9-11 Over?

[Evil]

Haha, well, I do have a lot of communist views, and people brought that up, but they didnt say that exactly.

[Moox]

Hah, you would hate my school. My english teacher is a german who came to the states when he was 10, he talks about the nazis with overwhelming pride. Take this story for example:

Erlich: I have pictures of my parents making a sand castle with the swastika on it.
Student: A sand castle with the nazi flag on it?
Erlich: NO! THE GERMAN FLAG!

Its kinda funny but me and him agree on some views but fight about others. Im like the border line between commie and facist


BACK ON TOPIC:
I think the presidential canadites are doing the correct thing by not mentioning it. It might split the votes, some people are for candle services etc... for it, some abhor it. By not mentioning it they are staying on high ground during the flood.

[evenwolf]

Every other word at the republican convention was 9-11.  Don't you watch the Daily Show with John Stewart?

[Moox]

Im speaking of on 9-11-04, not of the RNC.

[PaulSC]

Stop typing right now and MOURN, you shameful bastards!

No, really I completely agree with most of you guys - I found the widespread, but largely unspoken "time to just let it go" atmosphere yesterday quite refreshing. It looks like before too long the date 11th of September might just be able to exist as a regular day again.

It's not as if anyone's ever going to suddenly forget about the whole thing, anyway - if you're interested in worldwide current affairs in the slightest, I doubt a single week goes by without you being reminded of it in some small way.

I think we're long past the stage where your average person should feel any obligation to go out of their way to recognise the date. I certainly didn't.

To be honest I always hate feeling obligated to feel emotions about things I'm no longer all that bothered about in any case. The whole Princess Diana fiasco was the worst example of that. I'd ceased to give more then a vague shit about the whole thing about half an hour after I heard about it, but then they had to spin it out for WEEKS, with Elton John personally going to every British person's house and forcing them to weep about it at knifepoint.

[Dave Gilbert]

Last year, I wrote a long drawn-out thread about 9/11 (which is HERE if anyone has the time to spare to read it).Ã,  It was a very personal day for America, and for us New Yorkers in particular, and it is right that we remember the day.Ã,  I know that I will.Ã,  However, I definitely agree that the rest of the world doesn't need to share in our grief.

Memory is a funny thing.Ã,  You used to be able to see the towers from a local park near my apartment.Ã,  A few months after the attack, I went to the park and looked down at the skyline.Ã,  For some weird reason, I couldn't remember where the towers were.Ã,  I knew they were to the south, but I couldn't pinpoint the exact location.Ã,  I don't know if my memory was just faulty, or if this was normal.

[Gfunkera]

Die Commies!! 

[evenwolf]

demorgon, when the only "worthwhile" part of your post is a smiley - maybe you shouldn't be posting?

[Gfunkera]

kingsized, when the only "worthwile" part of your post is pointless - maybe you shouldn't be posting?

lets not do this please  :

[Moox]

O shut up Demo, he was making a good point.

[PaulSC]

Gosh, Dave, that was an amazing story, and vividly told - enough to cut through my cynicism and drive home exactly why we have memorial days in the first place.

I hope I didn't come across as offensively blasé about the whole thing in that last post, and I certainly don't want to downplay the value of people's direct experiences.

[Matt Brown]

well, I guess Im a minority here. Im an American. Im a democrat...I STILL CARE.

Yes, lots of people die every day. Yes, in fact, terrorist attacks have occured in other parts of the world since then (Spain and Russia come to mind). one of the funny things about New York in America, (or prehaps its just the midwest), is that just about everybody either lived there, or knows somebody that does. My parent's first apparment building was right next to the WTC. I dont think its there anymore. A lot of family friends were there. One was a firefighter who helped clean things up after it was over. It was scary.

I know it sounds a little bit cliche, but I think Im going to really remember 911 as a life changing day for me. I was hoping I wouldnt have to grow up in a war. I thought my country was invincible. The peace that we all had during the 1990's was shattered in an explosion on airplane. Its scary shit man. Shit always seemed to happen everywhere else. Well, everywhere else got really close to Matt Brown on 9/11.

I think that was also the day I decided I needed to go into goverment service. Im not going to join the military, but thats when I began to shed my old overly idealistic, semi-commie political beliefs, and try to learn more. I wanted to know what the hell was going on. I wanted to change the way my country is going, since I thought it was getting screwed up. I still do, and I still think I will.

I didnt spend the whole day mourning or living in fear like prehaps the folks at the RNC would have be do. I watched the news, went to a local blues festival, and then to a dance. I thought I handled things the best way: I thought about it, but kept on trucking. Thats what the county needs to do. Not forget, but not be so caught up in it that it destorys our way of life. We cant let terror win in the face of national security.

I guess thats all I better say.  America isnt a very popular country it seems like on AGS for a while...

[MrColossal]

I still care also, Panda, but there's no reason for me to go posting in AGSforums about it. That's all.

Also, the US not being popular around here? We just had a mittens here and no one said "In the US?! But they did such and such!" The US is a very big part of current news and it gets talked about alot. Though I don't feel any big Anti-US sentiment from these forums.

As for peace in the 1990's, what about Kosovo and the Oklahoma City Bombing and Waco and Columbine. Rose coloured glasses and all, or you just didn't know at the time that there was stuff happening [or didn't care, I mean I was a teenager for most of it, if it didn't involve me making sweet on the ladies then why should I care?]  but now that you're older you can see the scary stuff going on around you. I dunno, I'm sleepy from staring at this screen.

These are not fighting words.

[Matt Brown]

well, I wasnt really refering to you Eric, it was more towards the first few posts in that thread that said I DONT CARE in big all caps letters.

Were the 1990's perfect? no, of course not. I think we have to look at this in perspective. The cold was was just won. during that decade, there were no monster threats looming. no red menace, no crazy terrorist legion, etc etc etc. The whipping boy of the 1990s wasnt communists or a national security threat, it was Bill Clinton.  Big Difference. I was growing up around that time, and I know that scary stuff happened. Columbine hit close to home. but even that danger seemed fleeting, and far. I cared about Kosovo, but those events didnt really register with the US press. I was also younger during oklahoma city, and I barely rememeber waco. Im sure that if those things happened now, Id look at them differently, being much older and more politically aware. I was looking at that decade in a historical prespective.

As for the US not being popular, i was refering more to the political nature. People love the US AGSers, no doubt. Mittens, it appears, was very sucsessful. but once America is discussed in a political nature, which happens when we discuss 9/11, not so much anymore. I dunno...maybe Im being paranoid, or hanging around other internet forums too much.

[DGMacphee]

I think 2004 has been a cumulative year for criticism for America. And I don't just mean internationally, but within America too. More Americans are voicing their dissatisfaction with the country, and that goes from your Michael Moores to the person on the street who thought the Iraq war was a mistake. The last few years have been a bit of a wake-up call for a lot of Americans, and from the sounds of it I think there are more and more people who want to set things right. Not because it looks good in the eyes of other countries, but because people just want a better country than what they have now.

Here in Australia, we've recently had our second "Terror on our Doorstep" attack. The first was a car-bombing in a Balinese pub in 2002, which killed 202 people (most of them Australians). The most recent one happened last week outside the Australian Embassy in Jakarta, and death toll has so far reached 10 (according to Aust Federal Police). It's ironic. We seemed to have made more out of the War in Iraq than anything closer to our homeland.

Likewise for America. I think Americans are starting to realise that not enough has been done within the homeland (and I'm not just talking national security) when compared to the focus on international conflicts since Sept 11.

[Blackthorne]

One of my best friends just got married on Saturday.  It was 9-11.  He wanted to remeber a happy day.  It was beautiful and he married someone he loves.


Shit happens.  9-11 sucked.  Yeah.  But someday, it will just be an event that some stoned kid is pissed off he has to read about in his textbook for his homework in 8th period History Class.  That's it. 

NYC has had it's share of tragedies and horriffic things it's sworn to never forget.  But time heals wounds and life goes on.  This is one for the books..... and a good one to let go.

Bt

[shbaz]

I think 2004 has been a cumulative year for criticism for America. And I don't just mean internationally, but within America too. More Americans are voicing their dissatisfaction with the country, and that goes from your Michael Moores to the person on the street who thought the Iraq war was a mistake. The last few years have been a bit of a wake-up call for a lot of Americans, and from the sounds of it I think there are more and more people who want to set things right. Not because it looks good in the eyes of other countries, but because people just want a better country than what they have now.

This is OT, but I really wish all of the people preaching that all Americans need to die on the streets of Middle-Eastern countries knew that. I wonder sometimes if they realize that a good portion of Americans feel the same way they do about our government.

EDIT:
Except that we're infidels and need to die.

[Andail]

...Spain and Russia come to mind). one of the funny things about New York in America, (or prehaps its just the midwest), is that just about everybody either lived there, or knows somebody that does.

You need to move out of your personal sphere, man. You can't honestly believe that people around the world feel the way you do regarding the 9/11.

Also, yes people around the world think your government and your politics are a bloody joke. That can't be too much of a shock to you.
That doesn't mean we hate everything about america or the american people, I think you're being treated just like everybody else on this forum.
We don't hate or love americans more than norwegians, germans or russians on the AGS, so just stop putting so much nationality in the context.

[DGMacphee]

This is OT, but I really wish all of the people preaching that all Americans need to die on the streets of Middle-Eastern countries knew that. I wonder sometimes if they realize that a good portion of Americans feel the same way they do about our government.

EDIT:
Except that we're infidels and need to die.

It's a difficult situation since they've been subject to an invasion by a foreign government. It happens with most occupations. And a lot of Americans can say, "I wish they wouldn't preach death to us all" but a lot of Americans haven't had their houses bombed and family members killed by an invading Iraqi force. But I agree, though, that there should be more blame on the administration rather than the population as a whole. After all, most Americans were misled by their own government. And more Americans are realising this as each day passes. And I do hope all Iraqis come to realise this one day as well.

I also remember during both the Afghanistan War and the Iraqi War there were a lot of Americans who wanted both countries nuked without understanding the reasons behind both invasions. It's pretty much the same as Iraqi's taking to the streets and shouting "Death to infidels!"

[jrl2222]

My point wasnt to morn or be sad. The fact that that day pushed us into billions of dollars in debt and I didnt see one banner, or hear about it on tv at all, bothers me.

I don't know where you live but it was on all the news stations here. One station played interviews with relatives all day long. They showed the memorial with the two beams of light that can be seen for more then 50 miles. Not saying I wanted to forget but it would have been hard because here in western michigan you couldn't get away from everyone remembering it.