Ags games being used to profit?

[Squinky]

Hey all, I just noticed some of our games have been put up on a site that requires people to pay for the downloads (and it appears they just copied the review of fry 2 from the underdogs).....Thought it might be worth mentioning...It had rodekill and permanent daylight also....

http://free-game-downloads.mosw.com/abandonware/pc/adventure/games_p_r/pirate_fry_2_the_hand_of_anturus.html

[stuh505]

well, they're not asking you to pay for the games...they're asking you to help pay for their "service" of hosting a webserver..

[MillsJROSS]

However, Pirate Fry is not adandonware...it's freeware.  I'm not too certain on the legalities of it, but I'm fairly certain that if Squinky didn't want his game on this list, they would take it down. Can't say for sure, though. They might be assholes.

-MillsJROSS

[DGMacphee]

I read their synopsis of my classic game Ultimerr and I am absolutely disappointed!

Ultimerr is a small, but very enjoyable amateur adventure game. It is most of all a parody of the Ultima universe - but isn't restricted to just that. You will, for example, encounter quite a few familiar characters from other well known works, including some from a well known Alfred Hitchcock movie, some from an old children's tale, and some which will be kept a secret in this review, so as to ensure the enjoyability of them during the game itself.

Okay. So far so good. Though I'm not too sure what he means by "secret" characters. It's not like I could have been stuffed putting Easter eggs in the game.

The graphics, although not works of art, are exactly fit for the game. The backgrounds look like the kind you'd expect to find in most elder RPG games. The same goes for the characters, inventory items, and well... the entire game.

What do you mean the graphics aren't a work of art? They're fucking brilliant! And what's this about elder RPGs? My graphics could rival even EverQuest... and my graphics would win with a flying ninja kick to EverQuest's ugly face!

The puzzles are on the easy side. You shouldn't have any trouble solving them in most, or all, of the cases. This again, although probably not on purpose, is something which it has in common with most console RPG games. Some puzzles are quite original, or provide humorous situations between NPC's and the PC. Which is, more than anything else, the point of this game.

Easy?? EASY!?! Do you know how many people I get e-mailing me and asking me for help? Okay, it's not many (in fact, it's zero), but still, the puzzles are DAMN HARD. Like that blue gem. Who'da thought you'd have to [deleted by moderators so as not to reveal puzzle] in order to get the blue gem? NO ONE! THAT'S WHO!

The story is a collection of RPG clichés. You are Avatar, a good knight who has just arrived in town. Upon arrival, you discover that a bad person had kidnapped a good princess. Being the hero that you are, you decide to free her. But to do this, you have to find three gems which will create a portal to his lair. Sound familiar? Well, if it doesn't, then you probably just never played an RPG before in your life.

Cliches? Oh, now you're just insulting me! Plus, WHAT Princess? I'm starting to think this guy playing a different game altogether! Cliches! BAH HUMBUG! You're just imagining cliches and putting them into my game!

The game pulls off this old, worn storyline with grace, though. The game is refreshing and original in most departments, so even though you always have a faint idea of what will follow, the game still manages to surprise you at how it is executed. Again, the strong humor and good dialogue in the game are the strongest points, and are in fact what the game revolves around.

"even though you always have a faint idea of what will follow, the game still manages to surprise "... Wha??? So, you know what's going to happen, but it will SURPRISE YOU ANYWAY! Survey says... CONTRADICTION!

The only negative point I can find is, as stated before, the very short length of the game. You'll left wanting a lot more. But other than this, this is a game worth playing by almost everybody with an interest in funny games and/or RPG games.

So you've just ripped my game to sheds, Mr Reviewer... practically cut the fingers off my baby... and now you're saying you want MORE? WHAAAT? MOOORE!?! (That was a reference to the musical 'Oliver!'. Imagine I'm a big fat guy saying "MOOORE". Yes, pretty witty and clever and pop cultural, aren't I?)

Ooooo, your review makes me angry, Mr Reviewer! You won't like me when I'm angry!










<-- I look like this, only green and muscly.

[Barbarian]

I sent a little email to the guys over at www.agdinteractive.comÃ,  that these "free-game-downloads" scumbags are trying to profit from their hard work as well:

http://free-game-downloads.mosw.com/abandonware/pc/adventure/games_k_l/king_s_quest_vga_remake.html

http://free-game-downloads.mosw.com/abandonware/pc/adventure/games_k_l/king_s_quest_2_romancing_the_stones.html


The ADG guys sent me back a reply that they very much appreciate to be notified about this, and that they will "get on this" problem ...Ã, 

I'm hoping the ADG guys will open up a can of whoop-ass on these "free-game-downloads" scumbags.Ã,  Ã, I'm sure these "free-game-downloads" idiots never got the permission of the many authors of the various freeware games they have listed there. I know I would be rather angry if someone tried to "sell" a download of my game(s) without getting my permission.

[jaz]

Well, I found Coup de Cup on this CD:

http://www.excal.cz/excalsite/hv30.html

It's a monthly collection of freeware games. Previous issues included other AGS games as well, A Friend Indeed for instance.

Cost: roughly 4 USD.

I don't know if I should be glad or pissed off. I saw Coup on magazine's cover discs and I was definately glad because my game is not what sells the magazine. But when the freeware games are the very content that sells the product, then it seems like someone is screwing us...

I mean, I wanted our game to be free and if it's not then someone might have asked for a permission at least .

[Radiant]

Well, this depends entirely on what the legal disclaimer is with your game (if you have any) - and it also seems that some of the game distributors aren't very keen on legalistics.

If a game is 'public domain', that means that anyone can do anything they please with it - including modifying, etc. Very few games are in fact public domain.

If a game is 'freeware', then you still are the copyright owner of your work. Freeware isn't an exactly defined legal term, but what you should do to avoid this is put in disclaimer text stating that nobody may make money from the distribution of your game, and that it can be included in software collections only if said collections are made available for free (not even for shipping and handling).

Or, release your game under the GNU Lesser Public License, the one that doesn't require you to opensource everything.

AGDI is very good at legalistics, so informing them if it concerns them is definitely a good idea.

[jaz]

Well, this depends entirely on what the legal disclaimer is with your game (if you have any) - and it also seems that some of the game distributors aren't very keen on legalistics.

If a game is 'public domain', that means that anyone can do anything they please with it - including modifying, etc. Very few games are in fact public domain.

If a game is 'freeware', then you still are the copyright owner of your work. Freeware isn't an exactly defined legal term, but what you should do to avoid this is put in disclaimer text stating that nobody may make money from the distribution of your game, and that it can be included in software collections only if said collections are made available for free (not even for shipping and handling).

Or, release your game under the GNU Lesser Public License, the one that doesn't require you to opensource everything.

AGDI is very good at legalistics, so informing them if it concerns them is definitely a good idea.

Well I know this, I am a lawyer, and freeware/GNU are still very much unestablished legal areas. And I don't give a damn if someone is distributing my game even for profit. But it would be nice if they at least ask... I'm not talking about legal problems but decency.

[m0ds]

Can I suggest that, and I'm sure the majority of those who are in the know do, to include a README or LICENSE file in your game, whether its a fan-game, new production or what not - stating what YOU, as the developer, WANTS from the release of it. For example, so long as you include somewhere in there something like;

My game should not be sold for profit, ever, is strictly freeware and must NOT be distributed on compilation CD's for profit

will cover yo ass. Then you can officially start the manslaughter of these companies. If you haven't included a license or something then its your own fault. Just because its made in AGS doesnt make it officially "freeware" automatically, nor is it essentially covered by any satisfactory laws & still remains liable to be sold for profit, to someone else. YOU have to endeavour to state this stuff and protect your OWN works as best you can, yourself. There are laws that can cover all this, but its simpler just to make up your own license, that way no-one can disagree (I suppose its a bit like a contract).

This is why installers are particularly useful for even our smaller freeware games. That way a license can be placed before its installed etc, and cant be modified by those companies. EVEN better, but sometimes annoying - include a disclaimer/license screen at the start of your game. Or even something like, "strictly freeware".

It's cool to have your games on these CD's, but remember;

- They will rarely mention the developer, you
- They will rarely include your contact details
- You will never profit from it
- You will be struck down with great vengeance

I remember someone brought a CD compilation that was on-sale somewhere on the continent, it was like 9.99 and inlcuded the demo of Indiana Jones - Infernal Machine, LOL. Cheeky as!

[Helm]

Besides the initial annoy when you are in such a situation, I don't really see the necessity of actual legaleze disclaimers in freeware adventure games. Sure, someone might stick it in a horrid paysite  as in this case, but I doubt they'd check the txt and go "oh, here's a liscence. I guess I better not put it up with my other 2 gigs of commerical warez games, then" if you did include a disclaimer. Assholes will be assholes, and I don't see the point of going after them, be you equipped with the legal highround or not. Sticking a notice somewhere that the game is free, and if you paid money for it someone played you for a fool is a good idea, since it's informing your potential audience. But actually trying to fortify against people who blatantly couldn't care less about your disclaimer is not, really. Even if you shut a site down, big deal. I know the feeling of getting exploited sucks, but I don't think we should waste effort on going after them. It's not like they're making millions out of someone's free game, anyway. Only a fool would pay for that site, for example. 

[DGMacphee]

Sticking a notice somewhere that the game is free, and if you paid money for it someone played you for a fool is a good idea, since it's informing your potential audience... Only a fool would pay for that site, for example.

I agree with this sentiment. If someone loses their wallet to the 'wallet inspector' in exchange for any of my games, they deserve to be called a fool. Especially since if they did 5 more mins of googling, they'd find a free copy straight from the offical DG Designs website.

[Captain Mostly]

I don't get it. All these people hi-jacking AGS games for profit, and no one's ripped off Davy Jones C'est Mort yet!?!? I feel more than slightly slighted.

<EDIT>
hold the phone! They've got Nihilism on there! Everything's ok! Although they ARE clearly stupid, as Nihilism's crummy. Why not host Vegetable Patch Extreem Turbo 1 & 2 and do my reputation a little good... Mind you, I should be greatful for what I get. 
</EDIT>

[Squinky]

Yeah, I don't really care if someone uses my game this way, just thought others might....

[Phemar]

Yeh I'm sooo pissed off right now. Not because they make you pay for those games, mind you, but because MY game isn't on the list!!!

[Erpy]

Ah, so you were the guy Relight got that message from? Anyway, I contacted the webmaster with the request to have our games removed from there. He mentioned taking them off the server. The page mentioning the game is still there, btw, but I'll give him a little bit more time to remove those too before I start nagging him again.

[juncmodule]

Hello,

we've just deleted the game from our site.
Some links are still there, but they're blind. They will be removed during
next update.

Thank you for your notification.

Regards,
Ondrej Muncinsky
http://free-game-downloads.mosw.com/


----- Original Message ----- From: "juncmodule" <--------->
To: <games@mosw.com>
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2005 7:45 AM
Subject: Illegal Hosting of my game


> You are hosting my game Keptosh: The Search for Junc. You are charging for downloading this game. This is illegal. Terms of use for this game clearly state that the file may not be hosted on a site that requires payment to access the file. Please remove it from your website immediately.
>
> http://free-game-downloads.mosw.com/abandonware/pc/adventure/games_k_l/keptosh_the_search_for_junc.html
>
> Thank you,
> -juncmodule
>
>

[Scummbuddy]

I'd be a bit pissed if someone was making money off of my hard work. Thanks for the heads up squinky, even though I don't have a game they'd try to pawn off, I would care if I did.

[flukeblake_]

Yeh, sure, but what about if say someone made a shit game, and u had paid like $10 for it. That would suck.

[Captain Mostly]

like if a really shit RON game were on there? I can't imagine that!!!!