Adventure Game Studio

Community => General Discussion => Topic started by: rodekill on Sat 20/09/2003 00:44:52

Title: Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: rodekill on Sat 20/09/2003 00:44:52
Voxels are back (http://www.advsys.net/ken/voxlap/voxlap03.htm)
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Flippy_D on Sat 20/09/2003 00:59:20
Ooooh, how nifty.
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: TheYak on Sat 20/09/2003 07:51:01
Ken Silverman?  I could be wrong but wasn't he the guy who made Ken's Labyrinth?
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Shattered Sponge on Sat 20/09/2003 08:07:12
Yup, Yak; and he creted the Build engine, too - browse around his site and you find loadsa info.

Wow.  I hadn't seen this in a while, but it looks much, MUCH better then when I last looked.
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Hobbes on Sat 20/09/2003 08:52:51
Ooooh, then someone can finally make Outcast 2. :)

Looking good!
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Ciro Durán on Sat 20/09/2003 12:02:45
It's Ken Silverman! :o,  w00t, no wonder why that engine looks so  damn pretty cool.
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Trapezoid on Sat 20/09/2003 16:05:26
Heh, fun.
I completely leveled the place.
(http://www.eviltrailmix.com/img/leveled1.png)

Then I got creative with the scorch marks:
(http://www.eviltrailmix.com/img/leveled2.png)
(That's an S, not a 5.)
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Nellie on Sat 20/09/2003 16:20:54
Holy crap, blowing up the environment is fun.  I'd give my left armpit to see rocket launchers have that effect in Unreal Tournament.

And all that from a 500 measly kilobytes download, too.
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Ghormak on Sat 20/09/2003 19:00:12
If that thing had realistic physics it'd be the coolest thing ever.
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Snake on Sat 20/09/2003 19:54:51
AG5?2?!!

hehe

Sweet stuff, thanks Rode, downloading now...


--Snake
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: MrColossal on Sun 21/09/2003 00:16:10
wow Scid and i went on a "what the fuck are voxels?" crusade a few years ago and i found his page, i would love to know what games would be like if voxels were chosen over polygons...

i emailed him and asked him how it was going and if we'd ever get to peek at the new engine and he said soon.

2 years soon

downloading now

eric
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: BOYD1981 on Sun 21/09/2003 02:09:44
something like this perhaps...
(http://www.arstechnica.com/etc/games/3q99/outcast/water.jpg)

it's a screenie from Outcast btw...
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Flippy_D on Sun 21/09/2003 02:19:40
Ehm. Dude. Impressive.
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: auhsor on Sun 21/09/2003 03:16:40
Heh, that looks cool. Gonna download now.

Hmm, i don't really know what voxels are, but i think i got an idea...
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: BOYD1981 on Sun 21/09/2003 03:50:47
they're cars...
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Hobbes on Sun 21/09/2003 08:27:17
Argh!

Seeing that screenshot makes me want to install Outcast on my machine again... that game was just *too* good to be true.

And is also available on The Underdogs, if I'm not mistaken.... ;)

So, yeah, voxels are great. The only problem is that they're not accelerated with today's 3D hardware. This was one of the reasons why Outcast never really became a hype. Lots of computers back then couldn't play it properly. That, and the absurdly low resolution, of course.
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Nellie on Sun 21/09/2003 11:22:21
Yeah, Outcast was amazing.  But why oh why did they stick in that ridiculous LESN FLAER?
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Krynge on Sun 21/09/2003 14:39:24
? I've never seen anything like this before!!! a 500k file inflates into over 120mb, and the worlds look awesome!!! How is this done without solids (polys I mean)???
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: TheYak on Sun 21/09/2003 20:48:44
Voxel stands for volume-pixel.  In typical 3D, we have points connected to make lines and 3 lines together forming a triangle (Of course, some 3d apps don't use only triangles but 3D games do).  The problem with this is that for a realistic scene we need 3 sets of coordinates (in x,y,z) for every triangle and then attributes for the triangle (Texture, alpha, masking, shadowing, bumpmap, environment map, etc.)  It adds up to a lot of data for even the description of a simple box.  

With volume-pixels, each "pixel" is not one "dot" on your monitor but rather a 3-dimensional cube.  Imagine a landscape made out of building blocks and you get the general idea.  Since each voxel is a small part of the whole, it can be assigned simply 1 color based on the color scheme of the whole.  It requires only 1 set of coordinates - placing this "block" in 3d-space.  The amount of data is reduced greatly and any shadowing or other lighting effects are generated to the map as a whole.  The downside to voxels is that you can only be as detailed as the number of voxels generated, depending of the size of them.  So, if you've got decent hardware CPU-wise and memory-wise then a modern voxel app can generate a nicely detailed scene.  
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Hobbes on Sun 21/09/2003 20:52:11
Quote from: Nellie on Sun 21/09/2003 11:22:21
Yeah, Outcast was amazing.  But why oh why did they stick in that ridiculous LESN FLAER?

True. :) But in that game, it didn't really bother me that much.

Did you hear Outcast 2 got cancelled? Very, very big loss for the gaming community there. Appeal is bankrupt, and the project is lost. For more info: http://www.outcastii.net/eng/index_eng.php
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: TheDude on Sun 21/09/2003 20:56:34
That's not an engine... THIS is an engine http://rainbow.cs.unipi.gr/~harkal/sylphis/
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Trapezoid on Sun 21/09/2003 21:46:32
TheDude: I downloaded that. It just crashes. :P
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: TheDude on Sun 21/09/2003 22:01:41
Quote from: Trapezoid on Sun 21/09/2003 21:46:32
TheDude: I downloaded that. It just crashes. :P

Just download the physics demo video instead, it's pretty amazing for a one man effort.
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: remixor on Sun 21/09/2003 22:36:36
Wow...I haven't even heard voxels mentioned in years.  I remember when they were heralded as the Next Big Thing.  Maybe they'll come back.
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Archangel (aka SoupDragon) on Sun 21/09/2003 22:41:17
The only company I know to have used voxels is Westwood; Red Alert 2 was their last voxel game, before they started on polygons for C&C Generals
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: MrColossal on Sun 21/09/2003 22:53:06
um, whatsitcalled used Voxels... some war game that was really stupid

dammit the name escapes me

imagine voxels as water that flows and splashes and all that awesome shit... man polygons are for suckers

i bet Mr. T pities them!
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: remixor on Sun 21/09/2003 23:06:25
Didn't the Blade Runner game use voxels for character models?
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Isegrim on Mon 22/09/2003 09:49:23
I remember ancient Comanche using voxel landscapes.
(The helicopter simulation, not the indian tribe :P)
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: BOYD1981 on Mon 22/09/2003 10:05:34
i wish blade runner had used voxels, or even polygons, the characters were 3D sprites, they get real blocky when they're close to the camera, but it's a stunning looking game, but then, i'm blade runner mad...
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Shattered Sponge on Mon 22/09/2003 17:20:38
Quote from: MrColossal on Sun 21/09/2003 22:53:06
um, whatsitcalled used Voxels... some war game that was really stupid
Delta Force?
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: MrColossal on Mon 22/09/2003 22:01:39
yea delta force

it was dumb, at least the AI was

and about the link The Dude posted, esseb explained it to me but it's still weird...

ah well

eric
Title: Re:Now THIS is a cool 3d engine.
Post by: Helm on Mon 22/09/2003 23:33:46
I still think we'll witness an industry shift towards voxel technology in the near future. The way polygon engines work right now is inherently limited in terms on interaction.

YOU WILL SEE :(