I have been working out...

[ManicMatt]

Why do either of you argue? You're both very picky about your own subjects and must be absolutely correct about it, and can't admit when you're wrong, so both of you, agree to disagree! *slaps you both about for a bit*   

EDIT: Oh, and BB, Beckham would then be called a "professional footballer", no?

[big brother]

Why do either of you argue?

I have a small degree of knowledge or experience in certain areas. When these are being discussed, I will usually care enough to argue.

You're both very picky about your own subjects and must be absolutely correct about it, and can't admit when you're wrong, so both of you, agree to disagree!

What is this hippy bullshit?
Agree to disagree is a resolution for an opinion, not for something factual.

*slaps you both about for a bit*   

Hah.

Hahahahahhahahahahahahahhaha.

[Erenan]

I think the problem, however, is that when Helm said he couldn't care less whether the guy is or isn't a professional bodybuilder, he didn't mean that he makes no distinctions, but rather that he really just doesn't care. At least, that's how I understood him.

Actually, I'm just upset that Matt responded to you guys instead of to me.

But don't mind me. I have absolutely no interest in bodybuilding at all, and I'd rather not get involved in any kind of serious argument about it.

[LimpingFish]

Bodybuilding is almost as pointless an activity as masturbation. And less fun.

[Helm]

let's see. image posted was fake, someone says 'that's fake' and I remember I had seem some sorry bodybuilder person who through substance abuse of the worst way got into a similar state. So I post the picture as a reply to the 'that's fake' thing. I was meaning, crazy shit like this happens.

Now, whether sorry person is indeed a practicing, participating bodybuilder, I really really don't care. As far as I know, he was the product of the bodybuilding environ, a very grave reminder of what can happen with steroids. A lot of bodybuilders use steroids. Though Valentino is a cartoon case, I find for example this person equally nausiating, and he seems like a bodybuilder to me.

Bodybuilding for me is an expression of pathological narcissism (LET'S GET BIG! LET'S PUMP IRON WOO!) and has no redeeming factors. That's just an opinion though, you might find it annoying, you know?

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

The first guy looks like he's totally Tetsuo-ing out from Akira.  He's going to turn into a giant veiny fetus, I know it!

[big brother]

Bodybuilding for me is an expression of pathological narcissism (LET'S GET BIG! LET'S PUMP IRON WOO!) and has no redeeming factors.

I'm not saying that isn't an "opinion". It's just not a very credible one. In fact, it might be just as stupid if I were to to pronounce metal as music for insecure cavemen. To go one step further and say "it has no redeeming factors" is fairly ridiculous to say without knowledge of the subject.

I understand the context of your original posts, it's this one:

Gregg Valentino isn't a bodybuilder, Big Brother?

that seemed snide, less of an actual question and more of a correction. If you don't care whether or not he's a bodybuilder, why did you EVEN ASK ME???

Bodybuilding is almost as pointless an activity as masturbation. And less fun.

Is that why you stopped competing, Limpingfish?

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

Easy man, easy!  It's obvious that you enjoy the sport a fair bit -- and truth be told -- my brother is heavy into the whole Joe Wieder scene himself, which I respect.  I don't think anyone was trying to yank your chain, Helm just clearly doesn't see the appeal to having 1% bodyfat and 90% muscles, and Limpingfish just likes to masturbate.  True story!

[LimpingFish]

...and Limpingfish just likes to masturbate.  True story!

Huzzah for loving one's self! \o/

[big brother]

Easy man, easy!Ã, 

Roid rage....err, short fuse. It's a white guy thing.

[MillsJROSS]

Bodybuilding - "Bodybuilding is the process of developing muscle fibers through the combination of weight training, increased caloric intake, and rest."

A sport is not defined by the league it is contained in. If I play soccer regularly I can call myself a soccer player. Just because I don't compete does not nullify the activity that I've been doing. You might not be able to call Valentino a competitive or professional bodybuilder, however, regardless of steroids he is a bodybuilder. I think people associate the term bodybuilder as only including competitive bodybuilding, which just isn't the case.

Big Brother

Do you call IFBB judges "bodybuilders", since they too are products of the environment? How about the scientists that synthesize the supplements? Are they bodybuilders?

If the judges or scientists participate in bodybuilding, then yes.

Helm

Bodybuilding for me is an expression of pathological narcissism (LET'S GET BIG! LET'S PUMP IRON WOO!) and has no redeeming factors. That's just an opinion though, you might find it annoying, you know?

I think bodybuilding in moderation has definite benefits. As with most things, moderation is the key word.

Gregg Valentino isn't a bodybuilder, Big Brother?

that seemed snide, less of an actual question and more of a correction. If you don't care whether or not he's a bodybuilder, why did you EVEN ASK ME???

Um, because it is a snide comment, and regardless of whether or not Valentino fits in your definition of bodybuilding doesn't mean it doesn't fit into his. If you reread his post you'll realize he doesn't care what you classify the man as, he's already classified him by his definition. To argue about being snide, seems moot when you call him Telemachus.

Why must you challenge things for the sake of being fractious? When corrected, you fall back on an alternate definition of your own invention. If you don't care, why do you argue? Just....annoying.

I don't think he was challenging things for the sake of being fractious, I think he was challenging because he was actually correct through his definition. Just as you are correct through your definition. And he's arguing for the same reason you're arguing, because he thinks he's correct, and gosh darn it, it's also fun. Helm can be quite annoying, but usually that's because he generally has sound and reasonable logic that is usually well written, and it's hard to argue against that. Also he's Greek.

-MillsJROSS

[Gregjazz]

I wouldn't really consider someone who resorts to synthol to make their muscles large a bodybuilder. I mean, it doesn't develop your muscle fibers or anything. Just because he looks like a bodybuilder doesn't make him a bodybuilder.

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

Sounds like he wants to look like Big Lou without putting the effort forth!  Leave it to science to let you cheat your way to a tougher looking physique (and tons of health problems, smaller dick, etc)

[Andail]

I don't see why people are so picky about the definition of "body-builder".

Helm showed a picture to display a grotesque sample of someone who obviously is the result of a twisted view on human esthetics, which is also something you'll find in body-building. I'm not talking "let's drop by the gym tomorrow after school and push dumbbells and then spin a bit", I'm talking full-fledged, hard-core professional body-building, the sport whose participators are depicted on magazine covers in your local kiosk.

I mean, isn't body-building just about having as big and defined muscles as possible, along with visible veins? Or what did we miss?

Also, saying this like "sigh" and "no, Telemachus" in a debate sounds very snide to me.

[DoorKnobHandle]

This discussion is pointless, because THIS is what a rack is:

[Tuomas]

it might be just as stupid if I were to to pronounce metal as music for insecure cavemen.

which it is, so I don't see the problem in saying it

@ dkh: ditto

[Erenan]

My opinion is that questions on the Internet should usually not be interpreted as comments with snide undertones. Go back and reread Helm's question about Valentino and assume he's actually asking a question with raised eyebrows. It's not snide unless you want it to be.

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

Helm is always snide, and we prefer him that way.

[Gregjazz]

This discussion is pointless, because THIS is what a rack is:

+1 dkh

[A package of gum]

I think the best way to diffuse the situation is to state as clearly as possible that you're both Nazis and I hate you all.