MIDI C&C: How's this time signature?

Gregjazz · Thu 09/03/2006 08:05:45

Hey guys,

Here's a little jam based on Chameleon I was messing around for the last 45 minutes:

http://www.gregjazz.com/upload/chameleon.mid

Does the time signature (9/4) sound natural and relaxed? I'm trying to make it sound as natural as just a normal 4/4 funk tune, not jarring.

I just realized that my horn arrangement sounds terrible on standard GM soundset. Because right now I have any General MIDI in Cakewalk being played through a relatively nice (compared to standard GM soundsets) Sonic Implants GM soundset.

Please humor the keyboard solo. I used my 2-octave keyboard on my Ozone, so it's far from ideal, but you'll get the idea.

Nikolas · Thu 09/03/2006 10:42:42

You keyboard solo sucks! You loose notes! You suck!

No, the time signatuer sounds just fine as it is, with the brass hitting the ninth beat and then the first. I wouldn't call it exactly relaxed as it is but... definately funky and normal.

I say go for it! Definately! Make it better! and then post it!

Gregjazz · Thu 09/03/2006 17:35:16

Okay, cool. I want to make a non-GM version. It's times like these when Garritan Big Band would be very useful for the horn section, but I think I'll make do with assembling one using soundfonts. Maybe if a few of the instruments live it will make everything else sound live.

Evil · Thu 09/03/2006 18:06:31

I think if you're going to do it, have it 10/4. That extra note hold sounds weird to me. It's relaxing, yes, but something is unsettling about that pause. Maybe just add a quarter note in the middle of the pause?

Alun · Thu 09/03/2006 20:14:09

Quote from: Evil on Thu 09/03/2006 18:06:31
I think if you're going to do it, have it 10/4.

Nah, I disagree--definitely stick with 9/4. It's a very unusual time signature, and I have enough affinity for the unusual to want more songs to be written with such unusual time signatures.

And honestly, to me it sounds entirely natural. I wouldn't have even realized it was in a weird time signature like 9/4 if you hadn't said so.

Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens · Thu 09/03/2006 20:18:34

Nice 80's porno music, Geoff. Have you been doing research?

As for the tune, I like it. It has a funky beat. I think it ends a bit abruptly, though, unless you haven't finished it yet.

Gregjazz · Fri 10/03/2006 05:15:10

Quote from: Evil on Thu 09/03/2006 18:06:31
I think if you're going to do it, have it 10/4. That extra note hold sounds weird to me. It's relaxing, yes, but something is unsettling about that pause. Maybe just add a quarter note in the middle of the pause?

My original idea for it was indeed in 10/4 but that was too easy, I had to make it more interesting and difficult by making it 9/4.

The strange thing is that now when I'm listening to it, it doesn't sound very odd-meter-ish to me.

FYI this is a cover of the famous Herbie Hancock tune, Chameleon, which was in 4/4. I'm just arranging it differently. It's sort of a mockup for how I might play it in my band.

EDIT: The 5-note pattern about 1:07 is a nod to Herbie Hancock btw, that's something like he does sometimes.

Scummbuddy · Fri 10/03/2006 05:43:10

I like it. At first it reminded me of Toe Jam and Earl 1, but then the "jazzy" part took over and I was moved to Sonic 2's second stage, the city-type stage.

Don't mind me, but it's quite a nice piece of music you have there. My only crits could be that perhaps at times, the regular keyboard sounds seem a bit too loud, and could draw attention away from the game. Not sure really until it's seen in-game, but I await more music.

Helm · Fri 10/03/2006 07:14:25

QuoteEDIT: The 5-note pattern about 1:07 is a nod to Herbie Hancock btw, that's something like he does sometimes.

Yeah but try to keep this clean, you lose it towards the end. For polyrhythms to work, in this case series of fives against nines until it comes back together, you have to be spot on on all the beats.

If I brain was once periplexed by 9/4s I cannot remember how it felt. All signatures sound fine to me, the only way for my brain to go 'whoa, whait!' is if someone drops beats or adds them every repetition like stuttering.

Gregjazz · Fri 10/03/2006 07:56:52

Quote from: Helm on Fri 10/03/2006 07:14:25
Yeah but try to keep this clean, you lose it towards the end. For polyrhythms to work, in this case series of fives against nines until it comes back together, you have to be spot on on all the beats.

Yeah, it lags a bit at the end and there's some similar timing errors elsewhere.

As for having to wait for the polyrhythms to come back together, why do you say that? It seems like that'd be the safe way to do it would be to have the number of bars preplanned or wait until you can see the "end in sight." Actually the pattern of 5 16th notes will meet up on the downbeat of the 1 after 5 bars, I believe.

Tomorrow I think I will have time to hook up my real keyboard and do a new solo.

Helm · Fri 10/03/2006 08:03:10

Yes of course you can preplan the bars until it resynchs, this is usually the way to do it. But be aware that you can cut it short in other accents of the rhythmic base if it calls for it. For example, if you have a strong V interval in there you can rest on that with a sustained note. It's as much feel as it is theory. But for any of this to work, the sixteenths need to be on the spot. I really like this sort of playing and have done it extensively, I like how the brain begins to float against the beat when it tries to deal with two different sets of accenting at the same time.

[Cameron] · Sat 11/03/2006 01:48:51

I loooooove Herbie Hancock. Seeing my musial theory is not that great I cant really say much except for the fact that I quite like it.

Gregjazz · Sun 12/03/2006 06:11:41

New version:

http://www.gregjazz.com/upload/chameleon.mid

New keyboard solo, this time I set up my full keyboard to play it. Hopefully it's an improvement?