:52
There's another aspect of lucidity that I've experienced. I'm not sure if you guys have talked about it yet.
I was waking up from a lucid dream, and I felt myself waking up, so I tried to stay asleep. I actually soon found myself in a state between sleeping and dreaming, where I could actually see through my eyes in real life, and be dreaming at the same time.
I mentioned that in my first post:
Quote(...)It's like being awake and sleeping at the same time - 'IN' my dream I realise I'm about to wake up, and I can hear both "Worlds" - the "sounds" from my dream and the 'noises' IRL - for a few seconds before waking up...
But, as I said, I don't manage to 'stay' in my dream and see it fading out slowly :'(
Hmmm... but the interesting thing was I was both dreaming and awake at the same time, if you know what I mean. And rather than being pulled towards being awake, I was in a balance between the two. Almost like a mix of both worlds. :)
Geoffkhan, that half awake half asleep thing sounds cool :D
And a note to anyone who's thinking about lucid dreaming, although I'm only on the first step (dream diary) - I've been doing it for about four days now and each day I've remember my dreams more and more clearly. I wrote a lot down today about what I dreamt last night, as I have remembered a lot. I'm sure you will too.
:)
CJ, I think the sleepwalking issue stems from the fact that body is paralyzed when you're sleeping. If the body isn't paralyzed for some reason you probably end up walking around or something. But that's not really textbook knowledge.
An interesting related issue is that it's possible to wake up with your body paralyzed. I don't think it lasts more than a minute or something but it really would be scary to notice you can't move your body. I suppose it's one of the many variations of somewhere in between dreams and reality experiences.
I think the point of dream diary and similar methods is that you remember how it feels when you're asleep. So that you can learn to recognize the dream state. Or did someone already point this out? I probably missed it.
I had my first OBE when I was five. It was werid. I had gotten up and went downstairs. I made notice of what my mother and father were doing. But they wouldnt talk to me. I woke up. I found it odd, but I was hungry so I went downstairs. Parents were doing the same thing as in the dream, same spots, same clothes, same look outside, everything. I didnt know what it was until a few years ago.
As for my last lucid dream, well it was only semi-lucid. Meaning I know I am in a dream but I cant control it. That was a few weeks ago. Normal thing for me. Last time I had full control was last year, about march. Pretty average stuff, jumping high, backflips, the normal stuff I do.
Anyway, the easiest way I have found is what they say most everywhere, a dream journal. Once you wake up from a dream, write down everything you can to the max detail, drawing pictures helps a bunch. Once I started doing this I sort of have flashbacks, like I just had to pause because I had one. It stops your thinking. The one I just had was as vivid as the dream, but only seeing half a second. This helps to acheving lucid dreams, and they also make good stories for little kids I find.
Dreams are feelings, emotions, and thoughts that build up, and come into view as an image. Even if you cant lucid dream, but can remember your dreams and what happens, its still great. My dreams have taught me a lot. Well I'm done.
Quote from: m0ds on Sun 29/02/2004 13:35:51
And a note to anyone who's thinking about lucid dreaming, although I'm only on the first step (dream diary) - I've been doing it for about four days now and each day I've remember my dreams more and more clearly. I wrote a lot down today about what I dreamt last night, as I have remembered a lot. I'm sure you will too.
:)
Yep. That helps a lot.
I've been doing it (though not writing nor recording them, but just remembering) and... well, the first day I just remembered a short 'scene' of a dream. Then the next day I managed to remember TWO parts of my dreams (two different dreams) and each day I remember more and more.
This is really helpful. ;)
I have kept a dream diary for like a week now, and my notes show my memory oscicaltes (that the word?)... It's like, first, I remember a still image, then small shatter, then nothing, tne shattert, then nothing, then a coulpe of secs of my dream, then again nothing, then again a clip of the dream, then nothing, and the, I remembered nearly the whole dream....
About the self hypnosis thing, I've tried it on the past two nights.. the first night, I just got myself completely numb.. then I forced myself to change my pose, after which I could feel again, but very shotrly after that I fell asleep and rememberd most of my last dream, which was interupted by my alarm clock... had to wake up for school... and last night, I got myself completely numb, so I could feel myself nor the bed, but I was fully conscious of my surrounding. I heard all the noises normaly, I could open my eyes and stare at the ceiling and just think... that's what I'd call relaxing... But anyway, after a I continued the relaxing some more, I got this feeling like I'd be torn into several directions, by some sort of invisible forces, with my feet and my hands nailed shut right where they were.. that was bizarre.. but then, quite soon, it went away, and I was numb for a short time, after which I got the feeling of a freefall... AND WAS THAT AWSOME! :D Next time I get to that I'll try to think I'd be in CJ position... :P but the fall didn't last long, it just slowed down, after which I started spinning very fast... and that was awsome aswell. When I slowed down my breathing, the speed fell, and when I inhaled harder, the speed grew, very fast. For some time I spinned there (I even could open my eyes, it was wierd) after which it just stopped and I was completely numb again... Then I had the feeling I have to change my pose, which I forced myself to do, and the numbness was gone. After a while I fell asleep, but I couldn't remember anything from my dreams. But, for the whole time I was there falling or something, I could hear the sounds that came from the world around me, I could sense the bed there under me... It was an odd but great feeling.. Now I think I understand buddhas...
That's happens to me quite a lot without reading how-to guides.
Usually in the early morning.
The only bad bit is when I come back to reality. I feel like I've just fallen onto my bed from a great hight.
Quite unsettling...
I just read through this thread. Very interesting. The nearest I've ever got to controlling what I do in a dream is when I am nearly awake. I have had conrol for a few minutes but it then fades out.
Just one thing. If some people can control basic bodily functions. Isn't that kind of like hacking the mind? controlling it directly through commands you enter rather than the low level stuff beng handled by itself and you controlling your movement through a kind of high level shell? It sounds like you could really f**k yourself up if you mess around with your body too much. Just as you can your pc by changing settings in your OS or bootsector. Or you might not come back to reality and could be stuck in your mind. Just thinking about the risk factor here.
You came here to freak us all out? :P jk
Hmmm... I remember a dream from like 8 years back. And I wasn't a nightmare or anything, despite that it ended in a forrest fire blazing towards me and the other people there...
I think the spinning around your axis, and the hands thing is a thing ba C. Castaneda, right?
And your OBEs, those are Astral projections, right? I remember those, with nostalgy.
The thing with dreams is really crazy, or better, fascinating.
I think the thing Rode and Felipe were talking about is more of a feeling that you're falling/drowning (have you already finished this discussion?).
It happends to me occasionly ( i think) while i'm sitting on this chair in front of the PC, or on the couch (more oftenly), but i think of it more as a experience, than a unpleasant feeling.
Youre lying (or sitting) and suddenly you feel like your back and your head are going backwards, like you're gonna roll over, if your head is vertical you feel it then more horisontal, and if it's horisontal, then you feel more vertical, if not youre feeling like this:
V legs
/ back
0 head
Well, at least that it for me.
Anyway, are you guys familiar with the feeling when you are suddenly getting up from a long couch nap or something, and then you feel that there is a change of blood in your brain, and you feel weak, you're loosing balance, and your sight is blurred ( like when you're doing big pressure in a F-18).
Have you ever tried to control it, going against it, thatis?
You have to try that.
Quote from: Czar on Wed 03/03/2004 17:53:07
Youre lying (or sitting) and suddenly you feel like your back and your head are going backwards, like you're gonna roll over, if your head is vertical you feel it then more horisontal, and if it's horisontal, then you feel more vertical, if not youre feeling like this:
V legs
/ back
0 head
Something similiar happens to me sometimes when I'm lying on my bed, trying to sleep... I feel like I was sinking on the bed, yet the "top side" of my body is still... that's a wierd feeling...
QuoteBut anyway, after a I continued the relaxing some more, I got this feeling like I'd be torn into several directions, by some sort of invisible forces, with my feet and my hands nailed shut right where they were.. that was bizarre..
Seems also similiar, but in an already paralyzed state...
QuoteYou came here to freak us all out? jk
I haven't even started yet... ;)
Anyway, I sometimes get the feeling I'm falling when I'm in bed and I suddenly grab it in some kind of reflex action. It's quite real.
The being pulled around in different directions thing happens when I lay completely still for a few minutes. You can also make yourself feel like you are rolling around or moving your limbs by moving without using your muscles (hard to explain but its like trying to move a part of your body with an extremely small force so there is no movement, if you do move your muscle it breaks the illusion).
Yeah, after lying still for some time, I couldn't move my limbs... when I tried to move them, I felt them, but they didn't move...
Have you people experienced the feeling before you're supposed to sleep.
You lie in the bed, thinking: "this is so comfortable, I don't want to move" and then you have to turn the lamp off, but you don't want to. Then you DO turn off the lamp, and it's not the same anymore.
I also have these "wake up!" reactions. When I'm falling asleep, starting on a dream and happen to die in the beginning, I suddenly jump up to a sitting position and have this "WHEW!!!" reaction.
OR, should I go see a shrink?
QuoteYou lie in the bed, thinking: "this is so comfortable, I don't want to move" and then you have to turn the lamp off, but you don't want to. Then you DO turn off the lamp, and it's not the same anymore.
'
Had that. It's not nice...
Man, my dreams are getting wiggety whack. I dreamt the cast of Clerks (animated, not real,) all started to make fun of me. I'd scrounge around in the M$Pain game to find my other freakish dream.
I have to say, this is much more difficult than I imagined. Since last weekend I've just been trying to keep a dream diary, but only one morning have I woken up remembering anything at all to write down. I suppose it just takes time and patience.
It is hard... I have longer notes from only the past two nights... the others are just a few words or lines...
Ok here are some ideas. (Han't read all replies so sorry if some has already been suggested).
First the most crucial point in getting lucid dreams is remembering your dreams. We all dream every night. The first hours of the night the REM sleep is short. But later on the dreamperiods (REM sleep) gets longer and more frequent. Therefore the more hours you sleep you will experience more dreams and longer dreams. (I recomend 10hours sleep! and perhaps a nap in the afternoon :) )
Therefore remembering your dreams and having lucid dreams are easier in the morning hours. When you wake up in the morning, lie still (don't get distracted by your room and thoughts about what your going to do etc) and try to remember what you dreamt. Maybe you just get a feeling, write down the feeling. Maybe you just remember a person or something but nothing els, write that down. Often this trigger your brain to remember more. After a while thise will get easier and you'll have no trouble remembering your dreams.
There are good books about lucid dreaming (I'd recomend Experience lucid dreaming, Stephen Laberge? (spelling)).
Here are some extra things that I've found useful:
When you dream you are more or less uncouncious, you just float along and your subconcious keep poping up ideas and images. Your agenda is to get to a state where you are concious (like you are in the daytime) and still have your subcouncious mind intact (dreaming). But think about this how much time in the day are you really concious and how much time are you doing things without thinking! Alot. Take walking for instance. You walk without thinking about the walk, right? When you eat a pizza slice you don't think about chewing, swallowing etc this comes without thinking. If you (for instance 10 minutes a day) try to do things consiously that you normally dont have to think about (subcontious actions?) you'll probably do that when you dream aswell. This worked really well for me and it was interesting to think about how much stuff we do without thinking.
Another thing is don't neglect your hypnogogic dreams. Hypnogogic dreams are images and thoughts that flash before you just before you fall asleep. If you wake up early in the morning and you can fall asleep again this is a perfect oportunity to experience lucidity. When you feel that you are drifting into sleep try to focus (without thinking) on the hypnogogic imagery that you see. If you train this you'll hopefully drift into a lucid state when the hypnogogic dreams turn to a REM-state. This doesn't work very well when you go to bed since the hypnogogic dreams then wont get you to REM-sleep. But it's still good practise to focus on them then to.
Another thing that is important to understand is persistance in the lucid state. You may get a feeling when you're dreaming that everything is not right, you start to feel that this is a dream (but you havn't really figure it out yet). Maybe you make a joke in the dream and say: "Hey this is crazy, this must be a dream." This is the time to make a dream test (but you won't make a dream test if you havn't practised it when you're awake, so that is important).
I have often dreamt that when I'm just about to realice that I'm dreaming, someone tries to persuade me that it in fact is not a dream. If you are not persistant you'll exept the explanation, how crazy it may be, and the dream will continue without you getting to a lucid state (very enoying). You have to pass the line between subconsious and consious. It's a hurdle and you really have to puch your way through. Maybe you have to make a dream test several times.
Well that are some of my thoughts anyway, good luck.
Mason
I always find that whatever I go to sleep wearing is what I am wearing in the dream. Strange thing is, the people in my dreams act like I'm fully clothed.
Quote from: Pumaman on Sun 07/03/2004 19:54:04
I have to say, this is much more difficult than I imagined. Since last weekend I've just been trying to keep a dream diary, but only one morning have I woken up remembering anything at all to write down. I suppose it just takes time and patience.
Keep postits or some paper and a pencil in easy access from your bed. In fact, you could probably hang them from the wall or something so it's not too much effort to write down your dream. Sometimes I wake up from a dream and really don't feel like sitting up and getting a nearby pencil and paper.
I had another lucid dream about two days ago, and I tried something. I tried falling backwards. It was weird because I could pull myself back up *right* before I hit the floor. Sorta like in one of those special effects martial arts movies.
Now if only I could do some of that stuff in real life... :)
Something wierd happened to me this morning... It was like, I had just looked at the clock, which was 14:01, and I realized that I was late from school big time. So, I layed there for a few seconds, and looked at the clock again. It was seven. It was half an hour till the alarm clock would go off, so I layed back down, and wierd images started to flow to my mind. I don't remember what I saw, but all these things came from nowhere. I realized, that my brain must have still been dreaming... I layed there for some time in a half-conscious state, and when I felt I had been there for like half an hour, I looked at the clock, and it was only 7:14, so I layed back down again, and the next thing I knew was that my alarm clock was ringing...
Madness :D
I agree with Mason, the more sleep you get the better dreams you'll probably have. At the start of last week up until Saturday, I had been going to bed about 2 or 3am, and hadn't remembered any dreams in the mornings.
on Saturday, I went to bed about midnight and the next morning found myself writing three pages worth of dreams. Sunday night I went to bed about 11:30 and had the same luck!
No lucidity yet tho ;)
Weird Phenomena
1) Ever been asleep and dreamt something, like, having a bundle of cash in your wallet - and then woken up in the morning and checked your wallet cos you're sure you remember there being lots of money in it?
I remember once having a dream where someone had seen me do something and was threatening to ring the cops. I woke up the next morning and thought it'd be better if I didn't go into work just in case the police were there or that the person that was trying to tell me off had done something :p But, of course - it was just a dream!
2) One of the most taxing things that comes to mind when it comes to dreams for me, is this:
When you are physically having the dream, it all seems real and you KNOW it's happening (whether you're lucid or not). Like, say, I'm sitting here typing and tomorrow I'll remember that I did this, and that I physically sat through it. However with dreams the next day, what you remember is really bitty. You know you dreamt something and you know at the time it seemed real and was happening there and then, yet you can barely remember it.
It's quite hard to explain.
Anyway, YAY
:)
I seem to have been 'blessed' with another lucid dream last night.
This time I tried spinning around as fast as I could. It's hard to explain -- it's really wierd -- you just have to try it for yourself. And, of course, I had to try that 'falling over' thing again. It's just so fun!
Usually my lucid dreams have been very short of late, though, so that's the disappointing side of it.
You consider them a blessing? :p
Last night I had a little control over my dream, I believe. I don't think it was lucidity tho. A crack formed in a car park, and I willed it to keep going until a full earthquake situation was going on. Once gas and stuff started spraying out of the ground I willed it to stop. I don't know if that was lucidity or just control over the dream a little, or just the dream itself and neither of those things. There was never a point where I thought "Hey, i'm dreaming, so i'll do this."
Plus, I was being attacked by weird spiders in another dream and I was trying to "reset" or "restart" my dream. But again, I think thats just weirdness rather than lucidity.
First: the book I refered to is called Exploring the world of Lucid dreaming:
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/034537410X/103-4285153-3109464?v=glance
It's a practical book that deals with everthing that has to do with lucid dreaming. I can really recommend it.
TK, sounds lika a false awakening to me. You dream that you are awake.
This is a big trouble if you want to get lucid because just when you realise that you are dreaming it's easy to loose focus and you wake up. But often you don't really wake up. You just dream you do. :P
To get away from this you need to make a dream test by looking at your alarm clock, turn away and look back again. If the numbers have changed your dreaming. You can train this by doing a dream test every morning when you wake up. I've realised a silly thing, this only works with digital clocks normal clocks seem to work in the dream and therefore you can't make an accurate dreamtest!
Another intresting thing that I found is when you have a "total lucid dream" the dream seem almost more "real" then when your awake. You can feel the texture of things, is it cool,warm. Taste, colours everything seem MORE...if you know what i meen. It makes you think about life...what's reality. Is there life beyond this physical realm? My conclusion after experiencing with lucid dreams is that if I can have experiences that seem more real to me when I don't have to use my physical body or the physical world directly (I use my brain offcourse) then the thought isn't far away for me to believe that I can have experiences after I'm dead as well. You really have to experience a lucid dream for yourself that is so REAL you cant believe it... after that you'll start thinking...
/Mason
Quote from: Mason on Thu 11/03/2004 12:01:59
TK, sounds lika a false awakening to me. You dream that you are awake.
This is a big trouble if you want to get lucid because just when you realise that you are dreaming it's easy to loose focus and you wake up. But often you don't really wake up. You just dream you do. :P
But, I looked at my watch (digital one) - picking it up from the desk next to my bed, then putting it back on a difrent spot, which was 7:01. I layed back down, and I KNEW I was awake. I felt my bed, I heard the air conditioning... everything... when I next time looked at it, it was in the spot where I put it last time. I was awake, or then on really thin thread of dream... because it was just so real. I was sure I was awake. My dream had ended in me looking at my watch, and it being 14:01. That is all I remember of that dream.
I had my first lucid dream in a long time today! It was fun! I was floating around, as if I was swimming in the air, when I realised that what I was doing was not possible. So, I looked at my watch (remembering what was said in these forms about reality checks), which was a silly thing to do because it is not a digital watch. It was not there, which is not usual. Then I got this weird feeling of elation, and I realised that I was about to wake up, so I tried falling back and then spinning (another thing I read here), but it did not work, and my my vision kept switching from what I saw in from my bed and what I saw when I was asleep.
At last I woke up. My sister was there, so I started telling her what had just happened. She was ignoring me and acting like I was stupid, which was weird again. Then, I woke up AGAIN! This time it was real. The dream was weird, like I was controlling a puppet instead of myself
I used to have this alarm clock that made a weird staticky crunch noise before the radio would come on. After using it for a while, it got so I would wake up as soon as it made the crunch. Then, if during the day I heard a noise that sounded a bit like the noise my alarm clock made, I'd kind of tense and jump, like I was expecting to wake up...
I don't have that alarm clock any more.
I am glad.
Davy