In a dreamful mind of Microsoft developers, it should work like this:
Start -> Programs -> Subfolder(s) -> easy and accessible joy of getting things done
Throughout the whole time Windows XP exists, for me, it's been like...
Start -> Programs -> omfg how do I ever find anything in this mess?!
It's really, really annoying. And, I can't find simple way to organize my start menu. What irritates most are two things:
1) game/program companies, in their idiocy, imagine that every PC user is total fan of their company and knows every product created. So, it's good idea to name start menu item with company name. Yeah, I have mood for a quick game of Company of Heroes... Aw damn, who made/released this? Atari? Eidos Interactive? Electronic Arts? THQ? I can't find anything in this mess--! Why didn't just use name for a game?!
2) Even most unimportant, single-shot software (and there's lot's of this, especially freeware) tends to clutter start menu too. Why?!
Even AGS games that come with installer.
Do I really need a start menu item for every AGS game I try?
I installed this, I KNOW where I did install it. I can browse for it much quicker than spend 10 minutes looking at mess in programs section (start menu) and try to find it by another imaginative name you gave to yourself when releasing (and defaulting for installer path! >:().
Of course, most installers ask how start menu entry should be named. Or - with latest and (typically very good quality) software, it even asks if you DO want to create start menu item. But many things don't ask anything. They simply take a dump at my already painful start menu. This goes usually for all kinds of drivers or software that comes with hardware...
* After last XP fresh install, I decided to always name things properly, to have some order...
* After awhile, it became too time consuming. So I created start menu folder "trash" and forced all shortcuts I would never use to be there...
For example, AGS, 3ds Max, Artgem, Photoshop, FruityLoops...) I occasionally use them. I will never uninstall them (they WILL outlive XP installation, or specifically, die with it). I have shortcuts in my quicklaunch or desktop. Why the hell would I ever need a start menu item?
Thanks, NVidia. I will make sure I use your start-menu shortcut on daily basis, despite you also created one into control panel, another one into system tray, right-click menu, display settings window, asked if I also want quick launch one... your drivers control panel is a really useful thing, every human being having your video card alters brightness and resolution settings atleast twice a day. 5 points for thinking for me!
* After this, I forgot to use "trash" many times. Now both "trash" and main of start menu is one long scrolling, unexplainable mess. I will NEVER find anything there.
Is there some kind of way out of this mess? Or is there something I'm doing wrong?
How do you manage this (unless you're Excel-Word-and-Solitaire-user)?
I just put shortcuts to things I use often on my desktop or in my quicklaunch and ignore the start menu pretty much entirely.
Basically I do what I can to make it function as similarly to OS X as possible.
I never seemed to have this problem. But I frequently remove programs and games that I don't use.
Company of heroes is THQ, Battlefiend is EA, Call of Duty is Activision. How hard is it to remember, gosh.
I have no idea what you're talking about.
Just make some folders called Games, Graphical Programs, Audio programs etc. in your Start Menu and organise those links.
And delete unnecessary links.
Vista solves this problem, you know... :P
Quote from: SSH on Fri 18/07/2008 21:11:40
Vista solves this problem, you know... :P
I guess replacing one problem with another one does not really qualify as "solving" ;)
Well... I have 117 entries... Organize? I really don't have those 3 hours and billion nerves for this.
I have this habit to download whatever freeware game pops up on the grid and it's impossible to find it later for uninstalling. Every video/audio codec, VST plugin, random crap throws an entry.
Main point is that I don't want to organize something I don't use. I can't find anything, anyway.
Then again, it happens that I don't have location or shortcut for that one really important program, I must use start menu and then desperation and threads like this come.
If you have like 3 games you play, sure. What's the problem?
But this is not my case here. Even after fresh XP reinstall, after adding drivers for all things to work, plus essential things like from winamp to video codec packs to game/art making utils, I already have a mess. And this is very standard "equipment" to use machine at all. THEN comes the software and games.
I can manage maybe games and most of the software, but hardcore of amount of VSTi plugin entries renders situation unsolvable. And I DO need them.
I'm still waiting on a Saturday where I don't have anything to do and I feel like reinstalling Vista. Transfer everything I want to a external hard drive, then reinstall vista, delete all of the other crap I don't need, then transfer everything back and install a few programs. It's not that complicated, it's just long and time consuming. And I can't even be on the internet while I'm waiting.
I feel your pain.
I've had the same problem, but I use the same system that TwinMoon mentioned - and it works like a charm. It doesn't take 3 hours, and when you're done it's very easy to keep updated.
Just to show how neat it looks, here's a little screenie.
(http://www.danwa.net/junk/startmenu.png)
It's well worth it, and I have 253 seperate items in a total of 87 folders in my start menu. There is no simple solution. Either you use the standard location all these programs store their crap or you force it into a system. Yes, it'll take a while to get used to it, but once you are, you'll recognise while installing that it'll need to go in subcategory x and you'll fill that in when the install utility asks you for the start folder it'll place the links in.
Also, I never install games in my program files, NO MATTER WHAT. Games go to x:\games\ and that's where they belong.
And you also ask whether you did something wrong. Yes. You had a system that didn't work and rather than try to find a better one, you just made that 'trash' subfolder and dumped all the crap there. That's not a solution, as you just put the crap somewhere else. It's like saying you're cleaning your house but all you're really doing is shuffle the piles of trash from one place to another :P
I know how you feel, I've had the start menu jungle fever a lot in the past, but since I adopted and forced myself to adhere to the system I use now, my start menu's seen a lot more activity.
Though, of course, I launch my most used applications through Rocketdock ;)
I'll give you the benefit of the doubt with your personal consumer advocate concerns...
Quote from: jetxl on Fri 18/07/2008 20:33:38
I never seemed to have this problem. But I frequently remove programs and games that I don't use.
Company of heroes is THQ, Battlefiend is EA, Call of Duty is Activision. How hard is it to remember, gosh.
Why would I want to remember these? These companies should be
encouraging the commodity fetish, dammit!
Seriously, I have entries in my start menu for "NCH Software Suite," "Gadwin Systems," and "Dreamagination." How in hell am I possibly going to remember what programs those companies made?
Quote from: Makeout Patrol on Sat 19/07/2008 01:43:29
Seriously, I have entries in my start menu for "NCH Software Suite," "Gadwin Systems," and "Dreamagination." How in hell am I possibly going to remember what programs those companies made?
The funny thing is you can rename those folders to whatever you want. I never think to do this myself, it might be some sort of hold over from earlier computers or fear of breaking something, but it's just a short cut the name doesn't matter.
Also, InCreator, look in to ObjectDock, it's useful to me.
When I used the subcategory system in my start menu I came up with this problem. When you move or rename something in start menu and then uninstall that program, the dead links stays in the start menu as the installer can't find them anymore. This can be solved by always installing the shortcuts etc directly into the right folder in start menu, but not all installers give this option.
However, if you uninstall a program, you're going to at some point notice that start menu folder/item is still there and you can just right-click and delete it directly from the start menu.
Note: dragging&dropping on the start menu is THE key to a 'system'. If it isn't on, you can only change the location of items by opening the actual folder for the start menu in explorer. If it is, you can simply click, hold, drag to new location directly from start>programs.
If it's off, right-click the start button, choose properties. You should get the taskbar/start menu properties window, on the start menu tab. Choose customize, click the advanced tab. Make sure "Enable dragging and dropping" is checked.
Also, Rocketdock (http://rocketdock.com/), which I mentioned before, is a light-weight and slightly less buggy version of the OSX Dock than Objectdock (http://www.stardock.com/products/objectdock/) that MrColossal mentioned. Whichever of the two you choose (if at all), they both rock the hell out of quicklaunch and the start menu for launching applications you use often.
Increator, it's very simple:
right click on Start ---> Explore all users OR go to C:\Documents and Settings\All Users\Start Menu (if you're on a multi user computer go to your User instead of All Users) and you can edit, delete, change anythign and verything you want.
IT'S THAT SIMPLE !
Never occured to me I could customise it! I just deleted a lot of the shortcuts!
Eidos AND Eidos Interactive sub folders? Be gone foul beasts!
It's my job to know which publisher did which game, but to have games divided by publishers and/or developers is messy indeed.
I've followed the advice on here and organised the bitch. Even if I rarely felt a need to use it anyway!
I personally don't use Start Menu at all. Yes, I could customize it, it's easy. But I like it the other way: I have all the games on a toolbar on the right on my desktop, small icons, no text, just a little strip. Perfectly intuitive. All other program/software stuff I USE is located in the quick launch bar and the taskbar is 2 rows. This way I get all the sw I use in quicklaunch, all games on my toolbar, and whoa, no need for start menu. And If I search for something not used so often, I find it there usually.
Because of mess I don't even use the default My Documents where tons of programs create their own mess. I created my own documents with my own order.
All programs (except codecs and similar stuff) are installed in my own "Programs" directory, no Program Files, sorry Bill ;D
I guess everyone has to find his/her own way to order things. I worked hard on it, if you ask me for a single specific file, I can tell you where on my HDD it is. That's the order what I want.
Anyway, Start Menu can be customized just like My Documents or Program files. But as I said, I don't use folders that are messy because random software creates folders there. I use my own, unaffected ones. Start Menu is not one of them.
Here's the guide with PICTURES (PICTURES with capital letters):
1)Right-click Start and kick "Open All Users"
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/1a.gif)
2)Insde the newly opened folder, right click the white background and choose "New", then "Folder"
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/2abe.gif)
3)Create a couple of folders with names, with wich you would prefer to categorize your programs.
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/3abf.gif)
4)These new folders are easy to access. Just click Start.
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/4a.gif)
5)Next, pick a folder, which is usually lost in the mess and hover your mouse button over it and over the next folder (if it is summonned), untill you find the stuff you really need.
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/5a.gif)
6)Click & drag it and hover it over the corresponding folder. Drag it to the (Empty) tab.
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/6a.gif)
7)Now it is safely stored in an easy-to-access place.
(http://www.2dadventure.com/ags/7a.gif)
Do this once, every time, you click Start and ,soon enogh, you won't be lost in the mess, you created by unresponsivly installing stuff.
What could be easier? That's how fast and easy it is.
Personally, I've got no problems remembering all the companies and stuff, they make so I don't use this method.
Every Installer ever:
"Would you like to install this in the program directory?"
Sure! Why not! Lets have EVERYTHING in the program folder, that would make it so easy to find! Games folder? Pah! Stick it all in one place so I have tons all in one folder and can't find anything!
Has my girlfriend died? Wake up woman!
Use Linux ;)
Don't use computer ;)
Quote from: Radiant on Sun 20/07/2008 12:11:04
Use Linux ;)
QuoteEven after fresh XP reinstall, after adding drivers for all things to work, plus essential things like from winamp to video codec packs to game/art making utils, I already have a mess. And this is very standard "equipment" to use machine at all. THEN comes the software and games.
I repeat, Games (http://www.increator.pri.ee/i/dos.png)
The Start menu isn't designed for accessing every single file on your system. If you want to put games in your start menu, put the ones you most frequently used. I find the start menu very inefficient and would rather it were replaced by more taskbar space.
In 1280x1024 I have room for 204 icons on my desktop, all requiring a double click, or typing the initial letter several times and pressing enter. If you want your huge folder of games close at hand then make a shortcut to the folder on your desktop. If you don't have enough icons to store all your regular programs and unsorted files and downloads then download a program to manage it for you. The only one I've tried is Launchy, and it seems nice enough although most things are already on the desktop in clear view, and can be accessed with Windows+D.
In short, if your Start menu is so annoying then use something else.
InCreator, if you don't like the Windows XP start menu, just change it to classic (like windows 95)..
That just makes the mess a little bit different, that does not solve it.
Quote from: InCreator on Fri 18/07/2008 20:01:30
Aw damn, who made/released this? Atari? Eidos Interactive? Electronic Arts? THQ? I can't find anything in this mess--! Why didn't just use name for a game?!
You can, you know, look inside the folders to find out.
QuoteI installed this, I KNOW where I did install it. I can browse for it much quicker than spend 10 minutes looking at mess in programs section (start menu) and try to find it by another imaginative name you gave to yourself when releasing (and defaulting for installer path! >:().
You actually answer your own question here. If you know where the programs are installed, why do you insist on trying to find the shortcuts instead of navigating to the programs and starting them up?
Or you could do this (http://www.veriloylykauha.net/images/iconsaerhear.png)...
Quote from: Ishmael on Sun 20/07/2008 21:25:49
Or you could do this (http://www.veriloylykauha.net/images/iconsaerhear.png)...
Exactly.
Though windows in general is a mess, the startmenu and the folders/programs don't have to.
I'll ad a screenshot to clarify what I use:
(http://oliwerko.ic.cz/Desktop.PNG)
I am shortly before a big cleanup tho, my 500GB HDD is kind of full cause I did not care to uninstall old unused things :P
What's a Start Menu again? I literally.. never use mine.
I have shortcuts on my desktop to My Computer, Notepad, Paint and Calculator, so I never need to open it. And all my things are in top level directories on my HD, organised into programs, music, pictures and the like. I didn't realise it before reading this thread but I only ever use the Start Menu to get to Shutdown.