Pro Mistakes

[Nacho]

There's no need to be that harsh... but in my opinion, yeah, Blackthorne has being lame (no offence) of complaining FIVE TIMES of the attempts of improving of the AGSers! I felt quite annoying to see that "outer AGS" art has been criticised so vehemently instead of AGS work, but I enjoyed it quite a lot to see how it was improving, reaching the "suitable for CL" rank during the process.

Now, both of you, say sorry and shake your hands!

* Farlander apologies for moderatorism...

[TheYak]

I was being harsh? I didn't name any names and I certainly didn't call them lame.  I'm not disputing their points.  They're valid.  However,  somebody proclaiming a movie as a classic shouldn't preempt any critiquing thereof.

There are enough pointless, argumentative threads in the general forum.  Can't we keep the critics lounge as a place to critique rather than others criticizing the fact that we're making observations ?  I, for one, was vastly encouraged about the quality of my stuff seeing that even some professional games have had glaring errors.  I also learned quite a bit about light-sourcing and different methods for exploring it.  If a person or two is learning, I don't consider any critiquing, debating, or competition thread worthless. 

[Nacho]

My opinion about yout "harshity" has been just aimed to the "now you're officially wankers" thingie...

All the rest of my reply has gone in the very same direction of your stalement.

[TheYak]

I misspoke, I was very specifically only referring to Farlander as a wanker.

[Nacho]

I misspoke, I was very specifically only referring to Farlander as a wanker.

he...

[Blackthorne]

Ooops!  Sorry, I was trying to be humourous about something I actually feel very strongly about.

I see many criticisms of art around here, some of which almost imply that such errors limit the fun inherent in the games.  Sometimes I feel that people spend too much time nit-picking things, and not enough time enjoying them.  Although I do appreciate all the "work" and discussion that has seriously been done here, this is a commercial game that is sixteen years old.  If we spent HALF as much time working on other people's backgrounds, artists around here might improve.

People are human, and mistakes can be made.  Honestly, game design is way more important that a minor graphical error.  True, crappy graphics make for a bad game sometimes, but I'd hardly call a few wonky shadows "crappy" graphics.  I wasn't insulting anyone here, just making light of a situation. 

Bt

[Nacho]

No probs... I am talking just for me, but I had no problem with your message, man... the only problem is that I saw it "equal or very simillar" five times! 

But, hey... let's back to topic!

[Snarky]

This is the Critics Lounge, not the "chat about how fun it is to play adventure games" Lounge. Ã, :

And although graphics shouldn't limit the fun of a game, look at how different AGS games are treated. Games with polished graphics always get a lot of attention, and tend to be highly rated. In my opinion, certain games have received more acclaim than better games that happen to not look as good.

If it was just some Sierra artist from 16 years ago, I think everybody would have left it at "Take heart. Even pros make mistakes, and a mistake doesn't ruin the game." However, several people (including, as it turned out, me) were confused about what was going on, and how to correct it.

Hopefully, artists might improve from this thread. I know I learned something.

[TheYak]

Ooops!  Sorry, I was trying to be humourous about something I actually feel very strongly about.

Again, I don't disagree with the message at all.  I merely stated that it was a bit off topic.  I was going to suggest that looking over some backgrounds from games circa 1992 might be a good way to improve our art by seeing what techniques the artists used and potentially improving upon them. 

A bit more on topic; I've seen several diagrams showing how to correctly render a shadow, including its length and its perspective related to the object.  However, I've yet to see a good 1-point perspective shadow & light tutorial on the web.  It would seem we've all beat around the bush on this particular background but haven't hit quite the correct methodology.   

Yes, we're getting far too analytical.  The background doesn't ruin enjoyment, but it's an interesting session nonetheless.  I'd probably be more on the defensive with critiques of SQ3 backgrounds. (edit: whoops, I also wanted to mention an AGS game that was great fun, but didn't have the greatest graphics (No offensive Cap'n), the Box that Ate Time)

[GarageGothic]

While I certainly agree that the art has it's shortcomings, I'd like to point your attention the fact that:

1) This is an image from the pic resource. The room, as show in the game, had a lot of props to draw the attention from and partly cover the light effect

2) This is a very rarely visited room. In fact I don't think there's any reason to go in there except to talk to Ethel in the first quarter of the first act.

In a game this size, I really think this should be the last thing the artist would have worried about. Nevertheless, it was cool seeing you guys solve the problem with whatever means necessary.

[frisby@thecartographers]

Strangely no-one came to the conclusion that the windows are actually convex (or possibly concave - depending on whether you are outside or in).
I know that the picture doesn't clearly illustrate this fact - thats because its crap.

(The picture also doesn't illustrate that I am a buffoon.)

[Candle]

Those that do seek praise , those that can't become Critics

[Xadhoom]

To those of you going "the game is so-and-so old, it's not an important error, let it go, quit nitpicking" and so on and so forth, remember that this thread is not just meant  to whack the poor artist stuck with a 2 1/2 mhz spectrum machine and a brick-sized mouse to make this image so many years ago. It is also an excellent opportunity to look at a professional background and say "Hey, there's a problem here. How do we fix it in order to LEARN how to avoid the problem". I for one found this thread very interesting, and I appreciate the time people put into this.

The critics lounge is here for us improve as artists, and this is an excellent way of learning from mistakes, so we hopefully don't end up in the same situation ourselves.

So there.

[Moresco]

Amen!Ã,  Testify!

Yah seriously, this thread led me to a link (sorry I forgot who posted it) which in turn led me to seek out a book on the subject of light and perspective and architecture among other subjects.Ã,  It's thoroughly giant, and I am quite overwhelmed, yet pleased.Ã,  Ã, 

The only other thing other than the strange light problem that I see here, is the really ugly green wallpaper....but otherwise, it's a good background.Ã,  I've never played the Colonel's Bequest though, which is probably why I don't get the green wallpaper.Ã,  Peace.

EDIT:
Oh I forgot, are there any other "Pro Mistakes" to see?  I'd really like to see them. ^^