The nintendo Wii

[Helm]

No, pm applies to everything, really. In the sense of reinvention, willfull regurgitation and so on, yes, you are correct. "nothing new under the sun". Just the connection wasn't very clear to me on the second to last post of yours. Thanks.

[ManicMatt]

in response to maniac matts comment

Who?

ease of programing is very important for a console take the SEGA DREAMCAST,
it was superior to all consoles at the time, had the first ever built in multiplayer but it was killed by the difficulty coding for it resulting in rather poor third party support and a limited range of Home games,
it was downhill from there and SEGA was forced to leave the console industry for good after 15 years.

How does that expalin the pleathora of PS3 games in the making? I think difficulty of programming had little to do with it.

If is easy to program for, it wins FULL STOP.

Hey, AGS is relatively easy to program for, so why isn't it the most successful thing in the world ever? Hmm... there just be MORE factors included!


Everyone has failed to see the potential gameplay enhancements that come with next gen hardware. Look at Dynasty Warriors on PSone. It was a side on beat 'em up. PS2, it's a man against 1000 troops warground, something they couldn't ever have done on PS. Now imagine PS3 DW. Higher detail yes, but you should be able to see the troops in the distance instead of them just popping up in front of you! Heck, even more troops could attack you!

Or for a better example actually, the leap from PSone GTA to PS2 GTA.

[m0ds]

No problem Helm.

If you want a fight though, we can take it outside.

[Domino]

The Xbox 360 sucks. It's not even next gen. Wii is actually an African word, believe it or not...

Excuse me, but do you own a 360? I'm just wondering how you can say it sucks. At first some titles didn't look next-gen, but now i have seen some games and played some demos that would blow you away. I'm just assuming you are anti Microsoft, so all you can do is bash the system.

Also, didn't read the whole thread, but the Wii is going to have the virtual console which means you can go online and purchase and download whole games from systems ranging from NES to N64, and i also heard Sega Genesis and Turbo-Grafx games as well. I own a 360 and love it, and i'm definitely gonna buy the Wii, but i'm going to take a wait and see approach on the PS3.

I really wish there were no such thing as console wars, it really is sad.

[MrColossal]

why didnt they go the extra mile and try to appeal to graphic loving gamers as well  Ã, 

to keep it cheap and accessable to as many people as possible. That's not lazy.

[timlump]

domino is the most sensible albeit probably the richest      note im somewhat like that i hate the Ps3 yet am using a psp to post

[Domino]

No, i'm not rich, i just work for a living. But i have a very bad video game addiction. I think i need help. 

[EagerMind]

Actually, after reading the dictionary, I guess post-modernism doesn't really account for technical entities like consoles.

I think it's time to update the definition for the new millenium:

"Of or relating to art, architecture, literature or video games that reacts against earlier modernist principles, as by reintroducing traditional or classical elements of style or by carrying modernist styles or practices to extremes."

Plus, I really want to start calling myself a post-modernist gamer. I think I'll put it on my business cards.

[Kweepa]

[the Dreamcast] was superior to all consoles at the time, had the first ever built in multiplayer but it was killed by the difficulty coding for it
[...]
If is easy to program for, it wins FULL STOP.

Have you ever worked on a game for Dreamcast? I have, and it wasn't particularly hard. Compared to, for example, the PS2.
The XBox (and to a lesser extent the GameCube) are much easier to develop for than the PS2, but the PS2 won in terms of gross sales.

Wii will never have a hold on the serious or competative aspect of gaming thus we should let it do its thing because its never gonna threaten xbox or ps3 it never did and never will,

Nintendo don't try to compete. They just quietly make great systems and great games and rake in the cash.

it will only survive on its blindly loyal fanbase who would walk off a cliff if NINTENDO said it was original and innovative, it may be but its stupid.

Nintendo experiment. Sometimes it doesn't work (eg the Virtual Boy) - I don't remember the "blindly loyal fanbase" making that successful. Time will tell if the Wii is successful. I suspect it will be. Remember that it doesn't have to outsell the 360 or PS3 to be successful - it just needs to make Nintendo money.

[Domino]

The Dreamcast will always be one of my favorite consoles. When i first saw that sucker in action, i was hooked and bought one right away.

It sucks that most games for the machine were either from SEGA or crappy ports from other systems. Also, the game selection for the Dreamcast really blew. My only favorites from the Dreamcast were Crazy Taxi and Shenmue 1 & 2. The rest of the games were on the other systems as well.

I really don't know what killed the Dreamcast. But i read that too many people were able to copy Dreamcast games and play them instead of buying them. So the majority of Dreamcast owners were playing copied games and thus leading to less profits for SEGA. I still own mine, but it is wrapped in plastic and hasn't been used in ages. After SEGA declared the Dreamcast dead, i lost respect for the company.

It had something big on its hands, but didn't know how to handle it or market it properly, plus the controller sucks big time.

[Steel Drummer]

The Xbox 360 sucks. It's not even next gen. Wii is actually an African word, believe it or not...

Excuse me, but do you own a 360? I'm just wondering how you can say it sucks. At first some titles didn't look next-gen, but now i have seen some games and played some demos that would blow you away. I'm just assuming you are anti Microsoft, so all you can do is bash the system.

Also, didn't read the whole thread, but the Wii is going to have the virtual console which means you can go online and purchase and download whole games from systems ranging from NES to N64, and i also heard Sega Genesis and Turbo-Grafx games as well. I own a 360 and love it, and i'm definitely gonna buy the Wii, but i'm going to take a wait and see approach on the PS3.

I really wish there were no such thing as console wars, it really is sad.

I don't 360  8), and will die before I do!  But, think about this: You can get the same games, with graphics 2% less than what the 360 has, for way less the price (no, I'm not talking the wii, I'm talking about 'old' systems like PS2 or GameCube or XBOX). I know, you might be saying 'There are 360 exclusive games', but who wants to pay double the price for 'better graphics'? I mean, the 360 is around $600, and the original is around $200 (actually make that TRIPLE the price). You also might be saying 'the 360 can download things and surf the internet'. That's what you get a computer for. It's usually 300 dollars less, too.

[Domino]

You cannot surf the net with the 360 (At least not now). I never thought i would get addicted to XBox Live, but i did with the 360. I guess it is a matter of opinion. You have yours and i have mine. Any game console will be great because we can all enjoy video games, and that is all that matters.

It does suck that prices for the damn things are so high, but that is why you have to wait awhile for a price drop. When the PS3 comes out, i can guarantee the 360 will drop in price, just to keep the competitive edge in sales.

[Steel Drummer]

Tha's another thing that bugs me- the PS3 is gonna be $700 or more, and it's gonna have lots of things copied from Nintendo. I actually read somewhere that Sony was 'trying' to copy Nintendo's immerse-yourself-in-the-game-ish controller.

[Meowster]

Oh my god, there's so much stupidity in this thread it makes me want to kill you all.

Not all of you actually, some of you have made very clever and intelligent comments, obviously.

But I can't even begin to respond to some of the ridiculous statements made here, especially one I saw by a user called SkyFire1 or something at the start of the thread... something like 'ooo graphics aren't as pretty because nintendo didn't do what everone else did and make graphics!'

A few other select comments that made me cry in despair:

'Not HD = Not For Me'
'Xbox 360 isn't even next gen!'
'i dont really have too much against the wii but it just reaks of laziness'
'the overall Villagepeoplesh feeling Mario gives makes me prefer Sega'
'PS2 usually just have games that are copied onto all three systems, never any original games'
'I have no interest in Nintendo's wee.' (OOO HAHA FUNNY)
'Why would anyone buy the Wii it is basically a slightly better Gamecube'
'when did you ever see anyone except NINTENDO make a game for the gamecube other than a port.'
'wow another 35 euro and some friends of mine sadly due to medical reasons would not be able to use these controllers due to coordination issues , what about them?'
'it'll fade out soon after people realize they paid $200 to have their gamecube controller split into 2 pieces.'
'ive been listening to Ign podcasts about the Wii so I'm not ranting like Brabantio in Othello'
'However, the name Wii is dumb'



Thank god for the intelligent people in this discussion - whatever side of the argument they may be on.


Everybody else... take a look at the things which I have quoted. Then ask yourself why you're so stupid and dumb, and why you would bother giving your opinion about something that you know so little about.

[voh]

THE MACHINE WAS BETTER THAN SEGA?! WHO SAID THIS?

To clear this up once and for all:

SNES: 3.58 Mhz, 128 kB work RAM, 64 kB video RAM
GENESIS: 7.61 Mhz, 64kB work RAM,Ã,  64 kB video RAM

The SNES was slower, but had more RAM (also has 64kB sound RAM rather than the 8kB the genesis has, which explains why the sound quality of the genesis was rather poor compared to the SNES). More technical details that have nothing to do with speed, but with the quality of output:

SNES: between 256x224 & 512x448 @ 15-bit colour palette (4096 colours on screen)
GENESIS: 256x224, 320x224, 256x240, 320x240 (optional 320x480 mode) @ 512 colour palette (61 colours on screen)

The Genesis had amazingly shitty graphics compared to the SNES, because of both limited palette and limited amount of colours on screen at the same time. Just play Mortal Kombat 3 and you'll see exactly wht the Genesis wasn't up to par with the SNES.

I own a Genesis and I'm proud of it. I never liked the SNES, but speaking from a technical viewpoint, it's the age-old success story - it wasn't better, but it did perform better. Let's hope that goes for the Wii as it did for the SNES, the VHS system and Italy in the latest World Cup.

I really don't know what killed the Dreamcast. But i read that too many people were able to copy Dreamcast games and play them instead of buying them. So the majority of Dreamcast owners were playing copied games and thus leading to less profits for SEGA. I still own mine, but it is wrapped in plastic and hasn't been used in ages. After SEGA declared the Dreamcast dead, i lost respect for the company.

The PS2 killed the Dreamcast. Sega made a mistake not using a DVD-drive on the Dreamcast. Since DVD was still fairly new back then, having the possibility of watching DVD movies and releasing your games on the bigger medium (since GD-ROMs still only hold 1 gB) was a sure-sell. The Dreamcast even outperformed the PS2 from time to time, and the graphics on the PS2 were far from DC quality when it first came out. When I first saw Ico, I laughed. This was the best they could do? But with Sony's marketing budget, the DVD drive awing console enthusiasts, and a pretty, pretty system with backwards compatibility (thus having a HUGE software library at launch) was enough to win. Win hard enough that even now it's the best selling console.

Concerning your remarks that copying killed the Dreamcast. The majority of Dreamcast owners did not play copied games, as the DC's that can natively play CD-R's are of the first revision (1998), perhaps the second (last quarter of 1998, start of 99), but not more than that. The issue was that the GD-ROMs are read in a different way (turn at half speed, read at normal speed), so that the drive is incapable of reading "normal" CD's with game data. It switches over to Audio CD mode when you try that. However, since the first couple of games were not developed on Dreamcasts but Dreamcast Developer Kits, with regular CD-rom drives (which also explains why none of the first games really use the GD-ROM's capacity), the first revision of the DC had a debug mode, which basically means, yes, those can read regular CD-R's with game data. Now, you could of course install a mod chip, but this still means that most people did not have the option of playing copied discs.

Don't forget 90% of the computer/console users aren't tweakers. They simply buy the system, and buy the games.

When Sega decided to cancel the Dreamcast, it was because they were about to go bankrupt due to the fact that Sony had 1000xSegamarketingBudget, and they were simply too far down into the money pit than they could survive if they didn't pull the plug right then.

If a historical company, which has meant an amazing deal for the console world, does something to prevent going bankrupt is enough for you to lose faith in them, perhaps that's for the best. You don't seem to understand what's more important anyway, it seems.

I'd rather still have Sega around, than have them go bankrupt because they didn't bail when they (realistically) needed to.

[R4L]

It does suck that prices for the damn things are so high, but that is why you have to wait awhile for a price drop. When the PS3 comes out, i can guarantee the 360 will drop in price, just to keep the competitive edge in sales.

Even when the prices do drop, do you think a ps3 will still be affordable? Do you think it will really matter that much? The price of a high def TV won't be going down anytime soon, and that money that you "save" will go towards $60 games and other peripherals. I know that these consoles must be expensive in order to make more money, but $600 for a console is a bit harsh, considering the fact of buying add-ons and such.

[auhsor]

I don't think some people realise, but the Wii would be good for Adventure Games. Maybe even some Sam & Max?

[skyfire2]

Everybody else... take a look at the things which I have quoted. Then ask yourself why you're so stupid and dumb, and why you would bother giving your opinion about something that you know so little about.

OK, instead of calling everyone that doesn't support your opinion an idiot, why don't you explain why the Wii is any good, fanboy.

[Nacho]

Fangirl...

[Meowster]

Skyfire, you made the most ridiculously silly statement at the start of this thread, so I'm inclined not to take you seriously.

I'm not for or against any console in this thread. I'm simply pointing out the various stupid statements that have been made. What you need to do is get your facts sorted out and get your shit straight before you start loudly opinionating on internet forums. The amount of bullshit being thrown around in this thread is unbelievable.

Some of you are acting like 10 year old boys who are spouting an opinion they read in some second-rate magazine somewhere, passing it off as their own so that they seem more intelligent and have something to look important about on an internet forum.

You really shouldn't make stupid statements on an internet forum and not expect somebody to call you up on it. Stupid statements like this:

I hope that nintendo gives up on making games forever. Their games are always too easy and they suck ass. What's even worse, Far Cry Wii looks like it's 10 years old because they didn't try to make the graphics like most companys do for console games.