Down With Skirts!

[Meowster]

In this day and age, don't you find it ridiculous that girls are banned from wearing trousers in school? I mean, come ON!

When out and about, you'll notice most girls wear trousers. Doesn't this say something about our preferences?

Irish/English weather is wet and windy and cold. Skirts are uncomfortable, and you're constantly worrying about them blowing up or something.

There is a law against making a female wear a skirt in a workplace. A school is a workplace. This law, I feel, should also cover female students, whether or not it is a mixed or single sex school.

Why do schools feel it nessecary to hold down female students and deprive them of equality? What is the use of skirts? What do skirts have that a pair of trousers does not?

I've been given the following weak excuses by my Principal:

1. Skirts are TRADITIONAL.
Back in the 1920's, it was also traditional for a woman to be a housewife, and cook and clean for her husband. If you're going to be stuck in the past, you should teach history, not french, Ms Ryan...

2. Our School Uniform has been the same for over 80 years, and we're not changing it now!
Lies! Originally there was a green skirt, a blazer, and a jumper with the school emblem. Now, in recent times, the jumper is plain green without the emblem. There is no blazer, and the skirt has been changed for senior cycle students to a kilt. And now, they're changing it again, to a red/green jumper, a jacket, and a scarf instead of a tie. I don't think this is a valid excuse anymore...

3. Girls look awful in trousers!
Um, this one just makes me laugh.

4. We're not going to change the entire school uniform.
Somebody is a bit afraid of change. And no, you're not going to change the entire school uniform. You're going to change the skirt for some trousers.

5. You don't see Boys asking to wear Skirts.
This is because (a) skirts are retarded, uncomfortable and unpractical and (b) equality is the same for either sex. Therefore, I say let guys wear skirts if they want to. If they want to.

6. You signed a document when entering this school, saying you would wear the uniform.
Sure did. Didn't say I'd uphold and cherish the uniform, either. In fact, I didn't even say I wouldn't try to start a nationwide rebellion against it. Nosiree. No such words ever crossed my lips. Or pen nib.

7. Skirts are so much more practical. They just get dry cleaned every once in a while and... voila! Trousers need to be washed constantly, ironed, uh, other stuff...
Here's the truth. You have to pay to get the skirts dry cleaned. You have to pay a lot of money, in fact. They're pleated, so they can't be washed at home without wrecking them. This is inconvenience at it's worst. Besides that, one spill, one accident in the Home Ec room, one food-fight, one trip-up during PE... and your skirt needs to be cleaned. So it needs the dry cleaners, AGAIN. Besides that, it needs to be ironed once a week to get out the creases that appear naturally when you spend your day with your ass pressed against the item in question. Have you ever tried ironing pleats? Probably not, because you're probably a guy and don't have this problem. Trousers, on the other hand, can be thrown in the wash and ironed straight whenever. Skirts also allow for limited freedom of movement, discouraging girls from being athletic. Ever tried hopping across a wall in a skirt? Ever tried running in a skirt (In irish winds, this can be tragic...)? Ever tried going up a flight of stairs in a skirt? Skirts are also humilating in this sense. I can't count the amount of times I've seen girls stopping on the stairs to let up a male teacher, because they're embarressed to walk ahead of him, for obvious reasons.

So I want to know what your views are on such ridiculous rules as wearing a skirt to school. I know some people will take the view that Girls should for some reason, obey these rules and wear their skirts like good little girls. I want to hear all viewpoints, because I plan to rebel, and I need to argue my case until I yell it in my sleep.

Above all, when you think about this, try to imagine wearing a skirt during your everyday activities. On a windy, raining and cold day. As it most often is in Ireland at least.

[Privateer Puddin']

trousers were never banned at my school..

[Meowster]

Imagine if they were. Imagine all the girls being forced to wear skirts. You'd like it, wouldn't you?

Do you think they would?

Have a little compassion for your fellow human beings! Wreck something!!! It's time somebody answered for being a bitch.

Here's what gets me still more:

Our 'new' uniform has incorporated a pretty little blouse into our school attire. So, we're talking little pretty blouses, with little pretty jumpers, and little pretty jackets, with little pretty skirts? What do you fucking think we are? Pussies?

[m0ds]

Mmmmmmmm pussy.

Sorry to hear that. In our school they allowed trousers or skirts, whichever the girls chose (and yes, majority wore trousers).

Just rebel. Wear trousers.

EDIT: And i'm not mucking about. Wear trousers and if they ask you why, explain (preferably calmy and politley).

m0ds

[|Alky|]

Pfft.
At my school, I have to wear a full suit. It costs loads >_<
But the girls who enter the school in 6th form have no kinda uniform, while the guys do. It blows..

[Meowster]

That's also discrimination, and pretty pathetic. You shouldn't stand for it.

We'll rebel together!

[Nacho]

What are you complaining about? I was banned of my College because of wearing skirt!  

Female underwear is so comfortable...

[Mats Berglinn]

In my opinion school uniforms are stupid, stupid, STUPID! I'm glad that we in Sweden we don't have any uniforms, it's free-style (except for naked, nazi clothes and over-sexy clothes of course, "laughing") even religion clothes, punk and Rock N Roll clothes is allowed. I just hate that you actually are forced to wear clothes that you don't like or are unconfortable (except for working uniforms, I'm working in a foodshop but they're not uncomfortable of course). It's up to you what to wear, that's my opinion, at least in school and on the free time.

Oh, about the wind making the skirts blow up, you don't wear without panties, do you? What I know it is only in Scotland that men doesn't have any panties under the kilt (I don't know about the women) so why wonder too much. Of course it's embarrising that people see your panties but it would be worse without any (Bursting out in laugher, sorry I can't help it).

[Totoro]

hey, take it easy. In 60 years you will demand your granddaughter to wear trousers because "girls look so ugly in space-suits!"  

[Meowster]

But that's just it. The only ones demanding anything are the people running the schools who are generally child molesting perverts anyway.

[Trapezoid]

Then drop out.

[Matt Brown]

my old school used to have school uniforms

we actually went on strike over it once...they school administration had been dishonest with us one too many times, and that was the last straw

There are no protections for striking students sadly...most of us were suspended

then 60% of the student body left the school, including me, (uniforms again, werent the only reason, but a big part of it), and the school has since rethought its policy.

I have no actual advice for you though. sorry. continue to complain, get some petitions going, and maybe the school will meet you halfway, (I dunno, causal fridays or something?)

[Las Naranjas]

The rationale that keeps uniform in NSW schools is that is helps prevent the divisions that always mark highschool years being exacerbated.

Clothes are one of the most powerful indicators of class and wealth, as well as character, so when you have teenagers, especially those in the early teens, 13, 14, who have absolutely no tact, no consideration for others and little humanity as typifies that age bracket, it seems good to take away something that will be a goldmine for bullies, division and other distractions from learning for very emotionally fragile group.

The late 90's craze of having mufti days in offices ended when it became apparent that the casual dress undue stress among workers and lowered productivity. And these were adults. It's much worse for a hormone packed, teetering teenager.

I liked the fact that each morning I could throw on the school uniform and not have to bother about what I was wearing. However, that does take into account the fact that the uniform was flexible. Whilst the uniform allowed skirts and slacks, I never saw a girl wearing the official slacks, just ones of the same colour, or shape....as long as they weren't outrageously different like jeans.

So yeah, when dealing with stupid hormone packed kids, a simple, comfortable, flexible uniform is good for sanity. But make sure it isn't stupid and anachronistic.

[RickJ]

Wear pants and tell them you're really a boy.  If they disagree ask them if they want to have a look, that will shut'em up I bet.  

I say Up with skirts, Down with pants,  and lets all have a good time

[OneThinkingGal and ._.]

Are you there to study or to make a fashion statement?

Altho yeah skirts do blow up a lot? Maybe that's why they want them...all those old perverts on the school board.  :o

[DragonRose]

It's rediculous when girls are forced to wear skirts. I agree on everysingle point you made, Yufster.  Skirts are cold, a hastle to clean, and they're generally awkward.  Good lord, the thought of going out in a skirt in the winter has got to be the most horrific image I can think of.  There are certain place I don't EVER want to get frostbite, thank you very much, and short skirts tend to expose those places far too often!

I am, of course, talking about my knees.

Out of curiosity, is there some insane logic behind girls' school uniform skirts being rediculously short?

I've got no problem with school uniforms.  Just make them COMFORTABLE for god's sake! Most of the schools around here have choices- you can wear a blazer or a sweater, which you don't even have to wear except for assemblies; several styles of shirt; goofy tam or no goofy tam; any kind of socks you want. But girls still have to wear the stupid plaid kilt.  (Does being in a private school automatically make you Scottish or something?)

As for the "You don't see boys asking to wear skirts," most of the guys I know would LOVE to wear kilts.  Then they'd run around yelling "FREEEEEEEEEEEEEDOM!" and "You luuk lak a bebe!" at the top of their lungs.

EDIT: OTG- skirt vs. pants is not about fashion, it's about COMFORT.

[OneThinkingGal and ._.]

Hm, okay on reconsideration all your points make perfect sense and you should smack the principal till he agrees.

I do think there need to be uniforms, just to make sure it doesn't turn into a fashion war.

[Meowster]

See I actually LIKE Uniforms. I think they're a great idea and I enjoy not having to worry about what I'm going to wear. But I don't enjoy the skirt part of it. Especially not in irish weather.

I wrote a letter to the principal outlining some general stuff, and I'll give it to her on Monday, after I've checked it for dumb spelling mistakes, repeating words, (apart from discrimination, which doesn't have many alternatives and besides... the more I say it, the more threatening the letter sounds! Hurray for psychology!) and the inevitable "That Sentence Doesn't Make Sense"ness.

I throw the word "Equality" around in this letter quite a lot. I'd like y'all to know that that's to make it more imposing. The issue with me is not that I don't feel equal to a guy. It's the sheer discomfort of skirts and impracticality that's driving me to this, not penis envy. But words like Equality, Racism and Discrimination, make Principals tremble. But since there's no racism involved in skirts, I guess I'll just have to stick to the other two.




Since first attending St Leos College, I was always surprised (and still am) that any modern establishment could still uphold such ancient and ludicrous traditions such as making females wear skirts. I have brought this topic up with several teachers and received many different excuses for this clear-cut discrimination of over 800 students in this school alone.

1.   It’s Traditional
Need I mention that it is also traditional for wives to serve their husbands, or for women to be obedient homemakers and mothers? Modern society has (quite rightly) let go of these primitive ideas. Traditional is not a viable or convincing justification for the continual inequity against female students in St Leos, and across Ireland.

2.   It’s been our school uniform for years, we can’t/won’t change it
          now.
To correct this obviously accidental mistake on the part of many teachers, the St Leos School uniform has not always been the same, as it used to include a blazer, for a start. Also, the uniform is now due to be drastically changed again, therefore rendering this widely used defence obsolete.

3.   It’s not up to us, the Teachers/Principal/Vice-Principal
The issue of discrimination is in fact, up to you, the discriminator. As enforcer of discriminatory rules, you therefore partake in the act of discrimination itself, against over 800 female students. You may not be able to change the uniform overnight, or of your entirely own accord, but your input into the process is vital. So far, any interaction with staff members of St Leos and other secondary schools across Ireland has simply produced shrugged shoulders. It is quite evident that said staff members are not working for the welfare of the students being discriminated against.

4.   When you entered the school, you signed a document whereby you agreed to wear the St Leos School Uniform.
My parent/guardian signed the said document, and I did not willingly agree to
wear the derogatory uniform. However, as the document has been signed,
I can for now only continue to wear the uniform. Nevertheless, this does not
merit the constant discrimination, or justify it, or make it defensible. It merely
implements the inequitable rule and forces such discrimination on the
students.

5.   Skirts are more convenient than trousers.
In Junior Cycle, the St Leos skirts may be machine washed without much by way of ill effect. However, there lies the problem of ironing, which is a dreadful task on any pleated skirt. In Senior Cycle, the skirts are anything but convenient. They contain a lot of pleats, making ironing them a tedious and time consuming job. This also means that machine washing will destroy them and wash out the colours. Therefore, the skirt must be dry cleaned, at horrible expense and terrible inconvenience. A pair of trousers, on the other hand, can be thrown into the wash whenever and quickly ironed. They are also significantly cheaper than the current school skirts, which range in price somewhere around E55. To say that skirts are more convenient is to lie blatantly.

6.   Skirts are much neater. Trousers look horrible on a girl.
I can only laugh bitterly at this remark, which has been echoed by female and male teachers alike. Apparently, there is much conflict as to the true meaning or symbolism of a school skirt; so far suggested have been tradition, convenience, and because you just have to. But to suggest that a true reason for forcing a female to wear a skirt, to walk home in driving rains or winds in a skirt, to wait for buses or lifts in the winter months in a skirt, to wander around a cold school premises in a skirt, to endure teasing by male students from the neighbouring schools about her skirt... to suggest that it is because it looks better than a pair of trousers is insulting to both the said student, and the person who made such an absurd remark in the first place.  

7.   You don’t hear lads asking to wear skirts.
Of course not. Skirts are awkward, uncomfortable and belittling. But of course, if girls are allowed to wear trousers, of course males should be allowed the right to wear a skirt. It’s a silly and primitive tradition to bar any sex from wearing a particular item of clothing. If they want to sport a skirt, I say let them. If they want to.

8.   Get used to wearing the skirt; you’ll be wearing uniforms when you get a job in the real world.
No wise Employer makes the female Employees wear skirts. Such treatment can, and usually does, immediately lead to lawsuits. It is considered shameful to the Employer and does not stand well in court, as it is highly unlawful and extremely inequitable.

Many students are now realising that the school cannot, in fact, legally prevent them from wearing trousers. It is becoming a matter of time before some manner of a student strike takes place. Schoolgirls and women workers are no longer required to wear skirts following a landmark ruling by an Equality Officer that compulsory women's uniforms are discriminatory. Rulings by an Equality Officer have a legal standing and can only be appealed to the High Court.

Therefore it has already been decided that the compulsory female uniform in a place of work or education is considered discrimination. The enforcing of the strictly female uniform is discrimination. Furthermore, to deny a female in a workplace the right to wear the male uniform is highly discriminative and unlawful. The school is a workplace, and this law covers female students, as they are females within the place of work for as many hours a day as a teacher.

In conclusion to all of the above, I would request that you seriously consider your treatment of the St Leos students as regards the derogatory and outdated uniform skirt which has been the subject of this letter, before the students take more serious steps in making their voice heard. The uniform is being altered; now is the time to make the leap to equality.

[Las Naranjas]

I'm just wondering whether it would be conservative old men or old women standing in the way.

It reminds me of a fuss that happened in the Queensland Lawn Bowls association. The organisations laws say that women can't wera trousers or drink on the Greens. When TV reporters asked every one at various clubs they couldn't find anyone who had a problem with women do either of those things. They also asked everyone on the main board, and it was only these really old women that prevented the rule being changed.

I suppose they were probably the kind that complained that the Feminists were giving women a bad name or spoiling "everyone else chance od getting a man".

C'est La Vie.

[sergiocornaga]

I hate uniforms. I only had to wear them at one of my schools, but wearing shorts above the knees in the middle of winter sucks.