Hotel kitchen

[Mats Berglinn]

I'm still working on my first big game Hawaiian Treasure and I hope to release a demo before the end of the year. Anyway, here is a background which will appear in the demo. It's the kitchen of a cozy, quite big hawaiian vacation hotel. I would like some critics and opinions of how to make this even better.



I haven't done any shading yet but I have started to make some details for it (like the knives, the cutboard, the sink and the dish-washer in the corner). If you wonder what's the big grey thing is I can tell you that it's a big oven (even if you can't tell because it shows the behind in front of the "camera"/screen) and the white door is a giant fridge and freezer rooms for food storage. For this I use two programs for different abilties; Adobe Photoshop for correct size and wide viraity of colors, and Paint for copy/cut/paste without layer problems.

[AndersM]

It looks good, but is a bit out of perspective (the floor-tiles have one perspective, the walls and roof another and the 'kitchen equipment' got a third perspective. make up your mind about wich one you want to use and 'recompute' the others acording to that one...

[veryweirdguy]

2ma2 did a great tutorial on perspective:

http://user.tninet.se/~vqb114l/ilb/tutorials/pers.htm

ALL the lines have to come to a point, usually in the centre.

[Andail_unplugged]

Well, usually the perspective is mostly a matter of taste, but in this case it's pretty necessary...this room won't work until you have adjusted the perspective, sorry.

If you don't get help until monday, I'll upload an image of what the scene could look like with proper perspective.

Fortsätt kämpa!

[Moresco]

Unless you want to make wacky world.  Then you don't need to fix any perspectives I don't know, everyone is always biting at the perspective in all these backgrounds.  Sure it looks a little off, but just how important is it to look 'real'? Does any of it look real at 320x200? Not 'real'ly.    Don't ask me I feel a bit off today...

[Scummbuddy]

usually knives wont have the sharp ends facing where i would pick them up either, and yes, there are times when you need to be asthetically pleasing with your backgrounds and if the perspective is so off that it hurts your eyes, then there should be a change, but of course, you dont have to... its just heavily suggested.  nobody complained that DOTT had odd and too wacky backgrounds.  That perspective is a relaxed perspective....it has its own rules, but does not just scrap perspective all together.

[Mats Berglinn]

Ok, I will fix the perspective quite soon. I'm just not sure how to do it. I just want to match the floor to the ceiling and the walls. And the res is NOT 320x200 but 640x400 (actually not really 400 since I'm using the prosikto's DOTT SCUMM GUI). The game Hawaiian Treasure is not suppoused to be like a cartoon or wacky but more like real since I will be the main character in the game, just want you to know it.

[Pet Terry]

As everyone else stated, the perspective is wrong. Also, I would also add some shading. I was going to show you my edit, but it didn't turned out very well, because I should have altered the perspective more. I guess it's because you need that much floor to be visible. Colours are nice, but that table on the right looks like it's just a piece of grey paper Sink and that brown thing (what do you call it ) look flat too. And same goes with the white door, I would make it like... err... deeper in the wall? Sorry, I can't get the right words to say it

Anyway, you have right idea about the kitchen and good colours, you just have to make it so that it has more depth. Keep going

[Mats Berglinn]

but that table on the right looks like it's just a piece of grey paper Sink and that brown thing (what do you call it ) look flat too.  

That table that you refer to as gray paper is made of metal since resturant kitchens does rarely have wooden tables in these modern days but I will fix that after I have changed the room a little.

And that brown thing is a cutboard, you know to cut meat, fish and vegetables on it.

[Pet Terry]

heh, exactly, that's what I meant

* Petteri goes to study some more english

[Isegrim]

Maybe add some "shininess" to the metal table?

[Mats Berglinn]

Here is the "new" kitchen. I have spent a couple of hours on remaking the kitchen without start from scratch. I haven't redoing the oven, the door that leeds out of the kitchen and the cutboard but I will redo the stuff later. I will save both shading and shining until the picture is "perfect". It is NOT the final version, it's just a raw and rough remake just to check if you guys think that I'm heading into the right direction when it comes to perspective. I save the pattern on the floor and other stuff until you guys think it's alright.


What do you think? Does it have better perspective?

[Isegrim]

Er... not really...

The room itself is in central perspective (all lines perpendicular to the screen more or less meet in one point) while the rest is in parallel perspective (all lines perpendicular to the screen are inclined by the same angle).

Unless you want it that way (it somehow hurts your eyes, doesn't it?), I suggest: make it all in central perspective. It has the most "natural" feel to it.

One positive thing: The sink now has a more three-dimensional feel. With the water level a little below the rim, it looks good now. The angles also fit with the table.

[Mats Berglinn]

The room itself is in central perspective (all lines perpendicular to the screen more or less meet in one point) while the rest is in parallel perspective (all lines perpendicular to the screen are inclined by the same angle).

I don't understand what you mean. Could you show me which parts that are central and what is parallel? I hope I don't have to redesign the whole room again because that could take hours to complete. But if it does, I'm ready for it.
Good you noticed the water-level in the sink!  

[AndersM]

Look at this picture: look how all lines meets in the red dot (the point of the central perspective) but observe how the lines on the yellow areas (the walls/sides that directly faces the observer) is straight. I'm not so good at explaining this in english so i take it in swedish:

Hela iden med perspektiv är att skapa ett djup i en platt bild, därför måste alla delar av en vägg eller föremål som på något sett befinner sig längre bort från observatören vara mindre än de delar av föremålet som är närmare. Se kylskåpet till exempel: (det till höger om dörren) Framsidan är flat och helt symetrisk, för att alla delar av kylskåpsdörren är lika nära observatören. Sidan har däremot en kant som är närmare observatören, och en som är längre bort. Den del av kylskåpet som är närmast den bakre väggen är längre bort från observatören än den sida som är närmast kylskåpsdörrarna, och därför måste denna vara mindre, och dess linjer faller in i perspektivpunkten.

Tyvärr kan jag inte förklara bättre, men nu kanske du fått ett hum om vad det hela går ut på...

[Minimi]

Hela iden med perspektiv är att skapa ett djup i en platt bild, därför måste alla delar av en vägg eller föremål som på något sett befinner sig längre bort från observatören vara mindre än de delar av föremålet som är närmare. Se kylskåpet till exempel: (det till höger om dörren) Framsidan är flat och helt symetrisk, för att alla delar av kylskåpsdörren är lika nära observatören. Sidan har däremot en kant som är närmare observatören, och en som är längre bort. Den del av kylskåpet som är närmast den bakre väggen är längre bort från observatören än den sida som är närmast kylskåpsdörrarna, och därför måste denna vara mindre, och dess linjer faller in i perspektivpunkten.

Tyvärr kan jag inte förklara bättre, men nu kanske du fått ett hum om vad det hela går ut på...

holy crap... what was that... who farted there???

but seriously... nice example... i'll try to edit your kitchen!

[Mats Berglinn]

MrMasse: Good that you choosed to explain in swedish. But that example of yours, is it just an example or are you trying to explain how I should do the kitchen? If you tryed to explain how to make the kitchen then you misunderstand it because your drawing is a regular homekitchen while the kitchen of mine is for a hawaiian vacation hotel.

Minimi: If you can't be helpful, don't use a dumb answer like that, ok? And besides MrMasse and I are swedish, so it's no wonder you don't understand the swedish example since you're dutch (no offense).

[Pet Terry]

He tried to explain how to make it in perspective. See that red dot? It's perspective point and every room lines goes to it creating a good perspective.

[AndersM]

I'm not trying to teach you how to draw a kitchen, just how to draw a central perspective kitchen. Hope my picture and explanation can help you.

[Moresco]

Wow but he's not making DOTT.  I know you're trying to teach him, that's cool...but what if he just doesn't get it? No more adventure game? Screw that, just have fun, I like your kitchen! Boo down with perspective! booooo. ^^  

Yah it hurts the eyes...I always tell me 18 month old son: Stop, your drawings are hurting my eyes cuz they're not in perspective.

The perspective example is pretty simple.  You pick a point in the background and all lines must align with it.  Of course, horizontal & vertical lines do not.  It will come just don't self-destruct over it, it's not as important right now as creativity is.


This link is in English, but you can use the 2nd link to translate the parts you can't understand:
http://mathforum.org/workshops/sum98/participants/sanders/Persp.html

Translate english to swedish here:
http://intertran1.tranexp.com/Translate/result.shtml

Good luck Have fun! Or try anyway.