Disney blocks next Michael Moore film

[Ali]

Farlander, veryweirdguy, it looks like your signatures are racing each other.

And I'm glad I'll be able to see the film.

You know, a camera is quite like a ... robotic eye....

[Nacho]

And the smurf wins!

[veryweirdguy]

Hmmm..............who do YOU think would win? A short WALKING blue guy or a guy running for his life?

Let's ask the robot, shall we?

* veryweirdguy jumps onto the bandwagon.......and falls down face first.....

[Nacho]

Oh... I thought that the aura was because he smells... 

[veryweirdguy]

Well, in a completely unrelated matter, he also has a body odour problem, yes.

And he hasn't showered for years.

And he's on fire because someone was offended by the smell.

BUT, apart from that, he's on fire.

Stupid.

[Barcik]

If anyone still cares, although this has been hilarious.... http://www.cnn.com/2004/SHOWBIZ/Movies/05/12/disney.moore.reut/index.html

Can it all be a... publicity stunt?! I am not quite familiar with the history of Moore and Disney, but it does seem that by "blocking" this movie Disney created a lot of interest in it. Now, the public knows there is something controversial in it, and we all know how the average movie goer loves a little spicy controversy.

[DGMacphee]

Why would Disney create a publicity stunt where they sell the rights to a film that could make more money than the price at which they could sell it?

It's like selling the goose that lays golden eggs for $5.

And let's not forget driving away Miramax.

But let's just see what happes, cause if it's a publicity stunt it's not working well in Disney's favour.

[Ali]

It's like selling the goose that lays golden eggs for $5.

It's a deal. You send it round my house and I'll ... email you the cash.

On topic, if Miramax is a division of Disney (as I believe it is) what's the real significance of this move? Surely Disney will still make money from the film's sales.

Edit: Thanks Las, that makes much more sense. I had a feeling I was missing something.

[Las Naranjas]

No no, it's not being distributed by Miramax.

Disney says it won't allow Miramax to, so the Weinsteins who are the chairs of Miramax have bought the rights personally. So the brothers themselves are those who will distribute and [likely] profit from the film, but they still remain the management of Miramax.

[Barcik]

I know I am being petty, but this really annoyed me. After winning the Palm d'Or, Micheal Moore said: "There was a great Republican president who once said, if you just give the people the truth, the republicans, the Americans will be saved."

Is that what you do, Mr. Moore, with your selective choice of materials and half-truths? Give people the truth?

I wonder what he comes up with at the next Academy Awards ceremony.

Edit: Now that I kicked it up, NEW BOTS!!!

[DGMacphee]

[juncmodule]

Think what you want about Michael Moore, but please, watch how much you attack him.

If you attack the man because he tells lies, wins a bunch of rewards and whatever crap reasons you have then you are missing something very important.

I was born in Flint, Michigan and lived there until I was 21. My father worked at Fisher Body, and later retired from Buick City. Michael Moore is a hero, plain and simple. He is a hero without a victory. Recently, I read an article that claimed "people" (I would love to know who) were beginning to think Moore was "UNAMERICAN".

If you fucking think my FATHER or any GM employee from Flint, MI was or is unamerican you need to pull whatever stick you have shoved up your ass out of it. Michael Moore fought a nasty fight against General Motors (and lost) and he STILL supports his home town. Although General Motors has left it abandoned and ruined. In his OSCAR AWARD WINNING film he still spends a large amount of time on Flint. Anyone that fights for American factory workers the way Moore has is NOT unamerican.

If Moore's new movie, in even the slightest way, helps in getting George Bush out of office (whatever its content, lies or otherwise) then Moore has done America the greatest service.

There is nothing more Unamerican than sending our soldiers to another country to die without a clear agenda. There is nothing more Unamerican than forcing Muslims to eat pork. There is nothing more Unamerican that forcing a Muslim to thank Jesus that he is alive. There is nothing more Unamerican than George Bush.

(sorry about the rant but this pissed me off: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/3734531.stm)

EDIT: The moral of the story, if Moore wants to lie, cheat, and steal in order to save lives, then who cares.

later,
-junc

[MrColossal]

Well... I care junc...

But I just want to say, Barcik, why do you think Micheal Moore is such a liar? Have you researched his points or are you going off of a random website online that debunked his claims?

Did he edit his movie in his favour, sure. Did he out and out lie to persuade people to take up his point? I doubt it. Do other people out and out lie to persuade people to take up their point, yes. Is the best way to find out if Micheal Moore is lying doing the research yourself? Yes.

[Andail]

Juncmodule, let me kiss your forehead.

The problem I always have when defending people like Michael Moore, is that everybody knows I'm a leftist pascifist, who accordingly must love Michael Moore because of sheer genetics or something.

You prove what I've always thought; Michael Moore is first of all american, and he strives to save his own country before anything else. He loves it and he wishes it the best.

He has the guts to go against what the big mass considers patriotic, and runs the risk of being hated by the ones he wishes to save. He's truly a great man.

And I really wish some people could just look at the message Moore's tries to deliver, instead of clinging onto that same old dilemma of "unbiased documentary" etc.

[juncmodule]

"George Orwell once warned that the subversion of society begins with the corruption of its language. Words such as "conservative," "liberal," "patriotism," "taxation," "public," "government," and even "Christianity" have been twisted and distorted by those who stand to gain much from public perplexity."

The Last Refuge
-David W. Orr

Quote from a book I began reading today. I think people also confuse the words "American" and "Patriotism" when used together to mean anti-everyone else. I am a patriot, I love my country. But my country is currently guilty of war crimes, hate crimes, and an appalling abuse of power.

Another beautiful quote I came across today:

"I'm the commander -- see, I don't need to explain -- I do not need to explain why I say things. That's the intersting thing about being the president. Maybe somebody needs to explain to me why the say something, but I don't feel like I owe anybody an explanation."

-President George W. Bush

later,
-junc

[Darth Mandarb]

junc ... I must say, Wow!

You almost made me like Michael Moore!

I'll be the first to admit I don't know a lot about Michael Moore, so my attitude toward him comes solely from what I've seen of him.Ã,  (which isn't much)Ã,  And I'm from Michigan.

I got VERY pissed at him for what he said at the Oscars last year.Ã,  While I respect his right to speak his mind, I don't always approve of how he speaks it.Ã, 

But anyway ... as I've said before.Ã,  I tend to agree with most of his messages (that I know about).

Having said all that, I will say this:Ã,  If his stirring up the pot the way he does can actually cause some changes to be made to 'the way things are in America' then I will, while not particualarly approving of his methodology, support the message and changes.

[evenwolf]

I've met Michael Moore on two occasions.Ã,  The first time was during a book signing for Stupid White Men and I told him "Good luck with your new movie."Ã,  The second time was in an auditorium at the university and he was passing around his Oscar.Ã,  I handed him a mini-dv tape and he politely took it from me and said thank you.

I've been a stronger fan of his in the past and I agree now that he can be a bit extreme.Ã,  But from what I've seen, he is a caring human being.Ã,  Ã, At the speech at the university, a young republican stood up and asked Michael "What are you going to do with all the money you make from the movie?"

The response was as funny as hell.

"I'm going to buy a really big yacht."

He deserves it.

[Barcik]

But I just want to say, Barcik, why do you think Micheal Moore is such a liar? Have you researched his points or are you going off of a random website online that debunked his claims?

Did he edit his movie in his favour, sure. Did he out and out lie to persuade people to take up his point? I doubt it. Do other people out and out lie to persuade people to take up their point, yes. Is the best way to find out if Micheal Moore is lying doing the research yourself? Yes.

Did he lie? I believe not. Did he show people only what he wanted them to see? Yes. Did he manipulate stastics? Possibly. Did he, as he said, "give people the truth"? I doubt it. The truth is the whole picture, with all the minuses and pluses, pros and cons, good things and bad things, left-wing and right-wing. Both sides of the coin.

An Israeli leftist journalist, Ofer Shelah, wrote the following in an article where he described the American war in Iraq as Jihad:
"According to the details and explanations, I warn you that the things which will be brought up here describe, deliberately, only one side, maybe a few sides of America - which is a complicated thing, with plenty of sides and contradictions. But we are not here to understand the proceedings in Iraq through objective eyes, but to observe the historical and cultural aspects which had lead to the war. The other sides of the story, and they do exist, we shall put aside at the moment."
Shelah, a basketball analyst at his free time, is one of the few left-wing journalists I can read and respect. He does not consider himself to be better than the other side, and does not neglect its existence. Moore is so convinced that he and his views are better that he allows himself to criticize his 'enemy' for what he himself does. Disagreeing with the war? Fine. Creating art with an anti-war message? Fine. Patronize the other side and act like a hypocrite? Not fine.

[DG from Uni]

The truth is the whole picture

If you're looking for the whole picture in life, you'll be searching for an eternity.

"Truth is a pathless land. Man cannot come to it through any organization, through any creed, through any dogma, priest or ritual, not through any philosophic knowledge or psychological technique. He has to find it through the mirror of relationship, through the understanding of the contents of his own mind, through observation and not through intellectual analysis or introspective dissection. Man has built in himself images as a fence of security - religious, political, personal. These manifest as symbols, ideas, beliefs. The burden of these images dominates man's thinking, his relationships, and his daily life. These images are the causes of our problems for they divide man from man. His perception of life is shaped by the concepts already established in his mind. The content of his consciousness is his entire existence. This content is common to all humanity. The individuality is the name, the form and superficial culture he acquires from tradition and environment. The uniqueness of man does not lie in the superficial but in complete freedom from the content of his consciousness, which is common to all mankind. So he is not an individual." - J. Krishnamurti

In other words, Barcik, F911 is Michael Moore's truth, based upon his observations, relationship's with the world, and the content of his consciousness.

Your truth is based upon your observations, etc, and I'm sure F911 will contribute to that in some way.

Truth isn't something absolute and universal, so you can't treat it like it is. Having said that, truth is also something that's inter-connected between people, like a chain. When you see F911, your truth will be linked to Moore's truth.

Besides, I don't think any of us can say Moore's film is untruthful when none of us have seen it yet.

[DGMacphee from Uni]

Also...

Patronize the other side and act like a hypocrite? Not fine.

But the Bush administration does it more than Moore and you seem to accept that very easily.