Ben Jordan Case 7

[Fade to White]

Played through it again, and the commentary was good stuff also. It was interesting to hear about your thought processes, and the design decisions that went into making the game.

However, I ran into a bug that, while it shouldn't affect most people, would be annoying if you hadn't saved in a while.

Spoiler

When you enter Bianchi's appartement, if you wait for Alice to knock on the door and then attempt to leave  that way, you end up stuck behind the door on the next screen, unable to move or change screen.

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I uploaded a video of it to show what I mean Here (spoilers).

[[Cameron]]

I had that same problem Fade To Whit but....

Spoiler

When you are stuck behind the door, if you have taken the keys you can use them on the door to unlock it, then use the door to go back inside, you'll walk back in, and Bianchi will move back out of the doorway as well, at which point you can leave with ease

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[Cownip]

Looks awsome! I haven't got a chance to play it, but I can't wait. By the way, is there any possiblity of a remake for the second game? While it doesn't need one as much as the first, it still really can't compare to the rest of the series and it would be nice to see it redone before the final game. Other then that, the series gas been perfect. I just hope you continue making games after Ben Jordan.

[Secret Fawful]

You've outdone yourself on the story, and I got stuck on the puzzles quite a few times, especially the apartment puzzles. The game was short, but it was still very well made. However, I had a couple of plot gripes.

Spoiler

I thought the fact Percival Quentin Jones was a member of the Knights of St. Andrews was a glaringly easy plot twist to see coming. When the final scene came up, I expected the plot twist to surprise me and in fact read Alice Wilkins, and up til the final moment I was thinking Holy crap, holy crap, if it's Alice I'll scream. However, it was PQJ, and I think that plot twist was a little disappointing, but it was still very atmospheric. It would've been a lot more heartbreaking for the list to read Alice Wilkins though. My own little gripe, but I'm not the one who has planned out the game.

Also, what happened to poor Simon definitely sent chills down my spine. That was like a kick in the face. I managed to get the thrill of beating the game only to have Simon killed so brutally. Made me feel like a heel to even beat the game, but it was a brilliant way to get me to instantly hate the villain. Hats off to you, Grundislav. Not every author has the guts to kill off one of the most likable characters in such a brutal way, nor does every author have the guts to take a likable character like Percival and make him evil. I don't think the image of my favorite character dying will leave for a while. 

However, I don't think you gave the audience enough on Alice's family, the amulet prior to the ending, and Percival being in Rome, but I'm guessing it'll all be finalized in the last game. Please take extra pains to wrap up the the plot and all of it's subplots.

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I can only hope that you wrap everything up with a satisfying and action packed conclusion. You haven't yet disappointed, but now with what you've given us, this has so much potential to end brilliantly.

I'll rate it a 8.9 out of 10

[Dr. Suzy]

GREAT game!!!!!!

I agree that

Spoiler

it would have been very interesting for Alice to be in the Knights instead of PQJ at the end

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it sort of is,

Spoiler

Dan Brown/ National Treasure  all over 

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Spoiler

  why is Ben such a pssy when it comes to girls???

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[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

Fawfulhasfury:

Spoiler

It's rather amusing that you said it would have surprised you for it to be Alice in the same sentence as saying you were hoping it to be her.  I don't think you would've been surprised either way!  Percival's been around before Alice in the story and I think it was an important step to bring him back here and explain his knack for being where Ben is.  As for Alice, whether or not you're happy with her summary of events, Grundislav has said her past is a side plot and not actually important to the story arch, so I think her explanation worked about as well as could be expected to wrap up a comparatively unimportant loose end.  And it's the Knights of St. Anthony, not Andrews

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[splat44]

Hi,

All sorry about my previous post all have edited.

Those who haven't finish, you will find next game very interesting.

Talking about next game, unless I miss something down the line, where there supposed to 9 games instead of 8?

[olafmoriarty]

The commentary was excellent all the way through. The "final thoughts" commentary piece was suddenly aborted at a very unpleasant time, but I assume that is a calculated scheme and not a bug? :-)

One thing that fascinated me maybe a little too much when thinking about it, was

Spoiler

Bianchi's display cabinet: It had items from all the locations Ben has been to except for Smailholm. Apparently that's not a big problem since the amulet is the only item they miss, but we know that a Knight was present in Smailholm, so...

And speaking of Jones: I'm still not convinced he's evil. I think his biggest plot twist is yet to come.

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Talking about next game, unless I miss something down the line, where there supposed to 9 games instead of 8?

To quote Ben Jordan's homepage:

Originally, yes, I had planned to make 9 games. However, when I started thinking of what "major" events to put in what games, I realized one game would have been very weak story-wise, so it was scrapped. Trust me when I say you aren't missing out on anything.

[Adamski]

Good stuff as always, Grundy! I was pleasantly surprised to hear the 'artefact' theme I wrote again, as I kind of intended it to make an appearance in future games had I had chance to write music for them. I'd have loved to do a different, expanded version of it for this, but as you well know by now all I ever seem to have time to do these days is overtime.

The ending was a big surprise as well, as I had set myself up for something totally different having seen the dialogue. I look forward to the resolution of it all!

[JuuJuu]

oh my gosh!

CAN'T WAIT TO PLAY! Ben Jordan games are some of the best!

[22]

o yeah

I've just finished BJ7 and I was stuck and need help only 2 times.

Great game, but I want to know if ending was correct.

Spoiler

It was in celar with wine. BJ after reading book of knight's of st anthony, was strike by quentin Jones in the head and end credist show up.

Is that correct??

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[LuciferSam86]

Thanks for the spoiler... 

[Andail]

Jesus, people, stop spoiling the game.
I don't know if you're being jerks on purpose, but it's really easy to insert hide tags in your posts. Or just avoid giving away the ending all the time.

[Mr. Mozzarella]

Thanks for another fascinating game. I have the same question about the ending as 22, actually ...

Spoiler

... it came a bit suddenly, I thought I'd get something else to do in the cellar ... The thing with the inscription and the demon just finishing Bianchi was a little too easy (but then again, this was just the FIRST ending).

Also I was imagining more than one familiar name on the member list.

I won't sleep well tonight, really, the death was too shocking for me 

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And it leads to new questions ...

Spoiler

How will the next case - if it will be a real "case" to solve like the others and not mainly about how to get out of the vatican, stop the villains and save the girl - begin? With Ben in the cellar, tied up again and having to rescue himself?

And where did Alice go so suddenly after she had woken up Ben? Any ideas? Is Marcus Wilkins important for anything else than Alice's family history?

That demon is still around somewhere ...

McNamara mentioned something about relics becoming dangerous in the wrong hands and looked weird ... so something should happen to these relics, shouldn't it? Or was releasing the demon from the amulet the only thing that got wrong?

And it IS weird that there was no relic for Smailholm, so maybe that one will still play a role in Case 8?

And how is Ben going to do whatever it is he'll do ALONE? 

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[TheJBurger]

Just finished my second play through with the designers commentary. I enjoyed the commentary a lot, but I kind of wished there were more design/story commentaries, rather than voice acting commentaries which seemed to be the predominant topic of choice. I can understand that though, as the major item that separates this case from the previous ones is the introduction of voice actors.

I feel like I'm in the minority here, but I don't think the story was particularly strong, compared to say Case #3. To me, Case #3 really made the Ben Jordan games for me, and though the series has increased its overall polish and value, case 3 still remains my favorite. For me, it was the overall story in that game that makes it superior to the other games.

Spoiler

In case 3 you had mystery, competition, an opposing force working against you, conflict, love interest, a major plot-twist, and a satisfying ending. In case 7 it is more like a standard investigation with not much in terms of anything going on until the very ending where the behind-the-scenes details finally come into place. Not to say that it's bad, but in my opinion it doesn't match up to the overall story/screenplay contained in case 3.

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Just my opinion. 
Still, I enjoyed the game and I look forward to the next case. Nice job!

[Ali]

I finished the game recently, and I really enjoyed it. I was pleasantly surprised that Simon sounded Mancunian, I'd always thought of him as one of those public schoolboy type Englishmen you get in American films.

Lots of fun, and I only had to use a hint once (which was a puzzle in itself because the forums were down!). Can anyone explain what I've missed here:

Spoiler

With Bianchi's box, though I worked out that lost items were the key, I was absolutely stumped. It seems that the correct lost items are:

Atlantis, The Fountain of Youth, The Ark of the Covenant and the Lost Galleon.

What I don't understand is why the Dead Sea Scrolls don't count as lost items. They've been found, but Ben has found the Galleon and Atlantis. Maybe Bianchi doesn't know this, but as a player I had no way of knowing.

Also I really don't understand how the mythical fountain of youth is any more lost than the mythical philosopher's stone.

Finally, I construed the Angel button as representing Paradise Lost (in the duel sense of the fallen angels and the fall of man), which added to my confusion.

Since it's St Anthony, the clue seemed to me to be lost items found, which was impossible because there are more than four. Unless I've misunderstood something, I think some of the incorrect buttons would be better if they were more apparently not lost.

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Aside from that, it was a lovely game with enjoyable puzzles and some exciting twists and turns!

[olafmoriarty]

Spoiler

How will the next case - if it will be a real "case" to solve like the others and not mainly about how to get out of the vatican, stop the villains and save the girl - begin? With Ben in the cellar, tied up again and having to rescue himself?

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Spoiler

I bet Percy is really a good guy, who has been infiltrating the Knights of St. Anthony undercover to destroy them. That's also the reason why there's no relic from Smailholm anywhere.

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Spoiler

And where did Alice go so suddenly after she had woken up Ben? Any ideas? Is Marcus Wilkins important for anything else than Alice's family history?

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Spoiler

She's a witch.

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Spoiler

And how is Ben going to do whatever it is he'll do ALONE? 

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Spoiler

He did well in the first three cases ... but he's not alone, he has Alice and Percy. I refuse to believe that guy is evil! It's just too damn obvious!

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Can anyone explain what I've missed here:

Spoiler

What I don't understand is why the Dead Sea Scrolls don't count as lost items. They've been found, but Ben has found the Galleon and Atlantis. Maybe Bianchi doesn't know this, but as a player I had no way of knowing.

Also I really don't understand how the mythical fountain of youth is any more lost than the mythical philosopher's stone.

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Ah, well, that's one of the charms of Ben Jordan games:

Spoiler

You can't expect to find all puzzle clues IN the game. Some of them are hidden in the Paranormal Investigator's Handbook, that HTML document that was entangled in the zip file along with the game.

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[Layabout]

How can people moan and complain about the plot of a CLIFFHANGER when the whole story is not complete??? You don't know what grund has planned for case 8.

I love the game. And yes Grundislav did give me a bj for saying this.

[Mr. Mozzarella]

Spoiler

I bet Percy is really a good guy, who has been infiltrating the Knights of St. Anthony undercover to destroy them. That's also the reason why there's no relic from Smailholm anywhere.

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Spoiler

Maybe ... it was also him who gave the clue about the Knights' symbol and lead Ben there ... so if your theory is correct, the reason for why he lead him to the knights could be that he wants his help in destroying them. But it could also be that he lead him there for the knights. Remember that he was also chosen as a sacrifice in case 3 and it still remains to find out why in the next case. There also seemed to be a kind of prophecy in the wall painting with the red haired man in case 6 ... Somehow I assume there will be a second attempt for sacrificing Ben for something ...

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Spoiler

He did well in the first three cases ... but he's not alone, he has Alice and Percy. I refuse to believe that guy is evil! It's just too damn obvious!

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Spoiler

But the first 3 cases were different. And Alice has disappeared and Percy, even if he may not be evil, he struck down Ben again and if he's infiltrating the knights he can't be too obvious ...

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[Lufia]

Everybody has already said that the game is awesome, I'm sure. (I haven't read the whole thread) Well, it is. It looks nice, the voice acting is good, the gameplay is solid and the storyline kept me pretty hooked even if I had the impression I had heard it before at some points.

However, I found the game too easy. I can't remember if I felt the same way about the other cases, it's been a while. Maybe I'll do a BJ marathon when case 8 is released or something.

The thing is, true I never got stuck because I missed on of those "key item disguised as a pixel" annoyances but then the only thing you have to do to complete the game with a perfect score is to be thorough. Talk to everybody about everything and all the puzzles become incredibly obvious. Except for that "strange box" one in Bianchi's apartment. I understood the principle well enough but no in-game clues is a bitch. I never thought I'd ask for more convoluted puzzles in a game, but here it is.

Frankly, it felt more like an interactive novel than an adventure game. Maybe that's what you were going for, in which case it's well done.

I'm currently replaying it with the designer's commentary enabled. It's quite nice, adds some replay value. I hope you'll do it again for case 8.