The new Sam and Max thread

[LimpingFish]

*Limping Fish misses Mr Colossal's point*

Actually, I didn't. He implied I found Sam and Max lacking because I am apparently not its target demographic.

He brought up SpongeBob, and it immediately made me remember "Didn't he have some sort of connection to some atrocious licensed thing produced by one of those journeyman studios that pump out that kind of gaming swill?"

Too harsh. Uncalled for. Withdrawn.

[MrColossal]

I asked a question to eventually lead to a discussion, but nevermind, you just want to insult. That's fine, not interested.

[Helm]

man, Limpingfish, that's low.

[LimpingFish]

But it wasn't a very constructive question. And it brought out my hatred of such games. You just happened to be in the firing line.

Apologies.

EDIT: Yes it was, Helm.

[Helm]

Glad if this was resolved.

How about, yes. new Telltale Sam and Max might not be ment for you. Maybe they are going for more causal gamers or something, and they don't really care if the hardcore adventure gamers drop them.

[LimpingFish]

Quite possibly. But isn't that my "apologetic" point just repackaged?

"Easy" doesn't have mean "sub-standard". And that's mostly what licensed games, usually meant "for kids", are.

Does it also mean I can't enjoy a game that isn't for my demographic?

[Candle]

S&M screensaver by me
http://rapidshare.com/files/2161076/samandmax.zip

[modgeulator]

If the "point" of a Sam and Max game is the humour, then why bother with the game at all. The cartoons will give you the same experience, without the repetitive strain injury of clicking through the dialog.

I'm honestly glad they made the puzzles so easy. Getting stumped in adventure games, running around and trying random item combinations - it just isn't that much fun for me. It's 2006 and there are too many other games out there that offer instant gratification, my attention span isn't that long. I'm not interested in spending days figuring out some obscure puzzle anymore. I just want to get to the exploration, the interactive dialogs, the mini-games and the general "having fun" bits.

[ManicMatt]

Actually, I didn't. He implied I found Sam and Max lacking because I am apparently not its target demographic....

I took it as his point being that they weren't apologising for it, but nevermind. I don't think they were implying it wasn't meant for you. At least, that's how I took it.

Hmm hey, Bully/Canis Canem Edit is fairly easy, AND is based in a school, but is aimed towards 15 to 30 years olds. I'm just saying my thoughts out loud...

[Helm]

Quite possibly. But isn't that my "apologetic" point just repackaged?

Your apologetic point is based on irrelevant assumptions (my intentions or anyone's intentions in discussing Sam and Max) whereas the issue at hand is not that.

"Easy" doesn't have mean "sub-standard". And that's mostly what licensed games, usually meant "for kids", are.

That, is a point, however. You say that S&M is both easy and sub-standard. Others see it only as being easy. It's a personal call, then? It's just not 'substandard because it is easy'.

Does it also mean I can't enjoy a game that isn't for my demographic?

It means that if you do, it's a happy accident, awesome. If you don't, not the developer's fault.

[LimpingFish]

...and the general "having fun" bits.

I must have missed those

You say that S&M is both easy and sub-standard. Others see it only as being easy. It's a personal call, then? It's just not 'substandard because it is easy'.

Yes, that's what I said. Easy doesn't have to imply fault. I never said I didn't like it because it was "Easy", I said I didn't like it because it was weak. In almost all areas.

[Helm]

Man, I didn't like the first Sam and Max so I had no incentive to try this, but if people are torn on it I wonder if I'd like it. Probably not.

[LimpingFish]

I'll admit I entered into it knowing that I was going to be disappointed. Not in some "Oh I love Sam and Max!" way, but simply as a game that could hold my interest (based on Telltale's previous output).

I feel it failed, but I do admit I approach a lot of these games in a very clinical and pesimistic manner.

[EDIT]
Christ, all this negative energy raised by a debate over a f*cking video game!
"AngryFish" needs to chill, methinks. If I'm not careful, he can get to be a real asshole.  :

[ManicMatt]

Suuuure, in the demo I solved the cheese puzzle without even thinking about it, I couldn't even think what swiss cheese looked like at the time, and I solved it on my first guess hehe.

And some lines made me think "Was that supposed to be a joke?"

But for some reason the overall demo was fun for me. I'm seriosuly scraping up the pennies off the floor to maybe buy the season/episode.

Hmm what if they don't manage to make all of them for some reason, will one get their money back? They don't seem like a financially stable concrete company to me, that's all. Even if they have been around for years, haven't they? Just look at Acclaim. (I think it was)

EDIT: Yeah I was thinking of Traveller's tales. But my point is still valid.

[LimpingFish]

Telltale was only formed a couple of years back, two I think.
I suppose that's another way to look at it, sure.

[Kweepa]

Just look at Acclaim.

Well, the writing was on the wall for Acclaim for quite a while. Admittedly I have no idea what the finances of Telltale are like, but I haven't heard anything which is probably a good sign. Anyway I've risked my $35, which will go towards making them a more financially stable company. Either that or the CFO will take the money and run.

LimpingFish, I'm disappointed in you.

* Steve shuffles out the back, embarrassed

[Candle]

Telltale Games is a video game developer based in San Rafael, California and founded in June 2004. It was created by a group of former LucasArts employees who had been working on Sam & Max Freelance Police, a sequel to the 1993 game Sam & Max Hit the Road, prior to its cancellation on March 3, 2004. The company's CEO is Dan Connors who heads the company alongside cofounders Kevin Bruner and Troy Molander. The Telltale Games team have a large collective experience of working on notable adventure games, some of which include Grim Fandango, Monkey Island and Sam & Max.

On February 11, 2005 the company released their first game â€" Telltale Texas Hold'em, a poker card game simulator. The game was solely available through electronic distribution from Telltales' and other websites. Later that month on February 22, 2005 it was announced that the company would also be developing an adventure game based on the intellectual property of Jeff Smith and his Bone comic book series. Bone is to be released gradually through electronic distribution in episodic chapters. The first episode, Bone: Out from Boneville, was released in September 2005 while the second episode, The Great Cow Race, was released in April 2006.

Closely following the release of the first Bone episode, Telltale Games announced that they would be creating a new Sam & Max computer game, which would be released in the same episodic fashion. In May 2006, Telltale announced that the Sam & Max episodes would be shorter, more frequent, and self-contained than the episodes of Bone, and would also be made available via the GameTap game distribution service. Sam & Max: Season 1 - Culture Shock was released in October, 2006.

In November 2005, Ubisoft announced that Telltale was developing the next game for the popular CSI: Crime Scene Investigation television series. The game was released March 14, 2006.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telltale_Games

[modgeulator]

Hmm what if they don't manage to make all of them for some reason, will one get their money back?

I'd think so yes. If they don't make the rest of them and don't offer refunds I'm pretty sure that would be fraud. Even if they went bankrupt refunds should be made from the sale of their assets, etc. I guess there's a miniscule chance they're planning on taking our pre-order money and running away with it, but it's a gamble I'm willing to take. 

[Snarky]

Also, Sam & Max has a wider appeal than just about any other adventure game license (when was the last time you saw an adventure game reviewed on Slashdot?), and a lot of the audience aren't as experienced puzzle solvers as the people around here.

You just apologized for it...AGAIN.

The hell I did. I don't find the puzzles substandard, just easy. From what I've seen on non-adventure game sites and forums, they're about the right difficulty for inexperienced and rusty players. So that would mean there's nothing wrong with the puzzles.

If the audience isn't as experienced, do a Monkey Island 2 and give them the option of easier puzzles.

Yeah, how many games other than MI2 do that? Sure, it's a cool feature, but I don't see how you can blame a game for being one thing rather than everything for everyone. It makes just as much sense to complain that an adventure game doesn't have any action: "Well, if the audience doesn't want fight sequences, do an Indy:FOA and give them the option of different paths."

EDIT:

Given that in plenty (I would say most) of even good adventure games, the puzzles aren't the strongest point, I don't see this as an apologetic comment at all.

You're joking, right?

Not at all. It's true for almost every game that some aspects hold up better than others. And in many adventure games, the story, setting, characters, dialogue, etc. are the main attraction, not the puzzles. And those games seem to be the most popular among adventure gamers. For instance, I don't think the puzzles were the strongest point of Sam & Max: Hit the Road.

[Shane 'ProgZmax' Stevens]

Bear in mind that I don't cut developers slack because they're trying to make a commercial adventure game, nor do I hug them for bringing back old favorites to make a buck.

The implication being that anyone who claims to like the game is only saying so for those reasons? Wow. You old cynic, you.

Nah, I just know there are people out there who actually do that.  Also, I pretty much agree 100% with Limping Fish on the game being generally weak in just about every area.  I'm not as forgiving as some, granted, and I definitely think that after the negative feedback they got from Bone that Telltale's had time to get it together as far as providing something challenging and still fun.  I have to say that this was neither.  I will just restate that I did not start this game thinking 'this will be shit'.  In fact, the intro was rather cool and the tune was reminiscent enough of the original game to make me think 'this will be good'.