The Afterlife... (And a little bit about human nature, too)

[MrColossal]

Maybe you went to Elevator Action heaven?

[lo_res_man]

When I was a lad, my Dad (death to his testes) forced me to watch those old Billy graham left behind movies. for YEARS, my greatest fear was to be left behind, all alone, with no one who loved me or I loved still around. I used to stay awake at night, and get panic attacks that IT had happened. I would quietly get up and check on my family to see if they were still in there beds. Once I had (I think) a nervous breakdown. If I got a panic attack, and I was the only one at home, I would phone friends , just to see if they were home.Ã,  Part of me, who I keep hidden, still has this fear.

As for the afterlife, I want to believe in one, and there appears to some evidence with some of the memories some people have. But to paraphrase "contact", if there isn't, it would seem a terrible waste of mind. When a loved one dies, part of what makes it so hard is the apparent fact that all that the person was, and whatever makes them "them", is gone, forever. That all too brief dance is over, when matter knew itself, and looked at itself and said "I" Its short, and poignant, it is "the gift of men"

[LimpingFish]

After my father died, I had weird dreams where he could leave Heaven on special one-day passes to come visit. He even had a timecard that would have to be punched on leaving and returning to Paradise.

One time I asked him what the meaning of life was, but God interrupted by appearing as a giant cube and said it was a secret.

Dreams are weird.

For all intents and purposes I am agnostic, but on some subconcious level I must believe in all that Divine Light jazz.

[The Ivy]

I must believe in all that Divine Light jazz.

I imagine they play divine light jazz in God's waiting room.

[Dmitri]

but God interrupted by appearing as a giant cube

I find that amusing, all hail the cube.

Hey that means cubism isn't an expression of art, it's a religion!

Anyway I think the best idea we have of the afterlife comes from Near Death experiences, because really the people who have NDE's are the ones that got very close to the event horizon of death and came back to tell the tale. So when you die you:

1: have a sense  of being dead
2: feel yourself pulled away
3: have an out of body experience
4: your vision tunnels
5: You walk towards a light, with a sense of 'well being'

People who have near death experiences tend to enjoy life more, are no longer afraid of death and are generally more at peace and less worried about all the big questions because "someone or something worked it all out a long time ago."

[MrColossal]

http://www.skepdic.com/nde.html

I think people who have near death experiences are just experiencing normal brain behavior brought about by extreme circumstances or induced in a lab setting.

So I guess Becky and I are boring to the core.

BOREDCORE!

[scotch]

If you damage part of your brain you can lose memories you had, if you damage a different part you can stop being able to have certain emotions, another part goes and you can't recognise objects, or enjoy music, or perform the tasks you were good at, and so on. It seems clear that each aspect of our conscious minds and personalities is inextricable from the brain that forms them. So I can't envisage anything meaningful existing once that is no longer active.

It makes sense that people who are near brain death experience some similar things, but it doesn't suggest that there's anything "on the other side", just that their faculties are breaking down in a similar way.

Actually any scary thoughts I've considered about death are in that shut down phase, the kinds of effects that could happen when things are completely breaking down... perhaps your perception of that time wouldn't be short and painless at all, who knows. However, I've lost consciousness and nearly died due to lack of oxygen before and I experienced nothing special, so if I had to guess, I expect it'll be like that. Hope so, it's not very scary at all.

[Dmitri]

Actually I didn't intend to argue for or against the validity of the NDE and whether there's anything on the other side. Even if it IS just 'what happens to a dying brain' I'm saying this is what happens when you die, you have an NDE and then you're dead.

NDEs tell us what happens just before, you can decide for yourself what happens after. I suppose it'd be like a comfortable nothingness.

[Timosity]

I think this is slightly off topic but still related.

2 of my friends that I've known since Kindergarten (don't really see them much these days) both their mothers died from cancer before they were 5. They were both strong Christians, strengthened by the belief that their mothers were in heaven (so their fathers told them).

1 of the fathers re married and my friend is now a Christian Minister

The other father never re married and my friend is Gay (don't know if he's still Christian)

I've always wondered if the choices in these guys life has anything to do with the way they were brought up after their mothers died. not that it matters, but it would be an interesting case of nature v nurture

My Dads mother died when he was about 20, and he is a strong Catholic

I guess when sad things happen to people at vulnerable times in their life, they can turn to something that makes them feel more comfortable, I suppose it's safer than turning to drugs unless you become an extremist religious nut.

I also suspect that these decisions are also not really accepting the fate of their loved ones, but tricking themselves into believing they are happy in another place.


EDIT:
Just as I was typing this post I felt something biting my back, so I reached round and pulled out this Tick



that's a macro shot on my index finger to give an idea of size

So for a brief moment I was supplying extra life to this vampiris creature, while I was still alive, until I took it into my own hands to end its life. Therefore part of me is already in the afterlife within this deceased creature

[DGMacphee]

So, by that logic, if my balls were eaten by a lion and a hunter shot the lion, my balls would reach heaven before me?

[Erenan]

Well, we're constantly shedding matter and replacing it with other matter, so if it was material parts of us that go into the afterlife, then in a sense, we'd constantly be going to heaven. But insofar as our consciousness is what would transcend (and unless I'm mistaken, the consciousness is not housed in our balls... ... ...wait, maybe it is?), then it would have to be when our brain is eaten by a lion and the hunter shoots the lion. Or balls. Whatever.

[Timosity]

So, by that logic, if my balls were eaten by a lion and a hunter shot the lion, my balls would reach heaven before me?

No, the Lion would be in Hell for eating your balls (or possibly in heaven as the Messiah's favourite pet). your balls would be no longer balls but nutrients in the lions blood + probably a bit of shit in the woods

[DGMacphee]

But my testicles lead a good life. They gave money to charity. Why shouldn't they go to heaven?

[evenwolf]

Most people don't want to feel pain when they die.Ã,  Ã, When an old man dies in his sleep, his family will say, "well atleast he went painlessly."Ã,  True, long lasting pain is completely undesirableÃ,  -- but you only experience death once!Ã,  Ã, What better bookmark then a sudden contortion or a horrifying shriek.Ã,  Ã, I want people to say "now that's the way you go."

And I won't be done after I die!Ã,  Ã,  I've always had this dream that my corpse would be part of a practical joke.Ã, 

In my will:Ã,  Ã, "Dear friends, please fulfill my wishes and push my corpse out of a plane over a crowded city street.Ã,  For added fun feel free to strap an undeployed parachute onto my back (if not too costly.)Ã,  Please try to take pictures of some of the people below as I descend.Ã,  Thanks."

If I were to donate my body to science it would be best to make it a contest and spread my organs every which way and let the competing organizations race in an easter egg hunt.Ã,  Ã, 

As far as afterlife, hmm, I haven't thought about it.

[Nikolas]

Hmmm... afterlife huh?

Well in matters of life and death I try to think thus:

Since I'm alive there's no reason of worrying too much about death.
If I die, then it's all over and there's no need to worry since I'm already dead.



I've no idea what happens, but I try to think of it as an eternal sleep of sort with dreams and all. If you lead a good life then you will have a peaceful sleep, if you were an arse then you may get nightmares from which you won't be able to awake from (see hell...)

more or less...

[Timosity]

But my testicles lead a good life. They gave money to charity.

Ouch, that must have really hurt

[DGMacphee]

My testicles will do anything to help the homeless.

[Helm]

I enjoy the term 'brain death'.

I'm from the boring kind, I don't think there'll be anything for me once I die. Wormfood.

However, I keep thinking how in dreams for example, time seems severily relative (haven't you had the 3 second month-long dream?) and therefore if the brain can make me feel as if an eternity is a few minutes, I'm more concerned with the circumstances of my death. I'd rather it not be severily violent or generally painful because if the brain retaliates with my own personal hell for a few minutes-cum-centuries in brain-time, that'd be awful. 

[DGMacphee]

Helm, what you said, especially the "brain can make me feel as if an eternity is a few minutes", reminds me of what they say about how time slows down at moments of death. And, as an aside to that, that whole thing about how your entire life flashes before your eyes. Maybe that's a similar reaction the brain has at moments of facing death.

[Helm]

Yeah. Just imagine that whole reel being a shitty time. Kinda scary. So I am concerned with orchestrating my death in a proper manner. I am leaning towards total and utter disintegration. Gone in a milisecond, no time for my brain to remind me of what a jerk I was.