how many french speaking people around there?

Stupot · Sun 20/04/2008 10:08:47

I'm a little embarrasssed by the British attitude that everyone should speak English and we shouldn't bother. I love languages and it's only because I was a lazy teenager that my French is poor. I've been slowly picking up Japanese, and am going to uni to study it properly, soon, which is going to be great. But in all truth, Chinese would have been a more practical option... I think in a few years time it would benefit us all to learn Chinese, you mark my words.

riseryn · Sun 20/04/2008 10:38:52

QuoteI'm a little embarrasssed by the British attitude that everyone should speak English

Don't be embarassed, id rather like speak english than eat english food

QuoteI think in a few years time it would benefit us all to learn Chinese, you mark my words

I hope that this will not become true, asian languages are so difficult (especially pronunciation).

Nacho · Sun 20/04/2008 12:43:43

Hey Stupot, I've seen a high percentage of English people that is a little bit embarrassed to of "just speaking English". As I said, they try to say some words in other languajes, and I think that Spanish is quite popular in the US... As I mentioned before, that shy attempts are really appreciated by the locals.

Brokenbutterfly: I don' t like to use a certain event for generalising, I usually hate it when people does that in threads... But as I mentioned, it happened to me enough to consider that there was a pattern. Thinking it again, probably I treated with people over 30 years... maybe that is changing slowly. That would be IMHO good news.

And yeah, accent can be a problem. For example, Swiss guys do manage quite well, because they also study French, and English, they "learn" how to forget their "natural" accent when speaking in English. That also happens with Dutch, Denish... When some other people speaking germanic languajes has to speak in English without having "learned" to forget their accent the result is terrible (Example, people from Austria...) See episodes of "AllÃ³ AllÃ³" to know what I am talking about. Same with french... I recently had a guest who tried to speak to me in English (I did with him in my poor French, and the result was quite funny, with a person talking shitty English and the other talking shitty french...) And he pronounced "Think" in the way an English person should pronounce "sink". It was difficult... But when two people want to know what the other person thinks, it' s done in the end...

riseryn · Sun 20/04/2008 13:06:25

QuoteBut when two people want to know what the other person thinks, it' s done in the end...

Maybe its one advantage of english language, even if you re talking a kind of pidgin you may be able to communicate much more easily than with another language.

Someone said once (I think its Catherine the Great but im not sure and im looking for the exact citation) something like that :
"speak italian for love, french for diplomacy and german for war"
and maybe english for trade?

Nacho · Sun 20/04/2008 13:45:00

Non conjugating, no need to add particles in the verb since the subject, direct object and indirect object have to be mentioned... Yes, English is a good languaje for being able to speak soon with not much studying...

riseryn · Sun 20/04/2008 21:35:26

I guess we have about ten french speaking people around there on 3942 members.
hourra the french community is very big here and im proud to be part of it

Radiant · Sun 20/04/2008 23:35:42

Quote from: jetxl on Sun 20/04/2008 02:37:48
Oddly enough it sounds more like seperation to me. It forces german and french members to check those forums as much as the main forum.

Effectively, the present system also forces german and french members to check these forums in addition to their "own". With the added problem that there's a lot of redundancy and not a lot of mailflow in several of their "own", and that people might not know of the alternative.

Centralization = added community value.

riseryn · Mon 21/04/2008 00:54:18

Im not for centralization.
I think if forum here have different section regarding the language its much more segregation than centralisation.
One official forum one language is better.
I just wish it would be great to have a special section with links to non english community
Just add a section in community with a list maintened by moderators of non english ags community.

brokenbutterfly · Mon 21/04/2008 02:29:42

Quote from: Nacho on Sun 20/04/2008 12:43:43
Brokenbutterfly: I don' t like to use a certain event for generalising, I usually hate it when people does that in threads... But as I mentioned, it happened to me enough to consider that there was a pattern. Thinking it again, probably I treated with people over 30 years... maybe that is changing slowly. That would be IMHO good news.

Yes I understand that you came to your conclusion after encountering the same situation so many times. But I'm really surprised how rude those people are. If my friends and I came to your hotel, you would be proud of us because we would try our best to speak Spanish (even if it's not good

). I'm really glad if you say the situation is changing!

Quote from: riseryn on Sun 20/04/2008 21:35:26
I guess we have about ten french speaking people around there on 3942 members.
hourra the french community is very big here and I'm proud to be part of it

Only ten? I think we are more than that

Nacho · Mon 21/04/2008 07:41:12

As said, I probably made the mistake of stablishing that pattern based on people above 30 years... I think it's changing in the younger generations.

Nikolas · Mon 21/04/2008 07:49:23

Don't put in the equation the Swiss please.

Apart from not being exactly nice, as we talked about earlier, it's also that they already NEED to know 3 languages, or at least two very well. French, German and a bit of Italian. There's no way these people will even attempt to learn English unless open minded, etc.

I've been in Germany and France/Swizterland, and I do know a tiny bit of French and German, so my attempts to at least communicate were taken very nicely I think. Of course trying to do something else than order food or a glass of water (like buying an expensive watch, for example), were done in English. but I always started off in German or French. No harm there.

When I went in Syria, there was absolutley no chance to speak Syrian (Arabic that is), but, again, Syrians spoke French rather than English. And they loved us unans!

Going to a country it does make sense to try and communicate on their terms. When the tourists come over though, it is a different issue, isn't it? I always get pissed at French in Greece going "Mais, Je ne parle pas Engles (or however it's spelled

)". Well sorry mate, me neither! I won't even bother trying to remember so hard. What about body language?

riseryn · Mon 21/04/2008 10:08:07

This thread is slowly ( or not?) begining to evolve into a debate about "are french evil"?

I noticed that peoples who travels for hollidays in foreign countries tends to acts differently than they ll normally do in their own country.
Its true that generally im not very proud of french tourist behavior in other country , but it seems that this behavior is common to a lot of tourists whatever the nationality.
As if humans, when oustide their countries, becomes a new alien nation :the "evil tourist".

English is not the universal language (always surprised in sf movies when strange lifeforms in a far away galaxy speaks english

) but a very common one.
By example if one would travel in florida, spanish would be more accurate to communicate than english (I remember in the center of miami to have seen shops with the "english spoken here" panel on the front door).

I know a former teacher (ancient greek and latin) who always manage to communicate with this two old languages when he travels

Communication is not about the language used (well, its part of it) but mainly about the will to communicate.
Im sure you have many examples in your own life not be able to communicate with someone speaking the same language than you

.

Language is not a simple thing, its connected to the way a nation perceive life.
I recommand you to read this book "the languages of Pao" by Jack Vance to understand exactly what I mean.

Concerning the fact that french are not fond of english maybe history can give us some lights.
france and uk were the best ennemies for centuries.
same thing for germany and france.
france and uk have good relationship for less than a century, france and germany for 50 years.
30 years ago, when I was learning english in Edimburgh ,one of my teacher ( a scotsman) said to me that scottish were fond of french because france was at war with england for centuries

Nowadays things changes and evolves throughout the world and in 50 years what seems to be important today will be negligible as the difference in languages.

SSH · Mon 21/04/2008 11:29:07

In Poland, Jade Goody is teaching people how to speak English.

riseryn · Mon 21/04/2008 19:11:16

Who (or what) is jade goody?

passer-by · Mon 21/04/2008 21:00:26

I still believe there should be one forum only, but the other ones are more like communities, I think, so I don't mind. It's like forums about Harry Potter (or whatever you choose). There's the official site and there's a million of relative webpages and forums.

When you say french speaking, you mean natives, I suppose.

Quote from: Nacho on Sun 20/04/2008 12:43:43
But when two people want to know what the other person thinks, it' s done in the end...

Definitely.

I moved in Germany 8 months ago. I only knew 'hello' and numbers. I 've met germans who tried to use really poor english to help me, I 've met germans who double check if I got what they said in german because they "leider" (unfortunately)can't speak enlgish. I've made a mobile phone contract speaking french, I am guilty of delaying city trains for the driver wanted to help but could only speak german. I understand a bit italian and very little spanish. Clients at work keep teaching me the expressions I need. English, German, whatever...Did I mention I'm greek?

Nikolas · Mon 21/04/2008 21:17:34

Quote from: passer-by on Mon 21/04/2008 21:00:26
Did I mention I'm greek?

Well, no, but we should've known... Chirstina you also changed your nick, and it took me a while to figure out who you are.

riseryn · Mon 21/04/2008 21:20:07

QuoteWhen you say french speaking, you mean natives, I suppose.

No i mean what i wrote, no more no less .

Emerald · Mon 21/04/2008 21:22:29

If we're having French and German forums, why not Italian and Polish?

Or an Irish-speaking one. That would be funny...

passer-by · Mon 21/04/2008 21:22:52

Quote from: riseryn on Mon 21/04/2008 21:20:07
QuoteWhen you say french speaking, you mean natives, I suppose.
No i mean what i wrote, no more no less .

Oh, then I'm included
(reading and some writing, because, speaking, forget it!! And that's because I have to use english all the time... )

Quote from: Emerald on Mon 21/04/2008 21:22:29
If we're having French and German forums, why not Italian and Polish?

Or an Irish-speaking one. That would be funny...

So, you can see for yourself where it's headed... This forum being just the original, not the main one.

Emerald · Mon 21/04/2008 21:29:04

It's bloody discrimination! The Irish community is as important as any other!

Rise, my brothers, for the revolution is at hand!