Hurray for San Francisco!

[Nacho]

Bible is enough boring when resuming 5,000 years of history... Imagine including the previous 6,000 milion years...

Revisited Genesis:

"And the fish, became amphibius, which became a lizard, which became a Dinosaur, which was buried in the land by a holy stone thrown by God to the Earth, which bones were found by Spielberg, a sionist who made films... and God said, lets Jurassic Park be made! And he realised that this was good!"

[DGMacphee]

Massive low-loss compression algorithms, dumbshit.

Oh, Yakspit -- You and your witty play on words!

Why weren't you born a Marx Brother!?

Now write one of those algorithms to prove it, smartarsre!

[SSH]

Do you still use the bible as a book of history? Cool, let’s play, I’ll use the Bible and the book of the law of the Jewish, the Misna.

Was Jesus judged by Jewish? I say no:

(Extract of a homework I did for my class of Philosophy, years ago…)
no point in me replicating that...

Conclusion: Someone (Paul?) invented a Jewish trial for making it suitable for the roman population, while all the historical facts aim to a roman judgement.  It was clear that Paul could not export a Jewish religion to Rome if its most important figure was a person who fought against the Roman Empire.

That's one conclusion. Another is that the enemies of Jesus were so desparate to get his bumped off that they burst through all normal procedure. Anyway, the bible mentions that Pilate tried Jesus, so what's with this supposed denial of Jesus beging tried my the romans?

http://www.giveshare.org/library/sanhedrin/index.html

[Nigel Manning Smith]

Hello again, you heathens!

Last time I was offended at all the bad language you used, but this time you've gone too far! How could anyone debate the bible! It's the word of God! It is the truth and the devine light! Everything that's holy and pure is within the bible, so it must be truth.

I'm shocked and dismayed. No wonder I restrict my kids from using the internet, especially when I see filth like this. I try to give my children a good Christian upbringing and I don't expect them to question the word of God. God would be angry if anyone questioned it. And God is pure and holy, so why would anyone want to question him anyway. It's better than following SATAN!

I will be reporting you all to the internet police! Hopefully they can shut you down and stop such vile attitudes that corrupt our clean society.

Sincerely,
Nigel Manning Smith

[TheYak]

Massive low-loss compression algorithms, dumbshit.

Oh, Yakspit -- You and your witty play on words!

WTF? You recognized a play on words without a freakin' smiley? There's hope for mankind yet.

Edit:

* YakSpit reads "Nigel's" post and shrugs.  What the hell? I'll tag along with the Satan dude.

[SSH]

These debates, agruments and counter arguments have already been played out a million times on Usenet, etc. Why don't we just recognize that no-one changes their minds with these arguments anyway so lets just leave it and elope to get bisexually married, as Yufster's teacher suggests.

[Peter Thomas]

farlander, maybe I'm just not getting your post the way I'm meant to, but the bible does NOT incorporate 5,000 years of history. It postulates the existance of an earth only 2,000 years old. Not a day more (okay - maybe a day or two, but you get the idea)

YakSpit is right on the money with his faith/works thing. And he's ESPECIALLY right about the dumbness of that site. I've decided to give my 'reasoning' a rest for two reasons. 1) People will hate me and call me a bible-basher, which would probably become quite true if I were to keep going like I am and 2) It will save your eyes a lot of tired reading that could have been saved had those silly people who made the site BOTHERED TO DO SOME RESEARCH. Often it's just a matter of reading a couple of verses before/after, and suddenly their whole issue dies.

I also agree with SSH. There are many conclusions to be drawn from your argument. Which one EXACTLY, I do not know. FINALLY!! SOMETHING I HAVE NO IDEA ABOUT!! YAY!!!! My only quibble is some of the stuff written in the Misna. I won't go into why, because it took me nearly six months to understand the bloody book, and I don't want to repeat my thought processes on the keyboard

DG - your dinosaur post was a joke, right? if so, it's kind of odd, but if not, it's already been answered. The bible doesn't go into definitions of dinosaurs, but then again a lot of what scientists produce is only theory anyway, so there's not much factual stuff to compare. But yes, behemoth's are mentioned (some other names are used, depending on your translation).

I officially end here for 12 hours. yes - that's right! my bed time!! yay!! sleep has come at last......

sorry if I've been a P3N!$ to anyone in particular. It's nothing personal, I just get a little fiery over some topics, and people can interpret that the wrong way.

See you when I rise, everyone!! Sweet Dreams!!

EDIT: I love Nigel. When I grow up I want to be like Nigel. Actually, when I grow up, I want to BE Nigel!

[DGMacphee]

WTF? You recognized a play on words without a freakin' smiley? There's hope for mankind yet.

Though people who begin sentences with net acronyms (like 'WTF' and 'OMG') still make us look bad.

P.S. I also recognise sarcasm! Ain't I a fucking talented bitch?  

but then again a lot of what scientists produce is only theory anyway, so there's not much factual stuff to compare.

Except for these crazy things called........ DINOSAUR FOSSILS!

[Peter Thomas]

okay... so I said I was going to bed... and so I lied...

but this IS my last post.

You are right, DG, there are a lot of fossils around, and I don't pretend to have any clue whether they all match up or not, but I have always wondered how they determine the colour of an animal that is supposedly 6 million years old. I know there are ways of predicting etc, but they act awful smug for a couple of people who've been wandering this earth supposedly only a TENTH of the time of dinosaurs.

This really IS goodnight, now.

Give my regards to broadway  

[SSH]

farlander, maybe I'm just not getting your post the way I'm meant to, but the bible does NOT incorporate 5,000 years of history. It postulates the existance of an earth only 2,000 years old. Not a day more (okay - maybe a day or two, but you get the idea)

Ummmm.... that would mean that then earth began after Jesus was born... I think 5000 is closer to the mark

[Nacho]

I am not saying that the bible does not mention that Pilate judged Jesus... But it clearly says that he "washed his hands", which makes the whole history so much suitable for the people whose this "revisited" version was aimed for... the Romans.

And I can ensure you that no roman procurator (sp?) could wash his hands in front of a death penalty. He had to take a decission, and we know which was this... Romans acceded (at least) to the death penalty of Jesus.

BTW... if Jesus was really an annoying man for the Jewish church, there would be no need of Trial. Powers in the shadow (like nowadays) were perfectly able to finish discretely with a man, while the crucifixion seems to be more a punishement used as an example, more in the style of the Romans.

[DGMacphee]

God, doesn't like people who lie!  

but I have always wondered how they determine the colour of an animal that is supposedly 6 million years old.

Yeah, but that doesn't change the fact that they're... DINOSAUR FOSSILS!

Forget the colour, because they're... DINOSAUR FOSSILS!

Like, actual physical evidence of creatures that have existence longer than we have.

In fact, they even predate the beginning of the Earth according to Genesis.

I know there are ways of predicting etc, but they act awful smug for a couple of people who've been wandering this earth supposedly only a TENTH of the time of dinosaurs.

As opposed to people who act awful smug that they can actually interpret what God meant to say in the bible?

A little hypocrisy there! It's like Saddam saying to Osama, "You'd better hide, dude!"

[Nacho]

Just one thing Peter Thomas... Bible says that the World has 2,000 yeas old... that part of the bible was written 3,000 years ago... SO:

According to the Bible, the earth is 5,000 years old... what I´ve said in my post, where´s the problem? Where have I missquoted the Bible?  

[SSH]

Like, actual physical evidence of creatures that have existence longer than we have.

No, they are physical evidence of creatures that no longer exist. Proving that they date from millions of years ago is more difficult...

http://www.barahome.co.uk/Barahome/Christian/fossils.htm
http://www.wasdarwinright.com/Fossils.asp

As I said, there are thousnad of web sites on both sides of the srguments all over the place. You will be able to find some that counter the ones I have above. I can then find some that debunk those counter arguments, etc. etc.

The person who has the last word in this argument wont be the one who is right but rather the one with the most stamina for keeping the thread going. So, lets talk about something else!

[Timosity]

well if it says the Earth has only been around that short a time, does that include the universe?

Maybe the earth went into storage after an ice age or something.

But explain this: the light we see coming from some stars are millions of light years away, which means the stars we see at night are from light that has been travelling way longer than the earth has been in existance. Some of the light could have been travelling that long. And those same stars were around 2000 years ago & the light had still been travelling millions of years before that. (and this is not just a theory, it is actually measurable, there is no argument about this one)

But I have also heard that in the creation story of earth & the universe, the term days isn't in our sense of the word (how convenient) and was actually over a longer period of time, but it still is one of those stories that seems way off, hence helps in hindering beliefs around the world.

The big bang theory makes more sense but it still could be the same story as creation, but just explained in different terms.

Then there's evolution, that is a whole other story that we haven't covered much, but as we will never know any of these answers, it's good to see some different responses from people in how they deal with the unknown.

We just go on what other people have taught us or what we have read, then we make up our own minds anyway.

Who can you trust in the end?

it's me, honest, I don't even have my fingers crossed behind my back.

[DGMacphee]

SSH and Timosity:
You got me wrong.

I'm actually going by the Christian dating of the Earth, which extends to about 12,000-20,000 years ago (even though I don't believe it).

And since PT said dinosaurs supposedly existed 6 million years ago, that means they are supposedly older than human beings according to the bible.


EDIT: And even if they didn't exist millions of years ago, how come the bible makes no mention of giant flying lizards during the lifespan of the bible? I mean, the fossils are still physical evidence, right?

Surely there would have been a greater mention of giant lizards in the bible if they were even 12,000 years old?

[SSH]

But explain this: the light we see coming from some stars are millions of light years away, which means the stars we see at night are from light that has been travelling way longer than the earth has been in existance.

Look, if you accept that God can create the universe then making a few photons half-way between distant stars and here is hardly difficult for him. Being omnipotent means that you can do anything... of course, why he would do that is much harder to answer, but then I'm not qualified to psychoanalyse anyone, let alone the creator of the universe.

God COULD have made the world 5000 years ago and stuck some fossils in the ground. God could have kept the flying lizards out of the way of the humans so they didn't get eaten by them. If you try, there are plenty of plausible explanations for such questions. If you try, you can make some explanations sound silly, and no doubt many of them are. The closest thing we have to contemporary accounts are all poo-poohed by scientists as being mysitcal nonsense, but then all the scientists are doing is extrapolating from the scant set of facts that they have.

Maybe we should concentrate on the problems of the future rather than bicker over those of the past.

[DGMacphee]

Let's talk about Iraq again!  

[shbaz]

SSH, being omnipotent and all, shouldn't it also not be so hard for him to phone in every once in a while? I mean it's been 2000 years...

[MrColossal]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=1&u=/ap/20040224/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_gay_marriage_14

you goddamned peice of shit