I have a brand new laptop that I got for free, and it has everything that a store-bought laptop would, and it came with (yippee) Windows Vista. Thinking it woudl be a new and exciting experience, I was looking forward to using Vista.
If you consider consistent freezing (yes, the mouse cursor freezes when ONLY Firefox is open, with ONE TAB, something that hasn't happened to me since the days of Windows 95) exciting, then Vista is for you. Seriously, the damn thing freezes when I'm barely doing a fraction of what I used to do with my 4-year-old Dell Inspiron with Windows XP. I'm not about to play lemming and wait for dozens of updates to come my way. I used to run Firefox with 10+ tabs open, Photoshop, Illustrator, Dreamweaver, and a bunch of other programs all at the same time, and my XP laptop would barely blink at me. But my Vista laptop hacks and wheezes every time I ask it to do the most basic of functions.
So what I'm thinking is...I can't relaly afford to buy another copy of Win XP, and I've had back luck with cracked/patched (illegal) versions of XP in the past... So should I consider putting Linux on it? I know it's free, and it's God's gift to nerds, etc., but should I do it? Is it a big learning curve? Is it worth it? Are there any real drawbacks?
I've gotten so used to Windows, and I've never seen a problem with it until now. I dunno, I might try getting a cracked version and seeing if that works, but I have a bunch of projects being worked on, and I can't afford much downtime.
I don't know, I just wish Vista would work right. Would it improve performance at all to set Vista so that it looks like the old Win 9x interface? Would the Aero feature realistically be slowing down my computer?
The minute I saw the title I thought to myself: "well d'uh!!!" but reading on I thought to myself "Terran, you won a free laptop, quit your complaining..."
What does Microsoft say about this? Winning the laptop, couldn't you tell them to put on xp 64-bit, or xp pro/home, or something to that end, as well?
For linux I'm not the man to ask... Depends on what you do really, from what I've heard/seen. I deal with pro audio, so Linux is not for me. If you want an "office" computer, Linux could be fine I guess... you can also try it, by copying the files onto a CD and boot from the CD...
My dad once tried to break linux by launching at least a million programs. Any windows OS would have passed out already but linux fought like a champ. The system started going incredibly slow(a couple of minutes response time) and it took half an hour to terminate all the tasks that had been running(it was far more than anyone would ever need) but after that everything worked fine for the next few hours until he normally shut it down. He didn't even have to reboot it. The only (very few) times linux crashed was when my dad consciously made it.
Really, disable Aero and make it look classic.
This will safe a lot of performance, especially if your graphics-card is not very efficient.
Vista is not really slower than XP, it just comes with a lot more stuff to run by default.
Hehe, I had the same initial reaction as Nikolas and then you said "Linux". :D Nikolas correctly points out that if you have an absolute need to use a specific windows program Linux may not be for you. For example AGS2.8beta does not run in Linux while AGS2.72 does with the help of a program/library called "wine".
Although the decision ultimately depends on what purpose you intend for this laptop, I strongly encourage you to try Linux. Since it seems that you intend to scrap Vista anyway, you may as well take the opportunity install Linux. I have recently switched from openSUSE (http://en.opensuse.org/Welcome_to_openSUSE.org) to Kubuntu (http://www.kubuntu.org/). I think Kubuntu, in many ways, is easier to work with so that's what I would recommend. Everyone has their preferences so I don't think there any right or wrong choices.
- http://www.kubuntu.org/ (http://www.kubuntu.org/)
- http://en.opensuse.org/Welcome_to_openSUSE.org (http://en.opensuse.org/Welcome_to_openSUSE.org)
Go with Linux. Over and out. :D
Heh. Perhaps I should've elaborated as to what this computer is being used for.Mainly, it's:
* web design (I use Dreamweaver and prefer to keep it that way)
* graphic design (Photoshop, Illustrator)
* web browsing (Firefox)
* IM (Trillian)
I rarely use it for gaming, as my graphics card, as new as it is, doesn't have updated graphic drivers. I'm forced to get them from Sony Vaio instead of Intel, and this causes some problems, because the updated drivers are out from Intel, and I'm sure I could finally run KOTOR I and II on it, as well as Star Trek Legacy and a few other games I have and would like to play on it. Would this Sony Vaio laptop even let me get rid of Vista and put anything else on it? Sony seems to have a tight grip on this computer. It sucks that I have to wait until their site has the updated drivers. Bastards.
I think Linux would suit you very nicely, then. It has some great software for exactly the purposes you listed.
If you're going with Linux, I'd highly recommend Ubuntu. Fantastic piece of work, and their upcoming release will have some incredible eyecandy integrated (known as Compiz Fusion) integrated into it, all for free.
You can also get AGS games to work on it, though it's a bit of a lengthy process of setting up.
On a high note, though, DosBox and ScummVM work really well. Meaning all the classic games work. And some Windows games can be emulated with a project called WINE.
Though, my dad gave me his Windows computer today, and now I feel complete. I now have TWO computers, one for my beloved Linux, and the other for all the Windows games that don't yet work in Linux! :=
I was setting up a friends internet access. He has this (http://event.asus.com/2007/nb/vx2/index.html) computer, so even Vista should run fast as hell, right? It was my first experience with the OS.
I started by setting up the WLAN, this went relatively smooth. As soon as we were online, I downloaded several files using internet explorer. You all know how IE downloads everything to its fucking temporary internet files dir first, then moves (probably copies) it over to the specified destination. (Which is especially annoying if it's a huge file.)
Amazingly, it took Vista about 15 seconds to move a ~500kb file. While we were waiting, we were shown the little copy window with the progress bar at roughly 75% at all times, the text beneath reading "estimating time remaining". The screen looked like frozen, when suddenly the window disappeared without reaching 100% first.
That's when I decided to stick to XP as long as humanly possible.
When I continued to set up the system (AntiVir, Firefox, etc.) I got lags and non-responsive windows all the way to the end.
M$ actually sacrificed usability for eye candy.
So: don't switch to Vista unless there's absolutely no other way.
There's no Linux version of Dreamweaver, for starters. Adobe products are developed for Windows and Mac only, so this applies to Photoshop and Illustrator, too.
There's a Linux version available of Firefox (duh), Trillian is Windows-only.
Use XP. Since you've already mentioned it, I know somebody who uses a cracked version, and it works like a charm, with updates and everything.
Only switch to Linux if you're prepared to switch every program you're using for doing your work.
My dad bought a Vista computer, as it was the only thing being offered in stores, and he doesn't like buying online. Normally, it would have been a kick-ass PC, with a dual-core AMD processor, 1 Gig of RAM and an Nvidia graphics card (much as I hate them, it wouldn't have been bad for gaming). The trouble is that Vista doesn't work with anything. The slowness would seem to be from your graphics card, but Vista doesn't really work well with any program not specifically designed for it. My dad can't even access some websites because they're not configured to work with Vista yet.
I don't know anything about Linux, but if you can get a copy of Windows XP, I'd say go for it, though I don't know if MS will allow you to install it instead of Vista. And if I'm not mistaken, you can only activate a copy of XP once before you either have to shell out about 150 bucks for a new product key or buy Vista. So, if you do manage to get XP, be careful you don't end up having to restore your computer. :(
I think one problem is with the 1 GB of RAM, while 1 GB is more than enough for most uses, under default settings Vista will just crawl like a tortoise (I'd heard that at least 2 GB RAM is required to run Vista "smoothly", not really sure).
Try disabling all those stupid "shinny extra awesome" features of Vista, maybe your computer can work fine since then.
Let me just say this...
Linux has come a long way. It's become one hell of an OS, and I use it a lot, just for tinkering, and the eyecandy in Compiz Fusion, Screenlets, Avant Window Navigator, and just Linux in general has become very beautiful, and surprisingly lightweight.
Just look into Ubuntu, or Debian. Linspire's also an option, as is SuSe, Red Hat, Mandriva, and so on and so forth.
Though, once you get your desktop onto a smooth, reflective 3D cube that spins at your every whim, it gets very addictive. Windows stretch and float, you can cycle through them on a ring if you wish. It's very impressive.
Like I said, it's come a long way. Is the general public quite ready to use it? I dunno. Most people just play flash games, check their email, share photos, listen to music, and chat online. Heck, Linux has quite a few games (over 57 are available on one site, all of which are free. Yes, some of the games do suck.)
It also has quite a few apps. I won't go through naming them all, but it still needs three things:
1) More ports of commercial games.
2) Less crashability. Messing with beta software can have unexpected results in Linux, both good and bad.
3) AGS Editor port, and an easier way to play AGS games.
As suddenly resource-hogness matters again, you could, unless you're a total IE-hater already, try Maxthon (http://www.maxthon.com) for web browsing, which while using the IE renderer and other IE things (like the file download system) uses less memory than IE.
Well, I disabled Aero and even set it to the "Classic" (Win 9x) style. And it still freezes every now and then.
And I get that "Calculating Time Remaining" deal too! I've heard there was a fix for it. As for web sites, all web sites work with Vista...there shouldn't be a problem there.
So yeah I'm going to find a cracked version of XP (which is illegal and I wouldn't recommend, kiddies!), since I run a lot of Windows-specific programs. Linux - especially Ubuntu - seems very nice, but for my uses, I can't foresee using it.
There should be no problem on Microsoft's end in replacing Vista with XP...I'm just worried that the laptop itself (being a Vaio and all) will throw a fit.
I just hope that the XP installation successfully gets rid of Vista, seeing as how the Documents, etc. have been completely reorganized ("/Users/Name/Documents" instead of "/Documents and Settings/Name/My Documents", etc.). I'll have to check around the web to see if there is a proper way to replace Vista with XP.
@Terran
From personal experience: You should be safe with a quick'n'dirty format c:\...
@everyone else
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ImW0-MgR8I (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ImW0-MgR8I)
And people think Vista's Aero is sort of cool? Ha, I scoff at them! But I must add that I can't see much actual functionality, as good as the eye candy is...
Ghost you're totally right. format C:\ is an easy and great way for deleting that shit I mean ithe whole Vista is just a memory vampire and it wants you to see its beautyfull look and forget the horrible performance(Goddamn Microsoft). But what is Microsofts biggest crime with Vista that DX10 is only compatible with Vista. And some developers already working on games requireing DX10(even tho they have DX9 versionsas well) Now it's only a matter of time that Microsoft will force gamers to buy Vista by bribeing the developers so they will make only DX10 versions of their games.(Why Billieee why,why, why !?? ?? ?? ??)
Yeah well what if I have stuff on the hard drive? I can't spend hours backing everything up. Isn't there another way? I'd gladly format if it were that easy.
Hm, that could be messy then. I have two partitions on my harddrive, namely c and d, and each time I need a fresh XP I just move the files I want to keep to d and format the c partition. Works fine. I don't know if that's possible with Vista- when I removed it from a friends laptop, she had no data to backup, so we could "play it brute".
I can't think of a more elegant way, yet must admit that my Vista knowledge is limited. POssibly someone else can give you better advice; if not, just do that backup. Lacks style, yes, but gets you rid of Vista.
Plus, Partition managers are available. Shouldn't be TOO hard to lay your fingers on one, and create a new partition with a FAT XP can understand...
That's a good idea Ghost. I'll have to try that.
Glad to be of service. Let me know how it worked out.
Let me step in and introduce Wubi. You download the client, and you can install Ubuntu Linux as a folder inside Windows. It then adds a boot option in Windows boot registry for it, and you can dual boot without ever having to partition.
...really?!
I want this! But I need to know one thing. Is it going to take up a lot of space?
I'd do that, but I use certain programs for web and graphic design. Are there are any compatible programs that are comparable?
Quote from: R4L on Thu 12/07/2007 02:58:28
...really?!
I want this! But I need to know one thing. Is it going to take up a lot of space?
You decide how much space it uses. You can make it from small (a gig or less) to large (30 gigs or more).
You can also navigate through the windows filesystem in Ubuntu and vice versa.
And, TerranRich:
Photoshop = GIMP, Pixel
Dreamweaver = Nvu (http://www.nvu.com/index.php)
MS Frontpage = Bluefish
Itunes = Songbird
Firefox = Firefox
Paint = Koulourpaint
Flash MX = Synfig, Ktoon, Flash4Linux
AGS games = AGS Linux (have to use command line to run, still no GUI frontend)
Norton AV = Nothing Whatsoever
Windows Movie Maker = Kino
Audacity = Audacity
Good music recording/Sound editing tools = anything in the Ubuntu Studio repos
Dos Games =DosBox
LucasArts Games = ScummVM
Sierra Games = FreeSCI
And for anything else that you need in Windows, you can try and run in WINE. There's a dozen frontends, so experiment with that.
Ghost why do you need partition managers just simply use fdisk.
Bluefish, firefox, songbird... whoever comes up with these names.
Quote from: Alliance on Thu 12/07/2007 07:21:15
Photoshop = GIMP, Pixel
I hear GIMP is impossible to use...
Quote from: Wtcq on Thu 12/07/2007 08:51:56
Ghost why do you need partition managers just simply use fdisk.
And destroy everything with it. I once touched fdisk, and lost all partitions of said hard drive beyond any sort of data recovery.
A program called Partition Magic or something can do it, even without formating anything, IIRC.
Well, Gimp may be difficult to use but I don't have much problem with it atm, as long as it's free (I won't even dare to pay to use PS).
Pixel is promising, but the problem is it's basically like a one-man's work and is developed VERY slowly. In fact, I am one of the few people who actually paid for Pixel (when it's first announced nearly 10 years ago, I remembered some time after I paid for it the Pixel homepage announced that so far only 6 people had registered...), so I always have a legitimate copy of it in my system but I never used it due to its lack of features (as lots of stuff aren't implemented yet) and instability.
Quote
Ghost why do you need partition managers just simply use fdisk.
Quote
And destroy everything with it. I once touched fdisk, and lost all partitions of said hard drive beyond any sort of data recovery.
That's why. Fdisk is okay if you're ready to kiss your data goodbye; if I were to make partitions on a drive I'm still going to use, it's a manager for me.
Quote from: Rui "Trovatore" Pires on Thu 12/07/2007 09:16:48
Bluefish, firefox, songbird... whoever comes up with these names.
Didn't you know? That's what the Oompaloompas are doing now that Wonka closed his factory ;)
Quote
I hear GIMP is impossible to use...
It's a bit hard at first. Actually, there are some modified versions that have a more PS-like interface, which is good.
Now I really don't know what to do. I'm leaning toward setting up a partition (a small one at first) and moving files I want to keep there, gradually increasing the size of the partition as I get more free space on the original C: drive. I have a 90GB HD with about 12GB free, and about 30GB of the data on there I'd like to keep. So I was thinking, I'd make a new partition, maybe about 10GB, and once that's filled up, I"d have 10GB more space freed up on the original C: driver, so I'd move 10GB more to the new partition.
Is that even possible? Are there any free programs out there I could use? Everything I've come across so far costs money.
Oh, and I never paid for any of the programs I have. ;)
Quote from: TerranRich on Thu 12/07/2007 15:20:50
Is that even possible? Are there any free programs out there I could use? Everything I've come across so far costs money.
Oh, and I never paid for any of the programs I have. ;)
You could download a gparted live cd (http://gparted.sourceforge.net/livecd.php) (or live usb from the same site). I've successfully resized and moved several partitions of different types (ntfs, fat32, ext2/3 etc) without problems on my clients' machines with this free software. I have no idea how Vista reacts to it's main partition's size changing, but XP swallows this just fine if you make sure it's still the first partition on the disk. I give no guarantees, but in my experience the commercial Partition Magic has been much more unreliable.
Just expect the process to take ages. Regardless of the software you pick for the task.
EDIT: A typo! The shame, the shame!!!
Oh, no doubt. It's going to be a long, laborious process, I know, but well worth it if I can get rid of the Vista monkey off my back.
Doing a fresh install on a laptop can be very daunting. OEM laptops have a whole lot of "special" hardware, which is why they prefer to bundle a so-called "recovery CD/partition" rather than a vanilla Windows CD that can be used on any machine.
The reason why they do this is the vanilla Windows installer doesn't have all the obscure laptop drivers. So formatting/reinstalling with a vanilla disc will sometimes leave you with a whole bunch of useless mystery devices (such as the lovable "PCI Communications Device" and "PCI Multimedia Device"). It is possible to (track down on the manufacturers web site/dig about in the recovery CAB files) for drivers, but you may go nuts trying.
Linux is quite good; all the device drivers ever made are bundled with it, and so your bits of hardware either work brilliantly or they don't. :P
If you're after free format and partition tools, look no further than the Ubuntu Install CD. It comes with GParted and (more importantly) can automount your drives/portable media.
(The GParted LiveCD is both scary and ugly. Only recommended if you're a surly old UNIX hack wishing for the days of NeXTstations and CDE.)
As for "alternative apps" to the Adobe suite; this is a very contentious issue. Most professionals, understandably, find the free alternatives a bit rubbish (especially if they've already paid Adobe a million pounds). This leaves four options:
- Install XP
result: system looks ugly, slowly locks up with clutter
- Make two partitions (one XP and one Linux) and dual-boot
result: Linux partition almost never gets used
- Run XP in a virtual machine
result: while faster than a pregnant XP with 3 years of install bloat, Photoshop et. al. are still slow
- Run XP applications seamlessly through Wine (http://www.winehq.org)
result: a bit hard, cutting-edge software will probably crash a lot
Have a good think about your options before you start partitioning. And please, if you're learning most of this whilst you go along, do yourself a favour and BACKUP EVERYTHING FIRST.
Quote from: covox on Sat 14/07/2007 19:47:14
(The GParted LiveCD is both scary and ugly. Only recommended if you're a surly old UNIX hack wishing for the days of NeXTstations and CDE.)
Haha, thanks. ;D Too bad I've never touched a NeXTstation. Xfce has been my DE of choice for years though, and it
does did aim to be CDE-like. I might even be surly, but at least I'm still fairly young... ish. :)
But seriously, if all you're going to do is partition your hard disk, the much smaller GParted CD image is the better choice. It's the same software, and although the Live CD uses fluxbox now (or some other *box, can't be bothered to check) and other less user friendly thingamabobs in the background, the automatically started GParted isn't any harder to use.
I get that you might just be trying to trick him into checking out Ubuntu. Sorry for ruining your plan if that's the case. Nothing wrong about spreading the word... ;) In your defence I must admit that the Ubuntu installation CD does come with more toys to play with while waiting for GParted to finish resizing that partition.
I'm leaning more toward the option of:
1. Creating a new partition (let's call it X:)
2. Moving all documents and other important files to X: that will fit
3. Increasing size of X: as more space in C: becomes available, and move more stuff to X:
4. Once the moving process is done, boot with the XP CD, and format the C: partition
5. Install XP onto that partition.
6. Move everything from X: partition to C:
7. Format X: partition and get rid of it, leaving only the original, full C: drive.
Am I missing anything? I want to get started soon. And I've already compiled a list of every single driver installed in my system currently, just in case I forget anything after installing XP.
tube: They've moved to Fluxbox? Nice :D As a yoof who grew up with that particular WM I applaud their decision to ditch the frankly hideous GNUstep. Or maybe they never used it and I'm really thinking of some other blasted recovery CD with GParted on it. Geez there really are thousands of the bloody things. Anyway.
I do like to extol Ubuntu, and one of the neat things about the Install CD is that automounting partitions (through the magic of HAL) actually works well. It's better than Knoppix now. Possibly even to the extent that you don't have to fiddle around with typing "mount" commands in a terminal just to get RW access, but that avenue is still available if there's a problem. Just my recommendation :P
TerranRich: As much as I like to have faith in good old partition resizing, it can go catastrophically wrong, leaving you with nothing salvageable. To use an analogy, imagine you've got a big old "expired" anti-tank mine from WWII. Resizing a partition with data on it is like doing a vodka shot then kicking the mine.
Believe me, it's not worth the grief, just take it on the chin and purchase another hard-drive. They're insanely cheap at under AU¢40/GB for a 250gigger.
I was going to recommend an external harddrive, dump your stuff, reformat, install xp, dump stuff back on and use external as a backup. I didn't because it didn't seem like you wanted to spend any money but it's what I'd do.
Holy crap I don't have 30 gigs, but i have 1 gig! :D
I might have to splurge for another external HDD. I already have an old 40GB external but it's filled to capacity with music, videos, and other crap. :P So yeah, I'll do it that way. It seems a lot safer.